Discrediting an enemy

[8 Bit WWBG]

Did you ever have a direct hand in discrediting someone?  Do you prefer to let them hang themselves?  Did you hand them rope to tie knots with?

[tloonya]

May 14, 2016 20:49:57 GMT -5 8 Bit WWBG said:

Did you ever have a direct hand in discrediting someone?  Do you prefer to let them hang themselves?  Did you hand them rope to tie knots with?

I don't know your situation but forgiveness and prayers might just get your soul into the right place.

I got out of the bad stuff like that. PM me if you wish. I will tell you all. Just don't waste my time if you are atheist tot he core.

[Deleted]

Is the person likely to cause others immediate harm? 

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

If you just speak the honest truth, there should be no reason to ever actively discredit anyone.

Although, that said, it has been my personal experience that simply speaking the honest truth can cause others to discredit the person speaking said truth.

[resolution]

I have found a lot more peace and contentment in letting things go and not actively working against those around me.

[Deleted]

Yup, there are some cases where putting your head in the sand results in continually getting ran over.

A person many years ago screwed me over at work a couple of times, he was known for stepping on people to advance. One time he totally messed up and would have gotten away with it had I not made a person aware who had the power to get him fired.

I don't endorse such acts as a first option (or even 2nd or 3rd) but if you mess with my family, close friends or my livelihood I will take advantage when the opportunity arises.

[zibazinski]

May 14, 2016 22:23:13 GMT -5 @aj said:

Yup, there are some cases where putting your head in the sand results in continually getting ran over.

A person many years ago screwed me over at work a couple of times, he was known for stepping on people to advance. One time he totally messed up and would have gotten away with it had I not made a person aware who had the power to get him fired.

I don't endorse such acts as a first option (or even 2nd or 3rd) but if you mess with my family, close friends or my livelihood I will take advantage when the opportunity arises.

Amen. I'm still gloating about one of the women who slept with my then husband getting fired and escorted from the bank, thanks to me. One of the others husband divorced her. If they suffered half the pain they caused me and my kids, good. Yes, my ex was also at fault but you can't screw around on your wife if women aren't willing to help out.

[tloonya]

May 14, 2016 21:56:22 GMT -5 resolution said:

I have found a lot more peace and contentment in letting things go and not actively working against those around me.

Agree. However just a few month ago found out about people who are sociopaths...scary crap!

He goes to church telling the priest he has no sins so there is no confession needed for him.

However he tells his children all priests are child molesters and he sends 10 years old daughter to confess her sin...that she said she loves her mother and her sin is that she is a liar. Because she can't love her mother because she supposed to love her father...

Can you let those 'things' go?

Unless you are single alone person who has no one who cares for you...

[Opti]

May 14, 2016 23:03:13 GMT -5 tloonya said:

May 14, 2016 21:56:22 GMT -5 resolution said:

I have found a lot more peace and contentment in letting things go and not actively working against those around me.

Agree. However just a few month ago found out about people who are sociopaths...scary crap!

He goes to church telling the priest he has no sins so there is no confession needed for him.

However he tells his children all priests are child molesters and he sends 10 years old daughter to confess her sin...that she said she loves her mother and her sin is that she is a liar. Because she can't love her mother because she supposed to love her father...

Can you let those 'things' go?

Unless you are single alone person who has no one who cares for you...

It will change who this child will grow up to be. When she's an adult or possibly sooner she will choose to realize DAD is FOS, and love Mom anyway. Sad he's trying to create sins in his daughter.

[Opti]

OP, are you going to enlighten us on why you started this thread?

I'm looking forward to reading a post or two when I return from work today.

[MJ2.0]

I find that "those people" are generally stupid enough to not need help hanging themselves. All I have to do is sit back, document stuff (if necessary), and wait. I have been having issues with my newest associate and when *I* got a little too dumb, I'm the one who got in trouble. After that was resolved, she still tried to blame current shortcomings on me but my boss wasn't really having it. She's shaped up quite a bit since then - nowhere near where she should be, but it's much better.

[zibazinski]

I wasn't willing to wait.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

There is a clear difference between attacking another's character and defending one's own.

[8 Bit WWBG]

It's a business setting and unfortunately the person who needs to be discredited has the ear of senior management.  While one person can't usually make strong enough waves, if enough people band together, then even friends in high places can't look the other way for long.

I'm leaning towards the much smarter and more careful position of making sure that enough people are aware, but in a way that doesn't make me seem like I have an agenda.  I'm not suited to be a revolutionary, and dethrone a whole bunch of people.  I just need someone who currently has far too much leeway, reigned in.

[OldCoyote]

I am very generous,  for those that need it,  I give them plenty of rope to hang themselves!

[Tiny]

May 15, 2016 9:02:25 GMT -5 8 Bit WWBG said:

It's a business setting and unfortunately the person who needs to be discredited has the ear of senior management.  While one person can't usually make strong enough waves, if enough people band together, then even friends in high places can't look the other way for long.

 
Discredit sounds bad... it's like the person is actually a good person who's working in earnest for the Good of the Company - but you don't agree with them and maybe feel unfairly treated, so you are going to 'manufacture' some mud to throw at them or you are going to rile up a mob and head to Management with pitchforks and torches waving...  

Do you just not agree with the person's business decisions (or direction they are proposing to management to take?)   or is it a clash of personalities?   Or is the person actively harming the business?

I may have a skewed view - I've always worked for employers with hundreds of employees AND a very strong business plan AND a lot of overview/accountability to management to get the plan worked and done.  (the Powers that Be also holds management to getting the 'job done'.)  There is no whining about how I failed to complete project X on time because my staff sucks!  Because it's expected that management will say something early on about their sucky staff and either reconfigure (or hire/fire) to get the staff that can do the job.    Someone who's hindering the business plan - pretty much hangs themselves... it doesn't take long - a couple of quarters or at most a year (if they have a lot of friends in high places - Eventually the friends in high places realize they are making excuses for the person and it's starting to effect THEIR credibility...   )

[tallguy]

I don't really have an issue with enemies. I have a problem with "stupid."

I may or may not at some point have used the phrase, "You know, if it were me in charge, the only way that idiot would not be fired is if I killed him first."    

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I'm in this position now withal postdoc. We've run into an issue where I don't have something I need because he's taking it all.

I tried negotiating but that didn't work. Technically he's above me so I can't make him do anything.

So I went to our superiors and presented the issue. For some reason it was accepted that he needs all our cells without him having to provide any data to back it up.

I am left to use untested cells or if found three year old commsrical cells that may or may not be viable.

Angry is an understatement. I take care of the main money maker mice. I can't make mice we are all out of work.

I tried if I get too vocal or try go be sneaky I'll be the one in trouble.

So I am just going to document and give "just the facts MA'am". Let them do the math and come to the conclusion on their own that this is a major problem. I spoke up and there are many witnesses who heard me.

I just hope when they do reach the same conclusion I have it doesn't end with me being thrown under the bus.

[Opti]

May 15, 2016 6:51:53 GMT -5 MJ2.0 said:

I find that "those people" are generally stupid enough to not need help hanging themselves. All I have to do is sit back, document stuff (if necessary), and wait. I have been having issues with my newest associate and when *I* got a little too dumb, I'm the one who got in trouble. After that was resolved, she still tried to blame current shortcomings on me but my boss wasn't really having it. She's shaped up quite a bit since then - nowhere near where she should be, but it's much better.

I'm glad this your experience with "those" people. My experience with them is they can do pretty well.

I rarely go after them, because my political skills are not superb ... yet. But every once in awhile I make exceptions. I'm making an exception now.

New FTer I'm sure tried to blame me for not knowing a couple things, but she's going to be surprised with what people know, if and when she returns from maternity leave.

[Opti]

May 15, 2016 11:50:45 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I'm in this position now withal postdoc. We've run into an issue where I don't have something I need because he's taking it all.

I tried negotiating but that didn't work. Technically he's above me so I can't make him do anything.

So I went to our superiors and presented the issue. For some reason it was accepted that he needs all our cells without him having to provide any data to back it up.

I am left to use untested cells or if found three year old commsrical cells that may or may not be viable.

Angry is an understatement. I take care of the main money maker mice. I can't make mice we are all out of work.

I tried if I get too vocal or try go be sneaky I'll be the one in trouble.

So I am just going to document and give "just the facts MA'am". Let them do the math and come to the conclusion on their own that this is a major problem. I spoke up and there are many witnesses who heard me.

I just hope when they do reach the same conclusion I have it doesn't end with me being thrown under the bus.

I'm living a different version of your life. I'm past angry.

ETA: I actually had a decent discussion with the new administrator on the skilled nursing side. For today some hope. Maybe Miss Thing won't return, or enough will be revealed that she won't be able to.

[Spellbound454]

Dunno.
I don't really do subterfuge.......Usually very easy to get on with but if someone does the dirty on me ...I'll let them know what I think.
Stop management in the corridor and say has "X" been spreading lies about me and trying to get me into trouble.
Manipulative plans tends to unravel under a heavy dose of truth.

[resolution]

May 14, 2016 23:03:13 GMT -5 tloonya said:

May 14, 2016 21:56:22 GMT -5 resolution said:

I have found a lot more peace and contentment in letting things go and not actively working against those around me.

Agree. However just a few month ago found out about people who are sociopaths...scary crap!

He goes to church telling the priest he has no sins so there is no confession needed for him.

However he tells his children all priests are child molesters and he sends 10 years old daughter to confess her sin...that she said she loves her mother and her sin is that she is a liar. Because she can't love her mother because she supposed to love her father...

Can you let those 'things' go?

Unless you are single alone person who has no one who cares for you...

If I were the mother in that situation it would need to be mediated through counseling, and if that didn't work and there was evidence of harm to the child I would divorce and get the best custody that I could for the child. What I wouldn't do was remain in the relationship for years looking for a way to get revenge or bring about his downfall.

At any rate, the OP is about a work situation and not about family issues.

[Shooby]

  I think you have to proceed cautiously.    Yes, there are diffiicult people to work with, who are trying to cast aspersions on you, etc.   I think that for the most part, you just go to work and do your job to the best of your ability.  You don't take the fall for them but neither is it necessarily wise to actively try to hang them.  That can backfire.  If they have their supporters, you could find that they mobilize people against you.  It is a difficult position to be in.  You could very well be painted as a snitch, gossip or whatever.  Sometimes people do shoot the messenger.  However, if that person works with you and was responsible for something that wasn't done properly work and tries to blame you, then of course you need to stand up for yourself professionally.  Over time, these people usually become evident.

[thyme4change]

I worked with a VP that was terribly unqualified AND mean as shit.  I called my boss and told him I was reaching my breaking point, and he told me to sit tight.  A few weeks later the CEO showed up in my town, called me into a conference room and asked me many pointed questions about her.  I answered honestly, and I knew what was going to happen.  She was fired a short time later.  

[Opti]

May 15, 2016 19:03:29 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

I worked with a VP that was terribly unqualified AND mean as shit.  I called my boss and told him I was reaching my breaking point, and he told me to sit tight.  A few weeks later the CEO showed up in my town, called me into a conference room and asked me many pointed questions about her.  I answered honestly, and I knew what was going to happen.  She was fired a short time later.  

I want to like this again.

[NastyWoman]

I have been known once or twice in over 15 years to tell someone "watch your back with X" (not my ex-> we never worked together) if I (1) trust the person I am talking to and (2) deeply distrust the person I am talking about. But that is as far as I will go.

[weltschmerz]

May 14, 2016 22:56:53 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

May 14, 2016 22:23:13 GMT -5 @aj said:

Yup, there are some cases where putting your head in the sand results in continually getting ran over.

A person many years ago screwed me over at work a couple of times, he was known for stepping on people to advance. One time he totally messed up and would have gotten away with it had I not made a person aware who had the power to get him fired.

I don't endorse such acts as a first option (or even 2nd or 3rd) but if you mess with my family, close friends or my livelihood I will take advantage when the opportunity arises.

Amen. I'm still gloating about one of the women who slept with my then husband getting fired and escorted from the bank, thanks to me. One of the others husband divorced her. If they suffered half the pain they caused me and my kids, good. Yes, my ex was also at fault but you can't screw around on your wife if women aren't willing to help out.

Also at fault? he was entirely at fault!

He made vows to you and broke them. He promised to remain faithful and forsake all others. He owed you fidelity.

The other woman owed you nothing.

[zibazinski]

May 16, 2016 0:31:53 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

May 14, 2016 22:56:53 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Amen. I'm still gloating about one of the women who slept with my then husband getting fired and escorted from the bank, thanks to me. One of the others husband divorced her. If they suffered half the pain they caused me and my kids, good. Yes, my ex was also at fault but you can't screw around on your wife if women aren't willing to help out.

Also at fault? he was entirely at fault!

He made vows to you and broke them. He promised to remain faithful and forsake all others. He owed you fidelity.

The other woman owed you nothing.

They both pretended to be my friends. I have no remorse at all. 

[kittensaver]

I won't go after someone directly - it's too messy and you lose your credibility when you are tangled up in the middle of a messy, open fight.

OTOH, I'm not opposed to tossing out just enough rope to let them hang themselves . . . which they WILL eventually do if they are in the wrong.

[8 Bit WWBG]

...:::"Discredit sounds bad... it's like the person is actually a good person who's working in earnest for the Good of the Company - but you don't agDiscredit sounds bad... it's like the person is actually a good person who's working in earnest for the Good of the Company - but you don't agree with them and maybe feel unfairly treated, so you are going to 'manufacture' some mud to throw at them or you are going to rile up a mob and head to Management with pitchforks and torches waving... ":::...

A fair question.  People like this NEVER think they are harming the business, and that they know better than all the people who have been around for a while.  For me, it is like going to high school and the superintendent's daughter is in your class.  Oh!  Look who got appointed to chair the prom planning committee.  Big surprise.  Fine, it's a committee and people have to vote.  Wait... I submitted a proposal, on time, but the committee chair didn't include it in the ones we reviewed.  Wait, the theme was already decided?  We didn't vote!  Oh... the chair had a private talk with the principal and they just happened to agree.

I may not have to do anything though, as a lot of others are getting tired of feeling marginalized and are banding against this person.  This person is also slipping up and overreaching.