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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 9:32:46 GMT -5
I have a friend that was looking into police work for Surprise Az. I think he said it started at $27.00 an hour plus benefits. That does not seem to be underpaid. Compared to what? The corporate employees I have worked with make more than that and there is still 15% of them that are inept. I am saying if you want close to perfection and better candidates you are gonna have to start poaching the best candidates from the the private sector. For instance I make well over 2 times what my brother makes and he is a cop in the ghetto of a large city, there is no way in hell I would even consider doing his job for what I make let alone 55k a year considering all the crap he goes through on a daily basis. 55k a year for that job absolutely is underpaid, especially if you want to draw top candidates.
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djAdvocate
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Sept 13, 2017 12:08:45 GMT -5
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 13, 2017 12:08:45 GMT -5
I have a friend that was looking into police work for Surprise Az. I think he said it started at $27.00 an hour plus benefits. That does not seem to be underpaid. Compared to what? The corporate employees I have worked with make more than that and there is still 15% of them that are inept. I am saying if you want close to perfection and better candidates you are gonna have to start poaching the best candidates from the the private sector. For instance I make well over 2 times what my brother makes and he is a cop in the ghetto of a large city, there is no way in hell I would even consider doing his job for what I make let alone 55k a year considering all the crap he goes through on a daily basis. 55k a year for that job absolutely is underpaid, especially if you want to draw top candidates. moreover, unless it is private police work, he is comparing apples to oranges. wages in government work have generally kept up with inflation. not so in the private sector.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 7:08:57 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 7:08:57 GMT -5
$56000. a year to start plus benefits to start is not to bad,
Do you have a problem with the cop shooting the woman in her PJ's or the cop arresting the nurse?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 8:57:03 GMT -5
$56000. a year to start plus benefits to start is not to bad, Do you have a problem with the cop shooting the woman in her PJ's or the cop arresting the nurse? Yup, I also have a problem with people painting all police as bad from individual instances. Now will you answer my questions? You can find the first with google. If you aren't willing to answer it is really just old man yells at cloud at each individual instance. 1. what is the current police incident rate? 2. what do you think it should be? 3. how do you propose we get there? If 56k isn't too bad to deal with nonstop domestic disputes, being shot at and attacked with stabbing weapons, catching a guy gratifying himself with motor oil in front of a dollar general and busting a male HIV positive prostitute for selling the rights to his colostomy bag hole why didn't you ever sign up for the Police Academy? Those are all actual stories that I have been told by LEO's I know, not to mention my good friend that gave their life in the line of duty a couple years back.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 9:03:29 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 9:03:29 GMT -5
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 9:21:23 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 9:21:23 GMT -5
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Sept 14, 2017 9:29:35 GMT -5
Can you offer a rational reason why anyone should answer your above question when you won't answer aj's questions?
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 9:32:10 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 9:32:10 GMT -5
This trial is coming up, Ex-Mesa AZ police officer , Phillip Brailford, He shot a man crawling down the hall, crying, begging for his life,,, Yea, shot him five times in the back, with an AR 15, at about 4 foot away!! Nothing in the media about the up coming trial, I bet the prosecutor is look at every angle they can to drop charges against this murder. www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/police-officers-2014.htm If it does come to trial is the prosecutor going to use a Jr. prosecutor in this like the DOJ did in the Sheriff Joe trial?
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 9:37:42 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 9:37:42 GMT -5
Can you offer a rational reason why anyone should answer your above question when you won't answer aj's questions? I thought I did I googled the indent for police that is what came up, I did add the one about other dangerous professions, what else do you want, I will try to answer.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 9:45:39 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 9:45:39 GMT -5
If you don't realize what you are getting into, that may be the problem!
There are a lot of badge heavy cops out there, that think that it give complete immunity!
They are protected by other police and prosecutors that refuse to prosecute!
Explain how Scottsdale police allowed James Peters to shoot seven, kill six before he was given a medical retirement??
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Sept 14, 2017 10:08:12 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 10:08:12 GMT -5
If you don't realize what you are getting into, that may be the problem! There are a lot of badge heavy cops out there, that think that it give complete immunity! They are protected by other police and prosecutors that refuse to prosecute! Explain how Scottsdale police allowed James Peters to shoot seven, kill six before he was given a medical retirement?? Tried to get into a reasonable debate with you on the subject but there really is no point, either you don't understand what I am saying/asking or are just answering what you wish I had asked.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 10:24:02 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 10:24:02 GMT -5
$56000. a year to start plus benefits to start is not to bad, Do you have a problem with the cop shooting the woman in her PJ's or the cop arresting the nurse? Yup, I also have a problem with people painting all police as bad from individual instances. Now will you answer my questions? You can find the first with google. If you aren't willing to answer it is really just old man yells at cloud at each individual instance. 1. what is the current police incident rate? 2. what do you think it should be? 3. how do you propose we get there? If 56k isn't too bad to deal with nonstop domestic disputes, being shot at and attacked with stabbing weapons, catching a guy gratifying himself with motor oil in front of a dollar general and busting a male HIV positive prostitute for selling the rights to his colostomy bag hole why didn't you ever sign up for the Police Academy? Those are all actual stories that I have been told by LEO's I know, not to mention my good friend that gave their life in the line of duty a couple years back. 2. we can start with not shooting so many people in the back, Saying I feared for my life!
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 22:50:57 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 22:50:57 GMT -5
I copied and pasted What is the current police incident rate? here one that came up. www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/police-officers-2014.htmThe rate of fatal work injuries for police officers in 2014 was 13.5 per 100,000 full-time equivalent workers WELCOME TO TEXAS JUSTICE: YOU MIGHT BEAT THE RAP, BUT YOU WON'T BEAT THE RIDE. TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 Police have dangerous jobs but some occupations more fatal The latest federal Census of Fatal Occupational Industries came out last month, and I was interested to learn that the fatality rate among police officers and sheriff's deputies declined more than 20% in 2008 from 2007 - from 19.8 deaths per 100,000 full-time equivalent jobs down to a rate of 15.6 per 100,000 last year (the same as in 2006). That's welcome news. According to these data, law enforcement officers rank at the top of the fatality list among American service workers, with an on-the-job death rate more than five times as high as the average municipal employee (who in 2008 suffered a fatality rate of 2.7 per 100,000). So in a real sense it's true, as the saying goes, that police officers "put their lives on the line every day." But to place that statement into context, it's worth mentioning there are many common jobs more hazardous than being a police officer, including some among municipal employees. For comparison, here are some 2008 on-the job fatality rates (expressed in number of deaths per 100,000 full-time equivalent jobs) for various occupations: Fishermen: 128.9 Logging workers: 116.7 Aircraft pilots: 72.4 Iron and steelworkers: 46.4 Farmers and ranchers: 39.5 Garbage collectors: 36.8 Roofers: 34.4 Electrical power line installation/repair: 29.8 Truck drivers: 22.8 Oil and gas extraction: 21.9 Taxi drivers: 19.3 Drinking establishment employees: 17.0 Construction workers: 16.0 Police and deputies: 15.6Grounds maintenance: 11.9 Welders: 10.5 Electricians: 8.3 Gas station attendant: 7.5 Firefighters: 6.9 Auto mechanics: 5.0 Newspaper publishers: 4.8 Carpenters: 4.7 Janitors: 3.1 Retail sales: 1.5 Just as taxi drivers and truckers have high fatality rates, a lot of the danger from being a police officer comes from spending so much time on the roadway.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 14, 2017 22:58:52 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 14, 2017 22:58:52 GMT -5
Can you offer a rational reason why anyone should answer your above question when you won't answer aj's questions? Tenn, a lot of the time I post stuff, I know that I will probably not get a response, I see these thing as double standard others don't! It is my way, sometimes to vent, There are only a couple of posters or one here I don't respond to. Sometime I may not have an answer. I understand that AJ is on the other side of this fence, I have no ill will towards him.
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djAdvocate
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Sept 14, 2017 23:13:48 GMT -5
Post by djAdvocate on Sept 14, 2017 23:13:48 GMT -5
Can you offer a rational reason why anyone should answer your above question when you won't answer aj's questions? Tenn, a lot of the time I post stuff, I know that I will probably not get a response, I see these thing as double standard others don't! that is a good thing for you to contemplate. deeply.
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verrip1
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Post by verrip1 on Sept 15, 2017 12:00:32 GMT -5
Tenn, a lot of the time I post stuff, I know that I will probably not get a response, I see these thing as double standard others don't! that is a good thing for you to contemplate. deeply. Expectation of epiphany is quite illusory. Examples abound!
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Tennesseer
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Sept 15, 2017 23:15:44 GMT -5
Post by Tennesseer on Sept 15, 2017 23:15:44 GMT -5
OldCoyote DOJ Scaling Back Obama-Era Program to Reform Police DepartmentsThe Justice Department announced Friday that it is significantly scaling back a program created during the Obama administration to help reform police departments after controversial incidents such as police-involved shootings. The department will no longer issue audit reports of police departments or suggest reforms; instead it will focus on assisting local law enforcement agencies with specific grants aimed at fighting violent crime. Under the department’s Office of Community Oriented Policing Services (COPS), police departments could sign up for the program voluntarily and work with Justice Department officials to improve trust between police and the public. But, according to a background document provided by the Justice Department, the program over the past several years evolved to much broader investigations of police departments and led to tension and a more adversarial relationship between Justice and the participating departments. “Changes to this program will fulfill my commitment to respect local control and accountability, while still delivering important tailored resources to local law enforcement to fight violent crime,” said Attorney General Jeff Sessions. “This is a course correction to ensure that resources go to agencies that require assistance rather than expensive wide-ranging investigative assessments that go beyond the scope of technical assistance and support.” Complete article here: DOJ Scaling Back Obama-Era Program to Reform Police Departments
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Sept 16, 2017 9:48:35 GMT -5
OldCoyote DOJ Scaling Back Obama-Era Program to Reform Police DepartmentsThe Justice Department announced Friday that it is significantly scaling back a program created during the Obama administration to help reform police departments after controversial incidents such as police-involved shootings. The department will no longer issue audit reports of police departments or suggest reforms; instead it will focus on assisting local law enforcement agencies with specific grants aimed at fighting violent crime. Under the department’s Office of Community Oriented Policing Services (COPS), police departments could sign up for the program voluntarily and work with Justice Department officials to improve trust between police and the public. But, according to a background document provided by the Justice Department, the program over the past several years evolved to much broader investigations of police departments and led to tension and a more adversarial relationship between Justice and the participating departments. “Changes to this program will fulfill my commitment to respect local control and accountability, while still delivering important tailored resources to local law enforcement to fight violent crime,” said Attorney General Jeff Sessions. “This is a course correction to ensure that resources go to agencies that require assistance rather than expensive wide-ranging investigative assessments that go beyond the scope of technical assistance and support.” Complete article here: DOJ Scaling Back Obama-Era Program to Reform Police Departments This most certainly not good, for the police or us!
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OldCoyote
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Sept 16, 2017 10:28:15 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 16, 2017 10:28:15 GMT -5
www.cnn.com/2017/09/15/us/jason-stockley-officer-shooting-verdict/index.html The prosecution cited footage of Stockley rummaging through a bag in the back of the police vehicle. That was when Stockley retrieved the weapon, they argued. Prosecutors also pointed to the fact that Stockley's DNA had been found on the weapon.Question? wouldn't there have been dust from the bag on the gun also, why didn't come up? A bag with narcotics was found inside Smith's car, according to a responding officer's testimony. It was later revealed to be heroin, If the gun was planted could this also have been planted? Prosecutors argued Stockley intended to kill Smith, citing audio from the internal police vehicle camera during the car chase in which he told his partner, "We're killing this motherf***er."
And they did!!
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toomuchreality
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Post by toomuchreality on Sept 17, 2017 22:24:43 GMT -5
Update re: original post subject (fyi Tracy is Payne's supervisor who was also seen in the video) " Both department veterans, Payne makes about $129,000 annually in total compensation and Tracy about $150,000, according to Utah’s Right To Know. Both officers now face the results of internal affairs and Civilian Review Board reports, released earlier this week. They have until early next month to respond to the findings, which include the violation of about a half-dozen department policies when they arrested Wubbels. Chief Mike Brown ultimately will decide their future with the department. A criminal investigation into the episode by the Unified Police Department, FBI and Salt Lake County District Attorney’s Office is ongoing. The officers’ attorneys were not immediately available for comment Friday night. " "The controversial arrest of a University Hospital nurse wasn’t the first time Salt Lake City police Detective Jeff Payne had faced an internal investigation for violating department policies, newly released records show." www.sltrib.com/news/2017/09/16/slcpd-detective-who-arrested-nurse-had-been-disciplined-for-alleged-sexual-harassment-and-other-violations-records-show/
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OldCoyote
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Sept 18, 2017 19:50:01 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 18, 2017 19:50:01 GMT -5
Payne makes about $129,000 annually in total compensation and Tracy about $150,000, according to Utah’s Right To Know.
Doesn't look like these two were poorly paid!
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OldCoyote
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Sept 19, 2017 21:31:48 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 19, 2017 21:31:48 GMT -5
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toomuchreality
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Sept 21, 2017 3:19:01 GMT -5
Post by toomuchreality on Sept 21, 2017 3:19:01 GMT -5
Another unfortunate event gephardtdaily.com/national-international/oklahoma-police-shoot-and-kill-deaf-man-holding-a-pipe-in-his-front-yard/*Taken from the article: "Sept. 20 (UPI) — Oklahoma City police shot dead a deaf man who was holding a metal pipe in his front yard and allegedly walking towards a police officer, police said Wednesday."
"Mathews said Sanchez did not strike the officers and neither sustained injuries. He also said Sanchez did not have any prior criminal history.
Police said they arrived to Sanchez’s house to investigate a hit and run involving Sanchez’s father, who initially called police and told them his son had hit his vehicle.
Neighbor Julio Rayos said Sanchez uses hand gestures to communicate.It seems like this would be esp. scary to people with deaf loved ones. My thoughts go out to his family and friends In another officer related story.... (a bit different)Proano, 42, is the first known Chicago police officer to be convicted in federal court for an on-duty shooting.gephardtdaily.com/national-international/federal-jury-convicts-ex-chicago-cop-for-shooting-2-teens/ Aug. 30 (UPI) — A federal jury found a former Chicago police officer guilty of unreasonable force during a 2013 incident in which he fired 16 shots into a car and wounded two teenagers. The jury took four hours to find ex-cop Marco Proano guilty of two felony counts of using excessive force in violating the victims’ civil rights, reported the Chicago Tribune. Proano, 42, is the first known Chicago police officer to be convicted in federal court for an on-duty shooting. “Mr. Proano’s actions are intolerable and stand in stark contrast to the hard work Chicago police officers do each day to build trust and serve our communities,” Chicago Police Supt. Eddie Johnson said at that time, according to DNA Info. “As police officers, integrity and trust are paramount to everything we do, and we will always hold ourselves to the highest professional standards.”I think, for the most part, officers really are trying to do the right thing. I have no statistics or proof. It's just what I choose to believe. I have to have hope.-All the best to all.
*Sorry if these have already been posted somewhere. If so, please delete. Thanks!
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OldCoyote
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Sept 21, 2017 8:53:41 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 21, 2017 8:53:41 GMT -5
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toomuchreality
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Sept 22, 2017 2:43:55 GMT -5
Post by toomuchreality on Sept 22, 2017 2:43:55 GMT -5
I have to disagree. The article says they didn't HEAR them. That's not the same thing as not listening. "Magdiel Sanchez, 35, didn’t obey commands to drop the pipe before one cop shot him and another fired a Taser round, Oklahoma City Police Capt. Bo Mathews said at a Wednesday press conference. The two did not hear witnesses shouting, “He can’t hear you,” Mathews said."I'm not here to argue with you, or anyone else. But opinions and facts are not the same thing and should not be reported as such IMO.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 23, 2017 22:45:02 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 23, 2017 22:45:02 GMT -5
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OldCoyote
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Sept 24, 2017 9:24:51 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 24, 2017 9:24:51 GMT -5
From another thread, Wow! Looks almost as exciting as posting on one of your threads on police and waiting to read your reaction.
Most of the time I don't expect a reaction, It is pretty apparent that I am the only one that sees a double standard on what what police, government people are allowed to get away with!
Yea, they can shoot a woman in her Pj's,, They can plant evidence, destroy evidence, seize people's property at any time or reason they want, shoot your dog because it look at a cop,
beat up nurses, lie to, try to intimate that same nurse! action of the EPA that poisoned the drinking water of millions of us,
Have judges declare that there was no evidence that a gun was planted, when only the cops fingerprints and DNA were on it.
Constantly shooting people in the back "I feared for my life " as the victim is running or driving away!!
Unfortunately, I am the only one that expect equal justice for all!!!
Thank God I volunteered to work today, otherwise I would be beating on this key board!
And, No I don't expect you to fucking reply!!!
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billisonboard
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Sept 24, 2017 9:39:34 GMT -5
Post by billisonboard on Sept 24, 2017 9:39:34 GMT -5
From another thread, Wow! Looks almost as exciting as posting on one of your threads on police and waiting to read your reaction.Most of the time I don't expect a reaction, It is pretty apparent that I am the only one that sees a double standard on what what police, government people are allowed to get away with! Yea, they can shoot a woman in her Pj's,, They can plant evidence, destroy evidence, seize people's property at any time or reason they want, shoot your dog because it look at a cop, beat up nurses, lie to, try to intimate that same nurse! action of the EPA that poisoned the drinking water of millions of us, Have judges declare that there was no evidence that a gun was planted, when only the cops fingerprints and DNA were on it. Constantly shooting people in the back "I feared for my life " as the victim is running or driving away!! Unfortunately, I am the only one that expect equal justice for all!!! Thank God I volunteered to work today, otherwise I would be beating on this key board! And, No I don't expect you to fucking reply!!! You left off the from the quote. I do appreciate your keeping the problem on our radar. The challenge is that with the decentralized nature of law enforcement in our nation, what are we to do? All of us collectively beating on our keyboards isn't going to stop. it.
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OldCoyote
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Sept 29, 2017 20:43:44 GMT -5
Post by OldCoyote on Sept 29, 2017 20:43:44 GMT -5
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Sept 30, 2017 2:16:54 GMT -5
The dog didn't "eat the man". The dog did what it's taught to do. It latched on and held. It did not continue to bite. Had it wished to do so, it probably could have torn the idiot's arm off. Perhaps, had the man not been tweaked out of his mind and threatening passersby (actually hitting a taxi driver) he'd not have encountered the police and the dog.
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