|
Post by ed1066 on Mar 29, 2011 19:12:44 GMT -5
Hilarious Henry! That's what happens when teleprompters attack!
|
|
Shirina
Well-Known Member
Card carrying member of the Kitty Klub!!
Joined: Dec 26, 2010 23:15:55 GMT -5
Posts: 1,200
|
Post by Shirina on Mar 29, 2011 19:46:11 GMT -5
Are you effing kidding me? He doesn't say "uh" any more than any other person would in a non-scripted speech. He didn't even let the whole 4 "uhs" slow down his speech.
I have to hand it to you conservatives - your penchant for exaggeration is legendary.
Of course, if you had a leg to stand on, you wouldn't find the need to do so. Thus, you have to invent criticism through hyperbole and exaggeration. It's really quite sad, in a way, because the desperation is leaking out of every letter of your posts.
|
|
|
Post by ed1066 on Mar 29, 2011 19:47:02 GMT -5
Are you effing kidding me? He doesn't say "uh" any more than any other person would in a non-scripted speech. He didn't even let the whole 4 "uhs" slow down his speech. I have to hand it to you conservatives - your penchant for exaggeration is legendary. Of course, if you had a leg to stand on, you wouldn't find the need to do so. Thus, you have to invent criticism through hyperbole and exaggeration. It's really quite sad, in a way, because the desperation is leaking out of every letter of your posts. Me thinks the lady doth protest too much...
|
|
henryclay
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 5, 2011 19:03:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,685
|
Post by henryclay on Mar 29, 2011 19:54:35 GMT -5
I wonder why she didn't attack anybody for videotaping her idol lying about his daddy , , , whichever daddy he was lying about. They were both 5 years old when the war started. And we have to remember one of them was a Kenyan. A British subject. I guess it was stressful in Kenya for 5 year olds back then. But I'm sure glad his daddy got the treatment he had earned during the war years, , , , when he came home., , , , wherever "home" was.
|
|
Shirina
Well-Known Member
Card carrying member of the Kitty Klub!!
Joined: Dec 26, 2010 23:15:55 GMT -5
Posts: 1,200
|
Post by Shirina on Mar 29, 2011 20:10:05 GMT -5
You weren't talking about that. You were talking about all of his fictitious "uhs" and your overblown imitation of him. Thus, that is what I commented on.
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 29, 2011 20:15:19 GMT -5
I got dissed for my Yadda, yadda..ok, I went along , made a change. Got dissed for my suggestion that all complaints of the POTUS are on the same plain , "Obama sucks because yadda, blah, bla...", and actually considered " well just possible I might be a bit much on those same type, being a bit unfair, just possible some of ed's, henrys , others complaints might just have a basis ...." and then we get the real import criticism , the latest..the POTUS said "uh" to many times, and any thoughts that I might have been a bit harsh ? Naaaaa, so to my conservative friends here....
|
|
henryclay
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 5, 2011 19:03:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,685
|
Post by henryclay on Mar 29, 2011 20:19:25 GMT -5
Wish I had more to give, but I simply don't. But here is another to share.
|
|
|
Post by privateinvestor on Mar 29, 2011 22:02:05 GMT -5
President Barack Obama predicted Tuesday that continued military and diplomatic pressure will force Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi to "ultimately step down." In an interview with NBC Nightly News anchor Brian Williams a day after he addressed the nation to explain his Libya policy , Obama refused to rule out providing direct U.S. military assistance to the rebels fighting Gadhafi's government. But he said that was unlikely and that his comments shouldn't be interpreted as signaling wider U.S. intervention in the region. "Gadhafi's been greatly weakened," Obama said. "He does not have control over most of Libya at this point, and so for us to continue to apply this pressure, I think, will allow us the space and the time to forge the kind of political solution that's necessary. Obama said that nine days into the U.S. action in Libya, "The degree to which we've degraded Gadhafi's forces ... has been significant." His comments came after U.S. ships and submarines were reported to have fired cruise missiles at Libyan missile facilities in and around Tripoli overnight. "Our primary military goal is to protect civilian populations and to set up the no-fly zone," he said, but "we're not taking anything off the table at this point." "One of the questions that we want to answer is do we start getting to a stage where Gadhafi's forces are sufficiently degraded where it may not be necessary to arm opposition groups," he said. www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42326264/ns/nightly_news
|
|
handyman2
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 23:56:33 GMT -5
Posts: 3,087
|
Post by handyman2 on Mar 29, 2011 22:33:35 GMT -5
Ah at last the truth is known. Seems Quadafi bought 70 million dollars worth of military aircraft from the US a while back and the US embargoed them so now he wants his money back. So if he gets knocked off we won't have to give him a refund. Seems he is helping to pay for all those stinger missles we sent him. Makes good business sense to me. ;D
|
|
|
Post by privateinvestor on Mar 29, 2011 22:55:23 GMT -5
Obama: 'Gadhafi will ultimately step down'
President won't rule out direct military assistance to Libyan rebels
Ok let's see if this happens or not..we have members of Obama's own party who are against military assistance to the Libyan rebels because so little is known about them, & who are they aligned with.
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 29, 2011 23:53:00 GMT -5
Supposedly they are having meetings to see who they are, to me I think the majotity are young Libyans who have had enough of gaddafi and the way he runs the country. I am sure there are some who are not friendly to the West either, but the majority, just want Gaddafi out.
As far as weapons and training, I would think anti armor type , small arms , mortars , and automatics might help, there is no way they are going to get heavy weapons, wouldn't know how to use them in the first place.
|
|
handyman2
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 23:56:33 GMT -5
Posts: 3,087
|
Post by handyman2 on Mar 30, 2011 7:46:24 GMT -5
I hope the US and other nations think long and hard about who they arm if any in LIBIA. What we don't need is a repeat of the Afgan situation where we armed them against the Russians and they became our enemy. Once is enough for that error.
|
|
|
Post by privateinvestor on Mar 30, 2011 7:56:00 GMT -5
I hope the US and other nations think long and hard about who they arm if any in LIBIA. What we don't need is a repeat of the Afgan situation where we armed them against the Russians and they became our enemy. Once is enough for that error. Hillary said NO Way, NO How, but Obama was ambiguous again or cautious, I guess about arming the rebels...my gut feeling is they are being armed by Iran but who knows??
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 30, 2011 10:24:01 GMT -5
I hope the US and other nations think long and hard about who they arm if any in LIBIA. What we don't need is a repeat of the Afgan situation where we armed them against the Russians and they became our enemy. Once is enough for that error. Hillary said NO Way, NO How, but Obama was ambiguous again or cautious, I guess about arming the rebels...my gut feeling is they are being armed by Iran but who knows?? If they are , being armed, it hasn't yet shown up on the battle field that I can see, and I can see Egypt or even the Saudi's getting involved, remember Gaddafi tried to kill the saudi King just a year or so ago, and hasn't been a friend to the Egyptians either.
|
|
|
Post by privateinvestor on Mar 30, 2011 10:40:49 GMT -5
Ah at last the truth is known. Seems Qaddafi bought 70 million dollars worth of military aircraft from the US a while back and the US embargoed them so now he wants his money back. So if he gets knocked off we won't have to give him a refund. Seems he is helping to pay for all those stinger missiles we sent him. Makes good business sense to me. ;D Handyman don't forget that Obama wants Qaddafi gone ASAP but just a long term strategy involving sanctions and the threat of war crimes indictment by our 44Th President of these United States is a joke. Qaddafi has been able to laugh for 30+ years with these restrictions placed on him.. Practical questions today to the White House remain unaswered about the Libyan operations including some raised by Dems but not the ones in Maine...?? Basically the big question on everyone's mind today is " how does sucess of the rebels in Libya equate with success of the USA?" Hillary said "that question is a good one and being looked at by the State Dept" Obama said "................."..
|
|
|
Post by Mkitty is pro kitty on Mar 30, 2011 22:40:43 GMT -5
So you're just reiterating your disingenuous point. People can still be behind him and see him as a weak/strong military leader (is Obama gonna micro-manage the troops too?) They're not mutually inclusive. Thanks for playing. Look in a mirror. There's one! Point? Has Obama comparatively taken more vacation? Y/N So how much vacation you take has nothing to do being a leader? Nice attempt at deflection, btw. This coming from someone who was warned about abusing the "report to Mod" button. That's okay, we know you really have nothing to say and that's your routine meme. And BTW, Rand Paul caught in absolute lie on national television, then repeats it? www.sodahead.com/united-states/rand-paul-caught-in-absolute-lie-on-national-television-then-repeats-it/question-1633245/"Senate Tea Party champion Rand Paul was on Lawrence O'Donnell's Last Word program last night repeating a frequently used political lie, the one that says Obama didn't get direction from the congress before agreeing to help the international community impose a no fly zone over Libya. The facts are that weeks before the President's action he was directed to take that action by a unanimous vote in the Senate." It has a copy of the resolution dated March 1st. Official GPO copy of Senate Resolution 85: www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112sres85ats/pdf/BILLS-112sres85ats.pdf
|
|
henryclay
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 5, 2011 19:03:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,685
|
Post by henryclay on Mar 30, 2011 23:06:49 GMT -5
Desi, I doubt that very many Saudis or Egyptians are going to flat foot it in a headlong rush to get over to Libya to stand in the human shield around Gaddhafi. I say that because as you pointed out, Gaddhafi's trying to waste the Saudi King recently is undoubtedly still a sore point to the rank and file Saudi. Egypt, not so much, but the love between Egypt and ol' Mooramar turned cold a long time ago and has never rekindled.
So what in particular makes you think they'll get involved? And to what extent?
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 31, 2011 0:28:22 GMT -5
Henry, I am thinking only possible arms to the insurgents, possible paid for by us, that was all. Didn't mean to give impression that Egyptians would support Gaddafi.
However, after hearing the report tonight , just a in country reporter, last name is Anderson, can't remember his first name, but has been with insurgents, and seemed to know military tactics, make up of a combat force and in talking to other reporters who are there and have experience, saying no more tops 1500 insurgents and effectives in the hundreds , all young , basically ones who were in the demonstrations that got caught up in the actual fighting, students, professionals, little or no military training and actually not even paying any attention to the few military who have gone over to the insurgents, when tried to tell, teach them the rudiments of combat, how to protect their flanks, hell tell them what a flank is, to learn to dig in, make defensive positions, seems their thing is, thep jump into a vehicle and go like hell for the front, then when Gaddafi's artillery comes in they go like hell away from it , after alway losing some more of their numbers.
If true the report, this is not going to work. The uprising, and I think , possible why you are not seeing a lot of Gaddafi's troops and commanders leaving, they know what and how many they are facing and even with the air taken away from them, they are adjusting, no more heavy tanks, personnel carriers, just vans and pick ups jerry rigged with automatics on the back, and the GD artillery that all grunts hate, that is unless it's coming from your side, then we all love it .
This is not good, not good at all if there is any truth to that reporters report.
|
|
henryclay
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 5, 2011 19:03:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,685
|
Post by henryclay on Mar 31, 2011 9:30:44 GMT -5
Thank you, desi. But now I am even more confused by your statement in #75 above. Can you reconcile that statement, (which seems to contradict itself, and is quoted here), with your last response? . . . . I can see Egypt or even the Saudi's getting involved, remember Gaddafi tried to kill the saudi King just a year or so ago, and hasn't been a friend to the Egyptians either.
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 31, 2011 16:14:03 GMT -5
Thank you, desi. But now I am even more confused by your statement in #75 above. Can you reconcile that statement, (which seems to contradict itself, and is quoted here), with your last response? . . . . I can see Egypt or even the Saudis getting involved, remember Qaddafi tried to kill the Saudi King just a year or so ago, and hasn't been a friend to the Egyptians either. I am sorry you seem confused , I think I re explained my thoughts, I , at the time , could see the Saudis or Egyptians being the ones to supply weapons to the insurgents, whether we paid for them or not, but this way our hand prints would not be on that action. They would be so involved because I think they wouldn't mind Gaddafi being removed, especially the Saudis and The Egyptians too. Now however, it's reported that the total insurgents taking a active role against Gaddafi and his forces is tiny considering the size of his, Gaddafi's , forces, army units and the mercenaries from Africa that he has brought in , thus they may not want to get involved. Things are fluid, facts seem to be coming out , thus not sure what is going to go down. There is no way a force that small, insurgents, 1500 tops and in the 100's not thousands active forces, that's untrained and undisciplined in things military , is going to over come a trained Army , even if poorly trained , the majority of them, Gaddafi's forces, armed with artillery even with out a air force. It just is not going to happen , especially in the terrain that is Lybia, no high mountain ranges, valleys to retreat to, hide out in, spring attacks when needed from, just not going to happen with out outside intervention. There will not be time to train these people to become a Army of liberation, bravery is not enough. IMHO.
|
|
thyme4change
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 26, 2010 13:54:08 GMT -5
Posts: 40,451
|
Post by thyme4change on Mar 31, 2011 16:39:23 GMT -5
Yes, and every word you progressives said about Bush was so completely accurate and never exaggerated a bit!
Every President gets made fun of. The fact that SNL doesn't even bother to make fun of Obama just means that the rest of us have to more.
|
|
thyme4change
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 26, 2010 13:54:08 GMT -5
Posts: 40,451
|
Post by thyme4change on Mar 31, 2011 16:40:35 GMT -5
(BTW - I always hated Bush, and I'm not that crazy about Obama - so I'm sort of neutral here. Each side attacks the smallest thing they can find about the guy in power.)
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 31, 2011 18:02:00 GMT -5
Guess I am slow today ratch...and thank you for the resident liberal but you keep forgetting , there is a real liberal here, one left in a huff over something inconsequential and I am a middle to the left ...but not sure what your getting at. ' As far as the type of weapons, to me that's about all , and probably to much, for these young brave folks to handle, especially in the time they would have to even familiarize them selves with them.
Example , suggest go outside your base , pick 250 young men and woman too, civilians, students, retail sales, semi professionals, , say 18 to 26 in age, off the street, throw a pile of ammunition and matching to the ammunition weapons in front of them and watch what they do and when they all have them, weapons in their hands, some ammunition, point out the front of the weapon, the trigger and after all the milling around, goofing off , playing soldier, possible take a few minutes on how to load the weapons, nice to know and send them up the road and tell them to defend a four corners some where. Then lob a dz mortar rounds at them, and get your stop watch out and time how fast they get back to the safety of the base, also count how many came back with their weapons , not having thrown them away so they wouldn't be identified as insurgents. That's kind of what we have there now , give or take a bit, IMHO.
The rest of the post not sure I understand the meaning of.
If you are suggesting there was some confusion in what to do here, I agree, it came about quickly, the threat on Benghazi seemed very real , immediately being over run and Gaddafi's threats against his own populace , so a lot of seat of the pants.
As far as the Military , Gates being very cautious, they can afford to be. It was good advice , but the only one to be held responsible if what seemed about to be played out did play out and the only one with the authority to actually give orders to either let it happen, don't get involved, listen to the advice , well meant I am sure, cautious and wise, and the slaughter would be on his head or give orders to try and not let it happen , work to get a coalition of other liked mind leaders together, all done in nine days by the way, so we would not be the only one, again, even in time the leaders of, again, and the fall out to come on what ever his decision would be, that was the POTUS, not the Generals, the Sec Of State, Gates, just the Potus, so he wavered, sent ambiguous messages as the thing played out , worked on the coalition, and then made his call
It was not not going to happen, a slaughter of innocents, on his watch, devil take the high road, not on his watch.
There were 700,000 civilians in that city, who knows when the blood lust would stop if unleashed, on his watch.
You and others want to criticize his decision, how it played out, it's easy, not on your head either. For me , gutsy call, no matter how it plays out.
So easy to criticize, the man knows his responsibility's as POTUS, this middle to the left , glad he is the one in power , in that White house chair and I think most POTUS would do the same thing , even Clinton, if had to make that decision again, knowing what he knows now.
|
|
Value Buy
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 17:57:07 GMT -5
Posts: 18,680
Today's Mood: Getting better by the day!
Location: In the middle of enjoying retirement!
Favorite Drink: Zombie Dust from Three Floyd's brewery
Mini-Profile Name Color: e61975
Mini-Profile Text Color: 196ce6
|
Post by Value Buy on Mar 31, 2011 22:15:02 GMT -5
Dezi, to keep the answer short, Ratchets is telling you that from day one, we were going to get more involved in Libya than the President said we would. In other words, we, the American public were lied to.
|
|
henryclay
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 5, 2011 19:03:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,685
|
Post by henryclay on Mar 31, 2011 22:47:48 GMT -5
What should the opening strings of music sound like as you stand and tromp the mud , , and end up in a quagmire of your own making?
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 31, 2011 23:32:58 GMT -5
Actually, I don't know if you will be happy here or sad.
Interesting thought in a way , as the feelings for this POTUS are such as they are, but there are reports tonight that he, Gaddafi is looking for a way out, even though his troops seem to be doing well on the battle field do to their superior numbers and armaments, according to CNN reports.
Now I don't know how correct they are, but to me, the reports seem to be some what upbeat , that no matter how the battle is going, the indications that the coalition is prepared to do more, in other words , it doesn't look like they will be standing down , and possible he realizes that the fate is really out of his hands.
There are wonderings about how many more of his inner circle are looking to change to the other side and get out while they can, seeing the hand writing on the wall. Or Rats leaving a sinking ship, whichever way you want to call it.
I doubt that, as was indicated by some, that his kids, who are use to a European life style of the rich and famous would be happy being stuck in Lybia for the rest of their lives , unable to really travel the world, they are soft, and may not wish to follow their father to where ever he will end up. If we see one of them cut and run, then you know it's over.
To me and most Americans if that is true , a great thought , but I am getting a different opinion by many here, seems the same few would rather not see that type of scenario play out, again the Obama thing.
For me with my life experience, if that is true, I will tell you, to feel that way, it really sucks, IMHO.
It is our people, air man who are flying combat missions every day, I understand we lost another plane today, and while one pilot was picked up, not sure yet about the other, and if one ejects from a plane , that is dangerous as hell, not a cake walk so they are going in harms way.
Whether they take fire or have to eject because of malfunctioning aircraft, the chance of serious injury every time one ejects is very high, so to be anything but supportive of all who are involved, from the actual ones on missions to the commanders , support crews handling deadly munitions, and the Commander in Chief and his people, in time of war, it is a war, they shoot at you, you shoot at them, it's a war, is disturbing to me.
Just my thought and as far as "he lied ", I don't remember a time line on this thing, a cost analysis on it, beyond the fact that we would not be the numero UN , out in front but a supporting role, a big one I agree, but I see no lie. He told why, his reasons, agree ok or don't ok, but he was as straight as he could as to the reasons, and if he isn't telling me what is going on behind the headlines, I really don't see where in a war I have a right to know , nor you either.
After it's finished , which ever way, you want to criticize, critique, well go to it, as Ratchets would say as a lifer and experienced and i am sure he would go along , that with all the planning , the thought out scenario's , once the first shot is fired, it's all off th table, and one has to adjust. Our military, it's very good at adjusting, so we'll have to see where it ends up.
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Mar 31, 2011 23:53:42 GMT -5
I am a middle to the left ratch..I am glad we got involved, I would like us to go after him and his, directly, he deserves it and we either get him or he realizes we are really looking for him and trying our dam nest and takes Uganda or where ever it is up on the offer to live comfortable, Uganda is not darkest Africa, it's beautiful there, or any other place he goes to, he will live a good life. I haven't read a huff article in weeks, and to be honest, until this plays out , I don't know how it will. Last night I was depressed when the suggested figures of insurgents were bandied about , no way they can beat Gaddafi's forces. Now reports tonight, possible the insurgents don't have to beat them, the fact that the coalition will not allow Gaddafi's forces to win completely on the battle field, they keep being worn down and Qaddafi realizes, this is only a matter of time till they get me one way or the other, 10 billion in the bank and my life , for what it is worth and my kids, OK, maybe thats the way to go, and if so, he better do it fast before his supporters realize he is thinking that way. Possible there are ways to win on the battle field , with out actually winning battles. You really didn't know were Lybia was? Surprised at you. LOL
|
|
burnsattornincan
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 23:05:21 GMT -5
Posts: 1,398
|
Post by burnsattornincan on Mar 31, 2011 23:57:49 GMT -5
Alright Mr. Ratchets, I recommend to stay out of it and let happen whatever is supposed to happen, naturally. Before all this dissent stirred up, that entire country just as practically the entire Middle East denounced the US. So to hell with them.
|
|
hello fromWarsaw
Senior Member
Hiya! Wake UP!!
Joined: Feb 13, 2011 1:24:04 GMT -5
Posts: 2,044
|
Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 1, 2011 0:09:01 GMT -5
We shall see, and Obama didn't lie. Have some patience.GD pubs anyway...they never stop...is Fox paying them, or are they all one now?
|
|
deziloooooo
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 16:22:04 GMT -5
Posts: 10,723
|
Post by deziloooooo on Apr 1, 2011 0:35:42 GMT -5
Well if you are talking politically, then I don't know deziloooo. If you are talking militarily, then I think you know the answer to that question - if you don't then go back and re-read the post. And also put some of your experience and common sense into gear and come to your own conclusions. You do post a lot about your own families history in the military, so I think you know the score at the moment? Can't win , insurgents, on the field , but politically, he , Gaddafi is not fighting for a cause, if they can find a out for him, hoping he realizes, there are 28 nations, small and hugh, out for him, take his ill gotten gains, and hopefully , go.
|
|