What would happen to your minor kids?

[Deleted]

My son/DIL told me about a situation with my daughter and her husband. I didn't hear this directly, remember.

Anyway, my daughter and her DH are trying to help figure out what will happen to their niece and nephew. I think the kids are 15 (?) and 12 (?). This isn't my side of the family.

Their mother died due to an unexpected and extreme asthma attack. She was separated from her husband, who is a drug addic and is my daughter's BIL. They weren't divorced, though, which means custody automatically falls to him. Except he's not capable.

My son/DIL told me that my daughter/SIL are thinking of taking these two kids in because they have nowhere else to go. Both sets of grandparents are in their 60s plus the father's parents are taking care of one of their parents.

Good news is that my daughter/SIL wanted lots of kids. They have 3 so maybe 5 is gravy. The also good news is that my daughter is generous and kind. But still . . . wow. My own DH (new DH) admitted that if our grandkids had nowhere else to go, they would have to go HERE. But his eyes glazed over when i said that. Lol.

The Money Lesson I am thinking about is "what happens to your minor kids"? Rather ironically, my daughter/SIL 's kids are supposed to go to HIS younger brother/SIL.

I'm thinking his younger brother can't take these two kids but they can take your three or four kids? I think my daughter overestimated reality, which is easy to do if you are talking about BOTH parents dying. Almost sure not to happen. But what if you are a single parent?

I have no idea what will happen here. I heard it second-hand. My daughter and her husband will make the right decision. Grandparents will have opinions so maybe they will have solutions.

But it reminded me of a vulnerable area for a lot of you young parents.

[kgb18]

DH and I need to make a will. We've been going around and around about who to name as guardians should something happen to us. We're not in a fight (like he wants his sibling, and I say no, I want my sibling). It's more that we both agree that none of our siblings, though we love them, are right (at least right now where they are in their lives). Our parents are still relatively young and healthy, but we're probably leaning towards my parents. It's so tough.

[whoisjohngalt]

This is such a sore subject for me that I am hiding away from it. I don't have any siblings and we don't have friends that we would want to take the kids. My DH's parents are out of the question. So, that leaves either my parents or my DH's sister and her husband. My parents are not young and even though they would agree in a heartbeat, I don't know if they could really take care of (almost) 3 small children.

So, that leaves my SIL and BIL, who I think are the WORST choice I could think of for my kids. So, I am avoiding the whole issue. I just can't deal with it.

Lena

[Deleted]

Well, go ahead and do it, Kgb18. Ny daughter made me remember that you have to make sure the people you have chosen will take them. Why would the third brother and his wife be willing to take my daughter's children but not the first brother's children?

Maybe it's money. My daughter and her DH will leave mega-insurance if they both die. But isn't that an awful reason to decide which sibling's children to take?

I hope it makes her thing twice about her brother and her SIL. Her SIL said, "Maybe she doesn't want to give us custody because of financial reasons." Lol. Her CPA brother said,"No, there will be insurance. But whatever,

My sister and I had to "be taken in" after our father's death. OUr mother had mental problems and had been commited in 3 states.

So I guess this is an issue where I am on the sidelines hoping my duaghter will do the right thing.

[kgb18]

We need to just get it done. We can always change the will down the road if circumstances change. I know any one of our family members would do it. We have close friends who we would name, but they live too far away, and it's really important for us to make sure DD is near all of her family and that whoever takes her makes sure she sees both sides of the family.

[Apple]

I have a will, but in Oregon, that doesn't carry much weight. My ex is an alcoholic and when he left he ended up with a girl who was a crack addict. She'd shoot up, he didn't want to watch, so he'd go to the bar to get drunk. For years he'd use my phone number on applications and even now, 10 years after the divorce, I'll get phone calls from creditors trying to collect money from him...

I have life insurance that is to go into a trust handled by my sister until DS is 25 years old and then he would get the money. The house would also go to my sister. The will states that I want my sister to have custody (even though with her recent life decisions it wouldn't be a great situation, it would be better than any alternative). My ex has only seen our son twice in the last 7 years, three times in the last 10 years, his choice. I've kept the same number as we had when we were married so it's not like he can't find us if he wanted to, he only lives about 100 miles away (I think...)

Even though he hasn't seen my son, his child support, though garnished, is fairly up-to-date, so in the eyes of the state, he has first rights to custody. There is no doubt my family would raise a huge fight to get the state to follow my wishes, but there is always the (big) chance the state would be stupid and put my son in his father's environment. After the ex, the state gets custody before my family does, so even if ex-h declined custody the state would rather put my son in a home first. Anyway, my fear is that my ex would get custody and then drop my son off with his parents who are part of (imo) an extremely bad cult, and he'd be lost to my family forever. The drug addicted gf is gone and he's now engaged to someone else (who may or may not be involved in drugs, I know nothing about her but her name and been told she's a big drinker/partier). Don't know how she'd react to any of this...

So, I can't die. Not until he is 18 and on his own.

[Deleted]

You are so right, Apple. You can NOT die.

I am sure that is also what the mother of the kids I am talking about also said.

SHE earned the money. SHE provided their house and well beint.

SHE could not die. But she did.

Modified to remove the mother's name.

[Deleted]

(I don't have kids, but I have two potential homes lined up for my dog if anything should happen to me)

I am the "just in case" person for my sister's kids. Aside from the far more important fact that I wouldn't want anything to happen to my sister and BIL, I hope this isn't a job I would ever have to fill. I live out of state from the rest of the family, and in the event that a kid lost their parents, I can't imagine asking them to leave their grandparents and other family too, so it would mean me moving back home.

But that's just the stuff you do for family, right?

[Apple]

tbird--because he has paid no child support you may be able to have any of his parental rights removed. When I drew up the will, the lawyer told me that I couldn't do a thing about him having first rights as long as he'd paid child support within the last year. We decided to let sleeping dogs lie and never initiate contact with him. Your situation is different than mine so your wishes (in writing, in a will) would likely carry much more weight than mine will. Of course, there is the chance that he could swoop in and claim all sorts of things and some bleeding-heart would let him take her. I'd ask a lawyer and at least get a will drawn up that states your wishes.

[teppe2]

Should something happen to my husband or me our oldest would remain with my mother. He is staying with her during the school year as he goes to school in Germany already. He is 16 so only two more years until he is an adult anyways. The other three (13, 10, and 8) will go to my BIL and SIL, it's all mapped out in the will, they have a copy of it. Should something happen to them while they are still minors, they will either go to my other BIL/SIL or to my ex-SIL or if they are 16 or older they can choose to live with their oldest brother who by then will be in his 20ies. All financial arrangements are spelled out in the will as well.
That said, I always felt we were lucky because not only do we have people willing to take them in, they all also have the space and time for them.

[Deleted]

I have a friend, an only child, whose Mother died suddenly when she was 7. From talking with my friend, and what she's learned through recent therapy, apparently her family didn't really know what to do with her.

There was SS money, and she received insurance money when she turned 18. Her family fought her Dad in court for custody of her and won. She grew up in her Grandmother's home, but Grandma was a severe alcoholic. There wasn't really a bond, they just lived in the same house and my friend ended up being the caretaker as a teenager. Her uncle and his wife (who didn't have any children) in another state tried to control my friend (not like trying to keep her out of trouble, just controlling period) and the money. When she got the insurance money, she was caught between her uncle and her Dad (who ended up conning her out of some of it). She went away to school several states away to escape, ended up dropping out and coming home broke and basically homeless.

Maybe they all did the best they could under the circumstances (except for Dad basically stealing from her), but in hindsight it was a mess and my friend is still trying to sort out issues that stem from her childhood.

My point is that we shouldn't be so quick to assume that our families will really provide for all of our children's needs if something happened to us. There's much more to raising a child than providing shelter, food and clothing. My friend got all that, but her emotional needs weren't met and she wasn't nurtured.

I use to really worry about what would happen to my children if I died. I tied up some of the money they would receive, in the hopes that that wouldn't be the main motivation for someone to fight for custody of them. Some of that particular pressure has eased, as my youngest will be 18 soon.

[MN-Investor]

You also have to make plans if you have disabled children.

DH's younger brother has Down's Syndrome. He lived with his parents until they were in their 80s, then their own health issues forced them to put BIL in a care facility. Before FIL passed away we went to a lawyer and had the guardianship transfered to DH and to a very responsible nephew who lives near my BIL. That has worked out quite well.

[Deleted]

DH and I have a trust and a will written up. It says that guardianship of DS should go to my mother if something happens, with either FIL or SIL handling the finances. DS will get one third of the estate at 18, one third at 25 and the final portion at 32. There is room for the trustee to either hold back disbursements or speed them up depending on the circumstances. It was frightening and difficult to have the discussion but it's better to have something in place even if it isn't the perfect situation. DH and I both lost a parent while relatively young (16 and 24) and DH has been diagnosed with an auto-immune disorder that has potentially serious complications. I think that it made it easier in some ways for us to do estate planning and get life insurance. We know that crap can happen.

The one thing we haven't done is write a letter explaining exactly how we want DS raised if something terrible occurs. I can't bring myself to do it.

[Havoc]

I am hiding with Lena....

This is a topic that has come up periodically, and lurks in the back of my mind because I am typically a detail-oriented guy with contingency plans for my contingency plans.... but this one has a lot of family issues involved that are just really sticky. No one on either side of the family that could really handle three children -both sets of parents are too old to deal with young children, and while we both have siblings, all have financial and/or personal irresponsibility, and estrangement issues with parental units that would probably make for court fights.

So now that this thread has brought it back to the forefront of my mind, I will worry and think about this topic anew. Maybe this time I will come up with a cunning plan...

[cronewitch]

My great niece with down syndrome will always need someone. Her parents are under 40 but the grandparents are over 60. She is a hard to raise child, hates changes and doesn't bond with most people. She loves her parents, brother, grand parents and a school friend and a friend of the family and one uncle. Right now her grandparents parents could take her but she is only 12 and might need care for 40 years or more when they will be over 100. Only her 15 year old brother might be left of the people she loves. She might end up pretty independent they are explaining now that not everyone gets to learn to drive. A 16 year old friend with down syndrome is being told she will never be allowed to drive so the topic is coming up and her 15 year old brother is starting to learn to drive. She might be able to learn to take a bus and take a job but don't know if she could ever live alone and handle changes.

[bobosensei]

I don't understand why grandparents in their 60s can't take a 12 and 15 year old. I mean I totally get not having the energy for a young child, but these kids are older and will be able to mostly care for themselves. My dad passed away when I was 14 due to a car accident. At 15 we almost lost my mom due to an extreme and sudden illness. If she had died we would have been taken in by my grandmother who was in her 70s. My oldest sister was 20 and away at college, leaving behind a 17, 15, and 13 year old. We were all pretty self sufficient at those ages- but that could have come from having already lost our dad. We just needed a place to live and someone to look out for us a little.

[JustLurkin]

My disabled son would go with his father and stepmother. Years ago, before his father grew up, it would have been my parents.

Should anything happen to his father, his step-mother has requested visitation rights.

I need to update all my non-will paperwork, think there was a recent thread on this--like a list of my son's doctors, my bank account information, insurance policy numbers including my LTC.

We are trying our best to prepare him for living on his own, as he is almost at that age.

ETA: If anything were to happen to my SIL, I'd take her kids in a heartbeat (my brother is a knucklehead and would not be able). This became an issue several years ago when she signed up for the Reserves and thought she was about to be called up, no one would take them. I didn't want to be involved in the hypothetical, she had no business signing up, but had she been called I would have taken them.

[Deleted]

Jun 5, 2011 22:32:23 GMT -5 @tbird said:

The wild card is the erstwhile sperm donor.....who has expressed interest in dd via facebook once at 13 once at 14.....she wants no contact.
<snip>but if he knew there was 300K to go with her, he'd jump on that "for her own good...to know her father" blow through that money in months and then her back onto my family penniless "for her own good"

I was divorced from a man who was an irresponsible alcoholic who refused any settlement that required him to pay CS. (Technically I couldn't turn down CS, but I was "permitted" to keep about $200K in investments in my name in exchange for not getting ongoing CS, which the Ex wouldn't have paid anyway.) My attorney drew up a new will and she put in very emphatic wording about how I did NOT want my Ex to have custody because he hadn't taken any responsibility for DS in years. The way we set it up was that one brother and his family would have custody (with their consent). Another brother, who's a tax accountant and far more interested in managing money, would manage the money. The brother who would have had custody is solid and frugal and probably wouldn't have touched the money until DS went to college.

Fortunately, that was 1997 and DS is now 27 and on his own so none of this ever got executed. I just wanted to point out, though, that if you have confidence in one person to raise the kid(s) and someone else would be better at managing the money, you can separate the two. In tbird's case, having a will that says who will manage the money for the child might discourage a rapacious Ex from fighting for custody just to get at the money in the estate.

[Malarky]

If something should happen to DH and I, I have a pretty detailed plan in place.
Short term, the kids go to neighbors whom they know and trust. Long term, I have someone to handle the money who has only the best interests of the kids at heart. He can in no way benefit. Custody would go to DH's brother and his wife, since their parenting style so closesly resembles ours.
I have been thinking of changing the custody since the kids are older now. I'm not sure that it would be best to lose parents and have to move several states away. I have another closer option that I was unwilling to use when they were younger.

[bean29]

Well, we have made a decision, but we never put it in writing. I would say, partly because I don't 100% agree with DH's decision. Luckily my DS will be 18 in October. So my 14 yo would be the only one affected. I do need to put in writing how our assets would be divided. I would prefer that the $$ go into trust until my kids are 25 or so also.

Here is a link to what one Mother did to find a home for her Son who was autistic. She had no relatives who could take her son. It worked out really well according to the article in the local paper yesterday.

www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/123170783.html

[Wisconsin Beth]

We don't have a will or guardianship paperwork yet. I'd like to get it done this summmer.

2+ years ago, DH and I both had different people in mind. We discussed, then let go of the discussion (it doesn't rate as an argument) and now he's come along to my chose. My chose is my younger sister, who's flat out told me that if anything happens to DH and me, she's taking the kids. She doesn't need the assets (or any SS) we have either. She's about 30 minutes from the rest of the families, which shouldn't stop anyone from seeing them.

Both set of grandparents wouldn't be good choices as we have toddlers who are constantly moving. ;D The rest of my siblings aren't bad choices either but 2 have either said or indicated that they don't want to go back to toddlers as their kids will all be in college in the immediate future. They'd take the kids if necessary and would continue to spend time with them but they'd rather not have full custody. And I don't think my younger brother is ready or wants the responsibility. He's pretty much getting the burden of living with the parents and it's not fair to give him the kids too. Again, he'd do it if necessary though.

[Gardening Grandma]

My kids are adults now, BUT this was a huge issue for me when they were minors. Their father had disappeared after we divorced (to my relief), but I was afraid that if I died while they were minors, he'd reappear, claim them and along with them my modest assets.

I made a will stipulating that my sister be named their guardian AND that she also be named the person responsible for handling all the financial issues. The attorney said that the ex could still try to get custody of them, but without the financial incentives, he might not even try.

do you know if you can stipulate the management of the money from SS for the minor child?

A minor child has to have a "Representative Payee"...
"A representative payee is an individual or organization appointed by SSA to receive Social Security and/or SSI benefits for someone who cannot manage or direct someone else to manage his or her money. The main responsibilities of a payee are to use the benefits to pay for the current and foreseeable needs of the beneficiary and properly save any benefits not needed to meet current needs. A payee must also keep records of expenses. When SSA requests a report, a payee must provide an accounting to SSA of how benefits were used or saved.

NOTE: Having power of attorney, being an authorized representative or having a joint bank account with the beneficiary is not the same thing as being a payee. These arrangements do not give legal authority to negotiate and manage a beneficiary’s Social Security and/or SSI payments. In order to be a payee a person or organization must apply for and be appointed by SSA."

www.ssa.gov/payee/faqrep.htm

Note: My sister is Representative Payee for our mother who is institutionalized for Alzheimer's disease. She was quite surprised when informed by SS that her power of attorney did not automatically make her Rep Payee, but that she had to apply. Once she applied, then it was a pretty simply matter for them to appoint her as Rep Payee. My point is that , in the case of SS benefits, the decision is made by SS.

[sil]

I can't even get family to babysit my kids (including their grandparents), so this topic scares me to death. I've drafted a will twice, but never had the guts to ask BIL/SIL if they would be willing to take our kids in, because I'm afraid of the response. Our kids are 5 and 1 and our son has Autism - they are quite a handful. We have sizable life insurance policies mostly because I'm hoping this would be incentive enough for them to take custody of our kids. If the shoe was on the other foot, I know they dont have life insurance. But God-forbid if they die before their kids are 18, we'd want to take them in. Financially, they are flakes, but they raised 2 wonderful kids.

I know my sister and her husband would take custody of our kids, they are very stable (financially and otherwise) and they are also great parents. They'd actually be my first choice, except that they live so far away. DH is opposed to uprooting the kids, but I think I'm going to ask him to talk to his brother and if he doesn't/can't get them to agree, I'm going to ask my sister.

[thyme4change]

I'm kinda with Lena. The good news is, everyone that would take them are wonderful people and wonderful parents and my kids would be fine. I don't agree with everything they would teach them, and our personalities sure are different - but there is nothing bad about any of them. In fact, on paper they are all probably "better" choices than us to parent.

That said, I told some friends of ours, jokingly, that I was going to name them as guardians to our kids if something happened to us. They are a lot like us, so adjusting to their lifestyle wouldn't be quite as hard as, say, moving in with my parents. Also, their kids are roughly the same age as ours, so they are in the same life-place as us. They wouldn't need to readjust to having kids in the house, as say, my parents would. My kids could bounce right in and, except from having to buy a car big enough to cart 4 kids around, they could just keep on going.

But, I haven't put that into writing. If I can keep at least one of us alive for another 11 years, moot point.

P.S. The really single parents I know (like the widow, or the two where Dad was never around) have all the documents all set up and everything is locked up tight.

[thyme4change]

They'd actually be my first choice, except that they live so far away. DH is opposed to uprooting the kids

Better to have one completely f***ked up year where your parents die and you have to move across the country, and then you are left with guardians who love you and care about you and are there to help you through it all, then to have one f***ed up year where your parents die and you move across town and then the rest of your childhood is f***ed up, too, because the people you moved in with don't want you there.

[zibazinski]

Thank GOD I no longer have this issue because EX's family would have stolen the kids money and my family just isn't interested in their own children, let alone anyone else's (mine.) They have the mindset of that they did their "duty" and they are done. So my kids would have been screwed. We would have been able to protect the money except for the social secuirty and we did. We chose DD's Godparents because at the time, they were married and had loads of money so "stealing" anything from my kids would have been ludicrious because they have way more than we ever did. They had a 5 bedroom house so all the kids would have had their own bedroom. But EX's family at the time if it had happened would have fought it and the Godparents might have folded to keep the peace and not make lawyers rich. It never happened but when MOST of your family is trash one way or the other, it scares you.

[sil]

Quote:They'd actually be my first choice, except that they live so far away. DH is opposed to uprooting the kids



Better to have one completely f***ked up year where your parents die and you have to move across the country, and then you are left with guardians who love you and care about you and are there to help you through it all, then to have one f***ed up year where your parents die and you move across town and then the rest of your childhood is f***ed up, too, because the people you moved in with don't want you there.
**************************************************************************************************************************************************

You're absolutely right, Thyme. DH hasn't entirely come to terms with the fact that his brother isn't/doesn't want to be as involved with our kids as we are with theirs. I think they do care about our kids, but if they can't be bothered to watch our kids once or twice a year for a few hours, even though we babysat theirs once a month when they were small. I seriously doubt they would want to raise our kids, though I think they would do a fine job and SIL would probably be okay taking $1mil and quitting her job, in essence becoming a SAHM to the kids.

Truthfully, I don't think we have anyone who would want to raise our kids. Best we can hope for is someone who wants our kids to stay out of foster care, and who would accept $1 mil in exchange for raising them. I'd like to have a will state that $200,000 would be set aside for my kids' college. Beyond that, I don't care how they spend the rest, so long as the kids are well-cared for.

[midjd]

I know this issue kept my mom awake nights when my brother, sister and I were younger. She did NOT want my dad to have us (and we would have hated to live with him) but our family is very small and there would not have been anyone else to take us. Some relatives might have been willing to take one of us, but not all three. We would have probably ended up living with friends.

Once I turned 18 I think she felt a little better, since I would have taken DB and DS in if anything had happened (they were 12 and 13 at the time).

It is an unfortunate situation. Some people are lucky enough to have good families/friends they can count on in situations like this - but like Zib said, when most of your family is trash (or just too old/broke/busy to handle 3 kids), what do you do?

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I know my parents or his parents would take her in but I am not sure if that is a good long term solution. My brother is only 21 and in no way responsible enough to raise a child on his own. DH is on the outs with his brother. Which leaves his sister and her husband.

I told DH we need to talk to them because he just wants to name them in our will as DD"s guardians. I told him I don't think that is something you should really spring on someone. I want to know that they'd WANT or at least agree to take her in and make sure that she'd still have access to my side of the family.

[zibazinski]

Plus, remember, life situations change. Our Godparents ended up divorced. Who would have gotten our kids? Plus, people say yes when asked because to say no makes them look bad but they pray you never stick them with your kids. My ex sister-in-law would have been a great mom to my kids but her husband was a pervert so no way was that going to happen to my kids.