dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 15:48:29 GMT -5
Curiously, the master savers are relatively uninterested in investing. "It's much easier to cut back than to make smart investments," Amy insists. What's more, she adds, saving is a totally safe and predictable form of generating income. "I can guarantee the average family of six a $3,000 windfall in one year just by buying and preparing food carefully," she says. "No investor can give you such certainty." ![](http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff155/JiminiChristmas/smileys/8.gif) How in the hell can you be so committed to counting every last penny and so UNinterested in making any of those pennies work for YOU in return??! Where is Phil? I bet he'd have a few things to say about this. firebird: I noticed that too. We have done both. I've saved a ton through the use of coupons and have made quite a bit in the market.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 16:03:14 GMT -5
firebird: I noticed that too. We have done both. I've saved a ton through the use of coupons and have made quite a bit in the market.
And I would hazard a guess that by doing so, you are on track to have at least twice what they do in savings even without the book sales and online stuff.
OY VEY.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 16:06:57 GMT -5
The oldest married and is expecting. The next oldest is 18. Living at home. That leaves quite a few unaccounted for. I hope some of them end up going to college. Isn't the next-oldest a girl? She will likely live with her parents until her father picks out a spouse for her (they practice some sort of "courtship" thing. A Baptist church I once attended tried to convince all of us teenage girls that dating was horrible and we should let our fathers pick our spouses for us. I shudder to think how that would've gone...). Then she won't kiss her husband until their wedding day, at which point she will move in with him and submit to his every whim, and have as many children as possible. To their credit, a lot of the older kids do participate in the volunteer fire department (the girls do this too), so they do have some training beyond what you learn in high school. The boys could become firemen and make a decent living. And I think their parents prepare the boys for a decent paying career instead of college. Nothing terrible with that. They could always go to college later once the brainwashing wears off. P.S. - They seem like nice people with good values, but also a little extreme on the frugality/isolation (especially in the years before they became famous).
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 16:08:26 GMT -5
Curiously, the master savers are relatively uninterested in investing. "It's much easier to cut back than to make smart investments," Amy insists. What's more, she adds, saving is a totally safe and predictable form of generating income. "I can guarantee the average family of six a $3,000 windfall in one year just by buying and preparing food carefully," she says. "No investor can give you such certainty." ![](http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff155/JiminiChristmas/smileys/8.gif) How in the hell can you be so committed to counting every last penny and so UNinterested in making any of those pennies work for YOU in return??! Where is Phil? I bet he'd have a few things to say about this. firebird: I noticed that too. We have done both. I've saved a ton through the use of coupons and have made quite a bit in the market. Yeah, my plan has always been to save as much as I can (while maintaining what I consider a fulfilling life) and invest as much as I can. I hope that doing both will secure DH and I a financially healthy retirement.
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Post by soon2bmomof3 on May 17, 2011 16:10:32 GMT -5
"P.S. - They seem like nice people with good values, but also a little extreme on the frugality/isolation (especially in the years before they became famous). " At least they didn't force their kids to eat expired/past sell by date food. ![](http://us.social.s-msn.com/s/images/emoticons/52_52.gif)
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swamp
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Post by swamp on May 17, 2011 16:12:02 GMT -5
"P.S. - They seem like nice people with good values, but also a little extreme on the frugality/isolation (especially in the years before they became famous). " At least they didn't force their kids to eat expired/past sell by date food. ![](http://us.social.s-msn.com/s/images/emoticons/52_52.gif) Yes, but one episode they were serving tator tot casserole for dinner. ![](http://us.social.s-msn.com/s/images/emoticons/52_52.gif)
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azphx1972
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Post by azphx1972 on May 17, 2011 16:19:09 GMT -5
Right, but they're choosing to live on less than you'd make working a full time minimum wage job. You wouldn't need to generate a substantial income, the pimply faced 16 year old kid at McDonalds has more purchasing power. Well, they're choosing to be anti-consumerism, and I'm not going to fault them for that. Actually, I find things like that inspirational. I remember being floored when I saw "Affluenza" and "Escape From Affleunza" on PBS, and then reading "Your Money Or Your Life". They made a huge impact on me and changed my relationship with money, even if I wasn't prepared to go to the same extremes as some people did with their lifestyles. Karma for all of this. I am so thankful to have found Amy and the Tightwad Gazette. She's helped me in very profound ways. Not so long ago we were a family with more than $30k in CC debt. Now we have zero debt (non mortgage anyway) and more than $30k in an emergency/savings fund. Thanks! Karma back at you for digging your way out of your hole. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) It doesn't take a polygamist compound to really f up a kid's mind about religion. I know that. I was just giving an extreme example. I've had family members who were brainwashed by things other than religion (such as political views), and the end result is the same: it's nearly impossible to have a rational conversation with them. Anyway back to the OP, I don't necessarily agree with the way they raised their kids, but I certainly think the children could have done worse. Far worse. I guess if the kids truly hated their childhood, they can choose not to treat their own children the same way. It's their perogative as parents. Also, I felt deprived when I was a child because my parents were poor, but in looking back I wouldn't have changed a thing because it taught me some valuable life lessons that many other adults failed to learn.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 16:31:32 GMT -5
I don't know that I can completely articulate my issue with this couple, but hopefully the following story will make it clear. Imagine somebody posting a thread on YM. The title is, "Am I ready to retire and live the good life?" The body of the post would be the following: I'm 41 years old, and my wife is 35. We have a two 5 year olds, a 3 year old, a 2 year old, and my wife is pregnant with twins. We've been living on $28k a year between my job as an electrician and my wife's income from doing freelance graphic design. Luckily there's a store near us that sells expired food, my wife and I dumpster dive for toys and things for the kids and house, and we don't ever take vacations, eat out, go to the movies, etc. which has kept costs down. Over the last decade we've managed to save up $49k that we used for a down payment on our dream house (an old victorian farm house in the country).
Now that I'm eligible for a pension of $14k a year plus medical for the family, I'm pretty sure my wife and I can quit working, and spend all our time with our kids. Picking wild berries to make jelly, dumpster diving for things to fix up and use around the house, sitting on the porch and watching the kids play with each other (they aren't allowed to play with other kids), shopping at yard sales, sewing our own clothes, I'm getting misty just thinking about all the great family time ahead of us.
As long as we continue our frugal ways I think we can make it. However, I've heard you guys are the money gurus so you tell me. Are we ready to retire? Is it a good idea for both of us to leave the work force completely and rely on my $14k a year pension to raise our six kids? Now I don't know about you, but I'd tell that guy he's nucking futs if he thinks they can get by without a job. They managed to do so, but that doesn't mean I'd recommend other people give it a try.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 16:35:11 GMT -5
I don't know that I can completely articulate my issue with this couple, but hopefully the following story will make it clear. Imagine somebody posting a thread on YM. The title is, "Am I ready to retire and live the good life?" The body of the post would be the following: I'm 41 years old, and my wife is 35. We have a two 5 year olds, a 3 year old, a 2 year old, and my wife is pregnant with twins. We've been living on $28k a year between my job as an electrician and my wife's income from doing freelance graphic design. Luckily there's a store near us that sells expired food, my wife and I dumpster dive for toys and things for the kids and house, and we don't ever take vacations, eat out, go to the movies, etc. which has kept costs down. Over the last decade we've managed to save up $49k that we used for a down payment on our dream house (an old victorian farm house in the country).
Now that I'm eligible for a pension of $14k a year plus medical for the family, I'm pretty sure my wife and I can quit working, and spend all our time with our kids. Picking wild berries to make jelly, dumpster diving for things to fix up and use around the house, sitting on the porch and watching the kids play with each other (they aren't allowed to play with other kids), shopping at yard sales, sewing our own clothes, I'm getting misty just thinking about all the great family time ahead of us.
As long as we continue our frugal ways I think we can make it. However, I've heard you guys are the money gurus so you tell me. Are we ready to retire? Is it a good idea for both of us to leave the work force completely and rely on my $14k a year pension to raise our six kids? Now I don't know about you, but I'd tell that guy he's nucking futs if he thinks they can get by without a job. They managed to do so, but that doesn't mean I'd recommend other people give it a try. Sounds solid to me! I like the part about him being misty-eyed thinking of all those good family times ahead.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 16:42:19 GMT -5
Oh, and the other thing. The article quotes them keeping their costs down to $17,580 a year, but says his pension is only $14k and the article was written in the 90's. Even with all of her frugal know how and scrimping, they couldn't have afforded their lifestyle if the tightwad gazette hadn't panned out.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 16:45:55 GMT -5
Scrimping can only take you so far, and the concept is very dependent on being willing to deprive yourself of everything not necessary to survival. I've said it before, I'll say it again: MMM is way more fun than CB, and it's a lot safer.
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azphx1972
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Post by azphx1972 on May 17, 2011 16:46:28 GMT -5
Now I don't know about you, but I'd tell that guy he's nucking futs if he thinks they can get by without a job. They managed to do so, but that doesn't mean I'd recommend other people give it a try. That's the thing though, the Dacyzcns aren't seeking our approval or input. If they were, I'd give them my two cents too, but as long as they're happy with what they're doing and their lifestyle isn't harming other people or their children (and I'd imagine CPS would be involved if they were putting their kids' health at risk), more power to them. I'm sure there are things that each of us do that other people wouldn't approve of, but we still have the right to do them because we want to. Live and let live, I say. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 16:48:12 GMT -5
firebird: I noticed that too. We have done both. I've saved a ton through the use of coupons and have made quite a bit in the market. Yeah, my plan has always been to save as much as I can (while maintaining what I consider a fulfilling life) and invest as much as I can. I hope that doing both will secure DH and I a financially healthy retirement. frugalnurse: I have a feeling that you're quite well off now for your age.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 16:51:40 GMT -5
as long as they're happy with what they're doing and their lifestyle isn't harming other people or their children (and I'd imagine CPS would be involved if they were putting their kids' health at risk), more power to them. Fair point, however based on how this article described their diet, I would be nervous eating dinner with 'em. I won't say it's child abuse or anything, but I imagine they've had some upset stomachs and whatnot over the years eating what they do.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 16:56:51 GMT -5
That's the thing though, the Dacyzcns aren't seeking our approval or input.
They apparently sought and then shrugged off the experts' opinions about their diet, the psychology of their isolation, and investment tips that could have doubled their wealth. I don't think it's abuse or neglect (I take those words very seriously) but I think they should have at least CONSIDERED what experts had to say about potential consequences of some of their choices, especially the potential consequences for their kids.
They don't trust the stock market but they trust a pension? Uh... okay.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:01:40 GMT -5
Some of the recipes they described in the article sound like diabetes adn heart disease waiting to happen.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on May 17, 2011 17:01:57 GMT -5
I guess "poverty" is relative. Six children grew up in a large, beautiful home in the country with two parents who loved them. All six went to college because their parents saved up enough money in spite of a low income. Between their savings and earnings from publications, they were able to retire at an age most people can only dream of. I guess I would define "poverty" diffently. Poverty is relative, but I would consider purchasing/eating expired foods & many of the other things they do because they can't afford to live otherwise to be living in poverty.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:02:03 GMT -5
Scrimping can only take you so far, and the concept is very dependent on being willing to deprive yourself of everything not necessary to survival. I've said it before, I'll say it again: MMM is way more fun than CB, and it's a lot safer. Ok, I'm dumb. What are MMM and CB?
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 17:03:05 GMT -5
MMM= Make More Money CB = Cut Back
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:05:26 GMT -5
Yeah, my plan has always been to save as much as I can (while maintaining what I consider a fulfilling life) and invest as much as I can. I hope that doing both will secure DH and I a financially healthy retirement. frugalnurse: I have a feeling that you're quite well off now for your age. ![](http://boards.msn.com/Themes/default/emoticons/red_smile.gif) Thanks. You're always so encouraging and positive!
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:05:58 GMT -5
MMM= Make More Money CB = Cut Back Gracias!
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 17:10:30 GMT -5
MMM= Make More Money CB = Cut Back MMM - I like this one A LOT CB - This is a lot less fun, but it does work ;D ;D ;D
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 17:14:05 GMT -5
CB - This is a lot less fun, but it does work ;D ;D ;D Depends. To somebody living paycheck to paycheck on $80k, it's pretty easy to CB in certain areas and get on track. When you're trying to raise kids on $20k or something there's only so much scrimping you can do, and it's probably a better idea to focus on MMM.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 17:15:12 GMT -5
I guess "poverty" is relative. Six children grew up in a large, beautiful home in the country with two parents who loved them. All six went to college because their parents saved up enough money in spite of a low income. Between their savings and earnings from publications, they were able to retire at an age most people can only dream of. I guess I would define "poverty" diffently. Poverty is relative, but I would consider purchasing/eating expired foods & many of the other things they do because they can't afford to live otherwise to be living in poverty. I agree. I haven't read the book, but GG said that she never used coupons and I wonder why. I shopped with coupons in the 90s. Back in those days it was a lot easier for me to get food for free using coupons. It would have prevented them from having to eat expired food and it probably would have been cheaper too.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 17:16:19 GMT -5
CB - This is a lot less fun, but it does work ;D ;D ;DThe reason I say MMM is safer as well as more fun is that if it becomes necessary later, there is usually a lot more fat to trim if you start by MMM. If you've scrimped and saved as much as these guys and then for some reason you need to cut even further, what the heck else can you do? Plus you've spent a lot of time focused on scrimping instead of thinking up ways you can increase your income, which limits your creativity. ETA: Or what Dark said. I feel like I barely even have to post anymore
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 17:17:34 GMT -5
frugalnurse: I have a feeling that you're quite well off now for your age. ![](http://boards.msn.com/Themes/default/emoticons/red_smile.gif) Thanks. You're always so encouraging and positive! Right back atcha!! ;D
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 17:21:51 GMT -5
CB - This is a lot less fun, but it does work ;D ;D ;DThe reason I say MMM is safer as well as more fun is that if it becomes necessary later, there is usually a lot more fat to trim if you start by MMM. If you've scrimped and saved as much as these guys and then for some reason you need to cut even further, what the heck else can you do? Plus you've spent a lot of time focused on scrimping instead of thinking up ways you can increase your income, which limits your creativity. ETA: Or what Dark said. I feel like I barely even have to post anymore I completely agree, but depending on your skill set, MMM can be difficult especially in this economy. And yes, CB can only go so far. Not necessarily for this family, but for most the real key is SOOD.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 17:23:07 GMT -5
SOOD?
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:23:47 GMT -5
Too many abbreviations! SOOD - Staying out of debt?
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 17, 2011 17:24:55 GMT -5
Of course, SOOD = LBYM, which usually happens by CB and MMM! ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) I can play this game too!
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