billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 14:53:08 GMT -5
... I mean the standard of living across the mid east is just amazing and it has nothing to do with how these areas are governed. OPEC
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 15:06:00 GMT -5
... I mean the standard of living across the mid east is just amazing and it has nothing to do with how these areas are governed. OPEC Exactly!!
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 15:13:06 GMT -5
And I would contend that the Western World built a standard of living on the back of the Third World through economic colonialism as they were losing political control of that part of the world. This has lead to those countries taking more control of their economies and the West having to take on debt to maintain its standard of living. Religion is pretext. Great, argue semantics all you want. ... Gotta wonder how we get from my arguing semantics to my example being "exactly", unless OPEC equals Islam.
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 15:21:25 GMT -5
OPEC should have been the Middle East worlds way to a better life. Billions and billions of dollars have been made, and instead of the money flowing to the people, the leaders kept it for themselves. Meanwhile telling of these evil western colonial powers that are the reason for all their problems. LIES!!! LIES!!! LIES!!!! See it now?
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mroped
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Post by mroped on Nov 14, 2015 15:26:04 GMT -5
That Patton clip is just some kind of "more war" propaganda.
People, politicians especially, misunderstand Patton. He was more about the root and eradication of bad elements and those that had any involvement than what that video is conveying. His success during WW2 campaigns were the result of studying his enemy, anticipating his moves and responding in kind. He understood that what drove the enemy was ideals not actual riches. And of course he had his own ideal: a world rid of evil! And he was a freaking military genius! Maybe more so than given credit for.
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Robert not Bobby
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Post by Robert not Bobby on Nov 14, 2015 15:26:17 GMT -5
Tragic...what a crazy world we live in.
Unfortunately, I think there will be more of this.
I know. I know the average Achmed just wants to live a normal life and provide for his family. But there are a billion plus Muslims, if only one per cent are radical extremists...that is a whole lot of millions of people potentially doing unconscionable things. Can't someone tell them that there really aren't 72 virgins waiting for them in Allah paradise...besides, virgins are so over rated.
Ok, sorry...I was just trying to find some light in this dark day.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 16:02:48 GMT -5
OPEC should have been the Middle East worlds way to a better life. Billions and billions of dollars have been made, and instead of the money flowing to the people, the leaders kept it for themselves. Meanwhile telling of these evil western colonial powers that are the reason for all their problems. LIES!!! LIES!!! LIES!!!! See it now? It flowed to leaders of Third World nations instead of European and American corporate executives and trickling down through Western economies. See it now?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 16:20:04 GMT -5
... I really don't see why we should take in 80,000 Syrians this next year. ... Then you will be glad to know that we aren't going to be doing that: U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry says the U.S. will accept 85,000 refugees from around the world next year, up from 70,000, and the number will rise to 100,000 in 2017.
Aides to Kerry say that many, though not all, of the additional refugees would be Syrian. www.nbcnews.com/storyline/europes-border-crisis/john-kerry-u-s-accept-85-000-refugees-2016-100-n430576
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Robert not Bobby
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Post by Robert not Bobby on Nov 14, 2015 16:24:08 GMT -5
What a huge error to take out Saddam...that part of the world needs dictators with a heavy hand.
We can't go around and say...this is DEMOCRACY, enjoy.
It all blows up in our face.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 16:26:20 GMT -5
... Believe it or not, before the USA was the "bad guy" in the ME for supporting Israel and invading stuff we were actually considered the "good guys". We supported independence for the Arab lands after WWI, and many people looked up to our ideals. However the European powers were the baddies, and these are old grudges. I am not sure we can divine the answer to all that right at the moment. It's complicated. ... Ending European colonialism of Arab lands was certainly to our advantage.
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 16:37:55 GMT -5
OPEC should have been the Middle East worlds way to a better life. Billions and billions of dollars have been made, and instead of the money flowing to the people, the leaders kept it for themselves. Meanwhile telling of these evil western colonial powers that are the reason for all their problems. LIES!!! LIES!!! LIES!!!! See it now? It flowed to leaders of Third World nations instead of European and American corporate executives and trickling down through Western economies. See it now? Of course I do! And that fork in the road is where we are now. Does GOD want us to live in a multicultural, free & secular society - or under the sword of Islam? Neither side is innocent in their lies, and whoever has been telling the bigger one is finished. Since lying is actually part of the Islamic religion, I'm going with a lot more green on the map that is my avatar.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 14, 2015 17:07:54 GMT -5
It flowed to leaders of Third World nations instead of European and American corporate executives and trickling down through Western economies. See it now? Of course I do! And that fork in the road is where we are now. Does GOD want us to live in a multicultural, free & secular society - or under the sword of Islam? Neither side is innocent in their lies, and whoever has been telling the bigger one is finished. Since lying is actually part of the Islamic religion, I'm going with a lot more green on the map that is my avatar. The history of mankind has taught us God is indifferent as to whether or not we live in a multicultural, free & secular society.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 17:14:42 GMT -5
... Does GOD want us to live in a multicultural, free & secular society - or under the sword of Islam? ... Isn't the long term plan a theocracy?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 14, 2015 17:16:57 GMT -5
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b2r
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Post by b2r on Nov 14, 2015 17:19:41 GMT -5
If you keep your head in the sand, (or up your ass) your view never changes. b2r
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 14, 2015 17:29:26 GMT -5
God has nothing to do with this. This was not an act of God or for God. This was an act of inhumanity perpetrated by creatures without souls. Were I a believer I'd not want my God's name associated with this horror in any way, as mitigator, judge, jury, executioner, or otherwise. I mean that. It sickens me. Let's leave God out of it. If you want to discuss that angle of this (if you can find such an angle - I can't), take it to Religious Discussion, please.
From what I can read, the French have responded to this with courage and conviction. They're angry and they have every right to be angry, as does the rest of the world. We lost one of our own - a young student from California. Other countries lost citizens to this savagery, as well. What we need to focus on, and remain aware and educated about, is the response of the world to what's happened here. It's time, world. Words don't cut it anymore. Daesh must be taken care of once and for all. We need to stop playing around, get behind the Kurds (who are actually doing something - small and under-armed as they are), and stop this madness in its tracks. We have the ability. We have the power. If we don't have the motivation now, we're never going to have it!
I'm one disgusted person right now. I've cried all the tears I have. All that's left is anger. I imagine the French feel the same way. Let's hope the rest of the world does, too.
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 17:59:43 GMT -5
If you keep your head in the sand, (or up your ass) your view never changes. b2r ... enjoy talking among yourselves!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2015 18:10:00 GMT -5
We have been told to expect British dead and injured. The band in the theatre was American (They are safe)... but some of their audience may have been American. You must prepare for casualties too. Billison is right. The more people feel disaffected and not part of the country they live in..... the more they will be a recruitment ground for Daesh. That is such a bunch of BS. They don't want to be a part of the country they live in . They don't want to be Parisians, they don't want to be Brits or Canadians or Americans. They just want those countries to be them and theirs. How anyone is not able see that at this point is truly incredible.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2015 20:10:45 GMT -5
These guys are not about religion or Islam. They are just hiding behind the more radical tenets (remember the Bible has some pretty radical verses too). This is about revenge and envy.
They are clearly not thinking about what is going to happen to their families and the disservice they are doing to other Muslims. So true and well said, Bonny.
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b2r
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Post by b2r on Nov 14, 2015 20:27:28 GMT -5
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Nov 14, 2015 20:52:16 GMT -5
That Patton clip is just some kind of "more war" propaganda. People, politicians especially, misunderstand Patton. He was more about the root and eradication of bad elements and those that had any involvement than what that video is conveying. His success during WW2 campaigns were the result of studying his enemy, anticipating his moves and responding in kind. He understood that what drove the enemy was ideals not actual riches. And of course he had his own ideal: a world rid of evil! And he was a freaking military genius! Maybe more so than given credit for. He had his dark side too. Read about his participation in the "Bonus Army".
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 20:54:10 GMT -5
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frankq
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Post by frankq on Nov 14, 2015 21:22:30 GMT -5
That is such a bunch of BS.
They don't want to be a part of the country they live in . They don't want to be Parisians, they don't want to be Brits or Canadians or Americans.
They just want those countries to be them and theirs.
How anyone is not able see that at this point is truly incredible.
Absolutely! And here in the U.S. we foster this B.S. with all of this bi-lingual and worse nonsense and the push to accept and even nurture the cultures of others here. Hell, I was at the Home Depot last week and they have a big sign at the entrances stating all of the languages they speak. Not so at Lowes where I'm happy to go the extra couple of miles to get to now. Assimilation is the key to successful blending of the various ethnicities. If you come, you should accept the culture of the country you go to. As far as who has lied to who, well we're beyond that now. When you start cutting the heads off of nine year old girls, your time on planet earth should be up.....
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Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger
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Post by Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger on Nov 14, 2015 21:42:57 GMT -5
Precisely my point, q - precisely! We are at the fork, and all of us are going to see what path we end up on... Stay
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fishy999
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Post by fishy999 on Nov 14, 2015 22:14:13 GMT -5
More death brought to us by Bush Cheney.
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Nov 15, 2015 6:22:26 GMT -5
I understand the frustration and agree with the sentiment. but give that they are already here, the question has to be how do we manage the situation and prevent an enemy from within. (Given that thousands of people across Europe have gone to fight for Daesh)
Many immigrants haven't been allowed to integrate because of family pressures, ties to the mother country and radicalisation.
One thing could be to say "You can go to Syria but we will cancel your passport and you don't come back" We could prevent the proliferation of Saudi funded Wahhabisim in our Schools and Universities. The Saudis have their own brand of conservatism which is isolationist and doesn't fit into a Western country. They have been using oil money to further their wish of more conservatism in the Muslim populations across the world. We could deny admission to hate preachers who have been invited to speak. We could inspect Madrassas to make sue the teaching is within the law and culture of the land. We could close down internet sites and digitally track known aggressors. ..and we could engage the second generation youth (who are most likely to be radicalised) into Nationalist projects to make them feel they belong.
Most Muslims are horrified by the events of Paris. but in the scheme of things, they don't really matter. Its the very few with murderous intent..... who can and do cause such a huge death toll. ...and we don't need any more.
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 15, 2015 6:34:12 GMT -5
When you have areas in your country where the police won't even go into because it isn't safe, you have a problem. The French people, like those of many other countries have been sold s bill of goods by their own leaders. We are included in that. Get rid of all of them and close your borders. That's the first step. you want to keep your "culture?" Go to where it's acceptable.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 15, 2015 11:01:28 GMT -5
... Get rid of all of them ... That could certainly be a final solution to the problem.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 15, 2015 11:09:18 GMT -5
Yes, it would. I'm sure you see it as genocide. I see it as us or them. They're not willing to assimilate and live in peace.
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Post by Shooby on Nov 15, 2015 11:16:24 GMT -5
Because it's a worldwide war on the West.
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