Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2015 16:37:45 GMT -5
I think it depends on the person and what their mental health issue is. People who are paranoid are not likely to seek mental health counseling to begin with. But people who have delusions may believe that everyone knows that killing a certain type of people is a good and fine idea, and might even want to join in. What else do we have to try? Or is sitting around whining about how these mass murders keep continuing while doing nothing at all a better option? Doing nothing is better then doing something bad just to be doing something.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 6:45:41 GMT -5
Here is something we should be doing a lot more: www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/10/13/wisconsin_jury_finds_gun_store_liable_for_selling_firearm_used_to_shoot.htmlGun store sold a weapon to a guy who ends up using it to shoot two cops in the face. "Oh, the gun store can't know that the gun buyer would be up do no good' Right? Sounds like the gun store made a brisk business knowingly selling arms to straw buyers. Hundreds of their guns had later been used in crimes. Maybe the 6 million dollar finding against them will make other sloppy gun dealerships be a little more diligent. We hold bartenders accountable for detecting fake ID's all the time - gun shop owners should be held accountable for signs of straw buyers.
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Oct 14, 2015 7:19:25 GMT -5
Here is something we should be doing a lot more: www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/10/13/wisconsin_jury_finds_gun_store_liable_for_selling_firearm_used_to_shoot.htmlGun store sold a weapon to a guy who ends up using it to shoot two cops in the face. "Oh, the gun store can't know that the gun buyer would be up do no good' Right? Sounds like the gun store made a brisk business knowingly selling arms to straw buyers. Hundreds of their guns had later been used in crimes. Maybe the 6 million dollar finding against them will make other sloppy gun dealerships be a little more diligent. We hold bartenders accountable for detecting fake ID's all the time - gun shop owners should be held accountable for signs of straw buyers. You think that this is not going to be overturned?
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Oct 14, 2015 8:26:12 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 10:10:43 GMT -5
Here is something we should be doing a lot more: www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/10/13/wisconsin_jury_finds_gun_store_liable_for_selling_firearm_used_to_shoot.htmlGun store sold a weapon to a guy who ends up using it to shoot two cops in the face. "Oh, the gun store can't know that the gun buyer would be up do no good' Right? Sounds like the gun store made a brisk business knowingly selling arms to straw buyers. Hundreds of their guns had later been used in crimes. Maybe the 6 million dollar finding against them will make other sloppy gun dealerships be a little more diligent. We hold bartenders accountable for detecting fake ID's all the time - gun shop owners should be held accountable for signs of straw buyers. Are you willing to hold that standard to the "fast and furious" ATF and hold them accountable?
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Oct 14, 2015 10:23:55 GMT -5
Hickle, You have some real mental issues here if you think that our government should be held accountable!! Are you willing to hold that standard to the "fast and furious" ATF and hold them accountable?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 10:49:39 GMT -5
Here is something we should be doing a lot more: www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/10/13/wisconsin_jury_finds_gun_store_liable_for_selling_firearm_used_to_shoot.htmlGun store sold a weapon to a guy who ends up using it to shoot two cops in the face. "Oh, the gun store can't know that the gun buyer would be up do no good' Right? Sounds like the gun store made a brisk business knowingly selling arms to straw buyers. Hundreds of their guns had later been used in crimes. Maybe the 6 million dollar finding against them will make other sloppy gun dealerships be a little more diligent. We hold bartenders accountable for detecting fake ID's all the time - gun shop owners should be held accountable for signs of straw buyers. You think that this is not going to be overturned? I don't know, my crystal ball is broken right now. But I think it's kind of amazing that they won the case at all, since the NRA pushed through their legislation protecting gun store owners from prosecution. Maybe the will of the vast majority of the country (including a lot of NRA members) is finally prevailing over the dogma of the NRA leadership.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 10:50:09 GMT -5
Here is something we should be doing a lot more: www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/10/13/wisconsin_jury_finds_gun_store_liable_for_selling_firearm_used_to_shoot.htmlGun store sold a weapon to a guy who ends up using it to shoot two cops in the face. "Oh, the gun store can't know that the gun buyer would be up do no good' Right? Sounds like the gun store made a brisk business knowingly selling arms to straw buyers. Hundreds of their guns had later been used in crimes. Maybe the 6 million dollar finding against them will make other sloppy gun dealerships be a little more diligent. We hold bartenders accountable for detecting fake ID's all the time - gun shop owners should be held accountable for signs of straw buyers. Are you willing to hold that standard to the "fast and furious" ATF and hold them accountable? Not sure what you mean by that. Does the ATF sell weapons to felons via straw men?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 10:53:57 GMT -5
Are you willing to hold that standard to the "fast and furious" ATF and hold them accountable? Not sure what you mean by that. Does the ATF sell weapons to felons via straw men? Yes the ATF sells weapons to felons via strawmen. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATF_gunwalking_scandal
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 11:18:16 GMT -5
Oh, the fast and furious thing. I imagine some people lost their jobs over that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 13:23:54 GMT -5
When will these nightmares end. With the elimination of gun free/kill zones ? Humans have killed each other throughout our entire history. Creating convenient kill zones for the sick and more aggressive is a nightmare indeed.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Oct 14, 2015 13:24:44 GMT -5
When will these nightmares end. With the elimination of gun free/kill zones ? Humans have killed each other throughout our entire history. Creating convenient kill zones for the sick and more aggressive is a nightmare indeed. More guns-more deaths. Meh.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 13:30:12 GMT -5
With the elimination of gun free/kill zones ? Humans have killed each other throughout our entire history. Creating convenient kill zones for the sick and more aggressive is a nightmare indeed. More guns-more deaths. Meh. More kill zones- more death. Meh. Are you naïve enough to believe that removing one type of killing tool will change mans behavior ?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Oct 14, 2015 13:32:10 GMT -5
More guns-more deaths. Meh. More kill zones- more death. Meh. Are you naïve enough to believe that removing one type of killing tool will change mans behavior ? You know what? I don't care any more. Everyone just shoot everyone else and be done with it.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Oct 14, 2015 13:34:19 GMT -5
More guns-more deaths. Meh. More kill zones- more death. Meh. Are you naïve enough to believe that removing one type of killing tool will change mans behavior ? you are kidding, right? if i don't have a wrench to tighten a bolt, a pair of pliers will be FAR more cumbersome (if it can even be DONE).
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 14:58:34 GMT -5
Oh, the fast and furious thing. I imagine some people lost their jobs over that. When you said you wanted people to be held responsible, I thought you meant legally responsible.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 15:00:57 GMT -5
With the elimination of gun free/kill zones ? Humans have killed each other throughout our entire history. Creating convenient kill zones for the sick and more aggressive is a nightmare indeed. More guns-more deaths. Meh. I thought there were more guns now then most of history and that gun violence was at an historic low. I thought the world was the safest it has ever been. There is much to be hopeful and thankful for with respect to violence trends.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Oct 14, 2015 15:20:51 GMT -5
correction: gun violence is not at a historic low. it has been largely unchanged for decades. suicide rates are up, homicide rates are down. but both are way higher than they were prior to the 1960's.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 15:34:01 GMT -5
Oh, the fast and furious thing. I imagine some people lost their jobs over that. When you said you wanted people to be held responsible, I thought you meant legally responsible. Generally you would need to show someone profited from their illegal activity in order to sue them Easy to show the gun store owner profited illegally. Pretty sure the ATF agents didn't profit at all, but if you think you can demonstrate that, then sue them.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 14, 2015 15:34:55 GMT -5
More guns-more deaths. Meh. I thought there were more guns now then most of history and that gun violence was at an historic low. I thought the world was the safest it has ever been. There is much to be hopeful and thankful for with respect to violence trends. Who told you that, the NRA? Sounds like their spin.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 15:42:05 GMT -5
I thought there were more guns now then most of history and that gun violence was at an historic low. I thought the world was the safest it has ever been. There is much to be hopeful and thankful for with respect to violence trends. Who told you that, the NRA? Sounds like their spin. Reason.com often says that violence is at an all time low. Not Reason.com but an interview in Scientific American. Are you saying that the world is not the safest in history? It is my understanding that the world, while it still has lots of problems, is the safest it ever has been and more people are living outside of poverty then ever before. I have read that many time at lots of places. I did not know what words to search for, -------- is a pretty good googler, maybe he will post something, not that I am asking for him to. eta: or were you refuting that there are not the most guns ever now? I just guessed at that, but think it is probably correct.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Oct 14, 2015 16:28:34 GMT -5
More guns-more deaths. Meh. I thought there were more guns now then most of history and that gun violence was at an historic low . I thought the world was the safest it has ever been. There is much to be hopeful and thankful for with respect to violence trends. Safe? Ever hear of ISIS, Al Qaeda, Boko Haram, the Taliban? How about Putin and Kim Jong Un? The world is not so safe.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2015 16:34:01 GMT -5
I thought there were more guns now then most of history and that gun violence was at an historic low . I thought the world was the safest it has ever been. There is much to be hopeful and thankful for with respect to violence trends. Safe? Ever hear of ISIS, Al Qaeda, Boko Haram, the Taliban? How about Putin and Kim Jong Un? The world is not so safe. link to help you understand what I said.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Oct 14, 2015 16:42:40 GMT -5
I don't need a grammar lesson from you. If you say it's safer, then tell me....safer than when?? During WW2? At least you knew who your enemies were. People didn't just plant bombs to blow up civilians. People didn't fly planes into skyscrapers. People didn't plot to blow up railways.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Oct 15, 2015 6:59:25 GMT -5
I guess it depends on whether you judge the world safer because fewer people are getting shot to death with hand guns, or whether you look at the broader picture and include people who are getting murdered through civil war, terrorism, starvation and disease caused by refugees migrating, tyrannical governments murdering their citizens, etc.
If you looked globally at the number of hand gun deaths, I would suspect that statistic would be lower because most developed countries have gun control regulations, and their low number of deaths from hand guns would skew the total hand gun deaths lower than, say, 50 years ago when there weren't so many handgun control laws.
Don't know, haven't researched it, just guessing.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2015 8:21:34 GMT -5
I don't need a grammar lesson from you. If you say it's safer, then tell me....safer than when?? During WW2? At least you knew who your enemies were. People didn't just plant bombs to blow up civilians. People didn't fly planes into skyscrapers. People didn't plot to blow up railways.
I am not sure what part you are not understanding. I said, "I thought the world was the safest it has ever been". Which part of that statement is confusing you?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2015 8:24:42 GMT -5
The truth of the matter is that for all the challenges we face, all the problems that we have,...if you had to choose any moment to be born in human history, not knowing what your position was going to be, who you were going to be, you'd choose this time. The world is less violent than it has ever been. It is healthier than it has ever been. It is more tolerant than it has ever been. It is better fed then it's ever been. It is more educated than it's ever been.
Terrible things happen around the world every single day, but the trend lines of progress are unmistakable.
President Obama
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Oct 15, 2015 8:51:09 GMT -5
Are you willing to hold that standard to the "fast and furious" ATF and hold them accountable? Not sure what you mean by that. Does the ATF sell weapons to felons via straw men? Yes!!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2015 9:11:17 GMT -5
Not sure what you mean by that. Does the ATF sell weapons to felons via straw men? Yes!! Its okay though because maybe someone was fired so the government was held accountable.
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Oct 15, 2015 9:37:11 GMT -5
A couple of people were fired, But because of their actions more than 300 people died. Let compare that with a gun shop that "MAY" have sold a gun to a straw buyer under less than perfect conditions, You know helped with filling the form. That happens a thousand time a day when people help fill out forms for the government free phone program or liberal voter registration.
So one act results in a $6,000,000 judgement, Over 300 acts that resulted in death and a unplanned early retirement.
Lots of justice served here
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