The border is not open

[ripvanwinkle]

Jan 22, 2024 22:08:20 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jan 22, 2024 21:42:27 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

Is the 50 acre Eagle Pass Shelby State Park a recognized authorized entry point or just a part of the entry point at Eagle Pass? It says its a "hot spot" but I'm unclear if it's a official entry point. If its a State Park, can't a state close it for public use and put up a fence? Couldn't the migrants could go upstream or downstream of the park and enter the official border crossing there.

A few years back my state closed 2 state parks due to budgets and put up fences and blocked the access roads. They are reopened now but I see this as the same thing. A state has the right to close any state parks.

If the closing of any land, park, etc. by abbott along the Texas/Mexico border interferes with the Border Patrol's work it is illegal on Texas's part. The Border Patrol is federal. Abbott's national guard is state.

Were immigrants from central America entering the U.S. through your two closed and fenced state parks?

I still say the State had the right to. Why do the migrants select this Shelby Park to cross the river instead of the official border crossing? I ask again. Is Shelby Park the "official" border crossing? Why do all of these migrants choose to bypass any and all authorized manned entry points on the US border?

[Tennesseer]

Jan 22, 2024 22:47:54 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

Jan 22, 2024 22:08:20 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

If the closing of any land, park, etc. by abbott along the Texas/Mexico border interferes with the Border Patrol's work it is illegal on Texas's part. The Border Patrol is federal. Abbott's national guard is state.

Were immigrants from central America entering the U.S. through your two closed and fenced state parks?

I still say the State had the right to. Why do the migrants select this Shelby Park to cross the river instead of the official border crossing? I ask again. Is Shelby Park the "official" border crossing? Why do all of these migrants choose to bypass any and all authorized manned entry points on the US border?

I don't know. Go down there and ask the migrants.

Bottom line: the federal government is in charge of our borders. Not Abbott and his brown shirts.

[ripvanwinkle]

I think the simple answer is they cross at a unmanned place to evade the border patrol and not be checked. If thy were really wanting to enter legally they would present themselves at official crossings.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 22, 2024 22:47:54 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

Jan 22, 2024 22:08:20 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

If the closing of any land, park, etc. by abbott along the Texas/Mexico border interferes with the Border Patrol's work it is illegal on Texas's part. The Border Patrol is federal. Abbott's national guard is state.

Were immigrants from central America entering the U.S. through your two closed and fenced state parks?

I still say the State had the right to. 

you can say whatever you like.  but what you say undermines 200 years of federal law.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 23, 2024 1:23:52 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

I think the simple answer is they cross at a unmanned place to evade the border patrol and not be checked. If thy were really wanting to enter legally they would present themselves at official crossings.

that is because, for whatever reason, you are not able to consider what it is like to be a refugee.  it doesn't really take much imagination.  perhaps you should spend some time thinking about what it would be like to flee a country and to enlist the services of someone disreputable to bring you across the border into a better place.

[Tennesseer]

There is no article per se to link to. Just a link to a video which I received in email today. The video is from the New York Times which I subscribe to. So not sure if the video is only available to subscribers or to all. Video 8.33 minutes long.

Opinion Today: How did immigration become so polarizing?/Things Fall Apart: How The Middle Ground On Immigration Collapsed

[djAdvocate]

immigration has never been especially popular, here.

there is a long history of hatred for incoming immigrant groups, starting with the Chinese, right up to today. we never learn. the only countervailing force is from those that recognize that immigration is part of what made America great.

those voices are getting drowned out by the OTHER MAGA.

[Tennesseer]

Jan 24, 2024 12:21:38 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

immigration has never been especially popular, here.

there is a long history of hatred for incoming immigrant groups, starting with the Chinese, right up to today. we never learn. the only countervailing force is from those that recognize that immigration is part of what made America great.

those voices are getting drowned out by the OTHER MAGA.

DJ-wondering if you were able to view the linked video (if you don't have a NYT subscription).

[djAdvocate]

Jan 24, 2024 12:37:50 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jan 24, 2024 12:21:38 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

immigration has never been especially popular, here.

there is a long history of hatred for incoming immigrant groups, starting with the Chinese, right up to today. we never learn. the only countervailing force is from those that recognize that immigration is part of what made America great.

those voices are getting drowned out by the OTHER MAGA.

DJ-wondering if you were able to view the linked video (if you don't have a NYT subscription).

yes.  it only asked for my email address.  i don't have the bandwidth to run that video. however.

[djAdvocate]

it is interesting that GOP support for immigration reform is about the same as it has ever been.

[tbop77]

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott is touting a right to "self-defense" from a migrant "invasion" at the southern border, as the state fights a multi-pronged battle with the Biden administration.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/abbott-declares-texas-has-right-to-self-defense-from-migrant-invasion-amid-feud-with-biden-admin/ar-BB1hdeTC

<<<cough cough>>>vice president>>cough cough  

[happyhoix]

The GOP made a deal for improving border security as part of a package that gives money to Ukraine. GOP House MAGA reps refuse to go along because they don’t want to broker any deals with Biden. The senate was going along with it up until yesterday. McConnell said it was the best deal they had had in a long time and they needed to approve it, then yesterday, behind closed doors, he told the GOP members that ‘the candidate’ didn’t want to approve it because they didn’t want it to give Biden a win he could run on.

So Rip, the GOP is going to kill a border security bill and continue to allow the floods of illegals and drugs into our country because Trump wants things to be as bad as possible to help him win an election.

Goes right along with him hoping for the economy to crash.

Not very patriotic, is it? Pretty self centered and chaotic?

[Tennesseer]

Jan 25, 2024 8:01:44 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott is touting a right to "self-defense" from a migrant "invasion" at the southern border, as the state fights a multi-pronged battle with the Biden administration.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/abbott-declares-texas-has-right-to-self-defense-from-migrant-invasion-amid-feud-with-biden-admin/ar-BB1hdeTC

<<<cough cough>>>vice president>>cough cough  

"<<<cough cough>>>vice president>>cough cough" reminded me of this scene from the TV series Modern Family:

[happyhoix]

Jan 25, 2024 8:01:44 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott is touting a right to "self-defense" from a migrant "invasion" at the southern border, as the state fights a multi-pronged battle with the Biden administration.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/abbott-declares-texas-has-right-to-self-defense-from-migrant-invasion-amid-feud-with-biden-admin/ar-BB1hdeTC

<<<cough cough>>>vice president>>cough cough  

So is this the start of the civil war?

Why don’t we just give Texas to Mexico? Texas may not want that, but that won’t matter if they aren’t American anymore. Maybe Mexico can use the state as a giant compound to hold all the people coming up through Mexico looking for amnesty, while they wait for their documents to process. And we can fly in planes of illegals collected from other states.

[tbop77]

“This proposal would have had almost unanimous Republican support if it weren’t for Donald Trump,” the Republican senator said.



GOP Sen. Thom Tillis of North Carolina – who has also been involved in the talks – said he didn’t know if anyone could convince Trump to not kill the deal. But he acknowledged that it would take some “courage” for members to be able to press ahead at this point in defiance of Trump – though Tillis argued it would ultimately be beneficial for Trump for them to pass a border security deal and help address the flow of migrants trying to enter the country.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/gop-senators-seethe-as-trump-blows-up-delicate-immigration-compromise/ar-BB1hgaU2?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=16b2e1ff6f17477fab1a15071efb4219&ei=11

Yeah, come on here and tell us again how much the GOP and Trump give a shit about the border.  

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Jan 25, 2024 13:43:57 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Jan 25, 2024 8:01:44 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott is touting a right to "self-defense" from a migrant "invasion" at the southern border, as the state fights a multi-pronged battle with the Biden administration.


www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/abbott-declares-texas-has-right-to-self-defense-from-migrant-invasion-amid-feud-with-biden-admin/ar-BB1hdeTC

<<<cough cough>>>vice president>>cough cough  

So is this the start of the civil war?

Why don’t we just give Texas to Mexico? Texas may not want that, but that won’t matter if they aren’t American anymore. Maybe Mexico can use the state as a giant compound to hold all the people coming up through Mexico looking for amnesty, while they wait for their documents to process. And we can fly in planes of illegals collected from other states.

I don't think Mexico wants Texas back.  Maybe we could convince Mexico to help pay for that wall if it goes all the way around Texas instead?  

Let everyone who wants out out and leave everyone else to live in their supposed independent government free Utopia and see how long it takes before they start whining.

[Tennesseer]

When will republicans in congress stop being afraid of trump and do their job.

Senate deal on border and Ukraine at risk of collapse as Trump signals opposition

WASHINGTON (AP) — A bipartisan Senate deal to pair border enforcement measures and Ukraine aid faced potential collapse Thursday as Senate Republicans grew increasingly wary of an election-year compromise that Donald Trump, the likely Republican presidential nominee, seems likely to oppose.

Senate negotiators have been striving for weeks to finish a carefully negotiated compromise on border and immigration policy that is meant to tamp down the number of migrants who come to the U.S. border with Mexico. But now that negotiations have dragged for weeks, election-year politics and demands from Trump are weighing it down.

At stake is a plan that both President Joe Biden and Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell have worked for months to broker in hopes of cajoling Congress to approve wartime aid for Ukraine. The U.S. has run out of money to supply Ukraine, potentially leaving the country stranded without robust supplies of ammunition and missiles to fend off Russia’s invasion.

In a closed-door Republican meeting on Wednesday, McConnell acknowledged the reality of Trump’s opposition, that he is the party’s likely presidential nominee and discussed other options, including potentially separating Ukraine and the border, according to two people familiar who spoke anonymously to discuss the private meeting. Punchbowl News first reported the remarks.

Trump has loomed large over the talks, first skewering American support for Ukraine and now potentially upending a political compromise on the border that would hand his likely opponent, Biden, new policies meant to contain the historic numbers of migrants making their way to the country. With Republicans continuously raise the issue on the campaign trail, the border will likely remain central to elections this year.

Rest of article here: Senate deal on border and Ukraine at risk of collapse as Trump signals opposition

[busymom]

Why, why, why, does the GOP still give Trump so much power?  He's not even in office right now, and they're letting him influence their negotiations.  Either he has a LOT of dirty laundry on every one of them, or they're a bunch of cowards when it comes to not standing up to him.  Maybe both...  

[tallguy]

Jan 25, 2024 19:27:43 GMT -5 busymom said:

Why, why, why, does the GOP still give Trump so much power?  He's not even in office right now, and they're letting him influence their negotiations.  Either he has a LOT of dirty laundry on every one of them, or they're a bunch of cowards when it comes to not standing up to him.  Maybe both...  

It's the second. Certainly the second. Courage, honor, and integrity left the party a LONG time ago.

[tbop77]

Well, now we have a different request. Please DO NOT pay any attention whatsoever to the economy and instead focus entirely on the crisis along our southern border. Do not glance at how the stock market is doing, and under no circumstances check your 401(k) balances.

Anyway, the wise and powerful Trump doesn’t want us to do anything about the southern border because he’s worried it might make things better. If things get better, you all might feel less angry and start looking at the economy again. We can’t have that. Only a filthy liberal would want to fix a problem.

Anyway, in the days and weeks ahead we will be filling conservative airwaves with nonstop talk about THE BIDEN BORDER CRISIS and BIDEN’S FAILED BORDER POLICIES and ARMAGEDDON MARCHING ACROSS OUR BORDERS. We will start fearmongering about a migrant caravan in 3, 2, 1 … there we go.



And many Republican leaders you know and love will visit the border to stand and yell scary things into TV cameras, howling about the problem they are in no way willing to address.



So, prepare your fear glands for the impending swelling, and don’t you dare take your eyes off that border.



We can’t risk you getting a glimpse of Biden’s economy.



— The Republican Party

www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/good-economic-news-forces-the-gop-to-switch-narrative-to-the-border-there-must-be-fear/ar-BB1hi493?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=e5e0c31d428e401ea8ec57e172a148cc&ei=13


Does this about sum up the Republican agenda?  

[Tennesseer]

Jan 26, 2024 8:51:57 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Well, now we have a different request. Please DO NOT pay any attention whatsoever to the economy and instead focus entirely on the crisis along our southern border. Do not glance at how the stock market is doing, and under no circumstances check your 401(k) balances.

Anyway, the wise and powerful Trump doesn’t want us to do anything about the southern border because he’s worried it might make things better. If things get better, you all might feel less angry and start looking at the economy again. We can’t have that. Only a filthy liberal would want to fix a problem.

Anyway, in the days and weeks ahead we will be filling conservative airwaves with nonstop talk about THE BIDEN BORDER CRISIS and BIDEN’S FAILED BORDER POLICIES and ARMAGEDDON MARCHING ACROSS OUR BORDERS. We will start fearmongering about a migrant caravan in 3, 2, 1 … there we go.

And many Republican leaders you know and love will visit the border to stand and yell scary things into TV cameras, howling about the problem they are in no way willing to address.

So, prepare your fear glands for the impending swelling, and don’t you dare take your eyes off that border.

We can’t risk you getting a glimpse of Biden’s economy.

— The Republican Party

www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/good-economic-news-forces-the-gop-to-switch-narrative-to-the-border-there-must-be-fear/ar-BB1hi493?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=e5e0c31d428e401ea8ec57e172a148cc&ei=13


Does this about sum up the Republican agenda?  

For the posters here constantly clamoring for tougher border control like ripvanwinkle , we can now place the blame on trump if the bills in Congress fail. trump doesn't want to hand Biden a win in getting tougher border control passed during his presidency. trump doesn't want Biden to be able to campaign on that win.

With trump, it isn't tougher border control and the United States. With trump it, it all about him being elected.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination
The former president’s opposition has all but killed the prospects for a bipartisan border deal, reflecting how his influence in Congress has grown as he gains ground in the Republican primary.

Senator Christopher S. Murphy, the Connecticut Democrat who has been playing a lead role in the negotiations, said Mr. Trump’s opposition to the deal should come as no surprise.

“That is the cold, hard reality of Donald Trump, who just sees the border as a political issue, not as a policy problem to solve,” Mr. Murphy said.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination

[tbop77]

Jan 26, 2024 9:15:24 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jan 26, 2024 8:51:57 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Well, now we have a different request. Please DO NOT pay any attention whatsoever to the economy and instead focus entirely on the crisis along our southern border. Do not glance at how the stock market is doing, and under no circumstances check your 401(k) balances.

Anyway, the wise and powerful Trump doesn’t want us to do anything about the southern border because he’s worried it might make things better. If things get better, you all might feel less angry and start looking at the economy again. We can’t have that. Only a filthy liberal would want to fix a problem.

Anyway, in the days and weeks ahead we will be filling conservative airwaves with nonstop talk about THE BIDEN BORDER CRISIS and BIDEN’S FAILED BORDER POLICIES and ARMAGEDDON MARCHING ACROSS OUR BORDERS. We will start fearmongering about a migrant caravan in 3, 2, 1 … there we go.

And many Republican leaders you know and love will visit the border to stand and yell scary things into TV cameras, howling about the problem they are in no way willing to address.

So, prepare your fear glands for the impending swelling, and don’t you dare take your eyes off that border.

We can’t risk you getting a glimpse of Biden’s economy.

— The Republican Party

www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/good-economic-news-forces-the-gop-to-switch-narrative-to-the-border-there-must-be-fear/ar-BB1hi493?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=e5e0c31d428e401ea8ec57e172a148cc&ei=13


Does this about sum up the Republican agenda?  

For the posters here constantly clamoring for tougher border control like ripvanwinkle , we can now place the blame on trump if the bills in Congress fail. trump doesn't want to hand Biden a win in getting tougher border control passed during his presidency. trump doesn't want Biden to be able to campaign on that win.

With trump, it isn't tougher border control and the United States. With trump it, it all about him being elected.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination
The former president’s opposition has all but killed the prospects for a bipartisan border deal, reflecting how his influence in Congress has grown as he gains ground in the Republican primary.

Senator Christopher S. Murphy, the Connecticut Democrat who has been playing a lead role in the negotiations, said Mr. Trump’s opposition to the deal should come as no surprise.

“That is the cold, hard reality of Donald Trump, who just sees the border as a political issue, not as a policy problem to solve,” Mr. Murphy said.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination

Yeah, maybe the thread title should be changed to "LOL, don't fix the border to help Trump get elected"  

[Tennesseer]

Jan 26, 2024 11:07:39 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Jan 26, 2024 9:15:24 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

For the posters here constantly clamoring for tougher border control like ripvanwinkle , we can now place the blame on trump if the bills in Congress fail. trump doesn't want to hand Biden a win in getting tougher border control passed during his presidency. trump doesn't want Biden to be able to campaign on that win.

With trump, it isn't tougher border control and the United States. With trump it, it all about him being elected.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination
The former president’s opposition has all but killed the prospects for a bipartisan border deal, reflecting how his influence in Congress has grown as he gains ground in the Republican primary.

Senator Christopher S. Murphy, the Connecticut Democrat who has been playing a lead role in the negotiations, said Mr. Trump’s opposition to the deal should come as no surprise.

“That is the cold, hard reality of Donald Trump, who just sees the border as a political issue, not as a policy problem to solve,” Mr. Murphy said.

Trump Strengthens Grip on Capitol Hill as He Presses Toward Nomination

Yeah, maybe the thread title should be changed to "LOL, don't fix the border to help Trump get elected"  

Right now, trump wants no legislation passed regarding border security. Only trump, according to him, can fix it. So trump is perfectly fine until January 20, 2025 for the border to allegedly be wide open until his possible inauguration should he win the 2024 presidential election.

Didn't trump also promise he would stop immigration from Central America if he was elected in 2016? How did that promise work out.

[Tennesseer]

[djAdvocate]

Jan 26, 2024 11:24:18 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jan 26, 2024 11:07:39 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Yeah, maybe the thread title should be changed to "LOL, don't fix the border to help Trump get elected"  

Right now, trump wants no legislation passed regarding border security. Only trump, according to him, can fix it. So trump is perfectly fine until January 20, 2025 for the border to allegedly be wide open until his possible inauguration coronation should he win the 2024 presidential election.

Didn't trump also promise he would stop immigration from Central America if he was elected in 2016? How did that promise work out.

there you go.
fixed it for you.
you're welcome.

[Tennesseer]

For ripvanwinkle (again).

GOP senators seethe as Trump blows up delicate immigration compromise

Senior Senate Republicans are furious that Donald Trump may have killed an emerging bipartisan deal over the southern border, depriving them of a key legislative achievement on a pressing national priority and offering a preview of what’s to come with Trump as their likely presidential nominee.

In recent weeks, Trump has been lobbying Republicans both in private conversations and in public statements on social media to oppose the border compromise being delicately hashed out in the Senate, according to GOP sources familiar with the conversations – in part because he wants to campaign on the issue this November and doesn’t want President Joe Biden to score a victory in an area where he is politically vulnerable.

Senate GOP Leader Mitch McConnell acknowledged in a private meeting on Wednesday that Trump’s animosity toward the yet-to-be-released border deal puts Republicans in a serious bind as they try to move forward on the already complex issue. For weeks, Republicans have been warning that Trump’s opposition could blow up the bipartisan proposal, but the admission from McConnell was particularly striking, given he has been a chief advocate for a border-Ukraine package.

Now, Republicans on Capitol Hill are grappling with the reality that most in the GOP are loathe to do anything that is seen as potentially undermining the former president. And the prospects of a deal being scuttled before it has even been finalized has sparked tensions and confusion in the Senate GOP as they try to figure out if, and how, to proceed – even as McConnell made clear during party lunches Thursday that he remains firmly behind the effort to strike a deal, according to attendees.

“I think the border is a very important issue for Donald Trump. And the fact that he would communicate to Republican senators and congresspeople that he doesn’t want us to solve the border problem because he wants to blame Biden for it is … really appalling,” said GOP Sen. Mitt Romney of Utah, who has been an outspoken critic of Trump.

He added, “But the reality is that, that we have a crisis at the border, the American people are suffering as a result of what’s happening at the border. And someone running for president not to try and get the problem solved. as opposed to saying, ‘hey, save that problem. Don’t solve it. Let me take credit for solving it later.’”

GOP Sen. Todd Young of Indiana called any efforts to disrupt the ongoing negotiations “tragic” and said: “I hope no one is trying to take this away for campaign purposes.”

Rest of article here:  GOP senators seethe as Trump blows up delicate immigration compromise

[djAdvocate]

i hope they WILL try to take it away for campaign purposes.
particularly, Democrats.

[ripvanwinkle]

Does anybody know who is the largest manufacturer of razor wire is? I want to buy some stock. This could be a good buy.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 26, 2024 23:02:49 GMT -5 ripvanwinkle said:

Does anybody know who is the largest manufacturer of razor wire is? I want to buy some stock. This could be a good buy.

there are dozens of them.  hundreds.

items like this are "commodoties".  margins are exceedingly low.  in the single percentages.  competition is vicious.  you raise your price a nickle, you lose the work.  it is pretty much impossible to make money off a vanity project like this, rip.  i wouldn't even try.  if you are already in the business, you might have a chance to profit from it.  but you would probably need to be connected via MAGA.

short answer is the wholesalers won't even feel it, and the retailers are not generally publicly traded.  Home Depot, maybe?  WalMart?

[djAdvocate]

rip et al:

Governor Abbot "liked his chances" against the federal court, which ruled AGAINST him on Monday. what he probably meant is that he is going to openly defy the Federal Government, putting them in the position of enforcing federal law against Texas. that should be fun.

so, rip et al- do you believe in the law or not?
because Texas is on the wrong side of it right now.
no matter what you think the law SHOULD be, they are on the wrong side.

disclaimer: there are MANY laws in the US i disagree with. i don't think prostitution or drug use should be illegal, as examples. but i don't think that STATES should openly defy those laws except in court.

this is way outside what i would describe as the "constitutional order of things".

so, are you for or against the constitution? inquiring minds want to know.