Homeschool success? 6 kids in college before age 12

[Deleted]

Apr 18, 2013 16:53:13 GMT -5 formerroomate99 said:

And for the record, there are a lot of dirt poor homeschoolers.  Most don't have both parents working and they tend to have very large families. 

99,

Where their resurse is coming from.  It must be love!!

[zibazinski]

Middle school and high school totally suck. I don't know what planet parents are on but it must be even more horrible now than it was when I was in school. The teachers were disinterested and the curriculum was boring. I'd have given anything to have had the option of getting the hell out of that system and into someplace where my brain fit in. I felt sorry for my kids and they went to one of the top high schools in the county. DS wanted to drop out the end of his junior year, take the GED and start college. I insisted he stay in and finish his senior year. Bad move on my part but I thought it was best for him at the time. By the time DD was in high school, she could take college courses and virtual school. It saved her from being a statistic because high school was also terrible for her. Not everyone looks back on their school years with joy.

[Deleted]

I would have liked the option of taking college courses early; my schooling through HS was good, but it would have given me more challenges. Actually attending college full- time earlier might not have been a great idea. My Ex started at 16 and, like many studious, academically gifted people (me included) was behind socially. And of course, what college woman, even a freshman is going to date a 16-year old dweeby genius? He always said that was a bad decision and when I brought up the idea of DS skipping grades, he said don't do it.

I went away to college, it was the 1970s, and it was a great time of free thought, free love, and freely available pot. At 12 I might have missed it all or, worse, gotten into it without the maturity or perspective to realize that it was OK to have a little fun, but I was there to learn.

In general, I'm in favor of home schooling if you have the resources to do it right and your kids get out into the world, too. I just don't think that enrolling them in college at age 12 is a good outcome.

[raeoflyte]

When the kid graduates at 16 they will most likely enroll in grad school and get the college experience then.

Chances are most of their social circle are home school kids so they wouldn't be *that* weird as long as they didn't brag about it.

[Deleted]

My son is looking to take a summer 'camp' at his college of interest. You do go through dual enrollment process to go to camp, and you do get credits. He's 14.

dual enrollment, taking both high school and college credit at the same time, generally includes only a few classes at a time. Lots of time for other stuff...

[Sam_2.0]

I did high school in three years. And got a double-major in college in three years. To me, I wasn't the most out-going kid. Academics were what I excelled at, and I enjoyed it, so I put all my time into my school work. I don't feel like I missed out on anything because I was following my interests. I never partied until after college, just had no desire to. Never really dated either. I had a couple of friends that I would hang out with but I mostly preferred to be on my own.

Maybe it is because I had a brief experience with this personally, but I don't think that letting a kid take advanced courses or enroll in college as a young teen is the same thing as robbing them of their childhood. If that is what the kid wants to do, why not let them? Not every kid is interested in the "typical" teenage experience. I never wanted to fit in with the crowd. I wanted to be left alone to do my own thing and was happiest when I was allowed to do that.

[Deleted]

I am going to respond before reading the whole thread.

We lived in a college town.  I arranged for my daughter to take French classes at the university in seventh grade.  She didn't want to.  End of story.

I arranged for my son to take an Algebra class in ninth grade.  He made an A, but mostly learned that you have to show your work (LOL).  I honestly think that was the most important lesson since he was a know-it-all.  He learned college professors don't give a dang if you don't follow their rules.  He didn't want to take any more college classes, but he was able to use this one toward graduation.

I don't think being in college at age 12 is such a great achievement unless your kids are READY to be in college.  My kids were both bright.  They didn't want to be there.  It sort of reminded me of third grade when I was placed above grade-level.  Tons of fun . . . NOT.  I graduated at age 20; I certainly didn't want to graduate at 16 (and couldn't have taught because the minimum age is 20).

Challenge your kids, but pushing them ahead isn't the best solution.

[973beachbum]

Apr 18, 2013 17:51:09 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Middle school and high school totally suck. I don't know what planet parents are on but it must be even more horrible now than it was when I was in school. The teachers were disinterested and the curriculum was boring. I'd have given anything to have had the option of getting the hell out of that system and into someplace where my brain fit in. I felt sorry for my kids and they went to one of the top high schools in the county. DS wanted to drop out the end of his junior year, take the GED and start college. I insisted he stay in and finish his senior year. Bad move on my part but I thought it was best for him at the time. By the time DD was in high school, she could take college courses and virtual school. It saved her from being a statistic because high school was also terrible for her. Not everyone looks back on their school years with joy.

Yet, my Dd and her friends insist they want to be on the five year plan for HS.  I think that means it doesn't suck.

[Chocolate Lover]

I asked my 16 yo DS last night if he'd want to be a 12 year old college student, his answer "why not?". Guess it wouldn't bother him in the least socially and his biggest complaint is always being challenged or not challenged enough. (both with school work and the only thing he shows up to school for:music)

It also occurred to me that the 12 yo could get the underwater basketweaving degree, and then get the STEM degree and be out at the same time as their peers, more or less.

[973beachbum]

Colleges around here decided a long time ago to restrict students to 14 and over.  Having a 12 year old in a class, or in the op even younger, isn't a sign of their intelligence just their parents wants and needs.  They may be able to grasp the subject but are a major distraction to the rest of the class.  This isn't about the kids IMO it is about the parents.

Who here could teach a college class and have a 9 or 12 year old in it and not feel responsible for them?  So the prof and other students end up with babysitting duties.  That is seriously not what they signed up for. 

As far as having something in common with a 12 year old.  Why on earth would a grown adult want to find out what they have in common with a little kid?   If they did odds are they would be called a pediphile.

[Sum Dum Gai]

As far as having something in common with a 12 year old.  Why on earth would a grown adult want to find out what they have in common with a little kid?   If they did odds are they would be called a pediphile.

So you and your husband don't play with your kids?  You don't do anything together as a family?  You don't have interests that you like that you share with your kids?  That's sad.

[973beachbum]

Apr 19, 2013 14:33:52 GMT -5 Sum Dum Gai said:

As far as having something in common with a 12 year old.  Why on earth would a grown adult want to find out what they have in common with a little kid?   If they did odds are they would be called a pediphile.

So you and your husband don't play with your kids?  You don't do anything together as a family?  You don't have interests that you like that you share with your kids?  That's sad.

Is that a joke or are you seriously comparing playing with your own kids to some twenty something from the college wanting to hang out with your preteen girls tbecause they think they might have so much in common?

[Deleted]

It is. Look up dual enrollment.

[sheilaincali]

IDK  DS is friends with a number of adults.  They are also friends of my husbands but they consider DS to be a peer.  They don't like offer him a beer but they also don't treat him like he's a little kid.  (He'll be 15 next weekend)  In his gaming league it's mostly adults but there is also DS, another boy DS' age who is homeschooled and a girl their same age. But the rest of the 40+ person league is comprised of adults.  They don't treat the kids any differently than they would the adults.  They maybe try to swear slightly less (especially around the homeschool kid- my DS has the mouth of a sailor )

[Deleted]

Apr 19, 2013 15:19:54 GMT -5 @tbird said:

Apr 19, 2013 15:16:36 GMT -5 oped said:

It is. Look up dual enrollment.

Not what I'm talking about.  I'm talking about testing out of your last 2 or 3 years of high school.  Done with it.

I guess I'm confused, how would that be different from other options available? What would she do t that point?

what specific advantage did this person use that you think is denied your daughter I guess is what I mean?

[Deleted]

I'm guessing also that many would pass. I wonder though if you couldn't have them take the test?

[zibazinski]

I should have let DS start college. DD did. I wish I had had the option or parents who gave a shit about my education to begin with as opposed to viewing me as a freak because I had a brain.

[973beachbum]

Apr 19, 2013 17:43:04 GMT -5 @tbird said:

www.ctd.northwestern.edu/resources/displayArticle/?id=153

Colleges and universities have always accepted students without a high school diploma. More and more are instituting special early entrance programs to attract and nurture exceptionally able younger students. The increasing number of early entrants and early entrance programs is reflected in a growing body of research into the effects of early entrance. These studies enable us to answer some basic questions about early entrance and to offer students and parents guidelines on how to think through entering college early.

admissions.illinois.edu/apply/requirements_policies.html

Early Admission Program Under the Early Admission Program, a high school student meeting competitive admission requirements except receipt of a high school diploma may be enrolled in the University before graduating from high school. Although each application is treated as a special admission case, a prospective student must have earned 15 units toward a high school diploma, be in good academic standing, provide three letters of recommendation from high school staff members who are able to evaluate the student’s work, and meet competitive admission standards. In addition, a form signed by a counselor or principal acknowledging the student’s desire to attend Illinois is required. Those accepted in the program are enrolled in regular four-year curricula and treated as first-year students. A student interested in this program may apply for admission no sooner than January preceding the fall term of planned entry so that the application can include complete information about the student’s fall semester. However, the application should be completed as soon as possible after January 1.

There are also places like CC's that have open enrollment.    They don't have any requirements as far as prior education or such. They do have entrance exams for placement purposes though. So the student who is homeschooled or just tired of their HS can go to the CC no questions asked as far as HS requiremtns. The problem though is that most have age restrictions because they really don't want to be responsible for young kids. the student also can be required to take remedial classes. So just because a student is taking a class at the college, at whatever age, doesn't mean it is a college level class.

fifteen units is also probably three years also. Normal is 7 a year so they are still saying they don't want anyone under 16.

[Sum Dum Gai]

I guess I'm summing up by asking - why isn't the same "shortcut" available for kids in regular education?  And should it be?

It is there.  Or at least, I know in Arizona it is.  I couldn't take the GED until I was 16, so they waived that requirement for me.  I also couldn't take the SAT because it's only offered through the high school.  I could take the ACT at the college though.  I also had to take some basic math and language arts proficiency exams.  They're the same ones all new students take, but they weren't pass/fail they were to place you in classes.  If you don't score that well you have to take sub 100 level courses to catch up.  The college I went to put me on academic probation pending completion of my GED which had to wait a while, but there was a path to get me enrolled as a full time college student when I was underage.

[Sum Dum Gai]

Is that a joke or are you seriously comparing playing with your own kids to some twenty something from the college wanting to hang out with your preteen girls tbecause they think they might have so much in common?

I've spent the last three years as a twenty something hanging out with preteen girls because I volunteer my time to teach them a sport, and I know for damn sure I'm not a pedophile.

Our community jazz band is composed of people in the 20s through 70s and this year accepted a 12 year old kid that's in 6th grade.  Kid is fucking good too.  I don't think they're all pedophiles because they spend their free time sharing something they love with a 12 year old kid that has the same interest.

I went to college at 14 and 15 and the twenty somethings in my classes weren't pedophiles.  They all assumed I was a kind of odd young twenty something.  None of them even knew I was underage until one study group kept insisting on meeting at a bar and I had to explain why I couldn't go.

[Deleted]

My friends 14 year old is the longest standing member of their local university chess club... All the other members keep graduating. He also plays tennis with them... 

[973beachbum]

Talk about intentionally missing the point.

There is a BIG difference between having a little kid in your college class and being nice to them, or me coaching soccer for 8-12 year olds, and me wanting to spend time with a 9 year old, that isnt my kid, because "we have so much in common I think we should hang out"  No one here would ever want their preteen to go hang out with the adults from college, outside of class, so they can have fun together.  Yet we would all let our kids hang out and have fun with other kids their age.  dHyperbole aside everyone of us would think the adult is a perv for wanting to spend time alone with our little kid instead of people their own age.

Of course the adults that teach at the college or the other students don't have any motives that caused them to have that 9 year old in their class.  I try very hard to be nice to all the kids on the soccer team.  But make no mistake if I asked one of the kids to "hang out with me" outside of soccer practice or them playing with my 10 year old.  The whole town would think I'm a perv.

This type of thing is about the adult parents wanting their child at college, not the kids IMO.  Anyone can enroll in a college that has open enrollment.  The question of should you is the thing that most people in these situations don't think about.  Even if a 9 year old can do the work in the college class isn't a reason to have them there.  Does anyone here who is a parent really want to have to be responsible for someone else's 9 year old in a college chem class?  What college prof would want to have someone that young in their class that they are suddenly responsible for?  That would be a liability nightmare! 

[Sum Dum Gai]

Talk about intentionally blowing things way out of proportion.

My youngest brother is six years younger than I am.  When I was 18, or the age of the average college freshman, he was 12, or the age of the kid in the op.  We still had things in common.  Not a ton of things, granted, but things.  Enough that we could spend time together outside of school.  It's not as weird as you're making it sound, and immediately jumping to pedophile is honestly kind of disturbing.

Anyone else here have younger siblings that were 6 or more years younger than you?  Were you a pedophile because you hung out with them once in a while?

[Deleted]

When I was in H.S. the University of California had dual enrollment - you had to be invited to apply but once you got in you could take classes at the U and did not have to reapply for admission.  I believe they even used the same admissions application. My friend took classes at the C.C. and graduated a year early - she got permission from our school.

Twelve seems young to be in college, maybe not academically but I wonder if they are getting the same things out of the literature for example, simply because some things are easier to appreciate with more life experience.  But the kids seem to have done well and if they are happy then good for them.

This reminds me of the Polgars, a couple that I read about that decided to get married (good genetics) and see if they could deliberately raise geniuses. The three girls were homeschooled and became world chess champions.  It's an interesting take on nature vs nurture in terms of education and intelligence.

[Deleted]

And maybe that's a problem with our society today. 12-16 year olds used to hang out with adults. They used to be apprentices, they used to be socialized BY adults and not teenagers...

[Deleted]

I don't think taking a mixed class would be an issue. I think moving them into a dorm would be problematic.

i don't think any of us were assuming the 12 year old is going for the whole college experience.

What I was addressing above was more your idea that 12, 16 and adult year olds should somehow live in separate circles.... 

[Sum Dum Gai]

and do you not see the difference between family relationships and a stranger cultivating a friendship with a 12 yo?

I do, but I also don't assume that any adult who tries to mentor a child that isn't theirs is a pedophile.  Guess I'm weird like that.

[Deleted]

You can take college entrance exams at any time.  In the South, there is the Duke Talent Identification Program in 7th grade that attempts to identify the really smart kids on the basis of college entrance exams.  So if you rank in the upper 5% based on achievement tests, you can take the ACT or SAT.  If you score as well or better than the average college student, you receive a certificate and the opportunity to participate in outstanding summer program (which cost a lot, though . . . LOL).

So my guess is that these kids probably took the SAT in 7th grade or thereabouts.  They scored sufficiently high enough that their parents explored enrolling them in college.  I would think that any parent could do that if interested.

And even back when I was in high school, there was the option of skipping your senior year of high school and enrolling directly in college.  That's a gamble of sorts, though, because if you drop out of college, you don't even have a high school diploma.  I think of Dark who was taking college classes in high school and got bored.  Wouldn't that be embarrassing to have no high school diploma or college degree?  How would that affect your future employment?

What you do after college would strike me as a real problem.  Despite Doogie Howzer, I imagine that most of the professions have a minimum age to be licensed to practice.  For teaching in Alabama, it is age 20.  I know because I was barely 20 when I graduated.  It was a combination of skipping a grade and finishing college in 3 years.  Yes, these kids can go on to graduate school and be doctors at age 20 or 21.  But there's going to be a credibility gap.

When my son took that algebra class, he said no one talked to him except the professor.  He didn't really care, but he did notice that no one was very friendly toward a fourteen-year-old kid.  I personally think it was a good experience because he was such a know-it-all, but I didn't push it. 

[sheilaincali]

DS' friend has been in the program at Duke that southernsusana mentioned.  He's a freshman this year and will be doing it again this summer.  He really enjoys the program but our school didn't publicize that option. His mom found out about it and had him take the exams but didn't mention it to any of the other parents until 2 years later. 

[Deleted]

Can we assume these are high IQ kids?  Maybe it says we should be giving more individualized learning to children with higher potential.  Slow tracking everyone to a low median education level does not help anyone.

In general all children could be tracked faster through school with more focused education time during school.

I went to a school system that did track students based on IQ.  They got sued & told to knock it off.  Guess it's better to be mediocre together than to take the brightest students and accelerate their capabilities.  Sometimes the masses are kind of stupid.