Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 17:53:25 GMT -5
This is an update with a question. To recap: DH has a house that he got in his divorce back in 1971. His ex, however, never did sign a quitclaim deed, so her name is still on the title. (Obviously he's never refinaced or tried to sell it). When he told me, I wanted to contact her and ask her to sign a quitclaim deed. DH will not communicate with her. He agreed to let a lawyer write her. Found a lawyer who wrote her; no response. The lawyer then sent her a letter via certified mail. The receipt came back as "unconfirmed". He tried to call her, got an answering machine (but the greeting did verify that he had the right household). He emailed me today that if she didn't return his call, he'd try again to call her Monday.
I think that,clearly she is trying to avoid the issue..... The house, and the ex are in an adjacent county.
This is taking a loooong time. The lawyer is slow to respond to my emails.... So, I am turning, again, to you all....What should my next step be?
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t-dog
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Post by t-dog on May 12, 2011 17:59:10 GMT -5
drive over with quitclaim deed in hand and ask directly for signature
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 18:01:50 GMT -5
drive over with quitclaim deed in hand and ask directly for signature It has to be notarized.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2011 18:06:17 GMT -5
What does the divorce decree say about the house? I know he/you gave him $$$ to buy out her share. Was that stated in writing? My ex's lawyer forgot to file the paperwork so I had to sign twice, but I am much nicer than your former DIL.
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t-dog
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Post by t-dog on May 12, 2011 18:06:19 GMT -5
bring a notary with you.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 18:09:19 GMT -5
What does the divorce decree say about the house? I know he/you gave him $$$ to buy out her share. Was that stated in writing? My ex's lawyer forgot to file the paperwork so I had to sign twice, but I am much nicer than your former DIL. That was my son's divorce...... DH's divorce (in 1971) gave him the house.... But the county will not take her name off the deed without a quitclaim deed.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on May 12, 2011 18:22:47 GMT -5
And, if she is at all interested in money, bring $1,000 in $20 bills, too. Should make a nice stack about a quarter inch high, more if you fluff them a bit. Even though you don't need to throw additional cash at her, a stack of money is always a nice incentive for a reluctant signer. And certainly a relatively cheap way to get half interest in a house. In addition to the quit claim deed, I'd also get a signature on a receipt that identifies what the cash was for. Then you have some additional documentation if she should claim later that her signature on the quit claim was forged, or that the signature was obtained under duress.
Figuring out a way to get the quit claim signed without suing the ex is probably way cheaper than going to court or using a lot of lawyer time.
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on May 12, 2011 19:26:03 GMT -5
tskeeter, I like that idea! Maybe it doesn't have to be so much. Maybe a $100 American Express gift card would do it. Tell her it's for a dinner out on the town.
If if was in the divorce, then she can't come back and contest it.
Edited to add:
Maybe try this: Send a $50 gift card along with the Quit Claim Deed for her to sign. Tell her that you'll send her a $100 card when she sends it back to you signed and notarized.
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Post by debtheaven on May 12, 2011 19:41:08 GMT -5
I know nothing about the legalities of this but I was thinking bribery too. Evidently I'm in good company LOL.
No advice GG, just hugs! I hope this gets resolved quickly.
If you're going to go this route, personally I'd "up the ante". Offer a modest sum at first, see what happens. If it looks like she'll go for it, I'd double (or triple) the ante, under the condition that she signs by such and such a date.
To me the risk is that she's doing fine, smells money, and can afford to pay a lawyer and wait things out. You don't want that, so depending on how she's doing, it may be worth your while to offer more with a short time frame, ie "an offer she can't refuse".
But again, I don't know the legalities, I don't know whether she'd be legally entitled to half that home or not. If she is, keep things "cheap" so she can't "smell" the money.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 19:45:10 GMT -5
I don't know the woman. I've never met her... This isn't my ex dil......
The divorce papers award the house to DH. For 30 years he's rented it out. Why should I have to bribe her to follow a court order?
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on May 12, 2011 19:48:08 GMT -5
GG.
Because you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2011 19:49:41 GMT -5
Oh, well, that would be . . . the ex-wife. Lol.
Although she should simply sign it, why should she make the extra effort to correct something? I sort of felt like that (it was HIS lawyer), but I did it, anyway. I didn't want the house or $$$. I just wondered a little why his lawyer's mistake was MY problem. And I like my ex.
So, yes, a small bribe is probably in order.
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❤ mollymouser ❤
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Post by ❤ mollymouser ❤ on May 12, 2011 19:53:24 GMT -5
I like the bribe approach.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on May 12, 2011 19:54:25 GMT -5
The house is mortgage-free, I assume? If both parties are on the mortgage, the divorce decree doesn't mean squat (depending on your state). You have to refinance in one name or pay it off, otherwise if you default, the lender comes after both of you.
If no mortgage, he has a better claim to it... BUT things can get sticky (especially when it happened so many years ago), so I'd try to keep it out of the courts if possible. The others have had good ideas. Your lawyer may be trying to not press things because he suspects she will put up a fight and doesn't want to rile her.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 19:58:56 GMT -5
Yes, the house is mortgage free.....
The divorce papers clearly award the house to him.... In 30 years, she's never entered the pictur. And, yes, I'm a bit annoyed that he has refused to deal with this...... I guess the divorce was. very acrimonious.
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Post by debtheaven on May 12, 2011 20:04:34 GMT -5
The divorce papers award the house to DH. For 30 years he's rented it out. Why should I have to bribe her to follow a court order?
You answered your own question, GG.
The divorce papers clearly award the house to him.... In 30 years, she's never entered the pictur. And, yes, I'm a bit annoyed that he has refused to deal with this...... I guess the divorce was. very acrimonious.
The bottom line is, you have to deal with this now because your DH didn't deal with it back then.
FWIW, my divorce from my ex was extremely acrimonious as well. But ALL the paperwork was done, signed, sealed, delivered, etc. It took several years, but when it was over, it was truly over.
Like it or not, this issue is NOT over, legally. That is why you have to deal with it now.
You'll get through this. However, I'm guessing it may cost you, depending on what DH's ex is doing or not doing now.
(((GG)))
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on May 12, 2011 20:12:31 GMT -5
...:::"Maybe try this: Send a $50 gift card along with the Quit Claim Deed for her to sign. Tell her that you'll send her a $100 card when she sends it back to you signed and notarized.":::...
No way! Do this in ONE shot. You want to hit her QUICKLY before she has time to think about it. You want her money-urges to flood her brain so she signs before she has time to sit and think about it.
If you send her a $50, you'll be out $50, and you'll be dependent on all sorts of things. She'll claim that the mail lost it. Do this IN PERSON.
...:::"To me the risk is that she's doing fine, smells money, and can afford to pay a lawyer and wait things out. You don't want that, so depending on how she's doing, it may be worth your while to offer more with a short time frame, ie "an offer she can't refuse".":::...
All the more reason to hit her hard and fast in person. You want her caught up in the rush. Anyone who is impartial to the situation might advise her to keep stalling you. If you are going to these lengths, it must be important to you, and if its important to you, she might want to see just how much you'd be willing to pay.
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Post by debtheaven on May 12, 2011 20:22:49 GMT -5
Gowron, we have ZERO info on how this woman is doing now.
A close friend is in a second marriage to a jerk who had a wife and three kids before he married my friend and had two more kids. Legally, in France, the first wife is entitled to half her husband's pension (that includes her EX husband's pension) unless a second wife is married to that same husband longer than the first wife and / or the first wife remarries.
For many years, my friend's idjut husband's clever ex-wife refused to remarry because she wanted to maintain her half her ex's pension. One day she suddenly decided to marry her rich BF, relinquishing her claim to half my friend's DH's pension.
When he called her about it to thank her, she told him to consider it her charitable contribution for the year. OUCH.
All this to say, we have NO idea what GG's DH's ex is like. She may be dumb as dirt, or she may be incredibly savvy.
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cronewitch
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Post by cronewitch on May 12, 2011 20:22:52 GMT -5
I wouldn't pay her at all, she owes him a signature. If she doesn't sign take her to court for contempt of court and sue her for all the cost and pain a suffering.
Show up at her job with a notary and make noise so she is embarrassed, she wants you quiet so will go with you to a notary if you didn't bring one and they don't have one at her job.
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Post by debtheaven on May 12, 2011 20:28:35 GMT -5
OMG I so want to be Crone when I grow up LOL!
But seriously how do you get that she owes him a signature? If she really did, shouldn't that have been taken care of 30 years ago?
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Post by tiredturkey on May 12, 2011 20:42:39 GMT -5
I really like the way you folks take care of business-no fooling around, just a good crotch shot on the first opening. Seriously, if you can't blackmail someone into doing what you want, bribery is the next best option. FYI, when you get the quit claim deed, please file it for record. I have a good friend who got a quit claim deed from her ex several decades back at the time of divorce, never filed it for record, can't find it and can't find her ex. She asked me what she should do and I suggested she kiss his 1/2 of the house goodby and apologize in advance to her executrix for creating such a mess. Of course, she has been forging his signature and depositing all those pesky investment dividend checks into her account for 20+ years.........
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midjd
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Post by midjd on May 12, 2011 20:42:54 GMT -5
Exactly, debtheaven. Legally GG's DH is (probably) in the right by demanding a signature, but I can almost guarantee an attorney + any subsequent legal battle should she contest the issue will cost much, much more than a bribe.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 12, 2011 21:36:33 GMT -5
Well, I don't know where she works, if she works.... I (we) know absolutely nothing about her at all other than where she lives and the names of her husband and children...
Crone is right - She does owe him a signature. Legally, he (we) could take her to court for contempt...
(sighing)
I'm going to sleep on it. Maybe she'll return the attorney's call. I'm sure his letter was something of a surprise after 30 years.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on May 13, 2011 14:32:43 GMT -5
Personally I would avoid the bribe approach. If someone were to offer me $1000 to sign something, then I would start to question why. If I were her, I might be wondering if I still have legal ownership of 1/2 the house & the divorce decree doesn't matter, & that you two are trying to scam me out of something that is mine. She might be more resistant thinking that you need to buy her out of her share or something stupid.
I would either take the cronewitch approach & show up at her job or just file papers for contempt of court & get a hearing where a judge will order her to sign the papers.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 13, 2011 14:48:01 GMT -5
Have a friend sue you over a broken sidewalk at the house. Since her name is on the deed, she will be a party to the suit. But, she will probably show up and say that it isn't her house, at which time you can ask her to sign away her half. And then your friend can drop the lawsuit.
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greenstone
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Post by greenstone on May 13, 2011 17:54:45 GMT -5
Personally I would avoid the bribe approach. If someone were to offer me $1000 to sign something, then I would start to question why. If I were her, I might be wondering if I still have legal ownership of 1/2 the house & the divorce decree doesn't matter, & that you two are trying to scam me out of something that is mine. She might be more resistant thinking that you need to buy her out of her share or something stupid. . I would think this too. If I could get $1k (or less) for signing, then I could get a lot more for not signing. If she hasn't made a peep about this house in 30yrs, then I think it is unlikely she would wage a potentially losing legal battle over it. If she has any lingering resentment, she is probably just enjoying the inconvenience she is causing your DH. If the lawyer calls her again Monday, tell him to let her know that it will be the final attempt your DH makes to contact her which is being done as a courtesy to her. The failure to establish contact means the matter will be turned over to the courts. If the matter isn't settled she should expect a court summons. If the lawyer can throw in some legalese suggesting that there will be a request for her to cover the court costs, then all the better. Even if you haven't decided to go the court route, the uncertainty of knowing when/if a court summons will appear on her doorstep or at work may just light a fire under her to be more cooperative. Once the inconvenience is to her it won't be so funny. If the lawyer has a matter-of-fact, non-threatening approach, is probably your best bet at a peaceful conclusion. Showing up at her home or work could be seen as threatening, I know I would feel cornered and become aggressive in return.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on May 13, 2011 18:03:47 GMT -5
What are the chances that given him ignoring this for 30 years that she actually signed it over 30 years ago, he screwed up the ppwk to file it, and now she just doesn't wanna hear from him in any way and so rejects these contacts 30 years after she signed everything off to be done with him?
I really ask this more as a legal question for anyone who knows. If she signed the quitclaim 30 years ago, is she required to continue signing quitclaims forever until he finally files it? Is she supposed to file it? How does that work?
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greenstone
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Post by greenstone on May 13, 2011 18:15:22 GMT -5
The OP said the quitclaim deed was never signed, it is not a matter of not filing or losing the paperwork. Since DH got the house, he should have been the one on top of making sure the ex signed the paperwork. But it is just as much her responsibility that terms of the divorce decree are fulfilled so if she has to sign 30 yrs later, so be it.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 13, 2011 19:04:49 GMT -5
I'm guessing (hoping) that she wasn't there. She is taking her husband's word for it.
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greenstone
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Post by greenstone on May 13, 2011 19:23:24 GMT -5
Okay, so for argument sake, say it was signed but lost or never filed. Either way you slice it, I would say GG's DH was guilty of negligence (who isn't at some point intentionally or unintentionally), but I would NOT say he was guilty of gross negligence such that it should alter the divorce settlement terms.
GG and exW should get to call him dumb@ss at least once ;D but she should still sign the paperwork without drama.
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