ISIS Terrorist attack occurred in San Bernardino California

[djAdvocate]

Dec 2, 2015 21:14:34 GMT -5 Shooby said:

This was a very well planned organized attack.

what makes you think so?

[Value Buy]

Dec 2, 2015 20:11:42 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Dec 2, 2015 19:41:41 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Video footage made it look like all the windows shot out, tires were flat, and I thought maybe a tail light was blinking.
The police wasted no lead on them

Did I see the shot up vehicle's windshield wipers running?

Evidently you saw that also.

I figured I was seeing things

[Opti]

www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/one-suspect-identified-police-kill-man-and-woman-connected-to-san-bernardino-mass-shooting/ar-AAfWxUk?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=iehp#image=AAfWIj5|39

[Value Buy]

Dec 2, 2015 21:43:38 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 2, 2015 21:14:34 GMT -5 Shooby said:

This was a very well planned organized attack.

what makes you think so?

There might be an answer to some of our questions here.
The one person that is named, did work for that county office that was shot up.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/one-suspect-identified-police-kill-man-and-woman-connected-to-san-bernardino-mass-shooting/ar-AAfWxUk?li=BBnb7Kz
He is reported as having left the meeting room, "upset" or, out of sorts, and came back with the other two twenty minutes later.

It was obviously planned as they had pipe bombs in the car, and you do not come up with them in twenty minutes.


From the link:

In an exchange overheard on a law enforcement radio channel, an official can be heard telling a dispatcher Farook "was at the meeting," referring to where the shooting took place, and then left "out of the blue."



Farook "was acting nervous" and left the building approximately 20 minutes before the gunfire erupted, according to the recorded transmissions.



A black sport utility vehicle was seen fleeing from the office complex where the shooting occurred. Shortly before 3 p.m., police began pursuing a black SUV in San Bernardino.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 2, 2015 22:39:22 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Dec 2, 2015 21:43:38 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

what makes you think so?

There might be an answer to some of our questions here.
The one person that is named, did work for that county office that was shot up.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/one-suspect-identified-police-kill-man-and-woman-connected-to-san-bernardino-mass-shooting/ar-AAfWxUk?li=BBnb7Kz
He is reported as having left the meeting room, "upset" or, out of sorts, and came back with the other two twenty minutes later.

It was obviously planned as they had pipe bombs in the car, and you do not come up with them in twenty minutes.


From the link:

In an exchange overheard on a law enforcement radio channel, an official can be heard telling a dispatcher Farook "was at the meeting," referring to where the shooting took place, and then left "out of the blue."



Farook "was acting nervous" and left the building approximately 20 minutes before the gunfire erupted, according to the recorded transmissions.



A black sport utility vehicle was seen fleeing from the office complex where the shooting occurred. Shortly before 3 p.m., police began pursuing a black SUV in San Bernardino.

no.  it doesn't.

what part of this screams "well organized" to you?

[Opti]

Yup. I hope it turns out different than expectations. I am also not happy with most politician posturing on either side. I do not like calls for gun control when we do not have all the facts in and I really hope the NY Daily News supposed cover is not real.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 2, 2015 22:50:11 GMT -5 Opti said:

Yup. I hope it turns out different than expectations. I am also not happy with most politician posturing on either side. I do not like calls for gun control when we do not have all the facts in and I really hope the NY Daily News supposed cover is not real.

i am deeply concerned about where this debate is heading.

[Value Buy]

"what part of this screams "well organized" to you?"

Okay I give up.
Can anyone here please explain if three people are involved, one shows up at the party/meeting, leaves and three come back with automatic rifles and pipe bombs in the car, it is organized.
When you attack a very specific target and actually get away without the police tailing you, your organized. And maybe "lucky"

Smart? no
Organized? yes

If you cannot agree, no sense continuing talking tonight,

[djAdvocate]

Dec 2, 2015 23:04:36 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

"what part of this screams "well organized" to you?"

Okay I give up.
Can anyone here please explain if three people are involved, one shows up at the party/meeting, leaves and three come back with automatic rifles and pipe bombs in the car, it is organized.
When you attack a very specific target and actually get away without the police tailing you, your organized. And maybe "lucky"

Smart? no
Organized? yes

If you cannot agree, no sense continuing talking tonight,

sorry, but that doesn't seem well organized to me.
that seems like two dumbasses sitting in an SUV with a bunch of dud bombs, waiting for a third one to come back and say "ok, it's cool to go shoot some folks now".

nothing "well" or particularly "organized" about any of that.  just three assholes doing lame stuff in the dumbest way possible, and dying in a hail of bullets for it.

edit: if you don't agree, i couldn't really care less.  i will never figure out why you and shoob are so impressed, i guess.

[Opti]

Davis said the suspects also threw a thick-gauge copper pipe out of the SUV, but no explosives were found inside.

The fake pipe bomb was equipped with a piece of material made to look like a wick.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/the-latest-suspects-who-died-each-had-long-gun-handgun/ar-AAfWqmq?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=iehp

(Some good news!)

[Shooby]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3343309/At-TWENTY-people-gunned-California-mass-shooting-police-search-three-suspects.html


Work related violence people! Nothing to see here! Incidental Muslims. Maybe he went to Sunday School once when he was 3 so it's probably Christianity's fault!  He probably didn't like the punch at the Christmas party.

[Value Buy]

Dec 2, 2015 22:50:11 GMT -5 Opti said:

Yup. I hope it turns out different than expectations. I am also not happy with most politician posturing on either side. I do not like calls for gun control when we do not have all the facts in and I really hope the NY Daily News supposed cover is not real.

Was it the one mentioning God?

That was so wrong, in the heat of the moment.
There is an editor there that should have been fired last night.

[Value Buy]

Let's discuss this 
He went to S.A. to do the religious thing, came back with an internet bride nine months ago. 
They left their six month old child (do the math there) with relatives to "go to a doctor's appointment"

It is also reported the people that were attacked actually participated in a baby shower for the child.

This might have been work place violence. I imagine this party was an easier target than at their county offices, as I imagine they have security and metal detectors at the entrance.
Now we are down to two shooters, guns purchased "legally" although not be them.
If they did not originally purchase them, and it was through a third party, how do we determine it was legal, this soon in the investigation?
Were they registered by them?

[Opti]

VB, not sure what religious thing you are mentioning. I looked up Hajj, which happens at the end of their calendar. Times recently have fallen in October and September, not Spring.

HOW DID THE SUSPECTS MEET?

Farook, who was born in the United States, traveled to Saudi Arabia earlier this year and returned with a wife, said co-worker Patrick Baccari, who attended the holiday party Wednesday but was in the bathroom when the shooting started. Baccari says Farook was gone for about a month in the spring, and when he returned word got around Farook had been married. The woman he described as a pharmacist joined him in the U.S. shortly afterward, and they soon had a baby. Police described Malik as Farook's wife or fiancee.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/qanda-about-the-suspects-in-deadly-california-shooting/ar-AAfY0an?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=iehp

I do wonder if she radicalized him given he recently grew his beard long. Wonder what was so important they did not care much about their new daughter.

[OldCoyote]

Dec 2, 2015 21:43:38 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 2, 2015 21:14:34 GMT -5 Shooby said:

This was a very well planned organized attack.

what makes you think so?

www.aol.com/article/2015/12/03/san-bernardino-shooters-used-four-guns-explosive-device-atf/21277342/?icid=maing-grid7%7Cmain5%7Cdl2%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D1691831910

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

My completely amateur theory:

The wife/fiancé was Isis. She tricked/convinced/persuaded him to marry her (despite her being pregnant with another man's baby who may or may not be dead).

They return to the U.S., she continues to receive instruction and orders from Isis and includes a reluctant Farook in the plan using his faith to brainwash him into action. She gets the order to attack yesterday and texts Farook during the party to tell him so. He leaves under duress which explains his reported anger and nervousness. The party wasn't the original target, but she decides they need to eliminate any potential witnesses who can identify him as leaving the party. She can't take the chance that they will be prevented from carrying out the intended target -- whatever, wherever that was.

They never make it to the intended target.

[Opti]

Hussam Ayloush, head of the Council on American-Islamic Relations' Los Angeles area chapter, said Farook and Malik had been married for two years.

They left their 6-month-old daughter with Farook's grandmother Wednesday and said they had a doctor's appointment, Ayloush said.

The grandmother became concerned when she saw reports of a shooting at Farook's workplace. She called him but never got a response.

Police detained another person who was seen running
away after the shootout. But they don't know whether he was involved in the attack.

www.cnn.com/2015/12/03/us/what-we-know-san-bernardino-mass-shooting/index.html

Lots of questions for me now. Was the wife living in Saudi Arabia until early this year? What the heck does her sister think who is married to the guy who was the family spokesman last night?

(J/K)

Utah plates on the SUV?! Radical Muslim Mormons?

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

The car is probably a rental.

[Ombud]

Dec 2, 2015 15:29:01 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

I'm so glad I don't live there any more.

 

I could go to a Planned Parenthood and get shot.

I could go to a place of worship and get shot.

I could go to school and get shot.

I could  go to a center for the handicapped and get shot.

I could go to the movies and get shot.

You clearly need more guns in your country.

You don't have radicalized Muslims YET

Dec 2, 2015 15:38:21 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

VB, you don't see a difference between a ISIS sympathizer shooting at the military and ordinary citizens shooting up other ordinary citizens just for the hell of it?

Really?

the man and woman were radicalized Muslims not 'ordinary citizens'

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

It would be a huge job -- and likely not entirely doable -- but maybe it is time to block Isis' access to the Internet.  

[Opti]

Unclear if she was connected with ISIS. Not sure if it is related, but he posted a pic to an Indian dating website.

Surprised no news story yet has had anyone mention what the dispute was at the party that had him leave early.

[Ombud]

Dec 3, 2015 9:14:43 GMT -5 GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl said:

It would be a huge job -- and likely not entirely doable -- but maybe it is time to block Isis' access to the Internet.  

isn't that what Anonymous is doing? Trying to interrupt their lines of communication?

[mmhmm]

Dec 3, 2015 9:14:43 GMT -5 GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl said:

It would be a huge job -- and likely not entirely doable -- but maybe it is time to block Isis' access to the Internet.  

Sadly, that's quite un-doable, I'm afraid. It's like a game of whack-a-mole. Take one site down and another five pop up in its place. We don't even know, most of the time, who these people are. There are those who are dedicated to taking down pro-ISIS sites; however, it's a never-ending battle. The internet, like it or not, is still the equivalent of the Wild West.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Dec 3, 2015 9:23:23 GMT -5 Ombud said:

Dec 3, 2015 9:14:43 GMT -5 GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl said:

It would be a huge job -- and likely not entirely doable -- but maybe it is time to block Isis' access to the Internet.  

isn't that what anonymous is doing? Trying to interrupt their lines of communication?

I haven't followed the doings of anonymous too closely so I've always thought they were messing with everyone -- just because they can -- and not necessarily trying to be helpful (i.e., by thwarting Isis on behalf of the rest of us).

Does anyone watch Madame Secretary?  Really well-written and very current topically.  I highly recommend it.

[Opti]

Dec 3, 2015 9:22:33 GMT -5 Ombud said:

Dec 2, 2015 15:38:21 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

VB, you don't see a difference between a ISIS sympathizer shooting at the military and ordinary citizens shooting up other ordinary citizens just for the hell of it?

Really?

the man and woman were radicalized Muslims not 'ordinary citizens'

We know that how?

It is certainly suspected by many to be sure. Welts list of places to be shot included two mass shootings done by relatively young crazy men - the theatre shooting and the school shooting. No one assumed they were radicalized Christians, Muslims, or Atheists.

The Colorado shooter planned at least as much as this couple did. The big question is did they go crazy because of perceived personal slights or does it have anything to do with radical Islam? Being Muslim is not sufficient cause to make them part of the radical crazies. Maybe she had postpartum depression and was delusional. Hard to know now, as people are mostly guessing.

[Value Buy]

Dec 3, 2015 8:27:58 GMT -5 Opti said:

VB, not sure what religious thing you are mentioning. I looked up Hajj, which happens at the end of their calendar. Times recently have fallen in October and September, not Spring.

HOW DID THE SUSPECTS MEET?

Farook, who was born in the United States, traveled to Saudi Arabia earlier this year and returned with a wife, said co-worker Patrick Baccari, who attended the holiday party Wednesday but was in the bathroom when the shooting started. Baccari says Farook was gone for about a month in the spring, and when he returned word got around Farook had been married. The woman he described as a pharmacist joined him in the U.S. shortly afterward, and they soon had a baby. Police described Malik as Farook's wife or fiancee.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/qanda-about-the-suspects-in-deadly-california-shooting/ar-AAfY0an?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=iehp

I do wonder if she radicalized him given he recently grew his beard long. Wonder what was so important they did not care much about their new daughter.

Now it is reported they were married two years ago.

[Ombud]

Dec 3, 2015 9:28:35 GMT -5 GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl said:

Dec 3, 2015 9:23:23 GMT -5 Ombud said:

isn't that what anonymous is doing? Trying to interrupt their lines of communication?

I haven't followed the doings of anonymous too closely so I've always thought they were messing with everyone -- just because they can -- and not necessarily trying to be helpful (i.e., by thwarting Isis on behalf of the rest of us).

Does anyone watch Madame Secretary?  Really well-written and very current topically.  I highly recommend it.

I haven't either until now. They're currently modifying their lines on communication on the dark Web into ads for viagra

[swamp]

Reports on CBS This Morning said the man was an employee of the place that was having the party, he left mad, and came back with his wife and guns.

I'm holding judgment to see if this was an ISIS related terrorist attack, or just a run of the mill violent whackadoodle.

[Ombud]

Dec 3, 2015 9:29:57 GMT -5 Opti said:

Dec 3, 2015 9:22:33 GMT -5 Ombud said:

the man and woman were radicalized Muslims not 'ordinary citizens'

We know that how? ....No one assumed they were radicalized Christians, Muslims, or Atheists. ...Hard to know now, as people are mostly guessing.

Their family and the Muslim community down there isn't guessing and they know more about them then either of us. Not saying Daesh just radicalized

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Dec 3, 2015 9:31:31 GMT -5 swamp said:

Reports on CBS This Morning said the man was an employee of the place that was having the party, he left mad, and came back with his wife and guns.

I'm holding judgment to see if this was an ISIS related terrorist attack, or just a run of the mill violent whackadoodle.

Even if it wasn't an official act of Isis, the use of Isis-style attacks makes it so.