Not directly politics

[movingforward]

This is completely a personal opinion, but I think the democratic party started losing some ground back with the defunding of police. I am by no means saying that the police force doesn't need some serious overhaul but I don't believe defunding was necessarily the answer. In my mind, MORE money should have been going to include better training and the hiring of better and more qualified people. In my city, minorities were not very happy with defunding as it took resources away from their neighborhoods.

The other issues, at least here is Texas, was that many Hispanics were not thrilled with illegals because they felt like they were taking jobs away from legal immigrants. I know several Hispanic males that voted for Trump based on that reason. Whether this is true or not, it is what they believed...

The democratic party needs to take this opportunity to think about what they need to do differently. We are still the country that voted for Obama twice so I have not lost hope.

Trump just brings out the worst of our society. All those bigots that never had a mouthpiece in politics now have one. It's disgusting but where we are right now.

Once again, I am simply trying to understand what the hell has happened to us...Trump won the popular vote so my guess is that even some minorities threw him a few votes. I approach things from a logical stand point and seek reasons for things.

[raeoflyte]

Nov 8, 2024 9:55:48 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

I do think the Democratic party needs to face that the majority of people chose Donald Trump, a candidate that by any reasonable measure should not have been electable.  Why?  Over and over again, Trump's campaign kept running an ad (I'm in Atlanta so may have been different in other areas) about Harris being for they/them while Trump is for you. My husband and I thought that was such a weak strategy.  I mean, who cares?  Is that really the best argument they have?  Clearly, they're grasping at straws...

I've been listening/reading to various analysts and members of the Democratic party over the last couple of days state that it was in fact a very effective strategy.  That the view among the general public is Democratic policies are dominated by the hard-left, virtue-signaling types that are out of touch with the working class of all races.  

But, how does the Democratic party go about re-building those bridges with groups who feel that they've been abandoned without actually abandoning the most vulnerable members of our society?

I agree with you. I guess I am that hard left group - I don't think I am but I am for social supports and personal autonomy and I think that qualifies at this point?

I didn't see a single Trump ad. The local Republicans had some similar ads in tone to that but they felt like a vacuum here.

I don't have any answers though.

[Ryan]

If the dems want to win again, they can do so easily by doing 3 things:

1). Reasonable border policy- not everyone should have a free pass into the country, no matter if you change the name to asylum.

2) Ditch the advocacy for Trans. - Look, this will come across as a little insensitive but I don’t think I’ve seen an issue be shoved more to the mainstream like this one. 6 years ago, I literally had to lookup why a female was putting pronouns in their email signature. Obama didn’t support gay marriage until the tide was moving in the direction. Liberals made a huge mistake by advocating so hard on this issue, they are being tied to it now. There is some serious shenanigans going on with this and you all know what il talking about here.

3) Cut spending - Politicans and dems in particular will never advocate for spending cuts. I’m talking about spending cuts, not “paying “ for a program by increasing taxes. People are not pulling to give the government more money when they can’t handle what they have already.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I also think the Democrats need to get to talking about the economy again.  People are very clearly willing to cut off their noses for cheap gas prices.   They need to work on the message that things like women having bodily autonomy actually improve the economy because women can now go out and work and that is more money flowing into the economy, more taxes coming in.

Same with immigration.  I really think we need reform but not as a wall.  We need to go back and review what worked and what didn't.  IMO we need to  bring back the work visa program so people are encouraged to go home trusting that they can come back for the next harvest season.  IMO we should have a fast track for those people to get papers.  As our system stands right now people feel better off coming here illegally than legally.   Democrats should sell how that is good for our economy because let's be honest no white people are going to do those jobs for what they pay.

I am all for social programs and am probably more hard left than most Democrats but it's very obvious that making that the platform isn't working.  They need to step back from that as the primary message and focus on what people are clearly saying they want focus on and that is the economy and jobs.

Weave the social programs into the message.  People do not understand the economy is not a zero sum game.  By emphasizing social programs it makes these people scared their stuff/money is going to be taken away.   Democrats need to demonstrate that is not the case.

And for the love of God accept that people are woefully uneducated in how economics and government actually work.  I am not an expert by a long shot but I read plenty and taken enough classes to know that while the president does have some impact they don't control half the shit people think they do.  CONGRESS does so if you really want impactful change then you need to stop electing the same people there over and over again.

Same with economics.

That is why the fear mongering Trump engages in works so well.  He is telling people what they already believe.  Standing there saying "that's not how this works" isn't going to win.  Democrats need to SHOW that is not how it works and ease fear instead of standing there letting Republicans stoke it because they seem to think "well it's obvious that is wrong".

I blame the media for this too.  Fear sells.  Logic doesn't.  So they focus on Trump which gets him in front of more people and generating more fear which is an emotion us humans are primed to feed off it because if you are scared that must mean there is a threat so I need to be scared too.

[grumpyhermit]

Nov 8, 2024 10:56:14 GMT -5 movingforward said:

This is completely a personal opinion, but I think the democratic party started losing some ground back with the defunding of police. I am by no means saying that the police force doesn't need some serious overhaul but I don't believe defunding was necessarily the answer. In my mind, MORE money should have been going to include better training and the hiring of better and more qualified people. In my city, minorities were not very happy with defunding as it took resources away from their neighborhoods.

The other issues, at least here is Texas, was that many Hispanics were not thrilled with illegals because they felt like they were taking jobs away from legal immigrants. I know several Hispanic males that voted for Trump based on that reason. Whether this is true or not, it is what they believed...

The democratic party needs to take this opportunity to think about what they need to do differently. We are still the country that voted for Obama twice so I have not lost hope.

Trump just brings out the worst of our society. All those bigots that never had a mouthpiece in politics now have one. It's disgusting but where we are right now.

Once again, I am simply trying to understand what the hell has happened to us...Trump won the popular vote so my guess is that even some minorities threw him a few votes. I approach things from a logical stand point and seek reasons for things.

The democratic party did not back defunding the police. In fact they explicitly called out MORE funding in their 2024 platform. One reason some leftists and liberals have issues with the party (me, I have issues with this stance).

[movingforward]

Nov 8, 2024 11:07:08 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I also think the Democrats need to get to talking about the economy again.  People are very clearly willing to cut off their noses for cheap gas prices.   They need to work on the message that things like women having bodily autonomy actually improve the economy because women can now go out and work and that is more money flowing into the economy, more taxes coming in.

Same with immigration.  I really think we need reform but not as a wall.  We need to go back and review what worked and what didn't.  IMO we need to  bring back the work visa program so people are encouraged to go home trusting that they can come back for the next harvest season.  IMO we should have a fast track for those people to get papers.  As our system stands right now people feel better off coming here illegally than legally.   Democrats should sell how that is good for our economy because let's be honest no white people are going to do those jobs for what they pay.

I am all for social programs and am probably more hard left than most Democrats but it's very obvious that making that the platform isn't working.  They need to step back from that as the primary message and focus on what people are clearly saying they want focus on and that is the economy and jobs.

Weave the social programs into the message.  People do not understand the economy is not a zero sum game.  By emphasizing social programs it makes these people scared their stuff/money is going to be taken away.   Democrats need to demonstrate that is not the case.

This is spot on IMHO. You should be a campaign manager

[movingforward]

Nov 8, 2024 11:07:43 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Nov 8, 2024 10:56:14 GMT -5 movingforward said:

This is completely a personal opinion, but I think the democratic party started losing some ground back with the defunding of police. I am by no means saying that the police force doesn't need some serious overhaul but I don't believe defunding was necessarily the answer. In my mind, MORE money should have been going to include better training and the hiring of better and more qualified people. In my city, minorities were not very happy with defunding as it took resources away from their neighborhoods.

The other issues, at least here is Texas, was that many Hispanics were not thrilled with illegals because they felt like they were taking jobs away from legal immigrants. I know several Hispanic males that voted for Trump based on that reason. Whether this is true or not, it is what they believed...

The democratic party needs to take this opportunity to think about what they need to do differently. We are still the country that voted for Obama twice so I have not lost hope.

Trump just brings out the worst of our society. All those bigots that never had a mouthpiece in politics now have one. It's disgusting but where we are right now.

Once again, I am simply trying to understand what the hell has happened to us...Trump won the popular vote so my guess is that even some minorities threw him a few votes. I approach things from a logical stand point and seek reasons for things.

The democratic party did not back defunding the police. In fact they explicitly called out MORE funding in their 2024 platform. One reason some leftists and liberals have issues with the party (me, I have issues with this stance).

By the time 2024 rolled around it was too late. Most saw the democratic party as the party that defunded the police. Sadly, most people vote on perception and not facts.

[grumpyhermit]

Nov 8, 2024 11:07:08 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I also think the Democrats need to get to talking about the economy again.  People are very clearly willing to cut off their noses for cheap gas prices.   They need to work on the message that things like women having bodily autonomy actually improve the economy because women can now go out and work and that is more money flowing into the economy, more taxes coming in.

Same with immigration.  I really think we need reform but not as a wall.  We need to go back and review what worked and what didn't.  IMO we need to  bring back the work visa program so people are encouraged to go home trusting that they can come back for the next harvest season.  IMO we should have a fast track for those people to get papers.  As our system stands right now people feel better off coming here illegally than legally.   Democrats should sell how that is good for our economy because let's be honest no white people are going to do those jobs for what they pay.

I am all for social programs and am probably more hard left than most Democrats but it's very obvious that making that the platform isn't working.  They need to step back from that as the primary message and focus on what people are clearly saying they want focus on and that is the economy and jobs.

Weave the social programs into the message.  People do not understand the economy is not a zero sum game.  By emphasizing social programs it makes these people scared their stuff/money is going to be taken away.   Democrats need to demonstrate that is not the case.

And for the love of God accept that people are woefully uneducated in how economics and government actually work.  I am not an expert by a long shot but I read plenty and taken enough classes to know that while the president does have some impact they don't control half the shit people think they do.  CONGRESS does so if you really want impactful change then you need to stop electing the same people there over and over again.

Same with economics.

That is why the fear mongering Trump engages in works so well.  He is telling people what they already believe.  Standing there saying "that's not how this works" isn't going to win.  Democrats need to SHOW that is not how it works and ease fear instead of standing there letting Republicans stoke it because they seem to think "well it's obvious that is wrong".

I blame the media for this too.  Fear sells.  Logic doesn't.  So they focus on Trump which gets him in front of more people and generating more fear which is an emotion us humans are primed to feed off it because if you are scared that must mean there is a threat so I need to be scared too.

IMO this was one of their biggest weaknesses in this campaign. They TRIED to do this by touting the booming economy and job numbers. Problem is, if you ask the average person how they THINK they are doing, it's not great.

Economy aside, the day to day costs of housing and food are crushing some people. When you have politicians insisting , no no the market is booming its all good, while people are struggling, its nonsensical. It does not surprise me that people didn't buy it; it doesn't match their lived reality.

I am mid-forties, I make a decent enough wage, have a fair bit saved for retirement, and a pretty healthy cash savings. However, based on housing prices, and where I live, it is unlikely I will ever afford to be able to buy anything. It's even worse for younger folks, and it is extremely demoralizing to work, and work and realize you are just never making headway toward large goals.

[Tiny]

Nov 8, 2024 10:59:47 GMT -5 Ryan said:

If the dems want to win again, they can do so easily by doing 3 things:

1). Reasonable border policy- not everyone should have a free pass into the country, no matter if you change the name to asylum.

2) Ditch the advocacy for Trans. - Look, this will come across as a little insensitive but I don’t think I’ve seen an issue be shoved more to the mainstream like this one. 6 years ago, I literally had to lookup why a female was putting pronouns in their email signature. Obama didn’t support gay marriage until the tide was moving in the direction. Liberals made a huge mistake by advocating so hard on this issue, they are being tied to it now. There is some serious shenanigans going on with this and you all know what il talking about here.

3) Cut spending - Politicans and dems in particular will never advocate for spending cuts. I’m talking about spending cuts, not “paying “ for a program by increasing taxes. People are not pulling to give the government more money when they can’t handle what they have already.

 How do we do #1?   We already have policies that allow immigrants into America.    What changes to those policies are needed?  Who do we help?  And who gets a cold shoulder?   
www.cnn.com/2024/10/03/politics/trump-revoke-status-ohio-haitian-migrants/index.html

I don't get the hoopla about #2.   I personally find the use of pronouns in an email signature to be helpful.  I work with a lot of people who have names that I am not familiar with and don't know if they are male or female.  And sometimes keeping an email response totally neutral (avoiding pronouns, over using a person's name, or using they/their is more work than I want to do.   I do NOT want to make a mistake and use she for a name i mistake as female or  he for a name I mistake as male.  That is the ultimate rudeness.      

I personally would think conservatives especially  would LIKE to see the pronouns - they wouldn't have to give any thought about what "voice" to use when responding.  They could use their "I'm talking to a woman" voice or their "I'm talking to a man" voice.      And please don't try to tell me that people (male and female) do NOT change the way the speak and write if their audience is male or female.    

And I do think the trans/LGBTQ+ issue should be "shoved" into the mainstream.  I'm sorry if that means that you no longer get to snicker about feminine looking guys and and masculine looking girls and you can't pick on, bully, or otherwise make jokes about trans/LGBTQ+ people without any repercussions.   I'm sorry it means you can't use trans/LGBTQ+ cut downs and slurs to shame people you know or don't like even though you KNOW they are straight or male or female.     I'm sorry that treating people cruelly/unkindly isn't suppose to be fun and good natured and "just kidding".   Maybe some introspection on why being mean/treating like a second class citizen/making fun of /excluding or singling out some people means so much to you.  That would be a good thing. 

#3.  Don't worry - Republicans will cut Medicaid and make Medicare more expensive and will cut SNAP (in some way) and will change Social Security so future recipients will get less.     Don't worry military spending and tax cuts for the wealthy will continue.  Lots of money will flow to Big Business.        
 I personally don't want my family and friends who rely on government aid to loss that aid.    And please don't say - well they should pull them up by their bootstraps  OR their family should help them.   Family is already helping them (at some point helping family drags down the WHOLE family.)  And no one can pull themselves up by their bootstraps. 

[bean29]

Nov 7, 2024 21:36:01 GMT -5 movingforward said:

I live in TX and know lots of Republicans. Most are not haters, which is why I find it so hard to understand why they support the politicians they do. It seems like they truly believe the economy, foreign relations, etc are better under Republicans. I am not trying to defend but rather just better understand their motivations.

Maybe I am just delusional but I do believe most people are good. Life is short and I just can't let the bad apples suck all my energy. If someone is truly a hateful person I cut them out of my life completely.

We will be okay...the younger generation has much more tolerance and understanding. At some point Republicans will realize the party must change or become irrelevant.

I agree, which is why I said I am angry with some R family members and not others.  Like if you voted R thinking the cost of food would come down, or gas, or mortgages, it's not gonna happen.  My Mother and her friends and my SIL have always been right to life.  Their actions and life's work support young parents.  SIL volunteers 2 days a week in the daycare at the high school taking care of the babies.  Mom's church is always doing drives for layette items, diapers, and formula etc.  What I don't like is we now have laws that don't account for baby not compatible with life, but risks mother's life. I prefer to leave the decisions in the hands of the patient and the Dr.  I also have always felt that if we really didn't want abortion, we should ensure that low cost/free birth control is available as the failure rates of most BC when used properly are pretty low. 

My Brother and SIL have a very much loved and accepted Black SIL, and one that is Mexican.  which makes 5 of their grandchildren minorities.  I urge many of you to remember that there are successful minorities out there who just don't feel that minority preferences or DEI are needed anymore.  The crazy thing is they landed in the same party as the Nazi's and the white supremacists.  I guess we will just have to sit back and see what happens when all is said and done.  I hope good triumphs over evil.

It remains to be seen what the R's will do to fix SS and Medicare.  I have always had mixed feelings on raising retirement age as the only fix.  I personally would rather see the tax rate increase, but I don't expect them to do that.  So, they will probably raise the retirement age, and may haircut the benefits.  I am ok with them haircutting the benefits.  I am not prepared to not collect SS.

Trump promised not taxes on tips, and no taxes on SS.  I wonder what will happen with that?  I bet the amount of tips excluded from taxes will be limited, and the No taxes on SS will not happen.  He made a lot of promises that have to pass through congress, and even though they will have both houses, I don't think lower taxes that increase the deficit will happen. I do think they will take action on immigration.  I have doubts they will deport all illegal immigrants b/c it will cost too much and increase inflation. We will have to just let things play out.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Nov 8, 2024 11:17:23 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Nov 8, 2024 11:07:08 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I also think the Democrats need to get to talking about the economy again.  People are very clearly willing to cut off their noses for cheap gas prices.   They need to work on the message that things like women having bodily autonomy actually improve the economy because women can now go out and work and that is more money flowing into the economy, more taxes coming in.

Same with immigration.  I really think we need reform but not as a wall.  We need to go back and review what worked and what didn't.  IMO we need to  bring back the work visa program so people are encouraged to go home trusting that they can come back for the next harvest season.  IMO we should have a fast track for those people to get papers.  As our system stands right now people feel better off coming here illegally than legally.   Democrats should sell how that is good for our economy because let's be honest no white people are going to do those jobs for what they pay.

I am all for social programs and am probably more hard left than most Democrats but it's very obvious that making that the platform isn't working.  They need to step back from that as the primary message and focus on what people are clearly saying they want focus on and that is the economy and jobs.

Weave the social programs into the message.  People do not understand the economy is not a zero sum game.  By emphasizing social programs it makes these people scared their stuff/money is going to be taken away.   Democrats need to demonstrate that is not the case.

And for the love of God accept that people are woefully uneducated in how economics and government actually work.  I am not an expert by a long shot but I read plenty and taken enough classes to know that while the president does have some impact they don't control half the shit people think they do.  CONGRESS does so if you really want impactful change then you need to stop electing the same people there over and over again.

Same with economics.

That is why the fear mongering Trump engages in works so well.  He is telling people what they already believe.  Standing there saying "that's not how this works" isn't going to win.  Democrats need to SHOW that is not how it works and ease fear instead of standing there letting Republicans stoke it because they seem to think "well it's obvious that is wrong".

I blame the media for this too.  Fear sells.  Logic doesn't.  So they focus on Trump which gets him in front of more people and generating more fear which is an emotion us humans are primed to feed off it because if you are scared that must mean there is a threat so I need to be scared too.

IMO this was one of their biggest weaknesses in this campaign. They TRIED to do this by touting the booming economy and job numbers. Problem is, if you ask the average person how they THINK they are doing, it's not great.

Economy aside, the day to day costs of housing and food are crushing some people. When you have politicians insisting , no no the market is booming its all good, while people are struggling, its nonsensical. It does not surprise me that people didn't buy it; it doesn't match their lived reality.

I am mid-forties, I make a decent enough wage, have a fair bit saved for retirement, and a pretty healthy cash savings. However, based on housing prices, and where I live, it is unlikely I will ever afford to be able to buy anything. It's even worse for younger folks, and it is extremely demoralizing to work, and work and realize you are just never making headway toward large goals.

I agreed they sucked at it.  Fear overrules logic.  We humans are built that way from years of evolution.  Society has moved way faster than our brains can evolve.  We're still operating on lizard brains.

That's why I think they need to retool it to how does it benefit ME?  As a woman I know I am better off having bodily autonomy and control over my reproduction.  But your blue collar working white dude over there doesn't see because they have never needed to worry about it.  You don't need to convince me.  You need to show HIM how I am not a threat and I am actually of benefit to HIM.

This person sees illegals taking their jobs.  Logic is they are in the jobs that nobody wants because of poor pay and poor labor rights.  Show ME how it benefits ME that these people are doing these jobs.

I can read scientific papers all day long and understand them.  To your average person that paper doesn't mean shit.  I need to explain how it impacts THEM.  This is a long standing problem in science too not just politics.  Professionally I am wired to value evidence and data, the more you stack up the more you convince me you are correct.

But humans are not and never will be logical.  I have to convince you that this vaccine benefits YOU to counteract the fearmongering that you're going to get a 5G chip planted into you.  Shoving papers in your face proving otherwise won't solve it and will make you dig in your heels twice as hard.

Trump won because if he is anything he is a very skilled marketer.  He knows what sells.  Sex sells, money sells, FEAR sells and he beat that fucking horse to death.

Should I have to?  No.  But humans aren't totally altrusitic.  While we are social animals evolution hasn't caught up to how huge the human race has become.  We are still very tribal and the bigger the circle gets the harder and harder it is for humans to grasp "for the greater good".   Democrats need to shrink that message down into bite sized pieces that those who are fearful of losing everything can start to process that isn't how it works.   Their message is too big and too encompassing which is great for those of us who understand it but it isn't going to win the votes they need.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Nov 8, 2024 10:59:47 GMT -5 Ryan said:

If the dems want to win again, they can do so easily by doing 3 things:

1). Reasonable border policy- not everyone should have a free pass into the country, no matter if you change the name to asylum.

2) Ditch the advocacy for Trans. - Look, this will come across as a little insensitive but I don’t think I’ve seen an issue be shoved more to the mainstream like this one. 6 years ago, I literally had to lookup why a female was putting pronouns in their email signature. Obama didn’t support gay marriage until the tide was moving in the direction. Liberals made a huge mistake by advocating so hard on this issue, they are being tied to it now. There is some serious shenanigans going on with this and you all know what il talking about here.

3) Cut spending - Politicans and dems in particular will never advocate for spending cuts. I’m talking about spending cuts, not “paying “ for a program by increasing taxes. People are not pulling to give the government more money when they can’t handle what they have already.

They tried on #1, but the Republicans nixed it.

For #3, whoever is in office...they need to cut spending AND raise taxes but neither party wants to do that.

[ken a.k.a OMK]

On #3 the dems have always been better then the gop on the economy. Higher GDP, job growth, employment. Lower fed budget. The economy is doing better now, but prices always lag the data. The voters went with an entertainer who only insults everyone. How is he going to pay for all these programs like sending the immigrants home and decreasing taxes? Oh, raise the debt. 

presidentialdata.org/

[pulmonarymd]

Trump has never paid for anything in his life. Why start now?

[azucena]

Unfortunately I'm hearing thru teen's group camp text (that is still full of drama) that some Trumpers voted for him solely on abortion again. Teen and friend are arguing back um, he lies all the time and has already flip flopped on that exact issue AND I'm already alive and here, shouldn't you vote for my safety over unknown, unborn babies yet to be born.

[Ryan]

Nov 8, 2024 11:29:59 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Nov 8, 2024 10:59:47 GMT -5 Ryan said:

If the dems want to win again, they can do so easily by doing 3 things:

1). Reasonable border policy- not everyone should have a free pass into the country, no matter if you change the name to asylum.

2) Ditch the advocacy for Trans. - Look, this will come across as a little insensitive but I don’t think I’ve seen an issue be shoved more to the mainstream like this one. 6 years ago, I literally had to lookup why a female was putting pronouns in their email signature. Obama didn’t support gay marriage until the tide was moving in the direction. Liberals made a huge mistake by advocating so hard on this issue, they are being tied to it now. There is some serious shenanigans going on with this and you all know what il talking about here.

3) Cut spending - Politicans and dems in particular will never advocate for spending cuts. I’m talking about spending cuts, not “paying “ for a program by increasing taxes. People are not pulling to give the government more money when they can’t handle what they have already.

 How do we do #1?   We already have policies that allow immigrants into America.    What changes to those policies are needed?  Who do we help?  And who gets a cold shoulder?   
www.cnn.com/2024/10/03/politics/trump-revoke-status-ohio-haitian-migrants/index.html

I don't get the hoopla about #2.   I personally find the use of pronouns in an email signature to be helpful.  I work with a lot of people who have names that I am not familiar with and don't know if they are male or female.  And sometimes keeping an email response totally neutral (avoiding pronouns, over using a person's name, or using they/their is more work than I want to do.   I do NOT want to make a mistake and use she for a name i mistake as female or  he for a name I mistake as male.  That is the ultimate rudeness.      

I personally would think conservatives especially  would LIKE to see the pronouns - they wouldn't have to give any thought about what "voice" to use when responding.  They could use their "I'm talking to a woman" voice or their "I'm talking to a man" voice.      And please don't try to tell me that people (male and female) do NOT change the way the speak and write if their audience is male or female.    

And I do think the trans/LGBTQ+ issue should be "shoved" into the mainstream.  I'm sorry if that means that you no longer get to snicker about feminine looking guys and and masculine looking girls and you can't pick on, bully, or otherwise make jokes about trans/LGBTQ+ people without any repercussions.   I'm sorry it means you can't use trans/LGBTQ+ cut downs and slurs to shame people you know or don't like even though you KNOW they are straight or male or female.     I'm sorry that treating people cruelly/unkindly isn't suppose to be fun and good natured and "just kidding".   Maybe some introspection on why being mean/treating like a second class citizen/making fun of /excluding or singling out some people means so much to you.  That would be a good thing. 

#3.  Don't worry - Republicans will cut Medicaid and make Medicare more expensive and will cut SNAP (in some way) and will change Social Security so future recipients will get less.     Don't worry military spending and tax cuts for the wealthy will continue.  Lots of money will flow to Big Business.        
 I personally don't want my family and friends who rely on government aid to loss that aid.    And please don't say - well they should pull them up by their bootstraps  OR their family should help them.   Family is already helping them (at some point helping family drags down the WHOLE family.)  And no one can pull themselves up by their bootstraps. 

#1 Apply for admission or get a visa.  That is the way that you get in.  Trump had a policy that kept everyone in MX while they waited, which is the correct way to do it.  You can't allow them to come into the US while they are waiting.  If that's your policy, you're basically greenlighting an open border policy.

#2 I don't care if people put something in their email signature, the point of the story was to talk about the timeline of how quickly it happened.  You go from that to telling teachers that they should remove the signs off the bathroom in elementary schools or allowing boys to join girls teams.  If Dems want to continue to do this, then they can and they will continue to lose elections.   They won IL by 17% in prior 2 elections, this election they won by 8%.  I can 100% guarantee that a lot of those "Economy" polling questions are just a very easy way for people to give a generic answer.  

[Ryan]

Nov 8, 2024 11:44:56 GMT -5 ken a.k.a OMK said:

On #3 the dems have always been better then the gop on the economy. Higher GDP, job growth, employment. Lower fed budget. The economy is doing better now, but prices always lag the data. The voters went with an entertainer who only insults everyone. How is he going to pay for all these programs like sending the immigrants home and decreasing taxes? Oh, raise the debt. 

presidentialdata.org/

I think we all know that every president only inherits the problems, all the other good stuff is of their own doing. 

   

[andi9899]

Nov 7, 2024 19:56:22 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Don't get me wrong I'm worried for my daughters, their friends both queer and female as well as my own.

I worry about my international friends.

But if someone wants to vote against her rights in exchange for cheaper gas go right on ahead more power to you.

I'm done reasoning with people.

I'll always be a safe haven for those I care about and it extends to my kids friends.

Everyone else? May they get what they bargained for.

Does that make sense?

Perfect sense. I hope everything they voted for happens to them.

[Ryan]

One other thing, you guys are so focused on Trump.  It could've been literally ANY GOP member from the primary.....ANY SINGLE ONE and they would've beat Harris by an even LARGER margin.  Outside of hardcore MAGA followers, people voted R in spite of Trump, not because of him.  Vivek or Haley would've won by an even larger margin.

[daisylu]

Nov 8, 2024 13:00:46 GMT -5 azucena said:

Unfortunately I'm hearing thru teen's group camp text (that is still full of drama) that some Trumpers voted for him solely on abortion again. Teen and friend are arguing back um, he lies all the time and has already flip flopped on that exact issue AND I'm already alive and here, shouldn't you vote for my safety over unknown, unborn babies yet to be born.

Sadly, I have posts on FB touting this (a picture of a newborn, wrapped in a flag, with the tagline "this is why"). Have to make those babies be born but eff them once they are here. 

[raeoflyte]

Nov 8, 2024 14:00:20 GMT -5 Ryan said:

Nov 8, 2024 11:29:59 GMT -5 Tiny said:

 How do we do #1?   We already have policies that allow immigrants into America.    What changes to those policies are needed?  Who do we help?  And who gets a cold shoulder?   
www.cnn.com/2024/10/03/politics/trump-revoke-status-ohio-haitian-migrants/index.html

I don't get the hoopla about #2.   I personally find the use of pronouns in an email signature to be helpful.  I work with a lot of people who have names that I am not familiar with and don't know if they are male or female.  And sometimes keeping an email response totally neutral (avoiding pronouns, over using a person's name, or using they/their is more work than I want to do.   I do NOT want to make a mistake and use she for a name i mistake as female or  he for a name I mistake as male.  That is the ultimate rudeness.      

I personally would think conservatives especially  would LIKE to see the pronouns - they wouldn't have to give any thought about what "voice" to use when responding.  They could use their "I'm talking to a woman" voice or their "I'm talking to a man" voice.      And please don't try to tell me that people (male and female) do NOT change the way the speak and write if their audience is male or female.    

And I do think the trans/LGBTQ+ issue should be "shoved" into the mainstream.  I'm sorry if that means that you no longer get to snicker about feminine looking guys and and masculine looking girls and you can't pick on, bully, or otherwise make jokes about trans/LGBTQ+ people without any repercussions.   I'm sorry it means you can't use trans/LGBTQ+ cut downs and slurs to shame people you know or don't like even though you KNOW they are straight or male or female.     I'm sorry that treating people cruelly/unkindly isn't suppose to be fun and good natured and "just kidding".   Maybe some introspection on why being mean/treating like a second class citizen/making fun of /excluding or singling out some people means so much to you.  That would be a good thing. 

#3.  Don't worry - Republicans will cut Medicaid and make Medicare more expensive and will cut SNAP (in some way) and will change Social Security so future recipients will get less.     Don't worry military spending and tax cuts for the wealthy will continue.  Lots of money will flow to Big Business.        
 I personally don't want my family and friends who rely on government aid to loss that aid.    And please don't say - well they should pull them up by their bootstraps  OR their family should help them.   Family is already helping them (at some point helping family drags down the WHOLE family.)  And no one can pull themselves up by their bootstraps. 

#1 Apply for admission or get a visa.  That is the way that you get in.  Trump had a policy that kept everyone in MX while they waited, which is the correct way to do it.  You can't allow them to come into the US while they are waiting.  If that's your policy, you're basically greenlighting an open border policy.

#2 I don't care if people put something in their email signature, the point of the story was to talk about the timeline of how quickly it happened.  You go from that to telling teachers that they should remove the signs off the bathroom in elementary schools or allowing boys to join girls teams.  If Dems want to continue to do this, then they can and they will continue to lose elections.   They won IL by 17% in prior 2 elections, this election they won by 8%.  I can 100% guarantee that a lot of those "Economy" polling questions are just a very easy way for people to give a generic answer.  

As a parent of an actual younger gender queer kid in circles with other similar families no bathroom signs are coming down in any schools. Sports has gotten a lot of biased coverage but if people cared they could test and bracket teams bases on hormone levels instead of genitals.

But truth doesn't matter. Haters gonna hate. Thank you for the reminder. Make sure you advertise your beliefs in real life too. Loudly.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Nov 8, 2024 14:09:31 GMT -5 Ryan said:

One other thing, you guys are so focused on Trump.  It could've been literally ANY GOP member from the primary.....ANY SINGLE ONE and they would've beat Harris by an even LARGER margin.  Outside of hardcore MAGA followers, people voted R in spite of Trump, not because of him.  Vivek or Haley would've won by an even larger margin.

I am focused on Trump because I think he is a vile human being, and no longer mentally competent to hold the office of President to boot. The fact that he's putting people like Hershel Walker in charge of...well anything...is mind blowing to me.  

I would have been much happier with either of those other two options.

[billisonboard]

Nov 8, 2024 14:09:31 GMT -5 Ryan said:

One other thing, you guys are so focused on Trump.  It could've been literally ANY GOP member from the primary.....ANY SINGLE ONE and they would've beat Harris by an even LARGER margin.  Outside of hardcore MAGA followers, people voted R in spite of Trump, not because of him.  Vivek or Haley would've won by an even larger margin.

I am focused on Trump because he is a dangerous man. It isn't his policies, I simply would prefer different ones. But Trump is a threat to the institutions that form the basis of our constitutional democracy.

[pulmonarymd]

To echo that point, Harris conceded that she lost. Biden gave an address and stated he would work for an orderly transition. Trump refused to admit he lost, incited a riot, did not work for an orderly transition, and spent 4 years denying he lost, preparing to do the same thing if he lost again, and convinced his supporters that the elections were not fair. That is why we are focused on Trump.

We could live with Nikki Haley. Agree or disagree, she would follow the normal and obey the constitution. We would have a "normal" republican. Trump is a wildcard, and God help us/

[gs11rmb]

Nov 8, 2024 14:32:44 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Nov 8, 2024 14:09:31 GMT -5 Ryan said:

One other thing, you guys are so focused on Trump.  It could've been literally ANY GOP member from the primary.....ANY SINGLE ONE and they would've beat Harris by an even LARGER margin.  Outside of hardcore MAGA followers, people voted R in spite of Trump, not because of him.  Vivek or Haley would've won by an even larger margin.

I am focused on Trump because I think he is a vile human being, and no longer mentally competent to hold the office of President to boot. The fact that he's putting people like Hershel Walker in charge of...well anything...is mind blowing to me.  

I would have been much happier with either of those other two options.

Oh no!  During his senate campaign it was really obvious that he wasn't 'all there'.  I think the general conclusion was that he had suffered from brain damage as the result of his football career.  This is not a good sign.

[Ryan]

Nov 8, 2024 14:32:44 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Nov 8, 2024 14:09:31 GMT -5 Ryan said:

One other thing, you guys are so focused on Trump.  It could've been literally ANY GOP member from the primary.....ANY SINGLE ONE and they would've beat Harris by an even LARGER margin.  Outside of hardcore MAGA followers, people voted R in spite of Trump, not because of him.  Vivek or Haley would've won by an even larger margin.

I am focused on Trump because I think he is a vile human being, and no longer mentally competent to hold the office of President to boot. The fact that he's putting people like Hershel Walker in charge of...well anything...is mind blowing to me.  

I would have been much happier with either of those other two options.

You can focus on Trump, but what I'm saying is that your focus on Trump is not going to explain your loss.  You didn't lose because of Trump, you lost because of your policies.

You are blaming fellow Americans for voting him in office instead of saying "Wow, our policies, track record, messaging, and candidate were SO BAD that we couldn't even beat Donald Trump".  If you're blaming others, party leadership will never figure out the real reason.  Party leadership will continue to rely on polls with a generic message about "Economy" and "Gas Prices", but those will lead them astray.  Gas is $3.00/gallon by me, nobody didn't vote for Harris because of gas prices.  

[minnesotapaintlady]

Nov 8, 2024 14:48:07 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

Nov 8, 2024 14:32:44 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

I am focused on Trump because I think he is a vile human being, and no longer mentally competent to hold the office of President to boot. The fact that he's putting people like Hershel Walker in charge of...well anything...is mind blowing to me.  

I would have been much happier with either of those other two options.

Oh no!  During his senate campaign it was really obvious that he wasn't 'all there'.  I think the general conclusion was that he had suffered from brain damage as the result of his football career.  This is not a good sign.

Just the new missile defense shield.  No worries. 

[ken a.k.a OMK]

I think we all know that every president only inherits the problems, all the other good stuff is of their own doing.

Yes. trump inherited a strong economy and destroyed it. Also got rid of the scientists in China monitoring viruses and destroyed a plan to deal with an outbreak. 

Now trump again inherits a growing economy and plans to spend money we don't have. 

[billisonboard]

Nov 8, 2024 14:52:12 GMT -5 Ryan said:

Nov 8, 2024 14:32:44 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

I am focused on Trump because I think he is a vile human being, and no longer mentally competent to hold the office of President to boot. The fact that he's putting people like Hershel Walker in charge of...well anything...is mind blowing to me.  

I would have been much happier with either of those other two options.

You can focus on Trump, but what I'm saying is that your focus on Trump is not going to explain your loss.  You didn't lose because of Trump, you lost because of your policies.

You are blaming fellow Americans for voting him in office instead of saying "Wow, our policies, track record, messaging, and candidate were SO BAD that we couldn't even beat Donald Trump".  If you're blaming others, party leadership will never figure out the real reason.  Party leadership will continue to rely on polls with a generic message about "Economy" and "Gas Prices", but those will lead them astray.  Gas is $3.00/gallon by me, nobody didn't vote for Harris because of gas prices.  

I would encourage you to read or reread the posts on this thread. There is some good looks here on the issues part of the loss.

[billisonboard]

Nov 8, 2024 14:58:38 GMT -5 ken a.k.a OMK said:

I think we all know that every president only inherits the problems, all the other good stuff is of their own doing.

Yes. trump inherited a strong economy and destroyed it. Also got rid of the scientists in China monitoring viruses and destroyed a plan to deal with an outbreak. 

Now trump again inherits a growing economy and plans to spend money we don't have. 

Plus stop taking in a significant amount of the tax money we do have.