And the naysayers here said he would not do it

[djAdvocate]

Jan 25, 2017 14:18:54 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Mr. Trump seems intent on governing without involving Congress in any way.

which is something he consistently railed against Obama for doing.

[dondub]

Not just trump, but literally every righty here.

[whoisjohngalt]

Jan 25, 2017 11:33:43 GMT -5 dondub said:

But at least we finally have POTUS who actually wants to and is doing something about the problem instead of just yapping about it.

Obama was the deporter in chief, we already did.

Deporting them does nothing!

It's like when I have a bowl with candy on a table and my 5 yr old wants a candy and I tell him he can't have it.  There is about 95% chance that once I leave the room he will reach for that candy.   Making him spit out that candy will only accomplish one thing - he will know what that candy tastes like and now will be even more determined to have it.

So, you know what I do?  I take away the whole bowl.

We need to take away the candy bowl - the housing,  the medical care, the education and JOBS!  If we take it away  - they won't have anything to reach for. 

[engineerdoe]

Jan 25, 2017 11:46:15 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

I do as well but this gives those who have no or very little job skills a job plus some training. Bridges and what not require skills. I hope.

A wall of the magnitude Trump wants will require skilled people.  It's not just stacking bricks.

[billisonboard]

Jan 25, 2017 16:36:48 GMT -5 engineerdoe said:

Jan 25, 2017 11:46:15 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

I do as well but this gives those who have no or very little job skills a job plus some training. Bridges and what not require skills. I hope.

A wall of the magnitude Trump wants will require skilled people.  It's not just stacking bricks.

Plus it will have that big, beautiful door.  That will take skill.

[dondub]

JohnGalt,

  My response was to your assertion "we finally have a POTUS that wants to and is doing something about it instead of yapping about it. Obama did much more

than yap about it and deported more illegals than any previous president by far. I know it's hard for righties to give him any credit for anything, however.

[thyme4change]

tucson.com/special-section/beyond-the-wall/why-we-don-t-need-trump-s-great-great-wall/article_f87fd116-399c-11e6-ad53-ab5ac295e9b0.html#comments

I thought this was interesting.  I think the point that half of the illegal immigrants just stay when their visa expires is one that is not discussed enough.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 25, 2017 17:02:39 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Jan 25, 2017 16:36:48 GMT -5 engineerdoe said:

A wall of the magnitude Trump wants will require skilled people.  It's not just stacking bricks.

Plus it will have that big, beautiful door.  That will take skill.

will it be large enough to kick people through?

[NastyWoman]

I thought we were still at making illegal immigrants build the wall (they're illegal so we can pay them bupkes --- the reason for businesses to employ them in the first place) and then we would toss them over said wall after completion.  I really must try better to keep up here 

[billisonboard]

Jan 25, 2017 18:04:37 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

I thought we were still at making illegal immigrants build the wall (they're illegal so we can pay them bupkes --- the reason for businesses to employ them in the first place) and then we would toss them over said wall after completion.  I really must try better to keep up here 

Yeah, we were going to do it but realized they would do something like this:

[NastyWoman]

Cool! And just imagine how much that would cut down on border patrol (BP): they can just sit around at the doors waiting for the illegal immigrants to come through.  Hold that thought → layoffs in BP would reduce the net number of jobs created.  Damn this governing business is getting complicated.  And then there is the cost of all those chairs... 

[Tiny]

Has Trump said WHO will be manufacturing the fencing etc....    He seemed to be all "American Made" steel pipe for the Oil Pipe line he OK'd... but not a peep about where the materials for the 2000 miles of fence will come from...

Perhaps Trump doesn't have an interest in any companies that make fencing    So he's ok if we source it all from China? Or maybe Canada (we ARE buying Canadian Oil - ie that's what the pipeline is for)....  

(I still think landmines would be better than a Wall...  it would like nicer - no  American would have to look at a nasty dirty wall (Trump wasn't too thrilled about a windfarm near his golf course - so I'm sure he understands this).

I'm assuming Trump will be imposing HUGE taxes on the companies buying the oil from Canada... right... it's an import and it's hurting the US States that produce oil (they are in a recession....)

I'm so confused.

[whoisjohngalt]

Jan 25, 2017 17:29:43 GMT -5 dondub said:

JohnGalt,

  My response was to your assertion "we finally have a POTUS that wants to and is doing something about it instead of yapping about it. Obama did much more

than yap about it and deported more illegals than any previous president by far. I know it's hard for righties to give him any credit for anything, however.

Doing something useless and expensive is even worse than not doing anything at all.

[Opti]

Jan 25, 2017 9:18:06 GMT -5 b2r said:

  

Its a pretty good short film. I'm not sure its made by a Trump supporting film-maker though. Shooting missles from the package area is umm an interesting symbolic choice.

[Opti]

Jan 25, 2017 14:18:54 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Mr. Trump seems intent on governing without involving Congress in any way.

Why do I have the feeling executive orders will suddenly seem OK for a President to use?

Who needs a Republican Congress anyway?

[Opti]

Jan 25, 2017 19:09:36 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

Jan 25, 2017 17:29:43 GMT -5 dondub said:

JohnGalt,

  My response was to your assertion "we finally have a POTUS that wants to and is doing something about it instead of yapping about it. Obama did much more

than yap about it and deported more illegals than any previous president by far. I know it's hard for righties to give him any credit for anything, however.

Doing something useless and expensive is even worse than not doing anything at all.

  Net immigration has been down. I know its not that popular for some to acknowledge the actual facts of our reality and concentrate on the feeling that for some it FEELS like the immigration problem is worse. It FEELS useless. Not sure about the expense part perhaps you've compared the costs across other presidencies?

Its like when people tell me they've been on hold for 6 minutes or so and they are getting upset. If I'm in a generous mood I let their exaggeration slide. If they are nasty, I get factual before trying to page someone again. Yes I'm sorry you were on hold, but our system only holds calls for a max of two minutes. (fact) Sorry for your wait(not entirely true...), but let me try again for you (you have two more holds to be on b4 you get to 6 minutes Mrs. Caller. )

[jkapp]

Jan 25, 2017 15:33:55 GMT -5 dondub said:

Not just trump, but literally every righty here.

And I do believe the righties warned the lefties not to let it become precedent...but, alas, they didn't listen.  Again.  Now they will complain about Trump and, once again, show their hypocrisy.

[jkapp]

Jan 25, 2017 17:29:43 GMT -5 dondub said:

JohnGalt,

  My response was to your assertion "we finally have a POTUS that wants to and is doing something about it instead of yapping about it. Obama did much more

than yap about it and deported more illegals than any previous president by far. I know it's hard for righties to give him any credit for anything, however.

Yet the only reason Obama was able to deport so many was because of the steps taken by Bush Jr...but will you give Bush Jr credit for that?  Nah...

[jkapp]

Jan 25, 2017 19:09:36 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

Jan 25, 2017 17:29:43 GMT -5 dondub said:

JohnGalt,

  My response was to your assertion "we finally have a POTUS that wants to and is doing something about it instead of yapping about it. Obama did much more

than yap about it and deported more illegals than any previous president by far. I know it's hard for righties to give him any credit for anything, however.

Doing something useless and expensive is even worse than not doing anything at all.

Kinda like the ACA?

[citizensunite]

Jan 25, 2017 19:26:46 GMT -5 Opti said:

Jan 25, 2017 14:18:54 GMT -5 mollyanna58 said:

Mr. Trump seems intent on governing without involving Congress in any way.

Why do I have the feeling executive orders will suddenly seem OK for a President to use?

Who needs a Republican Congress anyway?

Because it can't become law without them? 

[dondub]

JK,

 Please provide a link about what Bush did that enabled Obama to become the deporter in chief. I will examine the info and give my opinion. Maybe Bush actually did something right!

 Even though you think it was "useless and expensive" (what will Trump do that differently that will be better and cheaper as far as deporting illegals?) more illegals were deported, by far,

than any previous POTUSA. What was that you said about giving Bush credit? How about you give some to Obama. It won't kill you.

[NastyWoman]

Ok, riddle solved. From the party that got us into two wars without putting the cost on the books, here is how we are going to pay for The Wall (it's called creative accounting):

Philadelphia (CNN)Congress may pay for the border wall through a special spending bill being hashed out over the next two months, footing the cost of President Donald Trump's priority before seeking any refund from Mexico, Republican lawmakers said Wednesday.

House Speaker Paul Ryan told lawmakers, gathered in Philadelphia for a private retreat this week, that they could pay for the wall through a supplemental appropriations bill -- a spending measure that would be dedicated just to the wall, according to Republicans in the room and a GOP lawmaker.
"(Ryan) talked about the supplemental budget coming this spring to push that along. The President said he's going to get reimbursed one way or the other and we accept that. Meanwhile, we do have to pay our bills," Rep. Chris Collins, a New York Republican and Trump ally, said Wednesday.

www.cnn.com/2017/01/25/politics/republicans-trump-retreat-border-wall/index.html

[dezailoooooo]

I have seen where the cost of the wall itself can cost Billions....many, many Billions...many, many Billions...and he also wants to hire 10,000 new border police plus 5000 new immigration officers dedicated to the round up and deportations og those here illegally...[ doubt u need them just to gather up those with records..and on that point..is misdemeanors, say a DWI, fender bender...is that a deportable offense...My feeling that majny officers for round up...a lot more then just those with records will be picked up. Another point...where is all these $ are coming from...where is the tea party when we finally need them..
====================================================
"President Trump signed a pair of executive orders on Wednesday stepping up immigration enforcement efforts and calling for “the immediate construction of a physical wall on the southern border.” Trump touted the actions in a speech at the Department of Homeland Security on Wednesday afternoon.

“As I’ve said repeatedly to the country, we are going to get the bad ones out, the criminals, and the drug deals, and gangs, and gang members, and cartel leaders. The day is over when they can stay in our country and wreak havoc. We are going to get them out. We are going to get them out fast,” Trump said.

In his speech, Trump argued that the U.S. is “in the middle of a crisis on our southern border” owing to “the unprecedented surge of illegal migrants from Central America” and drug cartel activity. He also stressed that his immigration reform measures would improve the U.S.’s relationship with Mexico and help both nations by “deterring illegal immigration from Central America and by disrupting violent cartel networks.”

“I believe the steps we will take starting right now will improve the safety in both our countries, going to be very, very good for Mexico,” Trump said. “A nation without borders is not a nation. Beginning today, the United States of America gets back control of its borders, gets back its borders.”

One of Trump’s executive orders called for the immediate construction of a “contiguous, physical wall or other similarly secure, contiguous, and impassable physical barrier” on the border with Mexico. The border wall — and having Mexico pay for it — was one of Trump’s signature campaign promises.

White House press secretary Sean Spicer discussed the order in his daily press briefing earlier in the day. He called it “a commonsense first step to really securing our porous border” and insisted that “Mexico will pay for it,” as Trump had vowed. Trump has called for construction of the wall to begin before any money comes in from Mexico, which has said it will not finance the project.


When he took questions from reporters, Spicer was asked specifically how Mexico would pay for the wall and whether he believes Republicans in Congress would fund the project in the meantime. Spicer suggested that there are multiple “mechanisms” through which Mexico could finance wall construction and indicated that, just days after taking office, Trump has had multiple discussions with congressional leaders in which he urged them to “make sure” there is funding.
=============================================
and when Mexico does not pay for the wall...then what..even the Donald does not have that many billions...Possible we go to war?  So we win...then what...a new Marshall type plan for the conquered Mexico..[for those who don't know what a Marshall plan is , suggest google..[keep forgetting..history not a big thing with a lot of younger ones among us..
================================================

“I think the president is working with Congress and other folks to figure out opportunities for that to happen. There are a lot of funding mechanisms that can be used. At this point, his goal was to get the project started as quickly as possible using existing funds and resources that the [Department of Homeland Security] currently has and then to move forward and work with Congress on an appropriations schedule,” Spicer said.

[djAdvocate]

dez- please remind us how many people he would deport in the first 100 days.  it was in the millions.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 25, 2017 19:39:32 GMT -5 jkapp said:

Jan 25, 2017 19:09:36 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

Doing something useless and expensive is even worse than not doing anything at all.

Kinda like the ACA?

i have a friend who lives down in San Luis Obispo County who is on the ACA, and loves it.  he has a wife and two kids, and owns his own business.

[MN-Investor]

If you want to cure the undocumented alien problem, you have to actually understand the problem.

In the right wing pundit world, the whole problem boils down to criminals streaming over the US/Mexican border. That's it. So the cure is to throw up a wall which will stop all the drug dealers and rapists and murderers.

Of course, that viewpoint ignores the thousands of undocumented aliens who have overstayed their visas.

But building a wall is just a matter of throwing it up, right?

Is there even an environmental impact statement required? That's got to disrupt a heck of a lot of animal migrations.

And then there's the matter of who owns that land you want to build on. Are you going to acquire it all through eminent domain? You're going to have to pay fair market value for it. I envision court cases there.

How high will the wall be? How deep will it go down? Do you even realize how deep folks can dig tunnels?

And there's the logistics of moving all that material to where the wall will be built. Where will the construction crew live while working on the wall?

Part of the executive order also addresses removing undocumented aliens. Simple in principal, but it can get expensive. That's one reason why Obama stressed removing actual felons (being an undocumented alien is not a felony).

These are just some of the things off the top of my head. I wonder if Trump has considered any of them. Nah. It would require actual analysis and that's not Trump's forte. He goes for the simple answers. However, this is a complex problem.

[djAdvocate]

there is also the geographic fact of the Rio Grande, the Gulf of Mexico, and the Pacific Ocean.  fence THAT.

[Opti]

Jan 25, 2017 21:40:51 GMT -5 MN-Investor said:

If you want to cure the undocumented alien problem, you have to actually understand the problem.

In the right wing pundit world, the whole problem boils down to criminals streaming over the US/Mexican border. That's it. So the cure is to throw up a wall which will stop all the drug dealers and rapists and murderers.

Of course, that viewpoint ignores the thousands of undocumented aliens who have overstayed their visas.

But building a wall is just a matter of throwing it up, right?

Is there even an environmental impact statement required? That's got to disrupt a heck of a lot of animal migrations.

And then there's the matter of who owns that land you want to build on. Are you going to acquire it all through eminent domain? You're going to have to pay fair market value for it. I envision court cases there.

How high will the wall be? How deep will it go down? Do you even realize how deep folks can dig tunnels?

And there's the logistics of moving all that material to where the wall will be built. Where will the construction crew live while working on the wall?

Part of the executive order also addresses removing undocumented aliens. Simple in principal, but it can get expensive. That's one reason why Obama stressed removing actual felons (being an undocumented alien is not a felony).

These are just some of the things off the top of my head. I wonder if Trump has considered any of them. Nah. It would require actual analysis and that's not Trump's forte. He goes for the simple answers. However, this is a complex problem.

I will add most illegal immigrants are NOT coming in via Mexico. Building a wall won't stop people from flying in for vacations, visiting family, whatever Visa type Melania had, coming in by boat, etc. Trump wanted to go after Mexico because its easy and he uses the perception IS reality card often. Back in the day he probably sold people on how the earth was flat and how to not go too far and fall off.

And focusing on the wall allows him to continue to sponsor flying in Romanians or other workers from countries where our wages are high relative to their usual living costs. So business as usual unless you hire undocumented Mexicans or those who come from Mexico.

[djAdvocate]

it is a bandaid to cover a severed limb.  it is utterly useless, for show only.  much like his entire campaign.

oh, and BTW, an EO won't fund this project.  how is this going to be funded?

[Opti]

Jan 25, 2017 22:01:39 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

it is a bandaid to cover a severed limb.  it is utterly useless, for show only.  much like his entire campaign.

oh, and BTW, an EO won't fund this project.  how is this going to be funded?

Well cutting Planned Parenthood funding will help temporarily ... but then there will be the additional WIC recipients to deal with before his 4 years are up. Cutting funding to the EPA,  and other agencies like Education. That will be some of it.

If he was smart it would also come from closing various military bases overseas. I'm not sure that will happen once he actually realizes we are in all those places for the US, not the host country. That many host countries would be happy to have our asses off their sovereign soil. Stay tuned. All Trump, all the time ... Trump TV also live streaming on Twitter.