ISIS reveal 6 reasons why they despise Westerners

[b2r]

1. Because you are disbelievers



"We hate you, first and foremost, because you are disbelievers; you reject the oneness of Allah – whether you realize it or not – by making partners for Him in worship, you blaspheme against Him, claiming that He has a son, you fabricate lies against His prophets and messengers, and you indulge in all manner of devilish practices."



2 . Because you are liberal



"We hate you because your secular, liberal societies permit the very things that Allah has prohibited while banning many of the things He has permitted, a matter that doesn’t concern you because you Christian disbelief and paganism 32 separate between religion and state, thereby granting supreme authority to your whims and desires via the legislators you vote into power."



3. Because some of you are atheist



"In the case of the atheist fringe, we hate you and wage war against you because you disbelieve in the existence of your Lord and Creator."



4. For your crimes against Islam



"We hate you for your crimes against Islam and wage war against you to punish you for your transgressions against our religion."



5. For your crimes against Muslims



"We hate you for your crimes against the Muslims; your drones and fighter jets bomb, kill, and maim our people around the world, and your puppets in the usurped lands of the Muslims oppress, torture, and wage war against anyone who calls to the truth."



6. For invading our lands



"We hate you for invading our lands and fight you to repel you and drive you out. As long as there is an inch of territory left for us to reclaim, jihad will continue to be a personal obligation on every single Muslim."



The article concludes that while foreign policy is an issue, the main reason they are hell bent on destruction is because they don't like the West very much.



It reads: "What’s important to understand here is that although some might argue that your foreign policies are the extent of what drives our hatred, this particular reason for hating you is secondary, hence the reason we addressed it at the end of the above list.





www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/why-isis-hate-you-reasons-8533563?service=responsive

[b2r]

[billisonboard]

Yeah, and we aren't all that pleased with you either.

[Tennesseer]

Standing side-by-side, points one and three don't make sense.

[kittensaver]

This is frankly no different in its world-view than the far right/Christofacists of the US:

www.autostraddle.com/i-was-trained-for-the-culture-wars-in-home-school-awaiting-someone-like-mike-pence-as-a-messiah-367057/

The religious beliefs may be different, but the dynamic of radical fundamentalism and intolerance is *exactly* the same. But of course, neither side will believe it . . . 

[Shooby]

 I really don't care what they think one way or the other.  In fact, i would be more than happy to stop their synapses from thinking.  

[Gardening Grandma]

May 26, 2017 13:16:55 GMT -5 kittensaver said:

This is frankly no different in its world-view that the far right/Christofacists of the US:

www.autostraddle.com/i-was-trained-for-the-culture-wars-in-home-school-awaiting-someone-like-mike-pence-as-a-messiah-367057/

The religious beliefs may be different, but the dynamic of radical fundamentalism and intolerance is *exactly* the same. But of course, neither side will believe it . . . 

I've often said that fundamentalist Christians are the other side of the same coin.  They practice the same intolerance; the same subjection of women; the same literal interpretation of their holy book; the same "I'm right and you are wrong" attitude; and the same desire to legislate their belief system onto those who don't share those beliefs.   

[Deleted]

May 26, 2017 13:32:19 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

May 26, 2017 13:16:55 GMT -5 kittensaver said:

This is frankly no different in its world-view that the far right/Christofacists of the US:

www.autostraddle.com/i-was-trained-for-the-culture-wars-in-home-school-awaiting-someone-like-mike-pence-as-a-messiah-367057/

The religious beliefs may be different, but the dynamic of radical fundamentalism and intolerance is *exactly* the same. But of course, neither side will believe it . . . 

I've often said that fundamentalist Christians are the other side of the same coin.  They practice the same intolerance; the same subjection of women; the same literal interpretation of their holy book; the same "I'm right and you are wrong" attitude; and the same desire to legislate their belief system onto those who don't share those beliefs.   

Is there any major cult in the world, that doesn't have somewhere in their theology, that their religion, is the one true religion ?

[billisonboard]

May 26, 2017 13:51:26 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 13:32:19 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

I've often said that fundamentalist Christians are the other side of the same coin.  They practice the same intolerance; the same subjection of women; the same literal interpretation of their holy book; the same "I'm right and you are wrong" attitude; and the same desire to legislate their belief system onto those who don't share those beliefs.   

Is there any major cult in the world, that doesn't have somewhere in their theology, that their religion, is the one true religion ?

[Deleted]

May 26, 2017 13:58:14 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

May 26, 2017 13:51:26 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

Is there any major cult in the world, that doesn't have somewhere in their theology, that their religion, is the one true religion ?

Of course I might be wrong.  That's why it's posed as a question.

[kittensaver]

May 26, 2017 13:51:26 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 13:32:19 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

Is there any major cult in the world, that doesn't have somewhere in their theology, that their religion, is the one true religion ?

I *think* Buddhism might come the closest (to not stating their religion is the "right" one). But then again, anyone can take any set of writings, call them "holy" and proceed to interpret them in any way that suits them personally. That is *definitely* done across all major world religions.

[billisonboard]

Doesn't quite qualify as a "major cult" but Bokononism doesn't claim to be the one true religion. Hell, it doesn't even claim to be true. I love it

[kittensaver]

May 26, 2017 14:05:58 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Doesn't quite qualify as a "major cult" but Bokononism doesn't claim to be the one true religion. Hell, it doesn't even claim to be true. I love it

Neither does the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

But I'd *definitely* call them a cult  (of tongue-in-cheek fun)

[mmhmm]

This thread has taken a decidedly religious turn. For that reason, I'm going to move it to the board meant for religious discussion. Please continue the discussion there.

mmhmm, Politics Moderator

[Deleted]

May 26, 2017 14:10:22 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

This thread has taken a decidedly religious turn. For that reason, I'm going to move it to the board meant for religious discussion. Please continue the discussion there.

mmhmm, Politics Moderator

ISIS is so steeped in religion, it is hard to keep it out of the discussion.

[mmhmm]

May 26, 2017 14:12:38 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 14:10:22 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

This thread has taken a decidedly religious turn. For that reason, I'm going to move it to the board meant for religious discussion. Please continue the discussion there.

mmhmm, Politics Moderator

ISIS is so steeped in religion, it is hard to keep it out of the discussion.

Yes, it certainly is. That's why I moved the thread to this board. It frees up the scope of the discussion which is now limited only to the rules that are applicable for this specific board.

[billisonboard]

May 26, 2017 14:12:38 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 14:10:22 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

This thread has taken a decidedly religious turn. For that reason, I'm going to move it to the board meant for religious discussion. Please continue the discussion there.

mmhmm, Politics Moderator

ISIS is so steeped in religion, it is hard to keep it out of the discussion.

Except they are also too well steeped in the strategy of terror.

[mmhmm]

Many of those affiliated with ISIS aren't there because of religion. They're there as mercenaries. They're there because they want to be a part of something that draws international attention and promises power and wealth. ISIS does that. For those, religion is just the cloak they use to justify their actions.

[Gardening Grandma]

May 26, 2017 13:51:26 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 13:32:19 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

I've often said that fundamentalist Christians are the other side of the same coin.  They practice the same intolerance; the same subjection of women; the same literal interpretation of their holy book; the same "I'm right and you are wrong" attitude; and the same desire to legislate their belief system onto those who don't share those beliefs.   

Is there any major cult in the world, that doesn't have somewhere in their theology, that their religion, is the one true religion ?

I don't know for certain, but when living in Japan, I observed that most Japanese seemed to be able to encompass both Bhuddist and Shinto beliefs without conflict.
Certainly tpneither religion subjugated women and believers did not seek to inflict their beliefs on others the way fundamentalist Christisns do here.

[kittensaver]

JMHO Judaism comes the "next closest." While the most orthodox factions certainly believe that 'their' God is the only and one true God, they swing almost universally the other direction from religious evangelists of various stripes and often take great pains to shut the world out. The most orthodox factions believe that they (by virtue of their birth to a Jewish family and heritage) are God's chosen people, and that it's impossible to be a Jew unless you were born as such.

But even the non-orthodox (reformed and conservative) Jews *generally* believe in their 'tribalism' and do not actively OR passively seek to convert others to their way of life. And they most certainly do not threaten to harm or kill people who refuse to 'convert' [conversion being a non-issue for them].    

[mmhmm]

Never, in all my years in Islamic countries, did I ever have anyone try to convert me to Islam. My late husband experienced the same. Religion just wasn't discussed, other than by my Iranian students. They wanted to discuss it but it wasn't allowed as a topic of discussion at the university so they arranged to come to my home once a week so they could discuss it. We had some very interesting talks and they never degraded into nastiness. We tried to learn from one another and it was, for the most part, a pleasant experience.

[Deleted]

May 26, 2017 18:14:27 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Never, in all my years in Islamic countries, did I ever have anyone try to convert me to Islam. My late husband experienced the same. Religion just wasn't discussed, other than by my Iranian students. They wanted to discuss it but it wasn't allowed as a topic of discussion at the university so they arranged to come to my home once a week so they could discuss it. We had some very interesting talks and they never degraded into nastiness. We tried to learn from one another and it was, for the most part, a pleasant experience.

I remember a few years back when there was a rash of kidnappings of "westerners" in some middle eastern countries.  One of the things that seemed to be a theme was the fact that they were forced to convert.  By what you say, this is not an activity condoned by the general populace over there?

[mmhmm]

May 28, 2017 8:56:34 GMT -5 @jma23 said:

May 26, 2017 18:14:27 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Never, in all my years in Islamic countries, did I ever have anyone try to convert me to Islam. My late husband experienced the same. Religion just wasn't discussed, other than by my Iranian students. They wanted to discuss it but it wasn't allowed as a topic of discussion at the university so they arranged to come to my home once a week so they could discuss it. We had some very interesting talks and they never degraded into nastiness. We tried to learn from one another and it was, for the most part, a pleasant experience.

I remember a few years back when there was a rash of kidnappings of "westerners" in some middle eastern countries.  One of the things that seemed to be a theme was the fact that they were forced to convert.  By what you say, this is not an activity condoned by the general populace over there?

In my experience it absolutely is not. We had quite a few Saudi friends. We were in their homes and they were in ours. We went places together and enjoyed one another's company. We didn't try to convert them away from Islam and they didn't try to convert us away from Western ways. The matter of religion rarely came up. If it did it was only to clear up misconceptions if they were brought up. I found the people to be just people, like you and I. They laughed and cried and wondered, just as we do. It was much the same in Indonesia. We weren't in Iran long because of their revolution; however, even while that was going on (before we evacuated) I didn't experience any of that from the Iranians we knew. The students talked about it and expressed their feelings and their fears but they never turned against us for it. Some of them did express the wish they could go to the US with us. They're just people so are curious and trying to learn.

[Tiny]

May 26, 2017 11:49:21 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Standing side-by-side, points one and three don't make sense.

Hmm, I thought they did... generally, even for some Christians - an atheist is even more despised and horrible than someone who professes belief in any supernatural god(s).   Having no belief in god(s) is WORSE than having belief in a god that isn't the right god (or one that exists - as in it's better to have belief in say, the Norse gods - than to be an atheist.   A Christian/Muslim doesn't believe the Norse gods exist - but atleast their followers aren't as vile and moral-less as atheists). 

[Tiny]

May 26, 2017 13:32:19 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

May 26, 2017 13:16:55 GMT -5 kittensaver said:

This is frankly no different in its world-view that the far right/Christofacists of the US:

www.autostraddle.com/i-was-trained-for-the-culture-wars-in-home-school-awaiting-someone-like-mike-pence-as-a-messiah-367057/

The religious beliefs may be different, but the dynamic of radical fundamentalism and intolerance is *exactly* the same. But of course, neither side will believe it . . . 

I've often said that fundamentalist Christians are the other side of the same coin.  They practice the same intolerance; the same subjection of women; the same literal interpretation of their holy book; the same "I'm right and you are wrong" attitude; and the same desire to legislate their belief system onto those who don't share those beliefs.   

I guess it depends on how seriously the Christians take the Ten Commandments - since the first 4 deal explicitly with humans relation to God <-- and the first 3 with there being only one "right" god to worship.     Of course who ever is interpreting the 10 commandments gets to decide how strictly those first 3 ARE interpreted.    I think this is mostly a Christian issue and not a Jewish issue  (since it's Old Testament).  

[Tiny]

On the atheist/muslim thing...  I've rarely read about a Muslim coming out as atheist to their family - or their story of how they got to atheism.  Plenty of Christian/Jewish and the occasional other belief system.   There are plenty of atheists passing as Muslim - about 10 years ago? a reporter did a poll/asked questions (and kept the identity of everyone interviewed anonymous) and many people fessed up to having little or no belief in Islam - but they couldn't come out- they'd be dead or cut off from their family (and then dead), and their family would be shamed, and suspect, and looked down on.   Even the more liberal Muslim families, who only do as much as is required (kinda like the Christians who only go to Church on Christmas and maybe Easter)... coming out as atheist was seen as NOT being something you'd want to do... the stigma is so bad.     It's also this way for some Christian denominations.  It's better to be a known faker than to be an outright atheist.   

[b2r]

  


     Possible reason why more, moderate muslims don't speak out against radical islam?

 EXCLUSIVE: 'The Islamic ruling for this is beheading': Chilling threat to imam who wants Muslim schools shut down - as he reveals he would never have come to Australia if he knew a 'mosque on every corner' was being built



But Sheikh Mohammad Tawhidi - the outspoken Shia imam from Adelaide - has revealed the chilling threat which this week drove him into hiding.

'The Islamic ruling for this infidel is beheading,' said a message posted to his Facebook page last Saturday.

'I will pay $5000 for anyone who gets me his whereabouts, I'll organise the rest'.





Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4388672/Mohammad-Tawhidi-hiding-following-chilling-Islam-threat.html#ixzz4iQ2PPA72

[billisonboard]

May 28, 2017 19:03:00 GMT -5 b2r said:

... Possible reason why more, moderate muslims don't speak out against radical islam?

I would answer, "Yes". The use of threat by bad guys of retaliation to keep people quiet has been common practice since the dawn of time.

[toshmanta]

I would suggest a few anecdotal experiences of a few ex-pats with a few middle class Muslims is about as relevant as me discussing fox hunting with the aristocracy, just check any opinion poll on the beliefs of those who make up the majority of Muslims,not their fault but it is 7th century morality and no longer acceptable in a world gauged toward universal human rights.

I am not an Islamaphobe, just a normal human being who recognises a bad idea when he sees one, not my fault over a billion people have their identity attached to a philosophy that is by essence, fascist.

[toshmanta]

Islamic State has nothing to do with Islam but here we are on the religious discussion board, now if that does not scramble your brains then go and visit a Creationist museum.

It seems to me if any person does good due to their religious beliefs then religion gets the credit, if any person does bad then it has nothing to do with their religious beliefs.

Bad people do bad shit but it takes religion to make good people do bad shit.

The sooner atheists take over and adopt my eugenics program the better, personally i have had enough of these death denying cults, i would prefer a world of robots with AI than shaven apes killing kids because of some freakin bronze age myth.