Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:10:59 GMT -5
You're telling me that if her friend left her baby on the floor for 5 hours he'd cry that entire time? If she did it again the next day, and the day after, and the day after, for weeks, he'd spend the entire 5 hours crying every single day for weeks on end? Not all babies are the same, that's totally true, it's also a convenient excuse to use when you know you're doing something wrong and don't care.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 18, 2012 17:17:30 GMT -5
You're telling me that if her friend left her baby on the floor for 5 hours he'd cry that entire time? If she did it again the next day, and the day after, and the day after, for weeks, he'd spend the entire 5 hours crying every single day for weeks on end? Not all babies are the same, that's totally true, it's also a convenient excuse to use when you know you're doing something wrong and don't care. Lets see she is trying modfied CIO for the 3rd time. She's a week into it. She's modified the checks. Trying to do decide if she needs them more often or less often. 1. Have you been around a baby crying 3 hrs at a time? After that amount of time at the age we are talking about the baby needs to eat. Period 2. It is about finding what works for your baby. It isn't about doing something wrong. SHe isn't. She knows what she is doing isn't working but she can't find what works. THat is not an excuse at all. That is life. Her baby is underweight and in danger of failure to thrive so she can't not feed him. Sorry to burst your bubble but you don't have all the answers in life.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 18, 2012 17:18:20 GMT -5
Your pregnancy and DS's first year remind me that it could be worse. You've had a tough time too! Are you feeling better? A little bit. I've still been nauseous this week, but I've managed without zofran for most of the week. Anyway, I better head home. Have a good one.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:18:37 GMT -5
Yes I have children. What a funny way to ask.
Clearly she should be worried about making sure he's getting enough tummy time then. Good to see a new mom with her priorities in order.
Agree to disagree. See how easy that is.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 18, 2012 17:19:03 GMT -5
Wow--really?
Have you ever been around a colicky baby?
Are you trying to start an argument or just be mean?
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:20:04 GMT -5
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:20:50 GMT -5
Are you trying to start an argument or just be mean? I think he's trying to prove that all pregnant women are hormonal and crazy by riling us up until we act hormonal and crazy
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:21:50 GMT -5
As long as it takes for them to realize they're going to have to deal with not being attached to mom and dad 24/7.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:23:04 GMT -5
My nephew. I swear to god that kid cried practically every second he was awake for the first several months. Here's the thing though. He was going to cry whether you held him or not, so you might as well put him in the crib and shut the door.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:24:05 GMT -5
As long as it takes for them to realize they're going to have to deal with not being attached to mom and dad 24/7.
And you really think that should be five hours straight for days in a row if necessary?
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Jul 18, 2012 17:24:08 GMT -5
They're babies, they cry. Leave them there long enough and they'll get over it. That is kind of sad. In general babies cry for a reason even if that reason only is "I want someone to hold me". I've got the entire rest of my life to not let my kids get their way & to let them down, I don't need to do it to a newborn if I can help it. Yeah, at 6 months or so I will start treating the issue differently, but I am not letting a 2 day old cry just so he can get over it if my holding keeps him happy.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:25:52 GMT -5
No because it doesn't take that long. The first few times it might be 10 or 15 minutes.
Yes, yes, I know, some women have kids 647 weeks early, who have health issues, and are in constant pain, and my advice doesn't apply to them so my whole theory is invalid. Get over it.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:26:48 GMT -5
No because it doesn't take that long. The first few times it might be 10 or 15 minutes.
But what if it's not? You're saying they should keep waiting it out, right? So I'm asking, for how long?
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 18, 2012 17:28:26 GMT -5
Which didn't teach the kid not to cry--he did it anyway right? So holding a colicky baby DOES NOT teach them to cry or to manipulate mom and dad. I think it provides a lot of other benefits than putting them in a crib for hours to cry by themselves does, but whatever.
I'm about tapped out on this conversation. Your kids are well past the age that any of this is relevant and too young to have to worry about it from a grandparent angle. Your trying to show the dad perspective which is valid and appreciated, but the blanket statements (followed by jmo a few pages later) are tiring.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:29:14 GMT -5
Yep. I mean, you would probably want to check the kids diaper and make sure they didn't crap themselves right after you put them down or whatever. But if they've eaten recently, burped, and the diaper is good, let em cry it out. They'll get over it eventually. I'll even make that a blanket statement. Every single kid will eventually get over the mommy/daddy separation anxiety. Until one of you can show me a 16 year old that cries every time the mom or dad stop holding them I'll stick by it.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Jul 18, 2012 17:31:12 GMT -5
You're telling me that if her friend left her baby on the floor for 5 hours he'd cry that entire time? If she did it again the next day, and the day after, and the day after, for weeks, he'd spend the entire 5 hours crying every single day for weeks on end? Not all babies are the same, that's totally true, it's also a convenient excuse to use when you know you're doing something wrong and don't care. I get letting them cry sometimes because you can't help them every minute. And I get letting them cry for 15-30 minutes hoping they will fall asleep or just stop. But, taking it to the extreme like just leaving a kid to cry for 5 hours is fucked up. Some infants don't stop crying after 15 minutes & just leaving them alone for hours is a really fucked up way to deal with it. Maybe they don't feel good, or just want to be held, but whatever the reason - they are too young to comprehend why you aren't caring for them & what you are suggesting (IMO) really crappy parenting.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 18, 2012 17:31:52 GMT -5
They're babies, they cry. Leave them there long enough and they'll get over it. That is kind of sad. In general babies cry for a reason even if that reason only is "I want someone to hold me". I've got the entire rest of my life to not let my kids get their way & to let them down, I don't need to do it to a newborn if I can help it. Yeah, at 6 months or so I will start treating the issue differently, but I am not letting a 2 day old cry just so he can get over it if my holding keeps him happy. I can't imagine having a kid if I didn't want to hold it as a newborn.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:32:16 GMT -5
True, but also completely irrelevant since we weren't talking about colicky babies in the first place, but way to derail the conversation to prove a point.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:35:58 GMT -5
Agreed, and I only took it to that extreme to counter the "but some babies are just different argument". Your baby is not a super special unique snowflake. Neither are my kids. "But Dark," I hear you saying "I tried the letting them cry it out and it didn't work, maybe my kid is just different." Yeah maybe, but the more likely possibility is that letting them cry it out for 9.5 seconds doesn't work for anyone. You have to give it some actual time. Or, maybe you really do have the first kid in the history of ever that can't go 10 seconds without being attached to a parent. It's possible, I'll admit that. I'm not putting money on it though.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:36:01 GMT -5
I'll even make that a blanket statement. Every single kid will eventually get over the mommy/daddy separation anxiety. Until one of you can show me a 16 year old that cries every time the mom or dad stop holding them I'll stick by it.So doesn't that imply that it'll naturally happen eventually and it's not the parents' fault if it doesn't happen right away?
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Jul 18, 2012 17:36:21 GMT -5
True, but also completely irrelevant since we weren't talking about colicky babies in the first place, but way to derail the conversation to prove a point. You are talking about dealing with babies crying by just letting them get over it. What do you think colicky babies do?
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:38:00 GMT -5
"But Dark," I hear you saying "I tried the letting them cry it out and it didn't work, maybe my kid is just different." Yeah maybe, but the more likely possibility is that letting them cry it out for 9.5 seconds doesn't work for anyone. You have to give it some actual time.
But why are you assuming that everyone who says "I tried letting them cry it out and it didn't work" only gave it 9.5 seconds rather than a more reasonable amount of time?
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 18, 2012 17:38:23 GMT -5
Yes, I interpreted Mutt's comment about her friend that her baby has colic. Maybe that's a reach, but I think any baby that cries most of the time has colic.
I still don't get your point that you would leave a newborn to cry for hours to teach it how to behave. I guess it worked for you?
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Loopdilou
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Post by Loopdilou on Jul 18, 2012 17:38:42 GMT -5
There are only three times a baby should not be left to 'cry it out' - 1) Needs feeding, 2) Needs changing, 3) Medical issue. The rest of the time, the kid will survive and *gasp* won't even remember anything anyway
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:39:40 GMT -5
Sorta. I was actually responding to somebody about how society blames the mother for everything, and in my response I tried to give one example where sometimes it really is the mother's fault. I went with something that's fairly common so people could relate, but that isn't all that controversial. Sometimes I forget the militant mom brigade on this board though, so obviously nothing is ever the mother's fault. Even stuff that is. My bad.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Jul 18, 2012 17:39:56 GMT -5
There are only three times a baby should not be left to 'cry it out' - 1) Needs feeding, 2) Needs changing, 3) Medical issue. The rest of the time, the kid will survive and *gasp* won't even remember anything anyway Now I'm seriously asking for clarification. Are you saying you should never hold a crying baby unless it's got one of those problems - and assuming that it does have one of those problems, you should put it down immediately once it's fixed?
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Jul 18, 2012 17:41:15 GMT -5
Damn, I must have missed that edition of infant-to-adult dictionary that told me EXACTLY when my kid was crying just bc or bc he "needed" something
Lena
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Loopdilou
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Post by Loopdilou on Jul 18, 2012 17:41:41 GMT -5
Now who's reinterpreting You can hold a crying baby as much as you want.. but if you put one down and it doesn't have any of those three issues, it will eventually stop crying.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jul 18, 2012 17:42:01 GMT -5
Dark, the fact that you have listed and continue to argue examples of things mothers do "wrong," but had a throwaway answer to things fathers do wrong, is not really supporting your "I'm not a sexist" angle.
For the record, I *don't* think you're sexist - but your comments in this thread are not really supporting that opinion.
Yeah, yeah, you were just providing an example, just your opinion, we should all get over it, yadda yadda.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 18, 2012 17:42:15 GMT -5
Because new parent and reasonable never belong in the same sentence. Why do you think your pediatrician doesn't believe a word you say during your early childhood checkup visits? He's not rude enough to call you liar to your face, but when you say the breastfeeding just isn't working and you've tried everything, he doesn't tell you to stick with it because there are no other options, it's because when he hears "I've tried everything" he's thinking "You tried a couple times, don't really know what you're doing anyway, and need to give it some actual time".
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