What to do when reason is not on the same page as

[swamp]

::Swamp... not everyone has forever....::

I know that, but she's 26 FFS, not 36! She's got a few good years left.

[midjd]

Yeah, here I thought I'd be fine waiting another 2-3 years... I'm 27, hopefully my eggs aren't all dried up by 30

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Swamp... not everyone has forever.... my mom tried to have babies again at 38-40... and could NOT sustain a pregnancy... don't know when exactly she 'passed the threshold'... but not everyone finds it easy later.

Where did they say they were waiting till 38-40? She's 26 and in two years she'll be 28.

Geez I had DD at 27 and no problems.

Reproductive "problems" unless you already have a history of them generally don't start till around 35.

OP's wife has told OP that she doesn't want to start trying in her 30's. So she has a good three year, possibly four if she decides at 30 before her cut off date.

[swamp]

Jul 11, 2011 8:42:34 GMT -5 midjd said:

Yeah, here I thought I'd be fine waiting another 2-3 years... I'm 27, hopefully my eggs aren't all dried up by 30

You're just kidding yourself. You'll be a dried up old hag at 30.

[swamp]

Jul 11, 2011 8:47:31 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Reproductive "problems" unless you already have a history of them generally don't start till around 35.

I had "known reproductive problems and didn't start trying until I was about 33. It took a while, but it eventually happened. I'm not recommending what I did for everyone, especially those who are bound and determined they are going to have their own child, gosh darn it, but it can work out.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I know it can, my mom was 35 when she had my brother. I was just trying to point out that she isn't doomed if she doesn't have a kid by 30. That's just the "average" age my OB told me.

Those are long odds though because Ameiko told me you are dried up by 25. We are supposed to be having them at our peak fertile years of 18-20 don't you know? Otherwise DH might go off to find a younger model with less dusty eggs.

[Deleted]

But 36 isn't 'better hurry up and get it done'... 35 is the generally accepted 'all down hill from here' date for fertility. It starts to decline in laste 20s, and is only slightly lower in early 30s... but 35 on is baked for most people.... sorry girls And 30-35 isn't all that long if you want more than 2, want any kind of space between them...

(and actually, some studies DO suggest that by 30 there is significant deterioration.... abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/women-fertility-falls-lose-90-percent-eggs-30/story?id=9693015 ).

And the point is... you just don't know. Fertility studies show a decline in late 20s... not because of an overall trend really, but because SOME people lose it earlier than others... some people can sustain fertility much longer... you just don't always know if it will be you.

Do i mean to tell women that they should go out and get pregnant right now? ... No... always make the choices best for you... but i think in we tend to look at it as, i'll just do it whenever i want.... and we see other people do it... and maybe don't know that they had fertility treatments, how long it took, etc...

I would prefer people be knowledgable in their choices, and not come back at 32 and wish they had done it differently...

[muttleynfelix]

Jul 9, 2011 19:53:25 GMT -5 achelois said:

I guess I was more used to it having come from a large family myself; Whenever a new kid came along you just moved over a bit and made room. I always had worked. I just didn't find it that hard. I will say that I was very organized at that time--slacked off a bit now:-)--and was pretty energetic.

We did not upgrade our house or our car, I used cloth diapers, breast fed and pureed stuff in the blender. Famiy donated a crib that was passed around whenever anyone needed it We raised most of our own food anyway, so not much extra expense.

I had a great daycare provider who ended up being with the boys for 12 years; she had boys the same ages as mine and they were close. I was very fortunate in that respect. My care provider kept the boys in her home, so I dropped them off before work and picked
them up after.

What emotional difficulties are you having? Hope it will work out.

Eta:when I was pregnant with my younger son, I was attending classes at night for electives for nursing school. I went on Wednesday nights at the time. Went one Wednesday, had the baby the Saturday after that and was back in class the next Wednesday. Organization. . The instructor told me that he feared I would give birth in class. ;D

Honestly, based on what other woman with young children have told me, I think your experience was the exception and not the norm. Putting it out there as the norm and what woman are expected to do, does a disservice to any woman who as expereince baby blues to PPD and PPA. I'm glad it was easy for you, but I hope 30 years from now when I am 59, I don't go around and say wow it was so easy.

Physically yeah it has been pretty easy. I never felt like I gave birth to an 8 pound baby. I felt great. I breastfed for 15 months. My DH stays home with DS and does a fantastic job. We cloth diaper and I made his baby food for the couple months he was on purees. But it still hasn't been easy. We had a flashback yesterday afternoon of DS's first 5 months. He was completely incosolable yesterday afternoon after his worst nap in probably a year. Plus he has his first ever awful diaper rash and he is teething. He just laid our chests and cried and by the end I was crying right along with him. It was far too reminiscent of everyday for the first 5 months of his life. Fortunately after about an hour, he jumped down and started to run around again. But the whole situation reminded me why for a year after DS was born we were leaning towards him being an only child.

Anyway, my point is all your planning and everything you think about having a kid can go out the window once you actually have one. My sister's oldest was born with a heart condition and could not be in daycare. Fortunately, she didn't have any student loans (of course she went to college almost 20 years ago so college was a lot cheaper too) and they were able to swing her staying home. But that was not the plan until her DS was born and the issues came to light.

[Deleted]

It also is different for women who have babies before their 30s and have more... having more babies actually increases your length of fertility... so a mom having her LAST child at 36 is not the same as a woman trying to have her first at 32...

[muttleynfelix]

32 is still 6 years away for her! Even Carl is talking about having their first by then on the long end of their time frame.

[Deleted]

I'm sorry, i wasn't just talking about the OP. I was talking in general. I just wanted to say that the idea that 29 is just like 25 and nothing happens to your eggs until you are 35 is not accurate...

Having babies at 25 and 28 was great for me... It might not be for someone else. Everyone has to make their own decisions. I just think they should be informed decisions. I know nothing about caillou's wife's fertility, or her mothers... I do not know if she will have any trouble if she waits. I do know that biological ticking isn't just psychological... your body knows more about itself than you do... I also sense from reading that if he makes her wait, and she DOES have any trouble at all conceiving... well... it wouldn't be pretty...

[midjd]

I also sense from reading that if he makes her wait, and she DOES have any trouble at all conceiving... well... it wouldn't be pretty...

True, but the other end of that is having a kid you're not yet ready for (or don't really want)... DH has a lot of female cousins who tried that tactic and are now single mothers. Not that Cawaiu would do such a thing, but it's always a gamble for one party to coerce the other into parenthood.

[swamp]

Jul 11, 2011 9:07:42 GMT -5 oped said:

Having babies at 25 and 28 was great for me... It might not be for someone else. Everyone has to make their own decisions. I just think they should be informed decisions. I know nothing about caillou's wife's fertility, or her mothers... I do not know if she will have any trouble if she waits. I do know that biological ticking isn't just psychological... your body knows more about itself than you do... I also sense from reading that if he makes her wait, and she DOES have any trouble at all conceiving... well... it wouldn't be pretty...

Having babies at 25 and 28 would have been a disaster for me, I didn't get married until I was 33, and I don't think I was ready to get married then, either.

I agree that everyone should make an informed decision, but that includes recognizing that there are lots of women who have children in their 30's without much of a problem.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

The OP has stated his wife isn't interested in having a baby in her 30's, she'd like to have one sooner. I don't think they should have one now if the OP isn't ready just because the OP might not be as fertile at 28-29 as she allegedly is right now at 26.

That isn't how you should have kids. I would think that that would lead to resentment after awhile if you were the party not ready for kids. Not that you wouldn't love your kid, but I know having WANTED DD at the time we had her it has been a serious adjustment.

I can't imagine if I wasn't ready for her and just did it to satisfy my "biological clock' before it craps out.

[qofcc]

Thanks everyone, I will ask her to ask her new ob/gyn about the different options out there.

If she had problems with hormone BC in the past, she should also look into getting checked for clotting disorders. If someone has it, it's usually found when they have complications from hormone BC (bloating/swelling leading up to a clot), so that might have been a sign for her. Some people just can't tolerate hormone BC whether it's pills, shots or IUD.

[midjd]

The Paragard is hormone-free - just copper. The Mirena has a light dose of progesterone, I believe (and lasts for 5 years instead of 10 like the Paragard).

[Deleted]

drama. I am not in control of their deicions... THEY are... but again... that is THEY... not C... and resentment works both ways... She could just as easily resent being asked to wait, especially if something interferes later (not that it will?... just saying.)

I get mixed up in the details sometimes, but i thought C's wife was an only child? ... not sure why that is? ...

Fine for you drama... but it sounds like C's wife IS ready for her.

[Firebird]

A fair amount of miscarriages are caused by something being wrong with the fetus. Not ALL fetuses should be brought to term. Natures way of dealing with it. I lost 2 and although I felt sad, I also felt relieved because no way was I ready to handle a special needs child.

This is an interesting thread, but I had a really hard time with this statement. It was an incredibly offensive and hurtful thing to say. Even if you felt relieved that your special needs children weren't brought to term, that doesn't mean special needs children shouldn't be born.

Nature's way of dealing with it? Frankly, this is one of the most absurd, disgusting and hurtful statements I have read in a long time.

ETA: I agree that the statement is true in essence, but I still don't like how it implies that special needs children ought to be Darwined out the way that non-viable children are, through miscarriage.

[Deleted]

Jul 11, 2011 9:47:01 GMT -5 Firebird said:

A fair amount of miscarriages are caused by something being wrong with the fetus. Not ALL fetuses should be brought to term. Natures way of dealing with it. I lost 2 and although I felt sad, I also felt relieved because no way was I ready to handle a special needs child.


Nature's way of dealing with it? Frankly, this is one of the most absurd, disgusting and hurtful statements I have read in a long time.

There is some truth to it, though.

[swamp]

Jul 11, 2011 9:43:51 GMT -5 oped said:

drama. I am not in control of their deicions... THEY are... but again... that is THEY... not C... and resentment works both ways... She could just as easily resent being asked to wait, especially if something interferes later (not that it will?... just saying.)

I get mixed up in the details sometimes, but i thought C's wife was an only child? ... not sure why that is? ...

Fine for you drama... but it sounds like C's wife IS ready for her.

Yup, she's ready for that baby with her $100k of student loans and a penchant for Coach purses..............

[Deleted]

I guess i don't see how it is an abusurd or disgusting statement... It obviously was hurtful to you, and one should try not to offend, but it was not a terrible statement in and of itself...

[midjd]

This is an interesting thread, but I had a really hard time with this statement. It was an incredibly offensive and hurtful thing to say. Even if you felt relieved that your special needs children weren't brought to term, that doesn't mean special needs children shouldn't be born.

Nature's way of dealing with it? Frankly, this is one of the most absurd, disgusting and hurtful statements I have read in a long time.

I don't think she was saying that special needs children shouldn't be born - just that she wasn't able to handle one.

And I've heard that up to 1/3 of pregnancies spontaneously miscarry very early in the process for this reason - many women never even know they're pregnant. "Nature's way of dealing with it" might sound callous, but it is essentially true...

[Deleted]

Like i said... if she told mommy that she could have a baby this year, if not for the school loans... then they would be gone. They would have been gone before now, except that daughter made some move mom didn't approve of... If this was all that stood in the way, then they could easily be gone tomorrow, i'm sure.

I do think they BOTH have some spending issues... they like to eat out and pamper the dog and buy nice things... but then i pissed a lot of money away before i had kids... and its not like they don't also have sizable savings and many options available to them...

[illinicheme]

Jul 11, 2011 9:47:01 GMT -5 Firebird said:

A fair amount of miscarriages are caused by something being wrong with the fetus. Not ALL fetuses should be brought to term. Natures way of dealing with it. I lost 2 and although I felt sad, I also felt relieved because no way was I ready to handle a special needs child.

This is an interesting thread, but I had a really hard time with this statement. It was an incredibly offensive and hurtful thing to say. Even if you felt relieved that your special needs children weren't brought to term, that doesn't mean special needs children shouldn't be born.

Nature's way of dealing with it? Frankly, this is one of the most absurd, disgusting and hurtful statements I have read in a long time.

It is nature's way of dealing with it. There are a whole range of possible chromosomal abnormalities that will not lead to a viable human being (i.e. much much more serious problems than something like Down's syndrome). In general, the body rejects those fetuses through miscarriage. It may not give you warm fuzzy feelings, but it's true.

[Deleted]

And there is a difference between a fetus that could never have been viable and a child that has special needs.

[swamp]

Jul 11, 2011 9:55:30 GMT -5 oped said:

Like i said... if she told mommy that she could have a baby this year, if not for the school loans... then they would be gone. They would have been gone before now, except that daughter made some move mom didn't approve of... If this was all that stood in the way, then they could easily be gone tomorrow, i'm sure.

I do think they BOTH have some spending issues... they like to eat out and pamper the dog and buy nice things... but then i pissed a lot of money away before i had kids... and its not like they don't also have sizable savings and many options available to them...

I piss a whole lot of money away with kids, they're a big old money suck.

[Firebird]

I don't think she was saying that special needs children shouldn't be born - just that she wasn't able to handle one.

Actually, she did specifically say that miscarriages are nature's way of making sure some special needs children aren't born.

I'm not saying the statement isn't factually true - I'm well aware that some kids don't make it to term because they aren't viable. I just didn't like the way she said it - implied to me that if a special needs child is born, then natural selection fucked up because it never should have been. Which is an extremely common ableist sentiment.

Anyway, back on point...

cawiau, I can relate to so much of what you write. I think DF and I are in the same place you guys are - we want kids as soon as possible but we know we need to wait until we're on better financial footing (and fortunately, we're both in full agreement on that).

I don't really have any advice for you except to echo what others said about making a specific plan, complete with milestones, so that you know at least you're striving toward it even if it's still pretty far away.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

She could just as easily resent being asked to wait, especially if something interferes later (not that it will?... just saying.)

She could, btu then he could resent the crap out of her for having to be a father before he was ready too.

I've been in that position and it's a no win situation. When he posted they've agreed to table it for a couple of years that is probably the best approach.

Then I agree with everyone who suggests setting a clear goal for when they will actually start trying. I wanted to make sure I qualified for FMLA here and that is a year. A couple months after I reached that date I went off the pill.

Waiting till she has her degree finished depending on how long she has isn't unreasonable. I know people who have been pregnant in graduate school but they have all warned me it is NOT easy, especially if you plan on taking maternity leave.

[Deleted]

No kidding.... they eat up almost my entire pre-kid cocktail budget... and then some

[Deleted]

I did grad school in 18 months with a kid and a full time job... anything is doable. Doing grad school while pregnant and having young kids also works for lots of people... because they can be home with kids, and still doing 'something' towards their careers....

(I do not know C and his wife personally... just from what he posts... but i don't know that i believe she will want to use that masters anyway?)