Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Mar 25, 2016 16:14:06 GMT -5
The generic yellow flags are: reclusive, unfriendly, having company at odd hours, non-assimilating (e.g. appearance, dress, speech, culture indistinguishable from that of their country of origin, without any meaningful effort to adapt or conform), unwilling to be seen in the company of [people other than their background]. Oh, you mean like my German great-grandma? Or my sister's grandmother-in-law who's New York Jewish? Or my sister's white and raised Jewish brother in law and wife who are fringe Evangelicals who created their own church in their basement, idolize people who bomb abortion clinics, preach to strangers in the grocery store and openly condemn their Jewish family at family reunions for not believing in Jesus Christ? Or the really, really rich WASPY people at my yacht club who only want to socialize there with other rich WASPS and prevent any minorities from joining?
Gotcha. I will start to keep a very close eye on these potential terrorists. I'm on the job.
If I thought it was a great way to identify terrorists, I'd have said "Don't say I never told you." instead of "It's not much to go on." Also, if we're talking about Islamic terrorism, you can probably rule out your great grandparents and the "WASPy" yacht club.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 19:24:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2016 16:28:29 GMT -5
I do not understand the 'terrorist' panic. They don't kill that many of us. It is tragic when they do, but it is also tragic when countless other deaths happen. We spent how many billions of dollars fighting terrorism when that money would have been better not spent. How many American soldiers have permanent brain injury from fighting needless wars? How many have PTSD? Think of all the suffering that our war on terror has caused. Make the people responsible pay for their actions, but not a religion or a region. You cant wipe out hate with bombs. Let the people of that region immigrate to here and become part of us. The ones that want to cause trouble, deal with that when/if it happens. There is a price to pay to be a free nation.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Mar 25, 2016 16:31:35 GMT -5
I do not understand the 'terrorist' panic. They don't kill that many of us. It is tragic when they do, but it is also tragic when countless other deaths happen. We spent how many billions of dollars fighting terrorism when that money would have been better not spent. How many American soldiers have permanent brain injury from fighting needless wars? How many have PTSD? Think of all the suffering that our war on terror has caused. Make the people responsible pay for their actions, but not a religion or a region. You cant wipe out hate with bombs. Let the people of that region immigrate to here and become part of us. The ones that want to cause trouble, deal with that when/if it happens. There is a price to pay to be a free nation. I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who disagrees with this on YMAM--or at least the part about bombing the world towards peace.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 19:24:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2016 17:22:35 GMT -5
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 38,241
|
Post by billisonboard on Mar 25, 2016 17:30:21 GMT -5
It happened outside of Europe and North America so it is more of a reaction than a tragedy.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Post by milee on Mar 25, 2016 17:37:32 GMT -5
The sad irony is that this was the radical Muslims killing the Muslims that they feel aren't radical enough. So when someone suggests banning, targeting or discriminating against all Muslims, the nonradical Muslims get screwed by both sides. :-(
|
|
gregintenn
Senior Member
Resident hillbilly
Joined: Dec 28, 2015 17:07:59 GMT -5
Posts: 2,840
|
Post by gregintenn on Mar 27, 2016 16:59:26 GMT -5
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 19:24:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2016 17:26:27 GMT -5
next time there is a school shooting, how will you describe that installment? Those people represent themselves, no one else.
|
|
gregintenn
Senior Member
Resident hillbilly
Joined: Dec 28, 2015 17:07:59 GMT -5
Posts: 2,840
|
Post by gregintenn on Mar 27, 2016 17:28:16 GMT -5
next time there is a school shooting, how will you describe that installment? Those people represent themselves, no one else. You don't believe ISIS, Taliban, and other similar groups organize and plan this stuff? I find it quite different than a lone nut who shoots up a "gun free zone".
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 19:24:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2016 17:32:06 GMT -5
next time there is a school shooting, how will you describe that installment? Those people represent themselves, no one else. You don't believe ISIS, Taliban, and other similar groups organize and plan this stuff? I find it quite different than a lone nut who shoots up a "gun free zone". I dont think anyone says or thinks ISIS and the Taliban are a religion. Were you talking about them or about Islam when you referred to "religion of peace"?
|
|
gregintenn
Senior Member
Resident hillbilly
Joined: Dec 28, 2015 17:07:59 GMT -5
Posts: 2,840
|
Post by gregintenn on Mar 27, 2016 17:33:49 GMT -5
You don't believe ISIS, Taliban, and other similar groups organize and plan this stuff? I find it quite different than a lone nut who shoots up a "gun free zone". I dont think anyone says or thinks ISIS and the Taliban are a religion. Were you talking about them or about Islam when you referred to "religion of peace"? Are they not totally muslim?
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Post by milee on Mar 27, 2016 18:28:32 GMT -5
I dont think anyone says or thinks ISIS and the Taliban are a religion. Were you talking about them or about Islam when you referred to "religion of peace"? Are they not totally muslim? ISIS and the Taliban are terrorist organizations whose members are Muslim. Not all Muslims are terrorists or support ISIS and the Taliban.
How can you not understand this by now?
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 38,241
|
Post by billisonboard on Mar 27, 2016 18:44:52 GMT -5
Are they not totally muslim? ISIS and the Taliban are terrorist organizations whose members are Muslim. Not all Muslims are terrorists or support ISIS and the Taliban.
How can you not understand this by now?
Ignorance is not just what you don't know. It's also what you won't know. AronRa
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 19:24:13 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2016 20:52:53 GMT -5
I dont think anyone says or thinks ISIS and the Taliban are a religion. Were you talking about them or about Islam when you referred to "religion of peace"? Are they not totally muslim? Are the school shooters not totally gun owners? eta: just to be clear, I am completely 100% pro guns and pro gun rights. I think many/most (maybe all) gun laws we have now should be repealed.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Mar 27, 2016 21:46:58 GMT -5
Are they not totally muslim? Are the school shooters not totally gun owners? eta: just to be clear, I am completely 100% pro guns and pro gun rights. I think many/most (maybe all) gun laws we have now should be repealed. In fairness to Greg, he's asserting that Islam is the motivation behind the killing. In your example, the firearm is a tool that facilitates the killing. The two aren't analogous. The only question of any relevance is: Does the Qu'ran, reasonably interpreted as a holistic doctrine, instruct practitioners of Islam to perpetrate the kind of acts ISIS is committing? Unfortunately you're never going to get a rational debate about it on YMAM. My advice: Read the Qu'ran. Assess the degree to which it comports with ISIS' viewpoint. Assess the degree to which it comports with Islamic moderates' viewpoint. Consider which of the two interpretations is closest to what the Islamic scriptures say. Your conclusion will answer the question "Is Islam responsible for the bombing in Pakistan?", assuming the bomber did it in the name of Islam.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,246
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Mar 27, 2016 22:16:17 GMT -5
Are the school shooters not totally gun owners? eta: just to be clear, I am completely 100% pro guns and pro gun rights. I think many/most (maybe all) gun laws we have now should be repealed. In fairness to Greg, he's asserting that Islam is the motivation behind the killing. In your example, the firearm is a tool that facilitates the killing. The two aren't analogous. The only question of any relevance is: Does the Qu'ran, reasonably interpreted as a holistic doctrine, instruct practitioners of Islam to perpetrate the kind of acts ISIS is committing? Unfortunately you're never going to get a rational debate about it on YMAM. My advice: Read the Qu'ran. Assess the degree to which it comports with ISIS' viewpoint. Assess the degree to which it comports with Islamic moderates' viewpoint. Consider which of the two interpretations is closest to what the Islamic scriptures say. Your conclusion will answer the question "Is Islam responsible for the bombing in Pakistan?", assuming the bomber did it in the name of Islam. I don't think you need to read the Qu'ran to decide whether Islam is the motivation for the killing or the group who interprets Islam their way is responsible for the killing. Mainly because if it was totally because of the religion, it wouldn't be simply one sect doing it or even a few.
You can look at the bible and see why Catholicism has decided birth control is against God and why indulgences were sold at one time. And you can look at other Christian religions and notice how few followed either of those practices. To me it seems reasonable to conclude that it wasn't the book that was the issue, but the sect or organization that interpreted the book. .
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Mar 28, 2016 2:54:45 GMT -5
You can look at the bible and see why Catholicism has decided birth control is against God and why indulgences were sold at one time. You really, really can't. I'd love to see anyone make a scriptural case for either practice in the RD forum. I don't think you need to read the Qu'ran to decide whether Islam is the motivation for the killing or the group who interprets Islam their way is responsible for the killing. Mainly because if it was totally because of the religion, it wouldn't be simply one sect doing it or even a few. I've never claimed religion is "totally" the motivation; there are other factors involved. I also don't believe for a moment that the majority interpretation of scripture is the most defensible interpretation (or anywhere close to it). Mankind has a redoubtable capacity for reasoning around the obvious to suit his preferences, and like Christianity, the majority prefers to twist Islamic scripture into a "lite", liberalized, watered-down version of what the texts actually say. Just because the majority of practicing Muslims don't take Qu'ranic doctrine seriously doesn't absolve the doctrine. It bears heavily on the "Not all Muslims are terrorists." issue, granted.
|
|
Cookies Galore
Senior Associate
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 18:08:13 GMT -5
Posts: 10,892
|
Post by Cookies Galore on Mar 28, 2016 6:27:14 GMT -5
It was reportedly a Taliban splinter group that murdered those women and children at a Lahore park while they were out celebrating Easter. Absolutely horrifying.
Excuse me while I go vomit the next time someone whines about the "war on Christmas" in this country.
|
|
gregintenn
Senior Member
Resident hillbilly
Joined: Dec 28, 2015 17:07:59 GMT -5
Posts: 2,840
|
Post by gregintenn on Mar 28, 2016 8:09:03 GMT -5
Are they not totally muslim? Are the school shooters not totally gun owners? eta: just to be clear, I am completely 100% pro guns and pro gun rights. I think many/most (maybe all) gun laws we have now should be repealed. The repeal of certain gun laws would all but alleviate this problem. A "gun free zone" is the target of choice for these nuts. They tend to shy away from a target that shoots back. Islamic terror attacks are a more difficult problem to deal with. Like it or not, it's going to take some profiling and political incorrectness to deal with effectively.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 38,241
|
Post by billisonboard on Mar 28, 2016 8:37:59 GMT -5
..., it's going to take some profiling and political incorrectness to deal with effectively. Suspension of Constitutionally guaranteed civil rights (but only for some folks).
|
|