Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Apr 18, 2013 14:37:14 GMT -5
Some of us have no natural teaching ability...... I once tried to explain something to my oldest DS and after a few attempts and it not making any sense to him he says "It's a good thing you don't homeschool us, we'd all be stupid!" and he's right. I just can't teach. And I think I'm right there with you CL. Teaching is not natural to me. I'm in awe of those for whom it is.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 18, 2013 14:37:30 GMT -5
I can teach just fine, it's my personality that don't match up. I get irritated having to explain something several times over. But to have to teach pretty much everything for 18 years? I'd rather stick a fork in my eye. This why I have no desire to be a professor anymore. I think DH could do it, he has the patience for it. Gwen and I are too much alike. I forsee the same situation happening that would occur every time my dad tried to help me with my homework. It wasn't pretty. I'll leave the bulk of the work to trained professionals and supplement at home.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Apr 18, 2013 14:41:10 GMT -5
I can teach just fine, it's my personality that don't match up. I get irritated having to explain something several times over. But to have to teach pretty much everything for 18 years? I'd rather stick a fork in my eye. This why I have no desire to be a professor anymore. I think DH could do it, he has the patience for it. Gwen and I are too much alike. I forsee the same situation happening that would occur every time my dad tried to help me with my homework. It wasn't pretty. I'll leave the bulk of the work to trained professionals and supplement at home. I left out all thoughts of how horribly impatient I am, figured everyone knows that by now ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/tongue2.png)
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swasat
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Post by swasat on Apr 18, 2013 14:41:13 GMT -5
People say that (a lot), but for me it just feels like an extension of parenting. I disagree about this..... So if schooling is a extension of parenting then why do you want the kids to go to college? Or does homeschooling mean that the parents only need to know or provide enough for a K-12 education. Why wouldn't (or shouldn't) your parenting abilities extend to your kids college education? Its perfectly fine that you homeschool. I am a firm beleiever to each his own. But educating your kids is not an extension of parenting IMO.
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swasat
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Post by swasat on Apr 18, 2013 14:46:55 GMT -5
Yes I do disagree with you. And you find it funny because ...... ?? ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/huh.gif)
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 18, 2013 14:51:16 GMT -5
I'd rather just stick with foisting my sub-par teaching skills on unsuspecting summer students. At least if I screw up with them they just don't come back to the lab next year. I screw up with Gwen and she could be living in my basement forever. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png)
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 18, 2013 14:51:20 GMT -5
I think you can feel differently about your kids as they age. Changing a diaper was a natural thing to do as a parent, but I wouldn't feel it very natural to do it now that they are 10. Having my kids live in my house feels very natural, but they better not live there when they are 30. So, if wrongside feels that educating her school aged children feels natural, it doesn't mean that she thinks it has to last forever.
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Apr 18, 2013 15:02:18 GMT -5
I hate trying to define words that are more concepts than concrete things. One day my brother and I and our kids were at Chipotle. I said, "This Chipotle is especially good today." My 6-year-old nephew asked me, "What does 'especially' mean?" I was struggling to explain. He said to me, "Aunt K, why are you using a word if you don't know what it means?" Little pill. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) I said, "I know what it means. I used it right. I just don't know how to explain it to you." DD keeps asking what an expression is. I give her examples, but it's a tricky concept for a 3-year-old.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Apr 18, 2013 15:02:37 GMT -5
My thoughts on homeschooling --- I gave birth to two very smart sons and sent them to private school. I still have two sons and they did great have v. good jobs and are well establised in life. Now if I had tried to homeschool my statement wuld be decidely different: I once had two sons and now I have none. And your taxes would have paid for the lunch I just ate. Dang, I should have thought this out a little better. Free food and housing for live in exchange for a couple of years of attempting to homeschool ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/angry.png)
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 18, 2013 15:08:15 GMT -5
I once had two sons and now I have none. And your taxes would have paid for the lunch I just ate. Dang, I should have thought this out a little better. Free food and housing for live in exchange for a couple of years of attempting to homeschool
![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/rofl.gif)
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telephus44
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Post by telephus44 on Apr 18, 2013 15:11:04 GMT -5
I really like oped's idea that you are in charge of managing your child's education. For us, that means putting our son in public school. Because of his autism, it's currently the best option for him - he gets a lot of supports, but he's also in a regular classroom and has lot of "normal" behavior to model.
And a lot of teaching him through life lessons we do anyways. We teach him about fractions when baking. We play "Dunkin Donuts" where we pretend to buy donuts and he has to compute the correct change. We have several maps of the Solar System in his room. I consider this part of managing his education - public school doesn't teach him everything, so we supplement with additional learning at home.
I think that in general, educational style should match what the child is best suited for. For some kids that's homeschooling. For some kids that's public or private school. Some children needs more structure. Some kids have more internal motivation.
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zdaddy
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Post by zdaddy on Apr 18, 2013 15:33:09 GMT -5
Unschooling is an interesting subject, but as long as a parent is supplementing what a kid is learning at school, aren't there some valuable lessons to be learned? For example, how to put up with bad bosses, how to deal day-to-day with annoying coworkers, and how to handle pointless busywork with a smile on your face? I'm all for encouraging kids to follow their dreams, but that doesn't seem all that realistic in the modern economy.
Also the Chinese and Indians are eating our lunch, and IMHO one of the secrets of their success is just how rigorous and challenging their educational systems are.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 15:54:44 GMT -5
I want to seel the idea of "unworking" to my boss ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) I have found it's better just to put it in practice without bothering Management. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png)
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Sam_2.0
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Post by Sam_2.0 on Apr 18, 2013 15:57:59 GMT -5
Unschooling is an interesting subject, but as long as a parent is supplementing what a kid is learning at school, aren't there some valuable lessons to be learned? For example, how to put up with bad bosses, how to deal day-to-day with annoying coworkers, and how to handle pointless busywork with a smile on your face? I'm all for encouraging kids to follow their dreams, but that doesn't seem all that realistic in the modern economy.
Also the Chinese and Indians are eating our lunch, and IMHO one of the secrets of their success is just how rigorous and challenging their educational systems are. bbm IMO, those countries are doing well because they drop the low performers. Around here everyone can get an education. Over there, if you are not performing, then you go work in a factory or something.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 18, 2013 15:58:59 GMT -5
For example, how to put up with bad bosses, how to deal day-to-day with annoying coworkers, and how to handle pointless busywork with a smile on your face?
Gwen could learn that just fine by having me as a teacher. I can be an annoying bad boss/co-worker and give out busy work with the best of them. Just ask some summer students I've worked with ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) .
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 18, 2013 16:02:22 GMT -5
Over there, if you are not performing, then you go work in a factory or something.
Not everyone goes to school period in those countries. There is some serious grinding poverty that the governments turn a blind eye to. Lots of uneducated people over there.
Here education up to at least 16 is mandatory. I can be put in jail if my kid doesn't attend.
Those kids in poverty that aren't sent to school don't make it into their shiny education stats.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Apr 18, 2013 16:08:58 GMT -5
I want to seel the idea of "unworking" to my boss ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) I'm pretty sure you already have ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png)
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 18, 2013 16:18:02 GMT -5
My thoughts on homeschooling --- I gave birth to two very smart sons and sent them to private school. I still have two sons and they did great have v. good jobs and are well establised in life. Now if I had tried to homeschool my statement wuld be decidely different: I once had two sons and now I have none. And your taxes would have paid for the lunch I just ate. Dang, I should have thought this out a little better. Free food and housing for live in exchange for a couple of years of attempting to homeschool ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/angry.png) LOL - I love my kids, but holy smokes, I didn't think my son was going to make it through breakfast. He is practicing being annoying, and getting darn good at it. We left for the bus stop a few minutes early - sanity!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 16:33:50 GMT -5
I just spent the last two days at a two day lab science intensive with the kids, which they run throughout the country, I didn't teach ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png) , does a whole year of labs in two days. I didn't teach, but it was a long two days, plus the driving down and back, spent the morning today at co op, afternoon at the library book sale, am exhausted. Meanwhile, this thread blew up, but I doubt I'll get to it tonight. Will try tomorrow, if any one is interested in my take as for college, no problem. I've already talked to several reps. Most like homeschooled kids, some even court them. Colleges know how to evaluate portfolios, nd read unusual transcripts. No need to use an 'approved curriculum', although you might want to stay away from certain religious science texts if you want them to count as pre-requisites. You don't need a GED or diploma program. i will say that this is true for PA. We do have rigorous standards though for homeschooling. I know some parents in other states do use a lot more CLEP, etc. pre college. The college reps I talked to said that really isn't necessary. Most homeschool kids have college credits of sme kind by graduation.
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Sam_2.0
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Post by Sam_2.0 on Apr 18, 2013 16:35:10 GMT -5
Can't wait to see what you have to say, oped.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Apr 18, 2013 18:08:24 GMT -5
I agree with Wrongside, but by that same token I don't think teaching your children is limited to those who homeschool (or unschool). Are you me? The ironic thing is that my dad is a teacher, and apparently a good one. It must skip a generation... Now that I'm prohibited from engaging in contact sports for the next 7 months I've been relegated to teaching basic skills to our new skaters. It is PAINFUL. Hopefully I improve at explaining things before my kid starts asking many questions. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png)
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Apr 18, 2013 18:32:31 GMT -5
We don't home school, and we don't unschool. I think that what you have listed is simply good parenting, and it isn't limited to homeschooling or unschooling. I start baking with my kids at age 2. I have them make brownies from scratch. You just need a mixing bowl and a spoon. I do hold off egg cracking though until they are 5ish. I was shocked at how coveted cracking a stupid egg or two is in our household. We let our kids buy small things. My oldest is pretty keen on money. At 5, he could buy a pack of pokemon cards, figure out the coins needed, and knew what the heck sales tax was. We do enrich our kids' interests at any given time....My oldest wanted to go see bison in person. So we planned a vacation out to South Dakota for a week and a half. My oldest also wants to go to Yellowstone. Hopefully we'll get there in 2 years, maybe more like 3. When he was big into Egypt, we went to a couple museums within a 4 hour drive from our house that had decent exhibits on Egypt.. My middle child really digs creative processes. She's a little too young yet, to take to concerts/dance performances. When the time comes, absolutely, she'll be going to what she wishes too. She has unlimited access to stickers, crayons, markers, paper, glue, etc and will keep herself busy for quite some time with these things. She can't wait to set up her easel and paint outside..We do enroll her in classes in her interests, mostly because we don't have the space/money to accommodate her interests in our home (ie, setting up a dance studio or gymnastics gym). I'm not knocking homeschooling/unschooling. I've seen it work really well for families. I don't think these folks have the corner on involved parenting, where the child leads with their interest, though.. ETA: We do not dictate what the kids read for the most part. My DS eats up everything from Captain Underpants to fiction with mythology woven into it, to the old GI comics from when DH was young, to a yearly almanac with a million factoids in it. Now, if he wanted to read 50 shades of grey, well, I'd put my foot down on that, seeing as he's 9. For the most part, I don't care, as long as he's reading... You're right in that it is nothing more than good parenting. My point, I think, is that these kids shouldn't be getting pushed like they are. My goodness...is it really that important that they are getting taught pre-algebra at the ages they are or required to do hours of homework each night? It's burning so many of these kids out and it's little wonder they aren't passing the tests. A teacher can only do so much. Why so many subjects, so fast, so early? These are kids, for Pete's sake, and there is so much time to learn what they need! At least for awhile, let them be kids. Who is burned out? Who isn't "being a kid?" My kids (6&8) like doing math. They specifically asked me to make up a sheet of 50 2-digit subtraction problems to work on in the car the other day. I know lots of kids who love to read. Or spell. Or go on and on and on about dinosaurs or earthquakes. Learning is fun (or at least is should be). What I don't get about unschooling advocates is that their philosophy seems to be based on the concept that learning is hard/stressful/boring and kids shouldn't be subjected to it. And yet they are the ones who propose being teachers! If you think learning is hard/stressful/boring you shouldn't be a teacher.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 18:43:38 GMT -5
Ok a lot to read. Let me catch up then I'll post.
Also I was able to watch the show on demand.
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Plain Old Petunia
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Post by Plain Old Petunia on Apr 18, 2013 19:25:38 GMT -5
You're right in that it is nothing more than good parenting. My point, I think, is that these kids shouldn't be getting pushed like they are. My goodness...is it really that important that they are getting taught pre-algebra at the ages they are or required to do hours of homework each night? It's burning so many of these kids out and it's little wonder they aren't passing the tests. A teacher can only do so much. Why so many subjects, so fast, so early? These are kids, for Pete's sake, and there is so much time to learn what they need! At least for awhile, let them be kids. Who is burned out? Who isn't "being a kid?" My kids (6&8) like doing math. They specifically asked me to make up a sheet of 50 2-digit subtraction problems to work on in the car the other day. I know lots of kids who love to read. Or spell. Or go on and on and on about dinosaurs or earthquakes. Learning is fun (or at least is should be). What I don't get about unschooling advocates is that their philosophy seems to be based on the concept that learning is hard/stressful/boring and kids shouldn't be subjected to it. And yet they are the ones who propose being teachers! If you think learning is hard/stressful/boring you shouldn't be a teacher. Oh, no. The unschooling philosophy is not that students shouldn't be subected to learning. It is about the student learning based on their own interests. So the student learns about dinosaurs if/when dinosaurs grab their attention; they don't learn about dinosaurs because someone else arbitrarily included dinosaurs in their lesson plan that day.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:11:12 GMT -5
Everyone has something they aren't good at or given half the chance wouldn't do it. My question is as an unschooler how would you make sure your kid learns what he/she needs to learn if they show no desire to learn it? An unschooled would not make them learn it if they had no interest in learning it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:16:18 GMT -5
I would love to hear an answer for DQ's question as well. Does homeschooling leave out any topic that the child is not interested in? If it does, till when? Is there a certain age after which serious homechooling families tell the kid "Suck it up, buttercup!" and make them go through it? . Unschooling lets children pursue their own topics, so yes, leaves out what a child shows no interest in. However, not all homeschoolers are unschoolers. Generally speaking, if you keep topics broad, kids will find something interesting in it...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:19:10 GMT -5
Cleaning up and sharing are two things I will never, ever learn or desire from within my being. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/yeahright.png) But I do have desires from within which make cleaning up necessary... Thus you come to it...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:30:03 GMT -5
Swasat and sheliaincali Here is my process for Algebra so far. We are back to Saxon. I buy the DIVE DVD. Son watches the lesson, reads the book, does the lesson. If he doesn't understand, he comes to me. If we need more, we turn to Khan Academy, etc. If we still don't get it, I have a math tutor I can call. I have not had to call the tutor through pre algebra, I'm sure by algebra 2 I will. We will also consider college intro classes as we progress. I have math kids. If I didn't, I might actually have backed off on math, but my kids have never really struggled with it, although son did have the wrong curriculum for him last year which was a short term issue.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:36:18 GMT -5
You guys also need to stop the highlight real to lows comparisons. Even when I see a less than ideal homeschool situation, first question I ask myself is if it is worse than what the kid in school would be like. Most kids who aren't having an 'ideal'' situation in homeschool would not suddenly have a STEM degree if only they were sent to school.... Drama, kids actually do have the desire to learn stuff... ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) Wrongside... I can remember being asked by people when we didn't send son to K.. Basically, .Are you going to teach him now?... I was like, well, I've basically been teaching him stuff nice I popped him out... Don't plan on stopping any time soon, lol... I really think that it's a lifestyle thing that, if you don't experience it first hand, it is hard to really grasp fully.... ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2013 20:43:55 GMT -5
As far as type of schooling, public, private, homeschooling, unschooling... Personality and aptitude are certainly important.
My most ardent unschooling friend is a never say no type. She is generally pretty easy going, but she can get a bit preachy about it occasionally. She had three really easy kids though. Calm, content, if her toddler was playing with a plastic bag and she told him dont put it over your head, he wouldn't.
She has a grandson who lives with them. Most demanding child ever. She says things like, 'he climbs on the table?.. Is that normal?' ... Lol. Different keeping up with a different kind of kid...
another thought... Someone said about most homeschoolers being religious not libertarian. This may be true for homeschooling ( although secular is growing), but its not true for UNSCHOOLers... Most unschoolers I've met are very libertarian and unschooling is an extension of that philosophy...
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