Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jul 24, 2012 9:35:46 GMT -5
Ah, countering the old "correlation implies causation" logical fallacy. I suppose that deserves a karma.
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beags
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I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath, do your research.
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Post by beags on Jul 24, 2012 9:42:50 GMT -5
World of War . . yes, my son plays that as well. Make that both my children have. If you're talking about World of Warcraft, Beags, if your kids are young teens, please, please, please monitor them closely when they play that game. Nothing to do with the violence. That's your decision. Just a heads up. ages 16 and 20 .. . by now they have seen every violent thing they could despite my trying to protect them from it . . . we didn't even watch the news in front of them. Some of what is on there is more violent than any movie or video game. UNLIKE video games or movies . . .the events on the news have actually happened. No, when they were young they weren't exposed to any of that. My son being the younger child had been exposed earlier than my daughter but that's because the kids would come here and talk or play the games. Luckily for me the oldest was a girl and didn't have much interest in the violent games . . some of her male friends did though. The neighborhood in which he grew up (my son) didn't have many children his age . .they were all older. I don't believe that a boy at age 16 playing those games is any worse than one at age 18. By that point in life you have either instilled a sense of right and wrong in them or you haven't. They also understand at 16 the difference between real and fake. Then you have to consider that my 16 year old just finished recording his first CD with the band. The band has a small tour this summer. He's also a wrestler . . . so if he chooses to entertain himself with war games . . so be it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 9:42:51 GMT -5
why is there no "some are, some aren't" response?
One of my favorite games is State of Emergency for PS2. My favorite stage is the "kill all clones" stage. You have to kill all the clones (unarmed sillouhettes running around yelling and scared) in the shortest amount of time possible. Weapons: rocket launcher, axe, semi-automatic weapon, flame thrower, and (if you decapitate a clone) the head of a clone.
;D
On the other hand, I'm not a fan of the killing options in the Grand Theft Auto franchise, nor do I like anything Resident Evil-ish.
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Jul 24, 2012 9:47:07 GMT -5
This still comes back to some personal responsibility on the part of parents concerning what their children are doing. No they should not be banned....but parents..READ the damn label on the package.Its up to you, not some bureaucrat, to monitor what you children are doing
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beags
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I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath, do your research.
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Post by beags on Jul 24, 2012 9:47:13 GMT -5
" Also colors, gangs use colors to represent their affiliation, no colors will mean no more gang violence. " Our school district already does this. Doesn't stop the gangs from fighting. That being said, I am finding w/ my youngest, now 12, just how easily they are manipulated, and how kids her age lack a sense of reality. I am not comfortable w/ banning things, but I would not allow my son to play games w/ content I was not happy with. He tends to play the multi-player fantasy games on line w/ all his friends. There is violence, but the premise is not reality based. You contradicted yourself. If the game is not reality based and they lack a sense of reality . . . what difference does it make that the game is not reality based?
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Jul 24, 2012 9:50:31 GMT -5
Even as a kid, I would know this stuff was make believe. So, what the heck is the big deal? They don't cause squat! That idea is just the libs trying to blame something else for their bad seed.
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beags
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I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath, do your research.
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Post by beags on Jul 24, 2012 9:53:39 GMT -5
Also if you live in an area where gangs are rampant . . . your children were exposed to voilence long before they started playing video games.
That cannot be helped in some cases where you live. I'm just pointing out .. . if there's a lot of gangs, your child has been exposed to violence. Not much you can do about random shootings, or beatings in the street.
Which is the point when a masacre occurs everyone wants to point fingers on how this happened and they want to blame games, movies and everything else.
What it comes down to . . what is the one thing a gang member is lacking . . . . a sense of belonging. . . talk to any gang member and why they are in it. They will tell you . . . it's my family. What happened to that child's family that he had to turn to violence of a gang to have a sense of the love, and belonging that member should have felt from his/her parents.
(I just used laralei's post as an example . . . I'm not saying she's that type of parent . . she's obviously not)
What it comes down to is the person itself. The one who did the shooting .. . why is he that way? Why is his brain predisposed to this violence? Why does he not seem to grasp the difference between reality and fake? (you know one of us could watch batman, or play a violent game and we would never thing . . hey that would be great to reinact that scene . ..I'm going to start my planning now.)
Living in violent surroundings . . . although perhaps being exposed earlier . . . is not the main thing wrong . .. . the main thing which people don't understand is that his mind is disconnected. It's disconnected from those around him, this is how people like him are able to do that. They aren't in a real world in their mind . . . . look at how bored he was in the courtroom?
His mind is disconnected. That didn't happen with games, movies, . . . I don't know how it happened. I'm not a psychiatrist, and if one was present I think this discussion over violence in games would end. Because I don't believe that is the issue.
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PK Bucko
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Post by PK Bucko on Jul 24, 2012 9:54:41 GMT -5
This again...
Parents responsibility.
A rating system like the one used for movies is fine. But ultimately this is the parents decision. No censorship.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 24, 2012 10:00:33 GMT -5
wonder whether many parents, like myself, just aren't aware of what their kids are watching,
It's not too hard to research video games. If it exists there is some nerd somewhere that spent the last 24 hours playing hte game and then typed up a storyline for it. Gamestop also rates the games online.
I don't think video games create sociopaths. I think you are already a sociopath. If it wasn't Grand Theft Auto that set you off it was going to be something else eventually. It's only a matter of time.
You could ban video games, regulate them etc. Then he'd go off because he saw a violent movie (like Batman). So we ban violent movies. Where does it end?
You can't keep banning/regulating things hoping that you are going to stop the nutballs because the nutballs will ALWAYS find something that sets them off.
I don't want the government deciding what will and will not affect my mental state for me.
DH has played quite a few of the games talked about on here, he owns just about every Grand Theft Auto ever made. He's never confused it for being real. I've never seen him running around beating up hookers with baseball bats.
That being said we have discussed a lot of his games together now that we have a kid. There are some twisted games he plays that we feel are too mature for little eyes so those have been put away.
But I don't make him stop playing Resident Evil or any of those types of games. He's free to keep playing Grand Theft Auto.
We will screen what we allow her to play, that's our job as parents. A lot of times DH will probably be playing right along side her.
But I don't buy that I am going to keep her from being a sociopath by screening her games. If she's that level of crazy there isn't going to be much that I can do to prevent her from snapping
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beags
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I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath, do your research.
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Post by beags on Jul 24, 2012 10:01:57 GMT -5
This again... Parents responsibility. A rating system like the one used for movies is fine. But ultimately this is the parents decision. No censorship. EXACTLY a parent knows their child better than anyone else. (or should) They know if their child at age 13 is ready for PG 13. They know if their child at age 16, 15, 14, 12, is ready for video games rated M. If the parent at any time thinks gee, I don't think Jonny can differientiate the violence from the movie/game and reality than that parent will choose not to let the child see the movie or play the game.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 10:32:17 GMT -5
In short, there is possible merit to the argument that video games stand apart from other media in their ability to influence our behaviour. Perhaps it is worth factoring in that other forms of media have mechanisms of influence which video games don't benefit from -at least not to the same degree. In music, for example, the content can be infused with the power of celebrity or idol-worship -potentially transforming song lyrics into words to live by. Music also enjoys far greater depth of social infiltration than video games. Likewise, film makers go to great lengths to suspend disbelief within viewers and to cultivate characters and scenarios which can be experienced vicariously. I've yet to bear witness to a video game capable of inspiring the range and profundity of emotional response which some of the better films achieve. I suggest, from the bullet-pointed information you've given, that there is a scale of sophistication which one could use to consider the different ways in which video games might be influential. At the 'crude' end of the scale we would have the kind of influence whereby it is the content of the game that influences the individual. I would place the matter of propaganda and indoctrination at this end of the scale -and, yes, I do agree that those are the goals of military-funded endeavours. In this regard I don't think there is much difference between the various forms of media; they all serve to introduce and reinforce 'beneficial' attitudes and viewpoints. As far as influential content goes -would it be the case that the happier video games stimulate outbursts of joy or the like?... or do we suppose that it only works with violence? At the 'sophisticated' end of the scale we would have the medium itself -the physiological effects of playing video games. I'm thinking of Marshall McLuhan's 'The medium is the message'. Here is where the differences between different forms of media become quite pronounced; the act of reading a book is very different to the act of watching a film. You've noted a range of things there -video games are more engaging, people play them for longer, there is perhaps an element of hypnosis. There are other things too -they can be stressful and/or rewarding, perhaps affecting brain chemistry more profoundly than books and films, for instance. There is also the strand of thought which suggests video games 'rewire the brains' of younger children. FYI - www.telegraph.co.uk/health/children_shealth/8825655/Video-games-can-alter-childrens-brains.html
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strider
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Post by strider on Jul 24, 2012 10:35:45 GMT -5
Parents should be the main influence here. I'm almost 25 years old and started playing video games at 4. My dad made a distinction to me long ago that what you see in movies and video games are not real. Seems like a simple concept to me.
I wouldn't buy my kids a GTA game or a shooter until they were teenagers. They'd have alot of talks beforehand too to make sure they understand. Also people need to keep their own firearms locked up.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jul 24, 2012 10:39:21 GMT -5
A most excellent Reply #76, Astronaut. I'm all karma'd out for now, but I'll "hit" you when I recharge.
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happyhippy
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Post by happyhippy on Jul 24, 2012 10:46:37 GMT -5
Yes I too would further this by the obvious ,that development in a young child, is through the eyes and ears. What they absorb is fundamental in these early years of development and with games of violence,-without guidance or restriction,- will undoubtedly sway towards individuals to become desensitized to violence later on in life. Upon this remarkable technological age,where graphically enhanced realism is portrayed ,we become alarmed and then we accept as normal.Such is so that if or when it happens for real,gamer generations may not even bat an eyelid.
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beags
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I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath, do your research.
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Post by beags on Jul 24, 2012 10:48:45 GMT -5
Parents should be the main influence here. I'm almost 25 years old and started playing video games at 4. My dad made a distinction to me long ago that what you see in movies and video games are not real. Seems like a simple concept to me. I wouldn't buy my kids a GTA game or a shooter until they were teenagers. They'd have alot of talks beforehand too to make sure they understand. Also people need to keep their own firearms locked up. I've said the same thing many different ways on another thread .. . but people seem to think that it's otherwise. . perhaps that's the problem .. . . parents are no longer the main influence.
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strider
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Post by strider on Jul 24, 2012 10:59:58 GMT -5
Parents should be the main influence here. I'm almost 25 years old and started playing video games at 4. My dad made a distinction to me long ago that what you see in movies and video games are not real. Seems like a simple concept to me. I wouldn't buy my kids a GTA game or a shooter until they were teenagers. They'd have alot of talks beforehand too to make sure they understand. Also people need to keep their own firearms locked up. I've said the same thing many different ways on another thread .. . but people seem to think that it's otherwise. . perhaps that's the problem .. . . parents are no longer the main influence. It's not just video games. I get sick and tired of people who see kids as "accessories" or "projects". Same thing with schooling. People like to blame public schools alot for their bloated administrations or teachers that get tenure and stop caring. That is valid. However a parent will make sure a kid's homework gets done. I too groaned and sighed when my mom forced me to do homework. I got over it just fine. Parents are afraid that if they aren't their child's best friend that they failed.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jul 24, 2012 11:00:53 GMT -5
::I've said the same thing many different ways on another thread .. . but people seem to think that it's otherwise. . perhaps that's the problem .. . . parents are no longer the main influence.::
Maybe the problem is parents ARE the main influence. Have you seen how many idiots there are in the world? Lots of them have children.
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Jul 24, 2012 11:28:25 GMT -5
I think the Final Fantasy characters got a bit of a cult following in some parts of the world ISA...though probably not here. Probably coupled with the fact that Japanese Manga is highly fashionable and influential. Maybe its a preview of how important what this medium has the propensity to be....as per living vicariously. You can even get programs to manipulate figures and make your own films. Then there is role play.....(not even sure what that's about)... but there are plenty of forums on proboards which appear to provide an extension to existing characters so that the players can further their experiences. I imagine that video gaming can run the whole gamut of emotions from excitement to violence, as you say......Which is all the more reason we have to be responsible with this medium.
I get the impression that people enjoy video gaming....so will defend their interest it at all costs.
Only what you enjoy.... isn't necessarily good for you.
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happyhippy
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Post by happyhippy on Jul 24, 2012 11:30:18 GMT -5
Indeed there are good parents and bad parents. So not all is lost ,I'm happy to say. However there are loving parents that themselves can not control their kids. When I say control I do not mean children being commodities or things,I mean as in children lacking respect for their parents, ( I talk of particular troubled homes and in my opinion only). Things have changed a lot these few decades,which to add is quite intriguing when considering a lot of adults can not even cook (not entirely their fault). There are of course many reasons to parents not communicating with their kids as a family should do. I have even seen some wonderful examples even in those nanny programs where it is shows that families do not eat together and play together as we should expect a family to do. I guess we have taught ourselves how to be bored very very quickly. Perhaps parenting skills are only naturally viable with those that have had good family experiences in this regard.Because communities have changed. Old folks now get sent to old peoples homes and life and taxes is very demanding. What may seem technologically clever may hinder parents in ways by being surrogates, keeping the focus of young minds with wonderful visual display or virtual worlds,all in the comfort of ones own home,so that people can do other things.
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Reckless Roselia
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Post by Reckless Roselia on Jul 24, 2012 11:43:26 GMT -5
Hello Spell,
I may be a pessimist as a sister but when my younger brothers were gifted their first PS2 Desert Storm game (ten years ago) I had seen how crazed up they were getting about it. I found nothing fascinating in such a game so I broke the PS2 CD. A bit harsh maybe given I left the Lara Croft one alone.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 24, 2012 11:48:27 GMT -5
Which is all the more reason we have to be responsible with this medium.
And that should be my job and DH's job. That should be the job of the guy selling it to me to make sure he ID's me so I can't buy an M video game if I am underage.
If you can't be bothered to look up what "M" means on a video game that is your problem. Like I said it is really not that hard to research a video game, even if it is just to hook it up and play it yourself before giving it to the kid.
I don't want the government telling me what games I can and cannot buy for myself or my kid.
So what if we take away all video games, all violent movies and someone snaps? What are we going to blame and take away then?
How far do we want to go into a nanny state in the hopes that one nutball won't go off the deep end?
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moxie
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Post by moxie on Jul 24, 2012 13:23:12 GMT -5
Parenting is a lot of common sense...unfortunately, some adults/parents have little.
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sowhatisit
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Post by sowhatisit on Jul 24, 2012 13:31:08 GMT -5
Blaming video games is rediculous. Parents are the ones buying the x-box and probably paying for the games as well. If the parents don't care, there is nothing anyone can do.
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ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
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Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Jul 24, 2012 13:39:44 GMT -5
Blaming video games is rediculous. Parents are the ones buying the x-box and probably paying for the games as well. If the parents don't care, there is nothing anyone can do. But even that caring parent who doesn't allow a certain game in their home, may not know if their child is or isn't playing that same game at a friend's home.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 24, 2012 13:46:12 GMT -5
Neither is ice cream, twinkies, soda, fast food, car exhaust, factory exhaust, hydraulic fracking chemicals getting into water, etc., etc., etc. Go ban all that crap, then we'll talk about video games.
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sowhatisit
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Post by sowhatisit on Jul 24, 2012 13:48:29 GMT -5
Blaming video games is rediculous. Parents are the ones buying the x-box and probably paying for the games as well. If the parents don't care, there is nothing anyone can do. But even that caring parent who doesn't allow a certain game in their home, may not know if their child is or isn't playing that same game at a friend's home. Its not about playing a taboo game once in a while. Its about the parents that let the game become the babysitter and their child sits there 4 0r 5 hours a day and longer on weekends. Seriously I've seen this.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 24, 2012 13:48:45 GMT -5
Good point, we should ban friends while we're banning video games. Maybe just require us to stick the kids in a chemically induced coma for the first 18 years to make sure they never run across a bad influence.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 13:54:03 GMT -5
Good point, we should ban friends while we're banning video games. Maybe just require us to stick the kids in a chemically induced coma for the first 18 years to make sure they never run across a bad influence. Ban friends, definitely.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 13:54:40 GMT -5
Neither is ice cream, twinkies, soda, fast food, car exhaust, factory exhaust, hydraulic fracking chemicals getting into water, etc., etc., etc. Go ban all that crap, then we'll talk about video games. Twinkies....
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happyhippy
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Post by happyhippy on Jul 24, 2012 13:58:19 GMT -5
Absolutely, It is hard to monitor when children spend time with friends. What comes with the great achievement in technologies also come access to all types of information. The wonderful world of advertising entertainment is where children are vulnerable to being duped into thinking they are already mature.Also gaining access to information especially for adults, is easily done nowadays with unrestricted enquiring minds. Young minds are easily corruptible. This does not mean we should ban all things or have,- like the poster mention,- have any G-ment decide what is best. We are what we watch is more my point.
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