AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 12, 2011 3:42:36 GMT -5
Just got in from game night with friends. Friend's new girl is of Pakistani and Indian descent. We got into a conversation about the meanings of some common names mean and where they "rank" in the socio-economic layers there. There was some back and forth and some looking stuff up and another friend who is a liberal said, "Jeeze, I know more about your culture than you do!" and I've already given the punchline in the subject...she didn't hesitate, she didn't flinch, she didn't stutter- just came right out and said, "That's not MY culture. I'm an AMERICAN." Cheers and toasts followed, fun was had by most...
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Post by Mkitty is pro kitty on Mar 12, 2011 15:05:46 GMT -5
Jpegs or it didn't happen. [Makes up a story about my derpy Conservative friend].
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 12, 2011 15:50:48 GMT -5
It was hilarious- she was so quick, so razor sharp with the point that (figuratively speaking- so we don't freak out a couple of certain liberals here) my liberal friend who set out to one up her and show how smart and well-informed he was lay minced in a pool of his own blood. Sometimes- most of the time, actually- liberals are so blinded by their worldview-- in this case myriad multicultural myths, white liberal guilt, and the need to be seen as understanding of those who have different colored skin because no brown skinned person could possibly be an unabashed, happy, fully assimilated, re blooded American-- that they miss the obvious simplicity of the greatness of this country.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2011 16:11:35 GMT -5
But all muslims are terrrorists...
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Mad Dawg Wiccan
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Post by Mad Dawg Wiccan on Mar 12, 2011 16:16:45 GMT -5
Why do you assume the girl in question is a Muslim?
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ugonow
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Post by ugonow on Mar 12, 2011 16:57:00 GMT -5
I have a conservative friend that would have never let her in his door.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2011 17:00:51 GMT -5
Mad.... I take exception to Paul's "liberals are so blinded by their worldview... because no brown skinned person could possibly be an unabashed, happy, fully assimilated, re blooded American..."
When he takes an awfully hard line, one could suggest he is even 'blinded in his worldview'... when discussing Muslim Americans... he finds it impossible to believe they could also put their status as Americans first and feel happy and assimilated...
Following his many trains of thought are simply exhausting....
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burnsattornincan
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Post by burnsattornincan on Mar 12, 2011 17:37:34 GMT -5
Following his many trains of thought are simply exhausting....
Well I'm wide awake and ready for his next train of thought. He sounds like a good hard working tax paying real American to me.
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Post by ed1066 on Mar 12, 2011 19:51:06 GMT -5
LOL! Can't keep up with the message board? Maybe some rest and relaxation is what you need...
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 12, 2011 20:46:24 GMT -5
Mad.... I take exception to Paul's "liberals are so blinded by their worldview... because no brown skinned person could possibly be an unabashed, happy, fully assimilated, re blooded American..." When he takes an awfully hard line, one could suggest he is even 'blinded in his worldview'... when discussing Muslim Americans... he finds it impossible to believe they could also put their status as Americans first and feel happy and assimilated... Following his many trains of thought are simply exhausting.... Actually oped , to me, the trains of thoughts of his are very few , not many, same old , same old with a ocasionaly a little, very little twist to them, but always, basic , same old , same old when you step back and really look at his ideas.
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Shirina
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Post by Shirina on Mar 13, 2011 13:22:55 GMT -5
While this girl may indeed be clever and quick of wit, your example does not show it. What she said has been a standard response said by immigrants since time immemorial. I think your enjoyment of this anecdote comes from the fact that it was used against a liberal and nothing more. I've seen it used more often against conservatives, to be honest, especially against that special breed of conservative who believes in the supremacy of a certain race.
Not only does this prove the point I made in my first paragraph, I got a big chuckle out of your over-the-top melodramatic prose. You make it sound as if she hit your friend with the Zing of the Century, but it wasn't.
Your pointless "attack" on liberals in this thread is a result of your own blindness. I've noticed many times where conservatives criticize liberals for traits that the majority of liberals do not exhibit, instead focusing on a tiny percentage of extremists and believing all liberals behave that way. Even more so, they love telling us what liberals think.
In essence, it's one enormous strawman.
If you build a house out of 3 boards, 5 nails, and 1 cinder block, you'll find that 99% of your house was built out of imagination - much like your post.
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Post by Shirina on Mar 13, 2011 16:28:57 GMT -5
No, I don't have to admit it.
In fact, the OP needs to prove two things:
1) That this particular liberal's behavior is indicative of all liberal behavior in general,
and
2) That this particular liberal's behavior was a direct result of him being liberal
Thus far, neither have been proven by any stretch, yet the OP went on to rant against liberals, providing some baseless armchair psychiatry to boot, without first proving the original premise. This, of course, makes everything said thus far all fluff and no substance.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Mar 13, 2011 16:42:48 GMT -5
...yet the OP went on to rant against liberals, providing some baseless armchair psychiatry to boot, without first proving the original premise. This, of course, makes everything said thus far all fluff and no substance. which is generally par for the course with Paul.
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Shirina
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Post by Shirina on Mar 13, 2011 19:31:06 GMT -5
I don't normally write "me too" agreement posts, but I will in this case because of how strongly I agree with it. and a karma to go with it.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 10:00:03 GMT -5
Well, you have to admit, it's condescension in the form of "liberal" thought. Kind of like the person who asks a Chinese person when their family immigrated and is told, "1858." Liberals never admit anything. They are like Cubs fans. Over a century of failure in dozens of countries all over the world, and they're still saying the same old things: America is imperialistic, racist, biggoted, homophobic, sexist, blah, blah, blah, blah... And what we need is a more "fair" and "equitable" society. And it'll work "this time". All they need is more money, and more power. Why, if we just put them in charge of everything and give them all our money, they will establish a glorious utopia for all. And it drives them absolutely batty to meet one of their would-be allies in the cause-- an oppressed minority-- who is a proud American.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 10:03:31 GMT -5
No, I don't have to admit it. In fact, the OP needs to prove two things: 1) That this particular liberal's behavior is indicative of all liberal behavior in general, and 2) That this particular liberal's behavior was a direct result of him being liberal Thus far, neither have been proven by any stretch, yet the OP went on to rant against liberals, providing some baseless armchair psychiatry to boot, without first proving the original premise. This, of course, makes everything said thus far all fluff and no substance. A person's behavior is indicative of their core beliefs. Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. A tree produces fruit after its own kind. If you plant an apple tree- you get apples. I don't have to prove something that is self-evident.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2011 10:04:54 GMT -5
Indians are very smart and sharp. Our friend Chessplayer immediately comes to mind.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 10:12:07 GMT -5
Interestingly enough LBJ remarked about the civil rights act (and this is very well documented), "I'll have them ni**ers voting Democrat for 200 years"
I just posted this for fun. It's not precisely on the topic of my friend's massive multiculturalism FAIL.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2011 11:15:20 GMT -5
hhmmm..... just like my 3rd gen Mexican American in-law kids are 100% American, have nothing to do with the bullshit in Mexico, and are as mad as anyone else about the border issues. THAT is being an American-- not walking around with viva aztlan t-shirts. Can be switched to fit any culture. Being an American does not mean planting yourself in an isolated neighborhood full of people just like you, never stepping outside your comfort zone, and maintaining your foreign identity only with American society benefits. The problem comes from not assimilating in to our society, but choosing, instead, to isolate from, and even condemn it. People like that don't love our country, they just come to TAKE from us.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Mar 14, 2011 11:19:01 GMT -5
Mad.... I take exception to Paul's "liberals are so blinded by their worldview... because no brown skinned person could possibly be an unabashed, happy, fully assimilated, re blooded American..." When he takes an awfully hard line, one could suggest he is even 'blinded in his worldview'... when discussing Muslim Americans... he finds it impossible to believe they could also put their status as Americans first and feel happy and assimilated... Following his many trains of thought are simply exhausting.... I felt the same way reading this. I am so confused on why several conservatives on this board feel that muslims cannot be trusted & aren't real americans, yet PBP is trying to prove some point with the discovery of an american with a different heritage. Frankly, I am a little confused as to what PBP is trying to even prove. I've never seen liberals insist that people don't assimilate & become american. Our entire history is based on people from all cultures coming to this country & becoming americans. If anything, I think this backs the general liberal idea that people of all cultures should be allowed to come to america. This is why I think it is ok that we have mexicans & muslims coming to the US - it is the conservatives that tend to get their panties in a bunch over immigration. It just seems like PBP is supporting liberal ideology while attempting to make an anti-liberal post. But, I'll take PBP supporting thes ideas, even if it means he somehow thinks he is proving liberals wrong.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 14, 2011 12:10:40 GMT -5
Interestingly enough LBJ remarked about the civil rights act (and this is very well documented), "I'll have them ni**ers voting Democrat for 200 years" I just posted this for fun. It's not precisely on the topic of my friend's massive multiculturalism FAIL. I took out the Youtube video from the quote. It's up there in palmbeachpaul's post. What fails to be mentioned is congress's voting on the 1964 Civil Rights Act was not a democrats/republican issue but a North and South issue: Note: "Southern", as used in this section, refers to members of Congress from the eleven states that made up the Confederate States of America in the American Civil War. "Northern" refers to members from the other 39 states, regardless of the geographic location of those states. The original House version: Southern Democrats: 7–87 (7%–93%) Southern Republicans: 0–10 (0%–100%) Northern Democrats: 145-9 (94%–6%) Northern Republicans: 138-24 (85%–15%) The Senate version: Southern Democrats: 1–20 (5%–95%) Southern Republicans: 0–1 (0%–100%) Northern Democrats: 45-1 (98%–2%) Northern Republicans: 27-5 (84%–16%) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#Vote_totalsIf you want a different spin, percentage wise, more southern democrats voted for the 1964 Civil Rights Act than republicans. No southern republicans supported it at all. The same hold true for northern democrats versus republicans. It was all about civil rights for blacks. The north supported and voted for the Civil Rights Act and the south did not.
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Small Biz Owner
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Post by Small Biz Owner on Mar 14, 2011 12:26:38 GMT -5
Reminds me of anyone who asks my political party. My response is always the same. "American"
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Shirina
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Post by Shirina on Mar 14, 2011 13:00:31 GMT -5
LOL @ people who unwittingly argue my case for me.
From my own post earlier in this thread:
See what I mean?
The only thing self-evident about your post is your fallacious accusation.
In your case, the specific fallacy is called semen hoc ergo propter hoc, which states that if A and B occur together, one must cause the other. In this case, a social faux pas was made by a liberal, and because both the faux pas and liberalism occurred together, liberalism must've caused the faux pas. You haven't proven that, any more than you can prove that your friend's liberalism caused him to stub his toe or have a car accident.
On top of it all, trying to claim that the proof is self-evident is disingenuous. In fact, it's just another logical fallacy called petitio principii where the conclusion of an argument is assumed in the premise.
So, as I originally said, you still have to prove that:
1) The behavior of this particular liberal is indicative of all liberals
and
2) That the behavior of this particular liberal was directly caused by his liberalism
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Post by ed1066 on Mar 14, 2011 13:06:52 GMT -5
Got that Paul, you HAVE to prove it! Our latin-googling resident philosopher insists...
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Shirina
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Post by Shirina on Mar 14, 2011 13:15:23 GMT -5
Paul doesn't have to prove anything, but if he doesn't, we'll all know that his original point was simply rubbish. I'm sure he wouldn't want that to happen, yes?
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 15:43:41 GMT -5
Oh, Shirina...It probably bothers you that conservatives not only know what we believe, but we know what you liberals believe. We often know all of your arguments better than you do.
Far from being "rubbish", the OP was simply an example of a smug liberal who made what he believed to be a brilliant poin, and instead got destroyed by a nice young, beautiful 20 something "brown girl whose parents are from Pakistan" (her words, not mine) who spoke a simple truth: her culture is the American culture. There's no room for "multiculturalism" in her life.
Now, multiculturalism isn't a conservative concept-- and perhaps not ALL liberals embrace it, but let's be real here-- it's a major influential concept over on the left. I woud suggest that if you're attempting to deny that multiculturalism, notions of American imperialism, and thoughts about how sad it is that so few Americans speak another language, know much about other cultures, and have so little appreciation for other cultures-- is not a dominant set of ideas on the left-- then you're the one that's got to do the proving.
You're a perfect example of what I was talking about on another thread when I was explaining why I participate on a purely right wing site from time to time. You are attempting to start a conversation where I am somehow responsible for going all the way back and proving that the earth rotates around the sun, and not the other way around.
Some things just "are". That the left embraces ideas of American imperialism, and multiculturalism isn't something that requires "proof". It's proven. It's self-evident. It just "is". And no, I'm not going to explain what the meaning of "is" is because you're having problems with that, too.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Mar 14, 2011 16:10:15 GMT -5
Actually, I believe you & several others on this board have proven time & time again that you have no idea what liberals believe.
This thread alone is an example. You seem to think that somehow you have proven something to liberals by having found someone of a different heritage that considers themselves an american. I know lots of people with different heritages that consider themselves american, so I fail to see what you think you are proving.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Mar 14, 2011 21:08:31 GMT -5
hhmmm..... just like my 3rd gen Mexican American in-law kids are 100% American, have nothing to do with the bullshit in Mexico, and are as mad as anyone else about the border issues. THAT is being an American-- not walking around with viva aztlan t-shirts. Can be switched to fit any culture. Being an American does not mean planting yourself in an isolated neighborhood full of people just like you, never stepping outside your comfort zone, and maintaining your foreign identity only with American society benefits. The problem comes from not assimilating in to our society, but choosing, instead, to isolate from, and even condemn it. People like that don't love our country, they just come to TAKE from us. If they are citizens, legally here, working people, how they wish to live their lives here, isn't that their right? I think some where in that great constitution of ours all those rights of free choice , how one chooses to live their lives is spelled out with protections so others can't force them to live differently. Their choice....yet your saying now, they have to live their lives as you would like them to do so?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Mar 15, 2011 8:34:57 GMT -5
I have a conservative friend that would have never let her in his door. You actually have a "conservative friend"?
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Politically_Incorrect12
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Post by Politically_Incorrect12 on Mar 15, 2011 8:45:08 GMT -5
I have a conservative friend that would have never let her in his door. You actually have a "conservative friend"? I doubt the poster has a friend that speaks about the racist idea the poster claims.
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