formerroomate99
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Post by formerroomate99 on Jul 30, 2012 14:31:12 GMT -5
... to encourage breastfeeding. Holy carp! Now the state is getting involved in the mommy guilt bandwagon? www.nypost.com/p/news/local/mayor_knows_breast_WqU1iYRQvwbEkDuvn0vb1HMayor Bloomberg is pushing hospitals to hide their baby formula behind locked doors so more new mothers will breast-feed. Starting Sept. 3, the city will keep tabs on the number of bottles that participating hospitals stock and use — the most restrictive pro-breast-milk program in the nation. 'But it’s our job to educate them on the best option.' - Allison Walsh, of Beth Israel Medical Center. Under the city Health Department’s voluntary Latch On NYC initiative, 27 of the city’s 40 hospitals have also agreed to give up swag bags sporting formula-company logos, toss out formula-branded tchotchkes like lanyards and mugs, and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receives. While breast-feeding activists applaud the move, bottle-feeding moms are bristling at the latest lactation lecture. “If they put pressure on me, I would get annoyed,” said Lynn Sidnam, a Staten Island mother of two formula-fed girls, ages 4 months and 9 years. “It’s for me to choose.” Under Latch On NYC, new mothers who want formula won’t be denied it, but hospitals will keep infant formula in out-of-the-way secure storerooms or in locked boxes like those used to dispense and track medications. With each bottle a mother requests and receives, she’ll also get a talking-to. Staffers will explain why she should offer the breast instead. “It’s the patient’s choice,” said Allison Walsh, of Beth Israel Medical Center. “But it’s our job to educate them on the best option.” ....
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 14:36:50 GMT -5
We're already talking about it over on the pregnancy thread. I saw it last night on ABC News.
I think they could kiss my ass and any nurse who wants to "lecture" me would be picking teeth up off the floor.
I also think they should make synthetic boobs and make Mr. Bloomberg wear them and use them for a week. Set up one of those robot Home Ec babies that he has to nurse and give him a pump that he has to use at least three times a day at work.
Then give him a round of mastistis and some supply issues.
Then let's see how quick he is to decide that he knows what is best for me and my baby.
Hate to say it but P&M was right when they said the 48 oz soda ban was the start. Once you give your mayor the power to regulate your every day life, it's not going to stop.
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formerroomate99
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Post by formerroomate99 on Jul 30, 2012 14:46:38 GMT -5
This sort of thing wouldn't affect people like us, drama, but there are a lot of women out there that are intimidated by medical professionals and this policy could cause all kinds of harm.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 14:48:59 GMT -5
Shouldn't he be so busy running the city he doesn't have time to worry about what I do with my boobs? YOu would think being the mayor of NYC he would have more important things he should be focusing on.
I really like my idea of making him wear fake lactating boobs, anyone who wants to try to make me breastfeed should have to experience it for himself.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 30, 2012 14:53:30 GMT -5
Maybe it is cheaper to provide poor women with nutrition and education about breast feeding vs. supplying formula for them, and this is a push to lower the cost of any new baby assistance programs. I mean, if they had restricted my use, it wouldn't have been that big of a deal, because I gave my son 1 bottle of formula in the hospital, and then went home and bought my own.
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flopsy
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Post by flopsy on Jul 30, 2012 15:00:19 GMT -5
How much time do new moms spend in the hospital? I thought you got the boot by the next day at the latest
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 15:00:57 GMT -5
Doubt it. I think this goes way too far. The mayor should have more important things to do than regulate how I feed my baby. That should be a private discussion between me, my OB and my kid's pediatrician. Everyone else can butt out.
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formerroomate99
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Post by formerroomate99 on Jul 30, 2012 15:12:58 GMT -5
Not really. A good breastpump will set you back a good $300+, and there are all kids of other accessories that become necessary if you want to hold down a job. And many of the women who are on WIC work the kinds of jobs that don't lend themselves well to pumping and where they are least likely to get any kind of accomodation from employers. And there are also a LOT of women who simply can't breastfeed, so the state will end up buying a breastpump and formula.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 15:18:34 GMT -5
Breastfeeding moms should stay home. That'll give YM a whole new set of people to bash! I do agree with you. Society has to come a lot farther than it has before you are really going to get everyone to breastfeed. You can't expect a woman working at Wal-mart to commit to EBfing for one to two years. Even in more "well off" jobs it can be hard to do. If I didn't work for the company I do and the bosses that I do I never would have been able to EBF for a year. Even with the accommodations and support it was an enormous task with the type of job I do. I haven't pumped now in a year and it still feels like I am playing catch up.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 15:22:03 GMT -5
How much time do new moms spend in the hospital? I thought you got the boot by the next day at the latest No, insurance is required to pay for 48 hrs of postpartum care at a minimum for a vaginal delivery and 72 for c-sections. This came after they were booting women out after 24 hrs a decade or so ago.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 30, 2012 15:24:06 GMT -5
I guess if they can get you BF-ing for the first 48 hours, they are hoping it will stick.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 15:24:34 GMT -5
This is what I posted on Babycenter on the topic: I think as a country we need to focus on long term support of nursing mothers instead of just pressuring them to get started. The lack of nursing eductation in this country and support is ridiculously low, but the pressure to breastfeed to try to breastfeed is high. This leads to something like a 75% rate of women trying, but less than 50% making it to 6 months and less than 25% making it to a year. Our focus should be providing support to women to help them make it as long as THEY want. Our focus should be normallizing breastfeeding so that if you are nursing in public people don't freak out on you. Yes I realize this is a "baby friendly" initiative, but Bloomberg needs to stay out of it. Unless he is going to help provide long term solutions and force employers to be more nursing mom friendly, then he needs to leave this issue alone. www.cdc.gov/breastfeeding/pdf/2011BreastfeedingReportCard.pdf (I double checked my stats before I posted and I thought the national rate for trying to breastfeed was more like 90% and at a year was 10%. The actually numbers do change my perception a bit, but I still think we need to focus on overall education and support and not just getting women started in the hospital).
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 15:26:00 GMT -5
Maybe it is cheaper to provide poor women with nutrition and education about breast feeding vs. supplying formula for them, and this is a push to lower the cost of any new baby assistance programs. I mean, if they had restricted my use, it wouldn't have been that big of a deal, because I gave my son 1 bottle of formula in the hospital, and then went home and bought my own. Women with low income jobs are going to be the least likely to have an employer that allows time to pump at work or cares about. Low income women are more likely to go back to work early because their jobs aren't protected or they may be the only ones providing any income.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 15:29:04 GMT -5
DQ Mutt. Mini rant on support I was surprised at how there was not a single breastfeeding support group available on weekends or at night. Every single one of them in the area was during work hours. Nice to know that apparently we working moms don't need support.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 15:39:41 GMT -5
You know i was told on Babycenter that because I was going back to work when DS was 3 weeks old that we would NEVER have a successful breastfeeding relationship because all the "rules" would have to be "broken" to make it work. These were "lactation Nazis" telling me too bad so sad, can't you stay home longer. We made it to 15 months. A year with no formula (except one small bottle in the hospital because the stupid lacation consultant had me position DS so he tore my nipples to shreds - thank god my doula helped us get it straightened out the next day) and started whole milk at 11 months. But when "experts" tell you, you can't do it and give you bad advice, it is can be very hard to overcome without people helping you get things straightened out. I mainly did it because I was cheap and DS was a good nurser. If I hadn't had my doula, I think things would have been very different.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Jul 30, 2012 15:44:03 GMT -5
I think its a dumb plan. Like muttley said unless you change how employers treat this, it won't change. I work in a professional job in an office and I'd have trouble with this. I'm at a cube, high traffic area, no privacy.
Visiting staff tends to use extra offices. And I'm sure some morons would bitch if I was given one temporarily. Add in travel for audits and training and I see how it'd be hard and I have an office job.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 15:46:02 GMT -5
I wasn't able to see the LC because I gave birth on the weekend (something the hospital I gave birth at and the one I work at are trying to fix). The nurses didnt' give me BAD advice but it wasn't the right advice. My milk had already come in, I wasn't under supplying, I was oversupplying. Then I had everyone warning me I needed to start pumping ASAP otherwise I'd never make enough to go back to work. It was when I experienced round #3 of engorgement that I called the LC. Thank god I did because I was two steps away from permenately regulating myself to that level. It took me four months to get to where I produced just enough for Gwen and not an army of babies. Technically she was not supposed to talk to me. She said, at the time, there was no way to do out patient consulting because they had no way to bill. So it was hospital policy that once I was booted out that was it, no more help for me. She told me they were pushing to change that and I know they are working on changing it here as well. It is insane that I am pushed by the hospital to breastfeed but then I am booted out on my butt with no help at all after 48 hours. Then workplaces aren't always accomodating and God help you if you breastfeed in public in some areas. But I am a bad mother if I accept reality rather than trying to force things to work. I realize how incredibly lucky I am to have some of the people I do in my life, I would not have been able to accomplish what I did if I didn't come into the set of circumstances I am currently in.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 15:54:28 GMT -5
Even better is that for most women their milk hasn't even come in within 48hrs. They have no idea how breastfeeding is going to go. They typically don't have many (or any) role models at home to help them out. It is definately a learned skill, but it is learned for both mom and baby. I heard it referred to as a dance and I agree with that. I'm actually much more nervous about breastfeeding #2 than I was #1 because even when things go well, they can still go wrong. Plus, I know my DS was a champ and this baby might not be.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jul 30, 2012 15:57:19 GMT -5
Wow, This is so dumb, I find it hard to believe medical professionals are going along with it. There is a lot of literature that indicates breastfeeding is best, at least there was when I was having my kids. My kids are 18 and 15. When DS was born, I tried to breastfeed. He was 6 lbs 1 oz. He had trouble latching on. I did the whole route, I had the pump and everything. I gave up in a short time, with my Dr's blessing b/c they were afraid for DS to lose to much weight b/c he was so small when he was born. When I was expecting DD my Mom asked me if I intended to try to breastfeed again. I told her I was thinking about it. She told me she thought I suffered from Post Partum Depression when I had DS and that the problems I experienced trying to Breastfeed probably contributed. She advised me not to try again, and I did not. I can not imagine having trouble nursing and having breastfeeding Nazi nurses lecturing you about doing what's best for your baby. . I am sure I have seen more recently that the breast is best studies were not 100% accurate.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 15:57:42 GMT -5
I'm a horrible excuse for a mother , I told DH if I ever have a second it is formula from day one. I said I have been there, done that, got the T-shirt. I am not going to bet the farm that somehow kid #2 is going to be so much better than my experience with Gwen. I am incredibly proud of what I did but now that I have the experience to compare it to I am doing things different with a second.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 30, 2012 16:03:18 GMT -5
Biologically speaking, breast is best. We are mammals. Mammals create milk that is perfectly suited to their offspring. Every mammal's milk is uniquely designed to match its offsprings needs. So no, nothing artifical or any other mammal's milk is going to be as good as your species own. That being said, I've read a few studies (actual peer reviewed studies published in legit journals) and not a single one has concluded that formula is "dangerous" in any fashion. Even the one that momaha blogger posted about "formula causes SIDS" did not say that, she spun it that way to push her agenda. The article stated clearly that there is a CORRELATION between breastfeeding and reduction in SIDS. They have no clue why and aren't even sure it is really revelant. There was no mention of formula increasing SIDS risk because there was no direct comparision done. But we can't havethe actual facts now can we, then we wouldn't be able to scare women into doing exactly what we want them to do.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 16:10:35 GMT -5
Actually the ask for formula is part of the healthy baby inititiave and something hospitals have to do to be certified baby friendly (or something like that). It says more on the CDC link, but I just wanted the stats. And there is some truth to the if you start with a bottle of formula it can exasperate issues, but that is an education issue and unfortunately most people in the united states don't understand how nursing works. We aren't exposed to it like they were in the past or in other countries. We are told to breastfeed, but only do it in our homes and "how dare you whip out your boob to feed your child in public". "That is nasty". We are told to "sit in the bathroom to feed our babies". So, not only are we being stunted in our efforts to breast, future generations aren't being exposed to it.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jul 30, 2012 20:36:27 GMT -5
I am the only one that thinks Bloomberg may have ulterior motives like reducing WIC since all mothers in "his" city are taugt to breastfeed so only the goo-for-nothing welfare leeches need formula and we should not support that. I like Drama's idea of the fake breast and everything that goes with breastfeeding unclding waking up umpteen times a night and being forced to stay awake for at least 45 minutes each time. And just don't let him off the hook too fast -> he needs to be forced to do this for at least a year . We'll talk again once he has done that
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 30, 2012 20:46:16 GMT -5
Muttley Joss (again).
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 30, 2012 21:03:08 GMT -5
and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receivesWith me, the reason would be that they don't want a bed pan stuffed down their throat again! I have two kids. I exclusively bF one and not the other. I am pretty sure I loved them both and did what I thoght was best for both. I made my decidions after much thought and talking with our Dr's. That isn't what this stupid ass law is about. That was about education and this is about power pure and simple. He needs his
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jul 31, 2012 0:01:27 GMT -5
I am the only one that thinks Bloomberg may have ulterior motives like reducing WIC since all mothers in "his" city are taugt to breastfeed so only the goo-for-nothing welfare leeches need formula Actually, I agree with you. If I ever ran for anything political, I'd suggest that gov't allow generic formula to be put on the "acceptable" list of formula for WIC. Do you know, as it stands, that the only "acceptable" formula is the brand name stuff in the itty-bitty containers that run $15 a pop. Seriously, on my birth boards at baby center, women on WIC say that WIC saves them over $100/month in formula costs. And, we're not talking about the special formula for kids that are super allergic. We're talking about run of the mill formula. All three of my kids were/are on generic target formula. I buy the huge honking cans, and when they are guzzling formula at 5 months, I'm still only paying $60/formula. So, let's say I'm saving $50/month on using generic formula vs what people spend on WIC. That's 600/year. There's 2 MILLION infants on WIC. Think about how much could be saved simply by making generic formula acceptable for WIC. Think about how they could take that money, and the money they give for juice (also spending money unnecessarily) and put it towards fresh fruits and veggies for kids. Wouldn't that be a better way to spend the money? Not withstanding needing help with super hypo allergenic stuff, I don't see why it's necessary to only allow brand name formulas at the taxpayer's expense. Something IS going to have to be done to start curbing the expenses of all our social services/gov't assistance programs. Maybe being obnoxious about breastfeeding isn't the answer, but something has to give soon. I've formula fed all my kids. I was surprised to hear that hospitals still hand out formula swag. Mine stopped doing that at least 5 years ago. I guess I don't see what the big deal is about locking up formula. Heck, if my area grocery stores lock up the formula that is on the WIC list, I would assume that there's a pretty good black market for it. I also wouldn't have a problem bringing in my own formula if it came down to it. Breastfeeding mom's bring in their own food to feed their kids... And as for a good breast-pump, you can buy a used Electric PIS and just get new tubing from the manufacturer. In fact, I had someone out right give me theirs. I couldn't use it, as the only thing that got any milk out was a hospital grade pump (The Medala Symphony), and I've never seen them sold at retail stores.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jul 31, 2012 0:54:09 GMT -5
Muttley Joss (again). Thanks Muttleyn and some Karma coming your way too
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jul 31, 2012 2:35:11 GMT -5
"Actually, I agree with you. If I ever ran for anything political, I'd suggest that gov't allow generic formula to be put on the "acceptable" list of formula for WIC. Do you know, as it stands, that the only "acceptable" formula is the brand name stuff in the itty-bitty containers that run $15 a pop. Seriously, on my birth boards at baby center, women on WIC say that WIC saves them over $100/month in formula costs. And, we're not talking about the special formula for kids that are super allergic. We're talking about run of the mill formula." And you can bet your petootie that this is the result of some good old fashioned lobbying. Yes we could save a lot of money in many programs if those in power( government) used some common sense rather than looking for and depending on the money they can get from industry lobbyist. So based on this total lack of confidence I have in those that decide where our tax money is to go, I don't believe for one minute that if there would be savings from this mandatory breast feeding edict that it would be used to improve the food provided under this program. It would just be spend on some pet program that is "incredibly important" in the eyes of someone. As for providing fresh fruit to poor kids instead? Who do they think we are Santa Claus?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 2:52:26 GMT -5
Bloomberg is a food freak. I'm telling you it is so obvious. He's pushing the donuts and hotdog eating contests while at the same time trying to ban the big gulp. and now this. He's got some food fetish going on too. He's a freaky food fetisher.
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skubikky
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Post by skubikky on Jul 31, 2012 5:37:58 GMT -5
I think as a country we need to focus on long term support of nursing mothers instead of just pressuring them to get started. This leads to something like a 75% rate of women trying, but less than 50% making it to 6 months and less than 25% making it to a year. Our focus should be providing support to women to help them make it as long as THEY want. I double checked my stats before I posted and I thought the national rate for trying to breastfeed was more like 90% and at a year was 10%. 1. I agree that Mayor Bloombergs insertion into BF is ridiculous but is absolutely based on economics. Perhaps that assumption that WIC costs or other supplemental programs would have less of a burden if more women decided to BF their babies. 2. I don't understand why these statistics concern you? There are many different reasons why babies aren't BF for longer than 3 months, 6 months or longer. Are you saying that because these Moms don't have "support" that they have ceased BF sooner than the La Leche League recommends? I think a part of those statistics are Moms that don't want to BF any longer. In my experience, both kids weaned themselves at 8 months. Who are you to say that I stopped before I wanted to? Who is anyone to say that my kids didn't get all the "benefits" of BF. Some people do it for a period of time and then transition. Some do a combination of both. Some just do formula. Some BF until their kids are well past a year. Hey, to each his own. But to attempt to legislate BF is ridiculous. Why not legislate birth control, vaccinations, dental treatments, a low fat diet?
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