MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 22, 2016 11:21:06 GMT -5
I wouldn't push her to work. It's not like she is just sitting around on the couch. She's busy with work, extra curricular, and wants to spend time with her friends. Working as a teenager is overrated. They work some sh*tty job at a restaurant and probably get exposed to all sorts of sketchy characters that work there. I'd rather my kids participate in activities they enjoy, study, and then spend the free time doing things they want to do since you're only young once. If they spent from 3:00 to Midnight playing video games, then that's another story. I worked at a grocery store as a bagger then a cashier my junior and senior years of high school. It wasn't the best job ever, but it was WAY better than fast food or waitressing. Plus, there were so many other kids working there that it was easy to find someone to take over a shift if you couldn't make it. That allowed me to pursue marching band, chorus, track and field, key club, theatre... Plus I had some honors classes as well. I also found time to relax and/or do something fun with my friends. I pulled A's and B's both years. It can be done.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jan 22, 2016 11:28:51 GMT -5
If she wants to be a nurse she would be better off focusing on the athletic training (sports medicine anyone?) and trying to find opportunities to shadow/volunteer at hospitals. Nursing school is incredibly competitive even if she does really well at the community college she is not assured acceptance into a BSN program.
The athletic training will put her head of other candidates, so would any other volunteer or job shadowing experience at a hospital.
That would also be good for her to see if she really wants to be a nurse before investing the time and expense in a nursing program. It's not cheap even if she goes the RN to BSN route. A LOT of people wash out. Better to try it now for "free".
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on Jan 22, 2016 11:37:14 GMT -5
I think they are both valuable for a teenager. Extracurricular activities, particularly sports taught me how to work as a team, how to lead a team and how to stand out from the team. It also taught me how perseverance, practice and hard work can take me from mediocre to MVP- all things that have served me well in my career and life.
My job as a teenager taught me more about earning money in the real world, getting along with co-workers, what it's like to answer to somebody other than teachers and parents and most importantly finance. Getting an allowance is not the same as getting a paycheck. I learned how to do my taxes, better understood how tax brackets really work, all about payroll taxes etc. and became more independent and matured more than I think I would have without a real job. And, I had a pretty decent resume by the time I got out of college that showed more than just my grade point average and activities.
That said, I was never expected to work during the school year. My job was to do well in school and keep my commitments to my teams and activities. I started weekends-only in May and worked full-time, with overtime in June, July and August starting at 16. It sucked getting up early in the summer, but getting that paycheck was awesome! It seems like it would be really challenging to juggle a normal school day (assuming school goes until at least 3:30 M-F and 5 days week practice until 5), homework, activities, a social life and a job. If school gets out really early where you are, then maybe it's possible to do it all.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Jan 22, 2016 11:48:01 GMT -5
This isn't going to happen, because she doesn't want to do it, but I'm interested in your opinion, purely as an intellectual exercise. Given the choice between doing an extracurricular activity or working a part-time job, what do you think is a better option for a senior in high school? Depends on the kid, and whether they've worked before. I've learned, the hard way, that if some kids don't get early experience working a job, of any type, they overthink work. Don't know how to search for a job, how to apply, how to interview, things to do/don't do at work, how to dress, etc. The longer they go without ever having a job (thru college, even) the harder it is to get their first real job. Once they have worked a few part-time jobs they realize it's not as complicated as they think it is, and learn to deal with people and new situations. Of course, my kids have been involved in extracurricular stuff forever, so they've had plenty of that. If someone is encouraging extracurriculars just to look good on college applications, senior year is a bit late to begin. It really needs to reflect the kid's interests, not just be for show.
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Jan 22, 2016 12:20:18 GMT -5
The athletic trainer sounds more related to what she wants to do. But having a job isn't a bad thing. Would manager let her work like 4 hours a day on the weekend- and would she be willing to do that? Enough to make a little money, but not so much that it sucks the life out of her.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Jan 22, 2016 12:26:14 GMT -5
This thread has reminded me of a thought I have frequently about the kids...... why do we expect so much more of them than we do of ourselves? Sitting still in class longer than we can stand sitting still ourselves. Work 2 jobs or more if you count school as the first, actual job/extracurriculars as the 2nd and 3rd. I'm not saying they don't have plenty of perks and a much easier time than we do, but.... As always, some kids thrive on having a full schedule and some need more down time. Just like the rest of us.
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Post by mojothehelpermonkey on Jan 22, 2016 12:31:51 GMT -5
I had a McJob, a waitress job, and I played in the orchestra in high school. I didn't have much of a social life though. When I got my first lab job in college, my supervisors were all really impressed with my work ethic. After working in the lab for a few years and supervising a couple of other students, I understood why. Some of the other students who worked in the lab had never had a real job before. They were the kinds of kids that were raised to believe preparing yourself for medical school was more important than anything else, so they would blow off coming into the lab if they felt like studying was more important. My reasoning was that even though I was only getting paid $8/hour to be there, I owed it to them to show up on time and be willing to work hard while there. It wasn't even like those kids didn't have any work ethic. They would spend every free moment in the library. It was more that it just took a while for it to sink in with some of them that all of the studying they were doing was eventually supposed to result in a paying job, so you should take those seriously too.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jan 22, 2016 12:32:18 GMT -5
B/c if we don't make them do all that and thensome they will be no good lazy moochers! I walked uphill both ways in the snow barefoot to my 3 full time jobs AND still managed to get a 4.0 GPA and be captain of the cheer leading squad. Okay but seriously while working can be beneficial if she is truly serious about nursing school she would be better off talking to local BSN program admissions officers and finding out what she can do to make herself stand out and focus on that. And it's not too late. I am 10 years out of school and looked into the Medical Technologist program. They recommended I job shadow with Nebraska Med, it would put me ahead of others even new graduates if I c ould show I have spent time in an actual lab and not just the classroom. I got similar advice from other professional programs. I know the Vet school at the University of Iowa requires you do at least one animal husbandry internship before they will accept you. I talked at length with a friend of mine about the internship program at the zoo while I was in it. Anything she can do to put her at the head of the pack would be valuable. I know here the programs are getting so many applicants they limit it to 10-15 people a year, that's out of HUNDREDS of applicants. Waiting tables isn't going to make you stand out for nursing school. Besides you can't work during nursing programs anyhow, you have to be available to do your clinical rounds and labs. So she wouldn't have much time to work a job anyhow before it'll be crowded out by her nursing requirements. Yes that applies to the RN programs at community colleges as well.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jan 22, 2016 18:52:20 GMT -5
The only reason I know of to work is to earn money. If she has money, why should she work? The only way to motivate her to work is to stop funding life.
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quince
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Post by quince on Jan 22, 2016 19:21:22 GMT -5
I did not work in high school. I did choir, a couple of plays, and I even dropped out of choir the last few months of my senior year so that I could spend more time playing tabletop RPGs. I went to college with plenty of scholarship money, and got a job my second semester, and added a second job the first semester of my sophomore year, and balanced that with school just fine, despite being a good for nothing unemployed high school student. My husband didn't have a job until after college. He managed to be independent, working whatever came his way (locksmithing!), did peace corps, and is finishing his PhD while working full time at a start-up and being an awesome father and spouse. (Of course, he still needs to finish his bloody PhD.) Obviously, I do not think that working while in high school is a big priority. I might not explicitly prohibit my kids from doing it, though. We'll see 14 years from now.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Jan 22, 2016 19:28:00 GMT -5
Drama has a good point I forgot about. Nursing school admission is highly competitive today. You need to set yourself apart. A job at a restaurant isn't going to do it.
It's why my cousin went with one college over another. One gave her direct admission to the nursing school. As long as her grades are good she's guaranteed a spot in the class.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 22, 2016 19:29:44 GMT -5
I'd really steer her into nursing as opposed to athletic training. Nursing gets you a career. I have a second cousin still being supported by her parents with a degree in it. My friends daughter wised up and is going into physical therapy after getting that degree. It sounds like a fun thing to major in but jobs that pay decently are few and far between.
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beergut
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Post by beergut on Jan 23, 2016 0:33:14 GMT -5
Well, she's basically an adult. Let her make her decisions and live with them. When she has no money to do the things she wants maybe she'll get a job. Maybe not. Yup. Since she's not asking for money from you, I wouldn't even worry about it. Let Mom handle that conversation. I know you're trying to help and I really respect that, but this is definitely one of those "offer advice if prompted, but otherwise smile and nod" situations. If you REALLY want to help this girl, you'd have to get Mom to stop subsidizing her social life because you probably know that she goes to Mom for fun money, and Mom goes to you for fun money. Change has to be made from the ground up if you want attitudes about money and wants/needs to change. About two weeks ago, she wanted to go out to dinner with some friends because they were celebrating a birthday. She had already said she would go, but she didn't have any money. She came and asked me for $20. When I asked what it was for, she mentioned going to Red Lobster to celebrate a birthday. That's her MO, agree to go then ask for money from me or her mother, figuring since she already agreed to go, it will be embarrassing if she has to call back and say she can't afford it. I flat out told her I'm not subsidizing her social life. She goes right to her mother and asks for the money. GF gets upset and asks me, "Why didn't you tell me you already told her 'no'?" Because I'm supposed to tell you to not give your daughter money for social gatherings she can't afford to go to? That was when GF told 17YO that this would never happen again. I think my and GF's money attitudes may be incompatible. I'm going to see if I can send her to one of those financial workshops, and see if hearing it from someone else will help at all.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 23, 2016 1:37:37 GMT -5
Hopefully you two can find a way to work through this together. But does Mom really want to stop giving her daughter fun money? Or did she only say that because she wants to appease you?
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beergut
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Post by beergut on Jan 23, 2016 1:53:47 GMT -5
Hopefully you two can find a way to work through this together. But does Mom really want to stop giving her daughter fun money? Or did she only say that because she wants to appease you? I think she wants to stop giving her fun money, simply because of her theory of sibling fairness, i.e. if I give one $20, I have to give $20 to each of the other two, so I'm out $60. Plus, she works hard for her money, so I don't think she simply wants to give it away. I don't think she'd try to appease me over $20, like I said, she didn't know I'd already told 17YO 'no'.
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beergut
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Post by beergut on Jan 23, 2016 1:55:16 GMT -5
I'd really steer her into nursing as opposed to athletic training. Nursing gets you a career. I have a second cousin still being supported by her parents with a degree in it. My friends daughter wised up and is going into physical therapy after getting that degree. It sounds like a fun thing to major in but jobs that pay decently are few and far between. Quite frankly, I don't think 17YO is smart enough or driven enough to be a nurse. I don't think she is going to get the grades needed to get into nursing school. She has a lot of wants and desires when it comes to college and what she wants to do for a career, but the drive and the plan to get there is lacking.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 4:10:52 GMT -5
It'll come. I had two 17 year olds myself. One works for Coke. The other is in PA school. 17 is 17.
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on Jan 23, 2016 7:13:20 GMT -5
Yup. Since she's not asking for money from you, I wouldn't even worry about it. Let Mom handle that conversation. I know you're trying to help and I really respect that, but this is definitely one of those "offer advice if prompted, but otherwise smile and nod" situations. If you REALLY want to help this girl, you'd have to get Mom to stop subsidizing her social life because you probably know that she goes to Mom for fun money, and Mom goes to you for fun money. Change has to be made from the ground up if you want attitudes about money and wants/needs to change. About two weeks ago, she wanted to go out to dinner with some friends because they were celebrating a birthday. She had already said she would go, but she didn't have any money. She came and asked me for $20. When I asked what it was for, she mentioned going to Red Lobster to celebrate a birthday. That's her MO, agree to go then ask for money from me or her mother, figuring since she already agreed to go, it will be embarrassing if she has to call back and say she can't afford it. I flat out told her I'm not subsidizing her social life. She goes right to her mother and asks for the money. GF gets upset and asks me, "Why didn't you tell me you already told her 'no'?" Because I'm supposed to tell you to not give your daughter money for social gatherings she can't afford to go to? That was when GF told 17YO that this would never happen again. I think my and GF's money attitudes may be incompatible. I'm going to see if I can send her to one of those financial workshops, and see if hearing it from someone else will help at all. That's rough. If she doesn't have a job and no expectations to get a job, what else is she supposed to do but ask her parents for money? I think it's interesting that so many people have piped in about a job not helping get into college or nursing school, so she shouldn't get one. From my perspective, it's not about whether it will help you get into college or nursing school, it's about being able to afford activities, save something for college and perhaps establish a stronger work ethic that is motivated by a paycheck.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 7:31:34 GMT -5
I agree and I don't agree. Depends on the child. DS worked hard in his magnet program and his extra time, what little there was, was taken up "shadowing" and volunteering plus he was in a sport and a few clubs to "round him out." The magnet was hard and he graduated with over a 4.0. That got him into the college he wanted. He worked a little in high school but mostly he detailed boats and cars. Big bucks there!! Cash as well. Plus, as long as it got done, he could work it around his schedule. DD made other choices but she still turned out fine eventually.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 23, 2016 7:57:49 GMT -5
About two weeks ago, she wanted to go out to dinner with some friends because they were celebrating a birthday. She had already said she would go, but she didn't have any money. She came and asked me for $20. When I asked what it was for, she mentioned going to Red Lobster to celebrate a birthday. That's her MO, agree to go then ask for money from me or her mother, figuring since she already agreed to go, it will be embarrassing if she has to call back and say she can't afford it. I flat out told her I'm not subsidizing her social life. She goes right to her mother and asks for the money. GF gets upset and asks me, "Why didn't you tell me you already told her 'no'?" Because I'm supposed to tell you to not give your daughter money for social gatherings she can't afford to go to? That was when GF told 17YO that this would never happen again. I think my and GF's money attitudes may be incompatible. I'm going to see if I can send her to one of those financial workshops, and see if hearing it from someone else will help at all. That's rough. If she doesn't have a job and no expectations to get a job, what else is she supposed to do but ask her parents for money? I think it's interesting that so many people have piped in about a job not helping get into college or nursing school, so she shouldn't get one. From my perspective, it's not about whether it will help you get into college or nursing school, it's about being able to afford activities, save something for college and perhaps establish a stronger work ethic that is motivated by a paycheck. This!!!! Nothing replaces the experience of a real job.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 8:15:15 GMT -5
She should work Summer's of course. But I'm not a fan of jobs during the school year unless it's babysitting or other jobs that can be worked around school. Most school are very demanding work load wise. Sometimes there's a lot of homework which I always resented. I'd hate to work my job all day long and come home and do it all again. At her age, and at all the kids ages, since their mother works, the house should be clean, laundry done, yard work done. That's a huge contribution to the family and their mother. Her car should be washed and gassed up for her. My son even grocery shopped for me.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 8:17:32 GMT -5
Her grades and the classes she's taking should be stellar btw. Volunteering at a nursing home, even if it's for a few hours once a week looks good to any college. Those places always need help at meal times.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jan 23, 2016 8:27:37 GMT -5
I'd really steer her into nursing as opposed to athletic training. Nursing gets you a career. I have a second cousin still being supported by her parents with a degree in it. My friends daughter wised up and is going into physical therapy after getting that degree. It sounds like a fun thing to major in but jobs that pay decently are few and far between. Quite frankly, I don't think 17YO is smart enough or driven enough to be a nurse. I don't think she is going to get the grades needed to get into nursing school. She has a lot of wants and desires when it comes to college and what she wants to do for a career, but the drive and the plan to get there is lacking. Nursing is certainly not an easy course of study and it's very, very competitive to even get into a program. She'll have to have a really good GPA to be accepted. I'd suggest community college to begin with. Most have a two year RN program she could try to enter (it's really 3 years after you finish the prerequisites). If she can pull a high enough GPA in those prerequisite classes, she's got a chance. Once she has her RN she can either go on to a 4-year university for her BSN or get her BSN through one of the online degree courses while actually working as a nurse.
As far as mom giving her spending money, that's something that's going to be very dependent on communication between you and GF. If the girl asks you for money and you refuse, let GF know what happened, how you responded and why. Do that as soon as possible. That way, the two of you are on the same page. I agree the girl has to learn the real ways of the world or that same world is going to eat her alive. In order to teach her those values, you and GF simply must be coming at it from the same place and with the same goal. If you're not communicating often and thoroughly, this will just continue to happen.
At least, that's how I see it. Good luck! Raising kids is certainly no picnic!
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 8:43:18 GMT -5
Btw, if her grades haven't been that good up to this point she can emphasize she wasn't focused until she decided on a plan. Then she focused on what she needed for that plan. Even the best YMers didn't know at 17 what they wanted to be when they grew up.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jan 23, 2016 8:58:55 GMT -5
Btw, if her grades haven't been that good up to this point she can emphasize she wasn't focused until she decided on a plan. Then she focused on what she needed for that plan. Even the best YMers didn't know at 17 what they wanted to be when they grew up. Precisely, zib! Lots of times, a year or two in a community college helps a young person find his/her way; especially, if their grades, study habits, and lifestyle haven't been stellar. The first year of prerequisites will help them to see one can't play forever. If they fail, they can try again, having learned that lesson they needed to learn. My granddaughter failed her nursing courses the first time around. She learned. She went back and finished with honors. It's a learning time. Give them the chance to learn and most will reward you with success.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Jan 23, 2016 9:03:04 GMT -5
The 17 yo doesn't seem like a bum at all. She may not be making money as an athletic trainer, but it is like a job. It's serving others and not herself by playing on a team. She's worked a paying job before, so she has that experience already. So, she's doing school work and volunteering right now. Sounds like plenty for now. She can work for money in the summer.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 23, 2016 10:42:49 GMT -5
I think you'd be a lot happier if you removed yourself financially from the situation. It still floors me that the children have been taught to ask you for money but given their upbringing, perhaps not. I get with money given you feel the right to offer advice. For parents this is true but in real life, even though you are living there, you are not the parent.
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souldoubt
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Post by souldoubt on Jan 23, 2016 12:42:42 GMT -5
I'll tell my kids the same thing my mom told me - if you've got time to spend with your friends and you need money get a job. Doesn't mean they have to work 20 hours a week while balancing school and sports while in high school but they need to learn how the world works and the fact that life isn't funded by mom and dad because it won't be. I went to a CC after high school and was working about 24 hours a week while taking a full load and would work as much as I could during the summer. Every kid is different and some are more driven (thinking top of my class who had multiple extracurricular activities, worked, etc.) whether it's nature or nurture but most can deal with balancing a few things at once which is what you have to be able to do as an adult.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2016 12:46:35 GMT -5
We always subsidized our kids' high school social life. Their job was going to school and getting good grades. My son worked some for his grandmother beginning when he was fourteen, but we paid for their car, their car insurance, their gas, and pretty much everything else. My daughter wouldn't have thought twice about asking for money to go celebrate a friend's birthday. But we lived in a small town. They didn't go out a lot except to school stuff so going out was special occasion stuff. There wasn't a lot else to do.
ETA: None of their friends worked either. There aren't many jobs in a small town.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 23, 2016 12:50:27 GMT -5
We always subsidized our kids' high school social life. Their job was going to school and getting good grades. I hear this a lot. Yeah, that was my job too. It was a given that I was supposed to get good grades and do activities in school. I still don't understand why you can't do that and work 10 hours a week part time. School and activities don't take up all of a kid's time.
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