I don't know what to do

[zibazinski]

[Wisconsin Beth]

I've heard of people having 1 phone just to deal with crazy parents. They never listened to the messages, never answered and felt that that the $20 a month or whatever was a cheap way to deal with their situation.

[swasat]

What do I do? Am I crazy? Am I a horrible daughter? Do I owe him a relationship? Please be honest, because I am really starting to doubt my sanity - and maybe I'm right in doing so.

Mid, Why does matter what other people think? If they are so insistent on something then THEY can maintain that relationship. You don't have to.

Don't doubt yourself. If you feel agonistic towards towards your dad down to your very bones, then there has to be a solid reason for that. Don't disregard your gut feelings and instincts.

You should be happy you have such a supportive DH. He is the third party here so he probably has the best view of the skewed relationship you have with your dad. His support means a lot.

[Deleted]

I disagree only because I don't think people need to play the "I got the last word in" game. If you don't want contact, ignore the messages, block them, and move on. You don't need to continue the dysfunction by trying to one-up him with comments back at him.

Hoops I can definitely see this side of things too. Ultimately it's whatever would work best for Mid. My thought was that at least her dad would see that HIS actions caused her reaction. But again, I can see your side too, and if my suggestion doesn't feel "right" for Mid, she shouldn't do it.

[Peace Of Mind]

I see her dad as an insecure, hates rejection/losing control, immature man who is having a temper tantrum out on his daughter because she is not doing what he wants her to. That's his problem, but he is making it hers. The less she responds, IMO, the less he will react. If he continues to react and lash out others will see who the nut job is. It always works out that way for me. But I can cut people out of my life who annoy me like a hot knife on butter. There are just too many people in the world to deal with assholes.




<--------- Read this. That's one of my motto's of life and always has been. It has to be worth the trouble before I expend any energy on it. I don't care who it is!

[973beachbum]

Mid I am sorry you are going through this!

I would call the cell phone provider and tell them that that number is harrrassing you and sending abusive texts. They do have a way to have his number blocked. If you have a landline block him on that number also.

I would also contemplate forwarding the texts to his new family and letting them see how he treats you first hand. Then again I have been known to be a vindictive bitch.

[midjd]

And it sounds (yet again) like your DH is a great guy.

He really is. I don't know what I would do without him. Sometimes I feel like he is the only person in the world who is always in my corner. I got very lucky, especially considering all my "daddy issues" - I could have ended up with a real dbag. And he has known my dad for 14+ years now (which I think both my parents forget) - it's not just me telling him "My dad sucks," he's seen a lot of it firsthand.

The fact that your mother is not supporting your feelings is, I believe, what is at the heart of your problem.
If not for your mother, you probably would have no problem dismissing your dad. Me thinks she is more of a problem for you than he is.
Maybe you care too much about what your mother thinks? I know...hard not to.

I think you've hit on something here. For so long I took for granted "Dad is crazy, mom is sane." But her boundary issues have become more pronounced lately (last year she sent me a very long email telling me all the things she doesn't like about DH), and I just can't get past the hurt that she is defending my dad in this situation. She has no obligation to him, they've been divorced almost two decades - why is she on his side and not her own child? I know she has some major codependency issues (her current BF is an alcoholic) and I wonder if my dad didn't pull the "I'm so hurt she won't speak to me, you have to fix this, you're the only one who can help" act or something. I don't know.

POM, you have him pegged. I looked up "narcissistic personality disorder" once and the description fit him to a T. He loves to control people, is pretty good at it, and gets VERY angry when he realizes he can't force someone to do something.

She might not even really care if all contact is cut from dad, but I can easily imagine how she wouldn't want to be the one to say that to you.

No, she's very insistent that I have a relationship with him. She thinks if I don't, I'll regret it after he dies. At least, that's what she says - she may have other reasons for pushing it.

[kittensaver]

A thousand times: get the book Boundaries. It will change your outlook on life. They are two Christian authors, but if you look past the biblical references (should you happen to not espouse Christianity) their advice is really, really sound.

You don't owe anyone anything . . . not your dad, not your mom. They are responsible for their own lives and their own feelings; don't get sucked into/guilted into carrying their opinions and their emotional baggage around with you. Good luck!

[Angel!]

I'm sorry you have to go through this.

I don't really have anything to offer beyond the advice already given, but know that YMers always have your back.

If contact with him is making your life difficult & stressful, then consider completely cutting off contact with him. Why let someone in your life that does this to you? He may have been your Dad when you were born, but it sounds like he lost his right to wave that title around a long time ago.

[Formerly SK]

Background: I dropped all contact with both parents (they're divorced) for about eight years. It was invaluable for helping me recover from their parenting (ie my childhood).

You are NEVER required to have someone in your life who makes you feel badly. I don't care how much blood you share with them. And while yes, the past is the past, your dad is being abusive NOW. If he was an asshat while you were a kid but is a big cuddly teddy bear now, you would not be having issues with him most likely. Certainly you wouldn't be getting texts calling you a bitch (who says that to their daugher?).

I too think you need to explore your relationship with your mom. You should not feel that you need to defend your decisions to her (or anyone for that matter). Simply saying, "I won't tolerate anyone talking to me the way he does" is sufficient. If he wants a relationship with you, he can be more nice. If someone can't understand your requirement for civility, that is their issue (whether it is your dad or your mom).

[sheilaincali]

DH's mother is a horrible excuse for a mother. I could go on and on for pages about all the crap she did to him growing up. He finally distanced himself from her a few years ago on the advice of his therapist. His Dr. told him that he mother wasn't a good presence in his life and to limit his contact with her. All of her phone calls go to voice mail and DH will email her back. He accepted her friend request on FB but then blocked her so she thinks they are still friends but doesn't see his updates.

In my opinion- if you start blocking his number and that it will just get worse as he will be angry that you had the gall to block his number. Just send him straight to voicemail or whatever and ignore him. Move on with your life and do let him keep dragging you down.

[movingforward]

No father that calls their child a bitch deserves the time of day. I agree with hoops in relation to blocking him and moving on. Best of luck to you as I can't imagine what this must be like. I realize daily how lucky I was to be born to the parents I had. I miss my mom everyday since she passed away and feel so grateful to still have my father. You deserve better Mid...

[MN-Investor]

Let's look at your mother's behavior and decide if she is a person to go to for advice.

1) She married the loser who is your father.

2) She is in a current relationship with an alcoholic.

3) She seriously dissed your DH to you.

She has no clue about good and bad relationships. She's the last person you should go to for advice!

I don't know why your mother chooses losers. Obviously she overlooks their faults. Maybe she has self esteem issues. Maybe she's one of those women who needs to have a man in her life, any man. Maybe she's a woman who needs to be needed, so chooses mates who need saving. But obviously she's not a very good judge of people.

It could be that by having a relationship with your father you're validating your mother's choice in him as a worthwhile individual. By rejecting him, you're also telling your mother that she made a bad choice in selecting him in the first place.

Or maybe this is just sideline psychology with no validity. But, hey, you get what you pay for.

But I do agree that you have to ignore your mother. Your DH, not your mother, has your best interest at heart. Listen to him. And listen to the posters here. There's a lot of collective wisdom here.

[hoops902]

::I too think you need to explore your relationship with your mom. You should not feel that you need to defend your decisions to her (or anyone for that matter). Simply saying, "I won't tolerate anyone talking to me the way he does" is sufficient. If he wants a relationship with you, he can be more nice. If someone can't understand your requirement for civility, that is their issue (whether it is your dad or your mom). ::

Or alternatively, don't "turn to the other parent" in this situation. You're putting her in an equally bad spot where she can't give out objective advice due to her relationship with both parties, trying to look out for your future as well as your present, complicated parent/child relationships, etc. She's doing what I would expect any good parent to do, she's encouraging a relationship with the other parent rather than bashing them. The person to really listen to is DH, he doesn't need to worry about whether he's being a good parent telling you to cut ties, he can give advice which is based purely and singly on your well being.

[Deleted]

No, she's very insistent that I have a relationship with him. She thinks if I don't, I'll regret it after he dies.

I thought that about DD. Her dad left when she was 1 month old and never had anything to do with her, although he did and does maintain a close relationship with her two older brothers (who were 4 and 6 when he left).

I felt that way as long as he was absent and negligent, rather than toxic. But I NEVER EVER pushed it. She has had NO relationship with him (his choice).

Then one day, two years ago he HURT DD VERY BADLY. That was it. My dreams, hopes, etc for any future relationship were done. I wanted to kill him.

Part of me hated myself. I had always tried to not bad-mouth him, but that day he proved once again that he is and will always be a total d-bag. I always tried to round out the edges because he has always been a good dad to her brothers (amazing, I know), but not to DD, so for years I hoped things would work out for them at some point. Plus, so kill me, he's extremely wealthy, and I would have loved for DD to get a piece of that too, just like her brothers did and do.

What he did to her wasn't negligence, it was inexcusable, it was totally reprehensible (and accidental, but that's besides the point).

That was it. DONE. That day, Mid, DD (who is pretty uncommunicative with me, although not with her friends) sent me 10 or 12 text messages.

And then she came home, and she cried, and she dried her tears AND SHE WROTE HIM OFF. FOR GOOD. Not even HIM, because he didn't even exist. But the thought of him. Does that make any sense?

This was two years ago, she was 17 at the time. What kills me is that I was TOTALLY supportive of her, I wish your mom could be the same way with you. And it was theoretical, in DD's case, because she had no real relationship with him anyway. She saw him once every few years when the grandparents or brothers forced the issue. And that day.

SO WRITE HIM OFF. FOR GOOD. Because NOBODY merits you feeling that way.

You have your DH, and if I'm not mistaken, his family loves you deeply too.

Hugs Mid

Stand strong.

[Angel!]

May 2, 2012 16:45:50 GMT -5 @debthaven2 said:

It wasn't negligence, it wasn't excusable, what he did was totally reprehensible (as well as accidental ... he literally did not recognize her).

This thread is making me so sad . There are some really bad parents out there. I know H wrote off his own father when he called to wish H a happy 13th b-day on his 15th b-day.

[Deleted]

There are some really bad parents out there.

For sure, Angel.

[Gardening Grandma]

No, she's very insistent that I have a relationship with him. She thinks if I don't, I'll regret it after he dies. At least, that's what she says - she may have other reasons for pushing it.

It is not her place to tell you who you should and should not have relationships with. Even if she is right and you regret it after he dies, that is still up to you and only you. (And he <could> outlive you).

My mother did not approve of my DH either. To the point that it was hurtful. Her 'him or me' attitude, while not articulated pretty much ended my relationship with her. I came to the point that I would do my duty by her when the time came, but that I would not sacrifice my marriage for her. When she needed a place to live (after her Alzheimer's diagnosis) I told my sister, "I'll help pay for her nursing home care, but she cannot live in my house. I won't sacrifice my marriage for her".

She forced the choice. And I still feel that I made the right choice.

[sbcalimom]

Mid: I haven't read the book Boundaries but I can tell you that establishing boundaries with my very co-dependent and intrusive mother has done wonders for my happiness and eventually for our relationship. It sounds like the issue with your dad is hurtful but you could deal with it if your mom wasn't making it worse. It sounds like her reaction is the more hurtful of the two. Here's why I did...

My parents divorced when I was a few months old and while my dad was there financially as was required by the court, we never really had much a relationship beyond that. My mother has always been very dependent on me and I basically took on the role of parent in our relationship from a very, very young age. When I got married, she had a very hard time dealing with the fact that DH took precedence. She was a massive PITA during the wedding planning and basically tried to ruin as much as she could. After one particularly painful event during the process, I decided I had simply had enough. I told her that if she didn't put on her big girl pants and just deal, she wasn't welcome at my wedding or in my life. After that, every time she started bad mouthing DH or crossing a line, I would hang up or leave. I would state very calmly that I wasn't going to listen to her insult my husband and that I was leaving. I also told her several times that if she was trying to force me to choose between her and DH, she really wasn't going to like the choice I'd make (ie DH). It took about 6 months for her to stop and another year or so before our relationship was good, but once she realized I was serious she really stopped all the destructive behavior and worked towards maintaining an adult relationship with me. She still isn't a huge fan of DH but she does her best to keep it to herself.

If you stick to your guns about whatever boundaries you set with mom and/or dad, it will definitely make you feel a lot better. For me, I felt like I had established the "rules" and if she chose to break them then that was her choice. It made it a lot easier for me to handle limiting contact since I felt like I had told her exactly what I expected of her and exactly how I would respond if those expectations weren't met.

[Deleted]

I agree GG, you made the right choice.

Just curious, did your sister take your mom in? Somehow, I'm guessing not.

[busymom]

No one gets to choose their parents, and it's amazing that some parent-child relationships work so well.

However, some people take no responsibility for their actions or mistakes, & sadly, your Dad may be one of those. Add a codependent Mom (maybe) and you've got a bad combination.

No, you are not a bad kid. You don't deserve to be b!tched at, you deserve to be loved & valued just as you are, with no expectations. Especially now when you are an adult. It sounds like you Dad may need therapy for control issues...

You just need to know you are a great "kid", and a lot of parents would kill to have someone with a sweet disposition like yours. And, yes, it's o.k. to go in for some therapy. I wouldn't mention it to anyone, 'tho, especially you Mom or Dad. Doesn't sound like they're the supporting kind...

[973beachbum]

May 2, 2012 16:30:06 GMT -5 sheilaincali said:

DH's mother is a horrible excuse for a mother. I could go on and on for pages about all the crap she did to him growing up. He finally distanced himself from her a few years ago on the advice of his therapist. His Dr. told him that he mother wasn't a good presence in his life and to limit his contact with her. All of her phone calls go to voice mail and DH will email her back. He accepted her friend request on FB but then blocked her so she thinks they are still friends but doesn't see his updates.

In my opinion- if you start blocking his number and that it will just get worse as he will be angry that you had the gall to block his number. Just send him straight to voicemail or whatever and ignore him. Move on with your life and do let him keep dragging you down.

Wow that sounds like it could have been written by my DH.

Actually for years I would send a Christmas card to her with a picture of the kids in it. I would sign it from the family. No question she knew it was from me though. Years later they got to the point he could be in the same room with her and neither get mad. Baby steps. ;D

5 years ago she had a massive stroke at 65 and has been in a nursing home ever since. He is the only one she remembers. We are also the ones to pay the bills like cable tv for her. We don't visit much. When we do it is a huge 2 hour long shit storm with her crying and him insisting he wont leave until she does. The last time I almost left him there. It is crazy sad though that at this point she had alienated everyone to the point that she is literally alone both in body as well as mind.

[Deleted]

Sounds like my relationship with my father and my mother says the same thing, I should forgive him and get over it.

Sorry but I do not want, need nor desire to have a relationship with him. My mom is mad at me for it (so is some of my aunts) he tells people I am an ungrateful son, etc and I don't care.

I sleep well at night and comfortable with my choice. As I tell my mother, when I needed a father he did not bother; now that I don't need one he is acting like he wants to be in my life. He is a day late and a dollar short.

And him only calling me when he needs money does not help either, so I just don't answer the phone. I haven't talk to him in months.

[Deleted]

Message deleted by debthaven2.

[Gardening Grandma]

May 2, 2012 17:04:53 GMT -5 @debthaven2 said:

I agree GG, you made the right choice.

Just curious, did your sister take your mom in? Somehow, I'm guessing not.

Yah, she did. I was not surprised. Growing up, she was mom's favorite.... I give my BIL a LOT of credit though, because mom was cold to him as well (it was my sis's second marriage and mom did not forgive her for divorcing the first. Then they lived in sin (gasp!) for a few years during which time mom would not set foot in their house even to visit her grandchildren.

My sis and BIL, at the time, lived in a very large house with a large master suite downstairs, (DH and I were living in a small house half the size) so everyone had their privacy. Mom lived there for about 5 or 6 years before she finally had to be institutionalized. I went and stayed with her when sis and BIL needed a vacation.

So I do give my sis and BIL a LOT of credit for those 5-6 years. Esp BIL..... (I tell him he's a saint. )

[mmhmm]

I think, if it were me in this situation, I'd send "daddy" one text telling him I didn't wish to hear further from him and no further text I received from him would be read. I don't think I'd bother to give him the satisfaction of blocking him. I'd just delete his texts without reading them and go on with my life. Let him rant to the airwaves.

In the case of "mom", she needs to learn to keep her distance instead of trying to live your life for you. I'd tell her so, in no uncertain terms. I'd make it clear I meant what I said and would not choose to have further contact with her if she couldn't respect my privacy, my right to live my life, and my request that she butt out. I did that with my mother many years back. It took about a year and a half of no contact but it worked. We live together now and she's gotten over the control-freak issues. Ours is a good, peer-to-peer relationship.

Just my way of dealing with these issues. Wish you didn't have to go through it.

[Opti]

May 2, 2012 15:08:38 GMT -5 Peace Of Mind said:

Honestly, it doesn't matter how others see him. It only matters how you see him because it's between the two of you. If he makes you feel bad or if you just don't enjoy his company I'd keep the relationship surface only (weddings, funerals, etc.) until you either feel differently or he changes towards you. Blood does not mean you have to allow abuse or allow somebody to hurt you. How you react and feel is on you so you need to find ways to deal. Good luck with that part.

You need to do what works for you. If Mom wants to have a relationship with him that's her business. What you choose to do is yours. Good luck whatever you decide.

[Deleted]

Wow, first off.....find a quiet place and let yourself cry. You are very disappointed in both your parents and that does hurt.

As far as therapy or not, you have to do what you need to do. I finally got to a place where neither of my parents have the power to hurt me like they used to. It was a long road, but I am healthier for it.

My father and I, sort of mutually, cut off contact almost 7 years ago. It was the healthiest thing I have ever done. We had no contact until a couple years ago on facebook (I denied his friend request, but he does send me the occasional pm (merry x-mas, happy birthday), I respond with one or two words and that is it).

We have been in each other's presence three times in the past two years (one dinner he asked for when he found out I would be in the state, once when we crossed paths at my grandmother/brother's house, and just a month ago when my grandmother died).

We are courteous, polite strangers. Our conversations go no deeper than that of acquaintances. And that is just fine with me. He has all of my contact information now (since I saw him stealing my address out of my aunt's phone at the funeral), but I know he won't use it. he has had my cell phone number since June and hasn't called it once.

There have been a few people with attitudes like your mother's. That I should be a dutiful, loving daughter no matter what just because he is my father. They have been put in their place very quickly.

My parents divorced almost 18 years ago. My horrifically co-dependent mother is what I affectionately call a functioning basketcase. I believe she is the reason they put mute buttons on cell phones. That way when she goes off on one of her tangents, I can hit mute and scream (or cuss, or say "blah, blah, blah", whatever floats my boat at that moment).

Basically, my parents are the reason I live on the other side of the continental US.

You don't owe him anything. You don't deserve to be treated like that.

[quince]

You're fortunate to have your husband's support- good for you AND him!

Agreement with what many people have said. You don't owe anyone anything. Your father doesn't 'deserve' anything. You deserve not to feel this way. You're perfectly sane, you're just trying to accommodate people in a way that's at odds with what's in your best interests, and that's not....comfortable.

[Deleted]

May 2, 2012 17:08:02 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Sounds like my relationship with my father and my mother says the same thing, I should forgive him and get over it.

Sorry but I do not want, need nor desire to have a relationship with him. My mom is mad at me for it (so is some of my aunts) he tells people I am an ungrateful son, etc and I don't care.

I sleep well at night and comfortable with my choice. As I tell my mother, when I needed a father he did not bother; now that I don't need one he is acting like he wants to be in my life. He is a day late and a dollar short.

And him only calling me when he needs money does not help either, so I just don't answer the phone. I haven't talk to him in months.

Ditto, except my dad doesn't call for money and my mom eventually left it up to me to want to have a relationship with my dad. I never told him I was PG. He left a message while I was in the hospital, and I never called back. He wasn't invited to the baptism although his mother (my mom-mom was). He's disappointed me one too many times, I'm done.