midjd
Administrator
Your Money Admin
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:09:23 GMT -5
Posts: 17,719
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 18:31:33 GMT -5
Post by midjd on Jun 25, 2011 18:31:33 GMT -5
So you guys were just messing around with everyone? If not, that's a hell of a lot of issues to just "blow over". If this is a recurring argument (and my DH and I have had some as well), perhaps a neutral third party could help you work it out.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:13:15 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 25, 2011 19:13:15 GMT -5
It'll blow over in time. None of our issues are really that big a deal in the grand scheme of things. We're saving for retirement, we aren't racking up debt, the braces are stressing us both out, but we'll find the money. Sure I could go pay somebody $100 an hour to sit there and listen to us talk, but we really don't need another bill right now. It's not like Loop and I can't sit down and discuss things on our own.
|
|
taz157
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 20:50:06 GMT -5
Posts: 12,833
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:17:39 GMT -5
Post by taz157 on Jun 25, 2011 19:17:39 GMT -5
It's not like Loop and I can't sit down and discuss things on our own. If you could, you and Loop wouldn't have been on the board airing your dirty laundry. Yes, I do realize that Loop started the tread, but both of you continued to post responses to the thread. You may not think you need to spend $100 an hour for a neutral third party, but it could be the best $100 an hour you spent.
|
|
midjd
Administrator
Your Money Admin
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:09:23 GMT -5
Posts: 17,719
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:44:48 GMT -5
Post by midjd on Jun 25, 2011 19:44:48 GMT -5
If you work for the federal government, you surely have pretty good insurance - I'll bet it would cover a session or two.
Seriously, you two reminded me of my husband and me a few years ago - and it was not pretty for us, either. Learning to communicate without driving each other up the wall is key. Spouses know how to push buttons like no other - and sometimes it takes a third person to get you to hear each other and not your own interpretation of what they're saying.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 15, 2024 1:14:19 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:47:49 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2011 19:47:49 GMT -5
Jerry Springer on the phone, he is interested in a booking.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 15, 2024 1:14:19 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:58:29 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2011 19:58:29 GMT -5
Sure I could go pay somebody $100 an hour to sit there and listen to us talk, but we really don't need another bill right now. It's not like Loop and I can't sit down and discuss things on our own. It might be beneficial for you guys to go individually. You each have your own issues and unhealthy ways of dealing with things. I'm going to therapy separately ( I think I understand some of Loop's feelings). On occasion DH and I have gone together to hash out a solution to a single issue that we can't resolve on our own - like having more kids.
|
|
Colleenz
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 8:56:39 GMT -5
Posts: 3,983
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 19:58:50 GMT -5
Post by Colleenz on Jun 25, 2011 19:58:50 GMT -5
Your wife mentioned feeling suicidal. This is a huge deal. Please get a neutral third party involved - if not for you then for your daughters.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 21:07:36 GMT -5
Post by mmhmm on Jun 25, 2011 21:07:36 GMT -5
Moon, if my marriage issues are that big a deal just ban me now, because I can't promise they won't affect my posts. Either deal with it or ban me, because I'm human and it's going to happen. I've stayed out of this, Dark, but I've read both threads. I'm glad you've posted to let us know you're okay. I hope Loopy is, as well. She and I have much in common when we post together and I do so enjoy her. I can understand not being able to keep things that are weighing on you from impacting your posting style. I don't think any of us can do that with complete success. Still, this isn't the place to really work out your differences. For one thing, it involves others who don't know the inner workings of your marriage. For another, it involves those who will only participate to throw in a barb, or what they think is a funny here and there. That's just not helpful. If you find talking it out apart helpful, IMs would be the way to go, or PMs if you're here, IMO. If there are people whose input you would like to have, and truly trust, perhaps you could set up a group on IMs. This just isn't the right place for it, as moon pointed out. It's not about you, or Loopy being wrong. It's more about being in the wrong place for, possibly, all the right reasons. Take that from an old almost-great-grandma (in September!) who's been around the block a few times, eh?
|
|
Sammy
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 17:01:55 GMT -5
Posts: 3,335
|
deleted
Jun 25, 2011 22:58:30 GMT -5
Post by Sammy on Jun 25, 2011 22:58:30 GMT -5
Dark: Moon, if my marriage issues are that big a deal just ban me now, because I can't promise they won't affect my posts. Either deal with it or ban me, because I'm human and it's going to happen.This is not the first, nor the second, nor the third time both have forced moderation due to airing their family laundry on the boards. Because this isn't MSN does it mean it's ok to resume old habits? Their battles were not acceptable on the old boards so why would they be acceptable here?? Your Money is not As the World Turns. Deal with it or ban you, Dark? Hey Fred, pass me the violin I need to help out an old friend.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 1:27:05 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 1:27:05 GMT -5
This is not the first, nor the second, nor the third time both have forced moderation due to airing their family laundry on the boards. And oddly every time we do it those threads get a billion views and tons of comments. Kind of weird since nobody here wants to see that kind of drama, don't you think? You were a mod on the old boards for like ever though, I'm sure you know exactly what everyone wants to comment about and read. I mean, that's probably why YM shuns train wreck threads (like Dox's, CM's, Terri's, etc.) and refuses to comment on them. Deal with it or ban you, Dark? Absolutely. Too bad you don't have your mojo anymore, you'd finally be able to do it.
|
|
Colleenz
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 8:56:39 GMT -5
Posts: 3,983
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 6:42:21 GMT -5
Post by Colleenz on Jun 26, 2011 6:42:21 GMT -5
UNTIL SOMEONE SAYS THEY WANT TO KILL HERSELF!!!
I am happy to post hoping it is a joke thread meant to get lots of posts. Or even if it is real, maybe give some fresh perspective or ideas to an old situation.
I am still hoping (praying) that thread was a joke. If not, I will pay Loops co-pay personally. Just PM me the name of the counselor. Please, please, please have Loop chat with a mental health professional. There is no shame in it - I have a personal counselor I talk to when I am confused - it really helps.
|
|
moon/Laura
Administrator
Forum Owner
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 15:05:36 GMT -5
Posts: 10,044
Mini-Profile Text Color: f8fb10
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 8:31:56 GMT -5
Post by moon/Laura on Jun 26, 2011 8:31:56 GMT -5
And oddly every time we do it those threads get a billion views and tons of comments. Kind of weird since nobody here wants to see that kind of drama, don't you think? You were a mod on the old boards for like ever though, I'm sure you know exactly what everyone wants to comment about and read. I mean, that's probably why YM shuns train wreck threads (like Dox's, CM's, Terri's, etc.) and refuses to comment on them. Yes, *because* it's a train wreck! While i don't doubt a fair number of people reading and commenting do actually care about you and loop, the majority probably viewed the whole thing as a subject of ridicule and/or pity. Water cooler gossip. Is that what you want for yourselves?
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,343
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 9:18:16 GMT -5
Post by swamp on Jun 26, 2011 9:18:16 GMT -5
Judge our marriage however you want. We've been married 11 years and including the last couple days have had about three fights. Dark, DH and I hardly ever fought for about the first 6 years of our marriage, not because there wasn't anything worth arguing about, but because I kept it bottled up, and I kept it bottled up until I seriously contemplated leaving him. When the anger finally came out, it was really ugly. Not "fighting" is not a good thing for a marriage. ETA: The only reason I didnt leave him, at the time, is because we had two babies. Now I'm glad I stayed, but it was awful for a few years. It still isn't perfect, but I've gotten much better at telling him when I'm upset and why. I've also stopped trying to do everything to make him happy and just do what makes me happy. Funny how that makes our relationship better.
|
|
midjd
Administrator
Your Money Admin
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:09:23 GMT -5
Posts: 17,719
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 9:25:01 GMT -5
Post by midjd on Jun 26, 2011 9:25:01 GMT -5
Swamp is right...if your fights typically end in threats of suicide, it's better to have more frequent, less serious ones. And repression never helps anyone.
|
|
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 10:09:01 GMT -5
Post by isabella on Jun 26, 2011 10:09:01 GMT -5
a mother with young children expressing depression and suicide ... a dad/husband in denial suggesting the problem will blow over, until the next blow up. murder/suicide is not an uncommon cause of death. If you can't care enough about yourselves to get help you owe it to your children to seek counseling for them to learn how to cope and manage the toxic environment you are exposing them to.
if starting these threads is a game you two play to get 'billions of hits' ........ what a sick way to get your jollies when so many here don't know whether to take it seriously as a life and death matter for the mother/wife or as a joke.
|
|
MN-Investor
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:22:44 GMT -5
Posts: 1,939
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 10:36:13 GMT -5
Post by MN-Investor on Jun 26, 2011 10:36:13 GMT -5
The biggest problem with making an argument public is that it will only exacerbate the problem.
Without knowing all the history of the issues, we will take sides or make what we think are helpful suggestions but only fuel the argument. For example, it could a long festering argument that one of you wants a 7th child but you have mutually decided that 6 are enough. Having one of us say that good families require at least 10 children creates discord while not helping the situation. (Substitute getting a job, staying at home, breast feeding, unschooling, etc. for my example.) What possible good comes from having uninformed members take sides in a personal argument?
|
|
MN-Investor
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:22:44 GMT -5
Posts: 1,939
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 12:28:41 GMT -5
Post by MN-Investor on Jun 26, 2011 12:28:41 GMT -5
7 kids, now thats crazy [image] My parents didn't think so!
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 13:22:27 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 13:22:27 GMT -5
murder/suicide is not an uncommon cause of death. What the.... what planet do you guys live on? My wife and I had a fight, that doesn't mean we're going to break out the shotguns and settle this like an old western. Jesus. I didn't realize Loop was as depressed about not being able to find a job as she is. The last time she was depressed, post partum after our youngest was born, she went to a counselor and took Zoloft. If she needs to do that again, that's fine. Our marriage isn't on the brink, I don't contemplate murdering her and killing myself. It was a fight. It's not the end of the world or our marriage. Let's try to keep things in perspective people.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 13:26:49 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 13:26:49 GMT -5
While i don't doubt a fair number of people reading and commenting do actually care about you and loop, the majority probably viewed the whole thing as a subject of ridicule and/or pity. Water cooler gossip. Is that what you want for yourselves? The whole board does it. Why is it OK for Dox to have thread after thread about her husband, her home life, etc. and everything is fine, but when Loop and I talk about ours it's a no no. If only one of us was on here posting about the other behind their back the mods never care. You get both sides of the story posting and we're either trolls making it up for our own amusement, or it's inappropriate for this board. The double standard is disgusting. If Loop's thread wasn't appropriate for this board, then neither are any of the train wreck threads where we only have one spouse on here trashing the other behind their back.
|
|
formerexpat
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 12:09:05 GMT -5
Posts: 4,079
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 13:45:55 GMT -5
Post by formerexpat on Jun 26, 2011 13:45:55 GMT -5
I have to agree with Dark's post 88. However, some of the things said went a bit too far and while I didn't see the post from Loop about the depression and suicide, those types of thoughts should always be taken serious.
At the same time, we generally only see one side of the story on these boards. We were able to see both peoples side of the story and I'm sure that many people on these boards, at one time or another, could relate to one or both of them in terms Loop not feeling appreciated because she doesn't bring in an income and Dark feeling the weight and pressure of providing for a family.
Dark - I hope things are settling a bit and you've been able to talk more calmly with Loop and iron some things out.
|
|
Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 14:24:03 GMT -5
Post by Miss Tequila on Jun 26, 2011 14:24:03 GMT -5
murder/suicide is not an uncommon cause of death. What the.... what planet do you guys live on? My wife and I had a fight, that doesn't mean we're going to break out the shotguns and settle this like an old western. Jesus. I didn't realize Loop was as depressed about not being able to find a job as she is. The last time she was depressed, post partum after our youngest was born, she went to a counselor and took Zoloft. If she needs to do that again, that's fine. Our marriage isn't on the brink, I don't contemplate murdering her and killing myself. It was a fight. It's not the end of the world or our marriage. Let's try to keep things in perspective people. Silly Dark...the pool isn't about YOU killing Loop...
|
|
moon/Laura
Administrator
Forum Owner
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 15:05:36 GMT -5
Posts: 10,044
Mini-Profile Text Color: f8fb10
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 14:25:57 GMT -5
Post by moon/Laura on Jun 26, 2011 14:25:57 GMT -5
While i don't doubt a fair number of people reading and commenting do actually care about you and loop, the majority probably viewed the whole thing as a subject of ridicule and/or pity. Water cooler gossip. Is that what you want for yourselves? The whole board does it. Why is it OK for Dox to have thread after thread about her husband, her home life, etc. and everything is fine, but when Loop and I talk about ours it's a no no. <chunck removed> The double standard is disgusting. If Loop's thread wasn't appropriate for this board, then neither are any of the train wreck threads where we only have one spouse on here trashing the other behind their back. you are missing the point i am trying to make dark. the topic itself was fine. that fact that you disagreed about it was ok too. what WASN'T fine was the very personal, ugly, nasty fight! i really don't see what is so hard to understand about that. when it gets to the point where you're both cyber screaming expletives and saying things you know full well are meant to cause the other deep emotional pain, it's time to STOP. take it off the boards. and while i can't say i approve of "one spouse on here trashing the other behind their back" as you said, at least in that case the spouse isn't a member here and people are not feeling like they're forced to take sides.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,869
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 14:47:43 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Jun 26, 2011 14:47:43 GMT -5
Well, it's amazing as to what can trigger a big fight. DF's and mine has been lurking and this am it came out as well. We will see if he gets his act together, or not.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:12:43 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 15:12:43 GMT -5
Well, it's amazing as to what can trigger a big fight. DF's and mine has been lurking and this am it came out as well. Sorry Zib, I know how much that sucks.
|
|
qofcc
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:30:58 GMT -5
Posts: 1,869
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:13:33 GMT -5
Post by qofcc on Jun 26, 2011 15:13:33 GMT -5
That's the thing that freaked me out. She got a SL and went to college for a degree in English but then stayed home and continued to be a SAHM. Why spend money you didn't have on something you aren't going to use? I would NEVER be dependent on ANY man now because you are one man away from welfare. Regardless of how she feels about working, and she is not into that idea at all it seems, she is in a very vulnerable position and needs to get herself taken care of. No one is too important to work.
So your opinion is that no woman deserves to be a SAHM even if their family can afford it, they should all be forced to leave their children and work as an insurance policy in case their husband decides to leave them? What kind of an attitude is that? That's exactly the kind of women's lib bullshit that people spout to that's supposed to "empower" women but instead just takes responsibility away from men.
She finished a degree a couple of years ago at the height of the recession and had trouble finding a job. Not exactly a shocker. Then her family needs a bunch of expensive dental care and her husband who is going through is own issues about being unhappy with his job tells her that she's needs to get a job and start contributing income. So she agrees to do that after the kids go back to school, but he said something that inadvertently set her off and she started a fight and he started taking out his frustration by telling her she's out of time to look for the right job, just get anything that will help with the bills.
And on top of that comment from her husband who would have probably backed down on the time line when he thought about it again, she had a bunch of people tearing her apart and calling her a spoiled princess and demanding she do something about it right now even though she said many times that she'll do it when school starts.
For someone who has a history of depression and is frustrated with things going on in her life, of course that could cause an episode of depression. Why wouldn't it??
Remember how earlier in the thread, Loop said that Dark always wins arguments by wearing her down -- because she gets frustrated and angry and eventually would rather back down than continue? Her words were something like "you don't win on the merit of your arguments, but on the anger of mine".
It was clearly a long standing, deep-seeded argument that was not going to be resolved in a thread. Both their issues, as you saw, lingered for years.
And that's one thing that you need to realize, Dark, is that just because you wear someone down in an argument and they give in and the next day they have themselves back under control and can smile and pretend like nothing happened, doesn't mean that they came around to your way of thinking and that deep down they're OK with things. I don't know what all of your marital issues are, and hopefully they are things that time can resolve, but if you push her to do something that is going to take her away from the kids or change your family dynamic and, God forbid, anything happens, it might cause a rift that can't be fixed. Not that any of your points weren't valid, just that you need to weigh these short term things against the long term.
And as far as the $100/hr, check with your insurance. I know there is a new law (at least in NY) that mental health visits have to cost the same co-pay as any specialist. You don't go and call it "marriage counseling", one of you goes for "stress" or "depression" and then brings the other to some of the visits to work on the marriage.
at least in that case the spouse isn't a member here and people are not feeling like they're forced to take sides.
Lots of times people take the side of the absent spouse. Hoops always takes the side of the absent spouse.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:14:03 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 15:14:03 GMT -5
[red]what WASN'T fine was the very personal, ugly, nasty fight![/red] Fair enough, but we usually get flak whenever both of us post on a thread whether we're fighting or not. It seems like having both sides of a couple involved in a conversation just weirds people out for some reason.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:17:54 GMT -5
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jun 26, 2011 15:17:54 GMT -5
And that's one thing that you need to realize, Dark, is that just because you wear someone down in an argument and they give in and the next day they have themselves back under control and can smile and pretend like nothing happened That's not what our arguments feel like at all. I never wear her down and get her to see my side. We argue for a while until the stress of arguing about it is too much for her, so I have to back down, because if I try to get my way when she's so vulnerable and depressed I'm obviously a douche. So I back down and Loop gets her way. If I was able to wear her down and get my way she would already be working.
|
|
qofcc
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:30:58 GMT -5
Posts: 1,869
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:24:37 GMT -5
Post by qofcc on Jun 26, 2011 15:24:37 GMT -5
I never wear her down and get her to see my side. We argue for a while until the stress of arguing about it is too much for her, so I have to back down, because if I try to get my way when she's so vulnerable and depressed I'm obviously a douche. So I back down and Loop gets her way.
And she doesn't come back and feel guilty and give in to what you wanted later? Then she's a stronger woman than I am, which we already knew. But it sounded like from her posts that you guys are following your dreams about the house and stuff. I would just be really careful about this thing with giving up time with the kids because you don't want her do end up feeling pushed into doing something she's going to resent you for later.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,869
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:38:54 GMT -5
Post by zibazinski on Jun 26, 2011 15:38:54 GMT -5
Getting pushed into a job is not the end of the world. Why act like it is? Obviously the SAHM isn't working for at least ONE of the parties and even if the other wants to keep doing it, it's over and she knows it. If thats enough to push someone over the edge then that is a serious issue. Did I want to go to work? No, I wanted to be a SAHM, but life intervened. But no way would I run up SL's and then not work, period. That is just wrong.
|
|
|
deleted
Jun 26, 2011 15:42:42 GMT -5
Post by debtheaven on Jun 26, 2011 15:42:42 GMT -5
Karma to Moonbeam because I think she is handling this very well, and I'm sure it's not easy (I think she's a she lol)
And hugs to Dark and Loop. It's not ideal to beech about one's partner. But when the partners are both on the board, and swinging at each other in the heat of a terrible argument in real time, like it or not, it DOES raise "the ante", and it's very unpleasant to read / watch, especially for people who care about both of you.
|
|