AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 9:51:23 GMT -5
Yep, bring back McCarthyism! While we are going after ALL Muslims, let's include the Catholics too! Nobody said that, either. We simply watch, listen, and learn. When there is a complaint by a peaceful muslim over something said in the mosque, we investigate. When you have a Hassan type in our own Army who rants in emails, and online, and carries a card that says, "Soldier of Allah" we investigate. We pay attention to what we find. Then we either act, or we determine it's not worth pursuing, but we ALWAYS follow up.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 9:54:29 GMT -5
But, when you find a group of islamists plotting to blow up airplanes, set off bombs in our cities whose aim is to defeat our government and establish sharia in the United States, you don't read them their rights. You capture them, turn them over to the military and they become POW's and war criminals for violating the Geneva convention acting as illegal combatants. We shoot them if necessary. But we have to immediately STOP treating these people as criminals. We have to treat them as what they are-- foreign enemy agents operating on our soil illegally.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 9:56:49 GMT -5
My husband has worked in muslim countries and with muslims. He hasn't seen or heard of what you speak. Then he must have lived under a rock....without going into a lot of detail or telling war stories again ad nauseum....that is absurd to say the least....in the Muslim Countries we were in they all hated us and wanted us to leave ASAP...and would do anything to accomplish their goals..
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 9:58:16 GMT -5
PBP, my point is go after the individuals, not the religion. Guess our politicians are too dumb to learn from McCarthy era mistakes. Yep, it does reek of that era.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 10:04:30 GMT -5
PBP, my point is go after the individuals, not the religion. Guess our politicians are too dumb to learn from McCarthy era mistakes. Yep, it does reek of that era. Yea but when McCarthy held his hearings about the Communist Threat to our country in the early 50s did we have any of our buildings destroyed by communists?? Did we have @ 50 bombing attempts in this country by communists in any one year?? Different times in the early 50s to today's Islamic Terrorism and that excuse is rather lame IMHO It came up in the congressional hearing last Thursday and was laughed at by the congressional members on both sides of the aisle as too irrelevant
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 10:08:22 GMT -5
No PI, same old, same old panic over different types. Go after the criminals, not the whold religion.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 10:21:59 GMT -5
No PI, same old, same old panic over different types. Go after the criminals, not the whold religion. Joe McCarthy's nemesis Edward R. Murrow said it best when he said the hearings that McCarthy held to ferret out communists in our government were done by a very sick and troubled individual who didn't know right from wrong...in other words a complete sham....I don't think Edward R. Murrow would have said the same thing about Peter King or his hearings last Thursday.... athough I am NOT in his league but feel strongly about this issue which we studied at BC in American National Government Class...and had some guest speakers from our Law School who were involved in the McCarthy witchhunts/ hearings
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 14, 2011 10:37:02 GMT -5
My husband has worked in muslim countries and with Muslims. He hasn't seen or heard of what you speak. Then he must have lived under a rock....without going into a lot of detail or telling war stories again ad nauseum....that is absurd to say the least....in the Muslim Countries we were in they all hated us and wanted us to leave ASAP...and would do anything to accomplish their goals.. "Note...whenever I use wikipedia as a source it is rejected by some of our Liberal Poltical Experts here....Oh well you can NOT please everyone all of the time or a few any of the time.." Well if they do , just tell them to stuff it, I use it and accept it fairly well , [and as you know a middle to the left type] especially for checking facts and information on a silly little chat zone as this one. If your information is off a bit, so be it, know one is betting the farm on what is posted here. Actually I haven't noticed these "Liberal Political Experts " making such objections, possible one or two but missed that and from your tone, I take it only "Conservative Political Experts " are welcome to express themselves as knowledgeable sources of information and interpretation of what is really going on on the political front. Better those others , liberals, in your mind , just move on and not take part in any discussions, what they have to say has little meaning to you?
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 10:44:22 GMT -5
Murrow would probably think King was a nut job too! I just love those that seek to vilify a religion, because a few of the members just happen to be evil. What I dislike about the Muslims, is their men walk around during summer in short sleeves and shorts, while the women are dressed head to toe in black. Otherwise, I have no problem with the religion. Chase the criminals, not the religion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2011 11:01:40 GMT -5
So now Israel will conduct some airstrikes and the bleeding hearts will scramble to call Israel terrorists, right? That's the way it usually works. Palestinian terrorists shoot off rockets, Israel does a quick airstrike, then news says "Israel attacks Palestinians, killing a child!!"
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Mar 14, 2011 11:31:28 GMT -5
a few of the members just happen to be evil.
that's where we disagree. i believe it's a large percentage, you believe it's a few.
I think we do agree that by being in America, we can disagree in peace and safety. ;D
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 11:40:36 GMT -5
I am not sure what Edward R Murrow would think of Congressman King...but if I recall correctly Murrow was a very well educated and eloquent conservative thinker for CBS News.. But he really took Senator Joe McCarthy to task and some claim that caused McCarthy to unravel and go off the deep end. McCarthy later died from alcohol abuse a broken and lonely man...seems to be some of that going around here lately as well...
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 12:10:36 GMT -5
PI, McCarthy didn't become an alcoholic because of Murrow. He became one because he couldn't not be one. Except for ICE, govt "police" agencies function adequately, if slowly, and do tend to catch the trouble makers. I suppose some of you would prefer to use tactical nukes on all the mosques. Sorta like the Israelis bombing the peasants with pitch forks. Without our support and arms, Israel would have to be a better neighbor. It is definitely time to stop supporting them.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 12:15:04 GMT -5
As I've said before- the purpose of responsible risk assessment of those that come from muslim countries where anti-American, violent islamic extremism flourishes- is precisely to AVOID labeling an entire religion and an entire people from being maligned. Deliberate efforts to separate the wheat from the chaff, the goats from the sheep-- serve the peaceful, legitimate majority of muslims here.
Failure to do so creates the very environment of fear and suspicion those on the left claim to fear.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 12:18:59 GMT -5
PI, McCarthy didn't become an alcoholic because of Murrow. He became one because he couldn't not be one. Except for ICE, govt "police" agencies function adequately, if slowly, and do tend to catch the trouble makers. I suppose some of you would prefer to use tactical nukes on all the mosques. Sorta like the Israelis bombing the peasants with pitch forks. Without our support and arms, Israel would have to be a better neighbor. It is definitely time to stop supporting them. I know he was an alcoholic before Murrow tore him apart but after that expose of McCarthy on national tv by Murrow ..McCarthy went to pieces from it and was never the same....I think he died shortly after that ..??
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 12:21:11 GMT -5
PBP, I think that means let the police do their jobs. I have no problem with profiling. Sometimes it is a good thing. If you have a crime spree involving young XXXX men attacking rich neighborhoods, you don't stop and question all men, just those who fit the profile.
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Mar 14, 2011 12:24:53 GMT -5
I am sure the people of Palestine feel justified, based on all the times they have been attacked. This is another area the US should just stay out of.
who's "attacking" the palestinians? shouldn't it be "retaliated against" or "counter attacked"?
isreal has been defending the "attack" that happened to them by a combined arab force minutes after they became a country in 1948 ever since.
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 12:28:03 GMT -5
Work, I think we should arm both sides equally and let them have at it. Then we can stand back and never interfere again.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 12:29:44 GMT -5
I am sure the people of Palestine feel justified, based on all the times they have been attacked. This is another area the US should just stay out of. who's "attacking" the Palestinians? shouldn't it be "retaliated against" or "counter attacked"? The US usually does stay out of Palestine....but for some unknown reasons our government is committed to funding them with millions of our tax payer dollars as part of some agreement with them. And to her credit Hillary Clinton has taken a hands off approach with the Palestinians and has let Netanyahu deal with them ...I think if she was to get involved in any Palestinian/Israel negotiations the Palestinians would tell her to bring tons of money before they come to the table...that was how Arafat deal with us and probably still true today with Fatah and Hamas..
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 14, 2011 12:45:27 GMT -5
PI, McCarthy didn't become an alcoholic because of Murrow. He became one because he couldn't not be one. Except for ICE, govt "police" agencies function adequately, if slowly, and do tend to catch the trouble makers. I suppose some of you would prefer to use tactical nukes on all the mosques. Sorta like the Israelis bombing the peasants with pitch forks. Without our support and arms, Israel would have to be a better neighbor. It is definitely time to stop supporting them. bluerobin, you make it very simple but it isn't. I have questions on many of their actions, their treatment and support of the Israeli Palestinians who are citizens of Israel, much less social and infrastructure support then their support of the Israeli neighborhoods, think the old Jim Crow days and community's doing the same thing to the Black neighborhoods, separate but equal, but they were never so. Also things done on the West bank. Yet they do know their opposition there better then we do , thinking our government , and definitely you and I. Israel , a home for Jews, is there for a reason. The Arabs will never ever accept them. Muslims in Singapore will be against them. They know that, yet they also know, with out a home for Jews , the Jews of the world will always have no one to look out for them. There are possible 12 million Jews in this world of us and you have to look at history, and history for over 2000 years has shown, with out a state of their own, they will be at times the scapegoats of the world , even where they are really not there. Thrown out of Spain, England, France, Portugal. Put in a separate hugh ghetto by the tsar, "Pale of Settlement ", pogroms in Germany, the Baltic's, Russia, and finally the biggie , though they were all biggies for those affected. For a small population, is there a populace of a single group who has contributed so much , positive, to the world as these people. They are going no where and if they ever are faced with their annihilation of a country, State, the world will remember that they were here, because I believe they will do everything , thats everything , possible to have that not happen, and the fall out will be horrific. They will not go silently, quietly , like sheep ever again.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 13:14:38 GMT -5
I am sure the people of Palestine feel justified, based on all the times they have been attacked. This is another area the US should just stay out of. who's "attacking" the Palestinians? shouldn't it be "retaliated against" or "counter attacked"? Israel has been defending the "attack" that happened to them by a combined Arab force minutes after they became a country in 1948 ever since. If you ever served along side with the IDF; you would have to say they extort retributions with force tens times that they have endured in Palestine and in Israel. Case in point, if Palestinians hit one of their vehicles with a rock they will respond with deadly force.....In Lebanon when an Israeli tank was hit by small arms fire they would level the building where the small arms fire came from. And even some of our Marine Commanders in Lebanon were shocked at the IDF's responses to their attackers....When asked; the IDF senior officers will say that is the only way to deal with their enemies..and believe me they are good at what they do and have to be that way in the Middle East after 60+ years trying to live in peace with the Arabs.
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 13:16:09 GMT -5
Dezi, it is simple. They cannot be trusted to honor any agreements they make. We should stop arming them, arm Palestine, and let them solve their own problems. We do not belong there. Notice if the US says we are not leading the way, no one else steps up to lead (example, Libya). We don't belong there and the Israeli's have brought us nothing but trouble from their actions. Time to stop policing the region.
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Post by privateinvestor on Mar 14, 2011 13:19:20 GMT -5
Dezi, it is simple. They cannot be trusted to honor any agreements they make. We should stop arming them, arm Palestine, and let them solve their own problems. We do not belong there. Notice if the US says we are not leading the way, no one else steps up to lead (example, Libya). We don't belong there and the Israeli's have brought us nothing but trouble from their actions. Time to stop policing the region. What do you think the UN has been doing in the Middle East ?? We are not the only country who has committed to Isreal and to the Arab Countries in that region...remember that trillion dollar word "OIL"...
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 13:21:34 GMT -5
PI, yep, I forgot about all that oil we get from Israel. We have enough of our own. All we have to do is stop exporting it and make a few other adjustments.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2011 13:21:39 GMT -5
Are you suggesting exterminating the Jews may be a good idea, bluerobin?
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Mar 14, 2011 13:25:35 GMT -5
Krikitt, no I am just saying we should not be friends with a terrorist nation. I despise their tactics "Never again, unless we do it." Their atrocities against their neighbors are not justified.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 14, 2011 14:34:23 GMT -5
Dezi, it is simple. They cannot be trusted to honor any agreements they make. We should stop arming them, arm Palestine, and let them solve their own problems. We do not belong there. Notice if the US says we are not leading the way, no one else steps up to lead (example, Libya). We don't belong there and the Israeli's have brought us nothing but trouble from their actions. Time to stop policing the region. ------------------------------------------------------------- "They cannot be trusted to honor any agreements they make." Your saying so foes not make it so is the old adage here. -------------------------------------------------------------- "We should stop arming them, arm Palestine, and let them solve their own problems." ------------------------------------------------ By that statement it shows you have taken sides, you feel the Palestinians are the wronged party here, and we should help them annihilate the Jews, because that is what will happen if they won a war here. I may have questions and criticism of some of their actions, hell Israeli's have questions and disagreements with their governments actions numerous times. They have so many political parties , even the Israeli Palestinians have representation in their Knesset [Legislature]. Israel is a dynamic Democracy, they have elections, boy do they have elections, noisy, wild ones too, power changes all the time, like here, but while ed and I for example , battle over who is who on some sides, we are both, I know this, are fully in favor of Israel has to be a Jewish State. By the way, after the slaughter of the Jews , if the Palestinian and of course the surrounding Arab States, they too would join in, won a war, there would be some survivors. I don't believe they, the surviving Jews, would be welcome to stay in the new Palestinian State, might be a few million left, would you want them to come here? They have to go some where, don't think, not sure here, but really don't think the Arabs would be allowed to put together their own , "Final Solution ", though as we see in the Lybia situation, depending how our people would be split over it, it might be moot , all gone, so would you welcome them to your neighborhood? Actually, we give them about $3 Billion a year. It is usually in military aid, it is ending by the way in a few years, and a lot of it is spent back here on purchases of our military goods. The latest seems to be the purchase of the new Jet fighter/bomber of ours, the F-35, thus we give then they spend so we get a lot of it back. The Israeli Economy is over 103 Billion, so the three Billion is helpful, but they could live with out it and the Israeli's have a robust arms industry, state of the art. We purchase arms from them actually. In fact they don't want our avionics/radars in their planes bought from us, the F-35, we are insisting on ours, they are not happy about that by the way , want their own, but finally agreed, they prefer their own, much better then ours from their standpoint also a lot cheaper too I understand. They have been our allies, only one in that part of the world. They help with intelligence, our forces train there. A new training area , urban, state of the art facility has been built there, almost $700 million spent, was a fraction of the cost if built in States, and we are training there with our troops there as I type as well as the Israeli's too. They have never wanted American troops to fight their wars. During the first gulf War we did send Patriot Missiles to defend them from the Scuds with American crews, their people hadn't been trained on the weapons, but since then, they have purchased batteries and they man the sites with their own people now. This is a allie that we can depend on, President come and go, but good allies, you don't change them as one does socks or administrations. Your comments of arming the Palestinians by the way is a perfect example of why Israel is there, the reason for, to trust anyone but themselves to look out for the Jews, as history has shown, the only ones that can be trusted with that chore, it has to be the Jews themselves in their own State.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2011 14:53:50 GMT -5
As I said--- people think Israel is a terrorist nation, even though it is tiny and surrounded with enemies that want to destroy it.
Question, then, to anyone else-- bluerobin wants to bail on Israel, arm the palestinians, and let the slaughter happen--- How about the rest of you?? Is it time finally to wipe out the Jews in Israel?
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safeharbor37
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Post by safeharbor37 on Mar 14, 2011 14:54:06 GMT -5
dezi, You'd better be careful. Keep posting like that and people will start to think you are literate and have learned to use Spell Check. [It's ally not "allie"]. But, assuming that you wrote that all yourself and were not quoting, I'll give you an Exalt. [Those who don't understand the strategic value of Israel to US foreign policy are just really, really dense and won't understand no matter how completely and simply you explain it to them.]
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 15:05:24 GMT -5
As I said--- people think Israel is a terrorist nation, even though it is tiny and surrounded with enemies that want to destroy it. Question, then, to anyone else-- bluerobin wants to bail on Israel, arm the palestinians, and let the slaughter happen--- How about the rest of you?? Is it time finally to wipe out the Jews in Israel? Israel is sitting on an estimated 200 to 400 nuclear warheads. They have a modern military capable of massive destruction. If Israel is an oppressor, they're pretty bad at it. A person is a damn fool that believes that if the same arsenal were in the hands of the Palestinians there would not be a firey bloodbath in the middle east. Israel is the lone stable, prosperous, peaceful democracy in a chaotic, unstable, violent middle east.
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