Kitchen remodel

[sesfw]

Yuck .....

Just had the second contractor give us an estimate on a kitchen remodel ....... Bottom end $25K without appliances. More than likely closer to $35K  Wednesday the cabinet maker will be here and we'll get a final price.

The range and microwave will be close to $2500 ....... Sticker shock .....

[Ombud]

Wow. Mine are birch. Guess I'll just refinish

[garion2003]

I'm planning a gut and remodel of a small kitchen and adjacent bath in an old house. New appliances - $4,000. Cabinets/sinks total: $12,000. Construction etc: $35,000

sigh.

[The Captain]

Pffth.  I wish.

[Wisconsin Beth]

My Mom just finished up her kitchen remodel.  I think the final cost is around $28K, give or take a bit.  $13K was for her new cabinets and I think her appliances ran around $2500 but she kept her old stove - as it's only about 5 years old. 

Mom went down to studs on 1 wall, removed part of a wall, moved her sink and gas lines, added lots of electrical outlets and under cabinet lighting.  They'd updated the electrical panel in the basement previously so that was already done.  Mom also got about 3x the cabinet space she had previously.  I think she went with Corian for her countertops.  The new table sucks though.  Gonna nag her into returning that.  It wobbles and feels very insecure. 

[hoops902]

Seeing all this is just a reminder of how cheap I am lol. I took our kitchen down to studs, blew out some walls, moved other walls back, redid all the electrical, plumbing, etc and spent less than $10k including new appliances.  And after all that, all my wife can remember is that I didn't put in a dishwasher (done when I owned the home before we got married, I didn't get many dishes dirty). 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

We are redoing the kitchen piecemeal.  The counters, back splash and sink/faucets is done.  Next on the list is either appliances or replacing the cabinet doors/drawers.  I suspect that appliances are going to come first for this because our dishwasher is gasping.  The cabinets are solid maple, made by a local craftsman.  He also made all the built ins that we have in the house in the kitchen and bathroom so our intention is to go to him to make doors in the same style as those in the rest of the house.  I suspect between these 2, it'll be easily another $15K.

After hitting every furniture store on this side of the Cascades, we found bar stools when we were in KY last month.  There is a local furniture store that is a conduit for Amish furniture.  4 bar stools in unstained, finished cherry cost about $900, and it looks like it's going to cost $600 to ship them to WA.  This brings the cost/stool under $400 for what we want in solid wood that will go with the style of the house....which seems high.  But $150/stool is cheap and looks it and we weren't about to pay $1400/stool for the ones we liked. 

[garion2003]

Aug 11, 2015 8:46:30 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

My Mom just finished up her kitchen remodel.  I think the final cost is around $28K, give or take a bit.  $13K was for her new cabinets and I think her appliances ran around $2500 but she kept her old stove - as it's only about 5 years old. 

Mom went down to studs on 1 wall, removed part of a wall, moved her sink and gas lines, added lots of electrical outlets and under cabinet lighting.  They'd updated the electrical panel in the basement previously so that was already done.  Mom also got about 3x the cabinet space she had previously.  I think she went with Corian for her countertops.  The new table sucks though.  Gonna nag her into returning that.  It wobbles and feels very insecure. 

That's good to know. I am going down to studs on all walls, new floors too. Moving sink and gas lines, new lighting and all new appliances (adding a dishwasher). Will be tons of storage, as also adding a peninsula. Heating is being redone separately (existing furnace does not work!).

[Wisconsin Beth]

Aug 11, 2015 12:51:10 GMT -5 garion2003 said:

Aug 11, 2015 8:46:30 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

My Mom just finished up her kitchen remodel.  I think the final cost is around $28K, give or take a bit.  $13K was for her new cabinets and I think her appliances ran around $2500 but she kept her old stove - as it's only about 5 years old. 

Mom went down to studs on 1 wall, removed part of a wall, moved her sink and gas lines, added lots of electrical outlets and under cabinet lighting.  They'd updated the electrical panel in the basement previously so that was already done.  Mom also got about 3x the cabinet space she had previously.  I think she went with Corian for her countertops.  The new table sucks though.  Gonna nag her into returning that.  It wobbles and feels very insecure. 

That's good to know. I am going down to studs on all walls, new floors too. Moving sink and gas lines, new lighting and all new appliances (adding a dishwasher). Will be tons of storage, as also adding a peninsula. Heating is being redone separately (existing furnace does not work!).

Yeah, Mom and Dad had insulation blown down the walls a couple of years ago.  I think that's the main reason the workers did as little as possible to the 2 outer walls.  The 3rd wall is the living room-kitchen wall.  It's got the fridge and a coat closet.  Mom apparently made it VERY clear that the closet is not going anywhere which means that wall remains the best place for the fridge, snug up against the closet wall.  They did build a cabinet over the fridge and a pantry thing down the side for more storage. 

Mom sort of blinked/cheaped out when it came to the floor.  She knew she'd spent over $25K at that point and opted for some boring beige-ish floor stuff.  It's not tile, it's not wooden and it's definitely not carpet.  It's your basic boring floor. 

[sesfw]

The contractor and cabinet guy were here yesterday taking measurements and such .......... and we'll get the final basic and finish $$$$ amount next week.

Today we are going to look at electric ranges.  I want 30", double oven, easy to clean and care for.

Any suggestions? 

I looked at reviews this morning and the biggest complaint with LG is the cook top is difficult to clean.  I haven't' really looked at others yet but getting the 'overwhelmed' feeling.  TMI

[emma1420]

I have s whirlpool that I like.  I tend to stick with companies that specialise in appliances.  So I stay clear of Samsung and LG for those types of purchases.  The only problem I've had with an appliance was a Samsung washer, and the only problems my friends have had with their appliances has been LG and Samsung.

However, I am also not a big cook so I refuse to spend a ton of money on a stove.  I know that if you spend more there are other excellent brands like Bluestar and Wolf that make excellent products (but you pay for it).

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Aug 13, 2015 10:43:52 GMT -5 sesfw said:

The contractor and cabinet guy were here yesterday taking measurements and such .......... and we'll get the final basic and finish $$$$ amount next week.

Today we are going to look at electric ranges.  I want 30", double oven, easy to clean and care for.

Any suggestions? 

I looked at reviews this morning and the biggest complaint with LG is the cook top is difficult to clean.  I haven't' really looked at others yet but getting the 'overwhelmed' feeling.  TMI

We went out last night looking at dishwashers, so I wandered over to the ranges to look at those too.  We went out last night with CR in hand (along with a dish to make sure that it fit in the dishwasher!).

CR issue is Aug 2015, so as current as you're going to get.
For electric smooth top ranges, GE, Kenmore, LG and Samsung were their safe bets.  The top of the double oven list was LG model #LTE3037ST at $1300.  It was also cheapest in the list.  Second was GE at $2800, Samsung at $1800, Maytag at $1700, Frigidaire at $1400 and at $1800 and the end of the list was another LG at $1300.  There isn't a wide range of scores, they range from 81-89.

Brands to avoid were Electrolux, Jenn-Air and KitchenAid.

[bean29]

Aug 13, 2015 12:00:09 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Aug 13, 2015 10:43:52 GMT -5 sesfw said:

The contractor and cabinet guy were here yesterday taking measurements and such .......... and we'll get the final basic and finish $$$$ amount next week.

Today we are going to look at electric ranges.  I want 30", double oven, easy to clean and care for.

Any suggestions? 

I looked at reviews this morning and the biggest complaint with LG is the cook top is difficult to clean.  I haven't' really looked at others yet but getting the 'overwhelmed' feeling.  TMI

We went out last night looking at dishwashers, so I wandered over to the ranges to look at those too.  We went out last night with CR in hand (along with a dish to make sure that it fit in the dishwasher!).

CR issue is Aug 2015, so as current as you're going to get.
For electric smooth top ranges, GE, Kenmore, LG and Samsung were their safe bets.  The top of the double oven list was LG model #LTE3037ST at $1300.  It was also cheapest in the list.  Second was GE at $2800, Samsung at $1800, Maytag at $1700, Frigidaire at $1400 and at $1800 and the end of the list was another LG at $1300.  There isn't a wide range of scores, they range from 81-89.

Brands to avoid were Electrolux, Jenn-Air and KitchenAid.

For what it is worth, I love my Samsung refrigerator (French Door) It is about 2 years old, and my Samsung Washer and dryer (about 1 year old)   I had issues with the whirlpool duet predecessors, so IDK if they are so much better.  I like to read the user comments on sites like sears and Home Depot and see what experiences people had.  Some say appliances with more electronics are more convenient but the trade off is they have shorter useful lives.  In which case you may want an extended warranty...if so, HD and Lowes extended warranties are much cheaper than the ones Sears offers.

When the range of scores is so tight, just keep in mind price and features are the most important deciding factors.

Like where are the controls?  If you have a drawer opening at 90 degrees to your stove, you might prefer the controls on the back.  I saw some ranges at Sears that have a lip that goes over the opening where the stove slides in.  If I had understood the concept when I was designing my kitchen I would have taken advantage of it.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

When the range of scores is so tight, just keep in mind price and features are the most important deciding factors.
Like where are the controls?


Exactly.  We are likely not going with the top rated Bosch dishwasher for a reason like this....even though the top rated dishwasher is $170 less.  The major difference is that the handle sticks out of the cheaper Bosch dishwasher and I can easily see me ramming my hip into it while I'm cooking.  There is only 1 point in difference between the scores, and only 5 points between the top dishwasher (KitchenAid) and the Bosch.  The 2 deciding differences in not going with the top rated were that (1) our plates didn't fit into it without hitting the top spray bar and (2) it has 2x the rate of repairs that Bosch does (18% vs 9%).

[Robert not Bobby]

In twenty years, everyone will be saying eww, those stainless steel appliances (finger prints)...like we say about those avocado green that our parents had in the 70s.

One thing I would recommend...cook with gas.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Aug 13, 2015 13:07:58 GMT -5 Robert not Bobby said:

In twenty years, everyone will be saying eww, those stainless steel appliances (finger prints)...like we say about those avocado green that our parents had in the 70s.

One thing I would recommend...cook with gas.

Have you been appliance shopping recently?  It's fairly hard to find appliances that are NOT stainless steel.

We're running into this now.  The stove I want (which is gas) is ONLY available in stainless.  So do I want to choose a dishwasher that is stainless to go with it, or have a stainless stove with a white dishwasher?

Another thing....with the newer planned obsolescence built into appliances, it's very likely they'd die before they go out of vogue.  I seriously doubt you'll get 20 years out of any appliance you purchase these days. 

[Robert not Bobby]

Aug 13, 2015 13:28:20 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Aug 13, 2015 13:07:58 GMT -5 Robert not Bobby said:

In twenty years, everyone will be saying eww, those stainless steel appliances (finger prints)...like we say about those avocado green that our parents had in the 70s.

One thing I would recommend...cook with gas.

Have you been appliance shopping recently?  It's fairly hard to find appliances that are NOT stainless steel.

We're running into this now.  The stove I want (which is gas) is ONLY available in stainless.  So do I want to choose a dishwasher that is stainless to go with it, or have a stainless stove with a white dishwasher?

Another thing....with the newer planned obsolescence built into appliances, it's very likely they'd die before they go out of vogue.  I seriously doubt you'll get 20 years out of any appliance you purchase these days. 

I hear you, and you are maybe right...so what do you do? I throw it back to you...you seem smarter. You tell me.

BTW, we don't need  any new appliances. We will let them die slowly.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

I really don't know.  We are in the process of letting our appliances die slowly too, but these are about 25 years old.  The dishwasher is gasping, so it's going to be first on the list.  I can get it in either stainless or white.  I'd prefer white.  

I know that the kitchen is going to look good with all stainless.  It would look good in all white.  Probably not so good in a combo of the 2.  I can't get the stove I want in white, so this might drive the decision.

[kittensaver]

Aug 13, 2015 14:00:18 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

I really don't know.  We are in the process of letting our appliances die slowly too, but these are about 25 years old.  The dishwasher is gasping, so it's going to be first on the list.  I can get it in either stainless or white.  I'd prefer white.  

I know that the kitchen is going to look good with all stainless.  It would look good in all white.  Probably not so good in a combo of the 2.  I can't get the stove I want in white, so this might drive the decision.

I've been pulling photos from magazines for a few years now, looking for remodeling ideas. I've seen any number of kitchens that have a mix of mix of metal colors and it CAN work. I think stainless + white could be fine. It all depends on how everything else is designed and laid out, and how it all works together.

I don't believe appliances need to be all matchy-matchy. I have a mix of black and stainless and it looks fine. But to each his/her own, of course .

[emma1420]

Aug 13, 2015 13:28:20 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Aug 13, 2015 13:07:58 GMT -5 Robert not Bobby said:

In twenty years, everyone will be saying eww, those stainless steel appliances (finger prints)...like we say about those avocado green that our parents had in the 70s.

One thing I would recommend...cook with gas.

Have you been appliance shopping recently?  It's fairly hard to find appliances that are NOT stainless steel.

We're running into this now.  The stove I want (which is gas) is ONLY available in stainless.  So do I want to choose a dishwasher that is stainless to go with it, or have a stainless stove with a white dishwasher?

Another thing....with the newer planned obsolescence built into appliances, it's very likely they'd die before they go out of vogue.  I seriously doubt you'll get 20 years out of any appliance you purchase these days. 

I've bought a new dishwasher and stove this year, and there were fewer choices in white or black, and I want to see what I'm buying in person and there were almost no non-stainless steel versions available in store.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

This is the quartz that we put in last summer.  The black is really more of a blueish grey, not quite as dark.  Back splash is beige limestone with grey figurings in it (we got some really cool fossils in this lot of limestone, so placed them where we can see them.




The floors are white ceramic tile, with a faint blueish grey/beige marbling, so it counteracts the darkness of the quartz.  Cabinets are unstained maple with white laminate doors (which are going to be replaced with solid maple).  The kitchen has a large slider and a larger window in it, so I have enough light in it to go either direction and it won't look dark at all.

The one thing that both of us agree on is that we do not want black.

[kittensaver]

Well . . . I just had my consultation appointment this morning with my contractor. He's going to give me a quote to rehab my kitchen in keeping with my Urban Cottage/Craftsman theme: white wide bead-board cabinets (I'm keeping the cabinets, just putting in new doors and drawers) with shaker-style plain glass fronts and "modern-but-period-appropriate" (if that makes sense) brushed nickel latches, drawer pulls and knobs; a new countertop in olive gray-green granite with a white subway tile backsplash; a butcher block island top; shaker doors with leaded glass for the island; clean and paint inside and outside everywhere; fix and replace molding and trim as necessary; add pullouts to my cabinets (including ditching the trash compactor for pull-out dual trash and recycling bins); new sink and faucet in the same modern-but-period-appropriate hardware; new refrigerator; upgraded electrical. I'm keeping the combo stove/oven and the dishwasher. Still to be decided: the lighting, but it will be in the same modern-but-period-appropriate vein as the hardware.

Wish me luck that I don't faint when I see the bid!

[Anne_in_VA]

Aug 11, 2015 8:46:30 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

My Mom just finished up her kitchen remodel.  I think the final cost is around $28K, give or take a bit.  $13K was for her new cabinets and I think her appliances ran around $2500 but she kept her old stove - as it's only about 5 years old. 

Mom went down to studs on 1 wall, removed part of a wall, moved her sink and gas lines, added lots of electrical outlets and under cabinet lighting.  They'd updated the electrical panel in the basement previously so that was already done.  Mom also got about 3x the cabinet space she had previously.  I think she went with Corian for her countertops.  The new table sucks though.  Gonna nag her into returning that.  It wobbles and feels very insecure. 

I'd love to do a remodel like this.  DSDIL says he'll make the cabinets for me, but it'll be awhile before I can afford the rest of it too.  I want to bring gas into the kitchen, move a door, remove a wall, add cabinets along one wall where there aren't any now, add an island, and get a new cooktop and wall oven.  We currently have a wall oven which I never had before and I love it!  Saves my back.

[zibazinski]

I've got a stove that's an electric oven and a gas cooktop. DH loves it.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Has anyone brought a gas line into the kitchen for a gas stove?  Any idea of costs?  We have a gas line at least to the family room, which is at the other end of the room from the kitchen, so know that we have reasonably near access. 

[Anne_in_VA]

Mich -  we were having some other work done a few months ago and asked about bringing gas into the kitchen at that time.  It would be about 30 or so feet from the current location, and I think they said it would only be a couple hundred dollars.

[The Captain]

Mich - I'm with Ann - we had a gas line run for our dryer when we moved and the stove is on the opposite side of the wall from the laundry room so we did both in anticipation of the kitchen remodel (I want a gas stove, we currently have electric).  It was right under where the main came into the house and I think about $250 for both.

Now this was done through the full height basement with the torn out ceilings.  If your contractor needs to patch drywall to get access that'll increase the cost.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

This is good to know.  I do NOT want those freaking burner coils and TD does NOT want a flat top.  If the cost to run a gas line (currently, it's to the fireplace at the other end of the room, so no more than 30') is only a couple hundred $$, I'll win.  Otherwise, I might wind up with another stupid electric coil stove.

Another gas stove question.....do you need a special vent for a gas stove?

[The Captain]

You mean like the vent you need for a gas furnace?  I don't think so?  We didn't have one in our last house (that I know of).  A range hood is recommended though I don't think it's required per code because I've seen houses without one.

[mroped]

I'd recommend putting a hood over a gas stove as the Captain mentioned.
Im working with all sorts of heating devices- more like fixing the "after" problems.
People fail to understand that gas produces water vapors while burning that can be harmful to your home and you.
If you have your stove on an exterior wall then best would be to put a hood with a vent thru to the outside with just a flap on the end like for the dryer.

And Oh My God! 
Where are you people living? Those prices that you throw arround for kitchen remodels are like astronomical!
Are your kitchens that big?
Do you go all out on the latest things?
To me is just mind boggling.
Of course we did our kitchen like 12-13 years ago so I might be out of touch but man!
I think I'm gonna raise my prices; it appears that I'm too cheap!