The President uses the N word

[ArchietheDragon]

So, President Obama said the word n_____ on a pod cast the other day in a conversation about the shootings in S Carolina.   The right is going nuts about it.     Is it fair for him to use it?  Is it fair for the right to go nuts?

[The Captain]

Either it's a vile, disgusting word that does not deserve use in a civilized conversation or it's ok for everyone to use it.

I'm not sure how it was used or what they're going nuts over.  I do know that I'm having DD read Tom Sawyer and we're having some conversations about historical context due to that one word.

[ArchietheDragon]

Jun 23, 2015 9:20:39 GMT -5 The Captain said:

Either it's a vile, disgusting word that does not deserve use in a civilized conversation or it's ok for everyone to use it.

I'm not sure how it was used or what they're going nuts over.  I do know that I'm having DD read Tom Sawyer and we're having some conversations about historical context due to that one word.

Here is what he said:


"I always tell young people in particular: Do not say that nothing's changed when it comes to race in America unless you lived through being a black man in the 1950s or '60s or '70s," Obama began. "It is incontrovertible that race relations have improved significantly during my lifetime and yours." Then, on a less hopeful note, Obama said, "What is also true is that the legacy of slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination in almost every institution of our lives -- that casts a long shadow. That's still part of our DNA that's passed on.  Racism, we are not cured of it. And it's not just a matter of it not being polite to say n----- in public. That's not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. It's not just a matter of overt discrimination. Societies don't, overnight, completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior. ... Progress is real and we have to take hope from that progress, but what is also real is that the march isn't over and the work is not yet completed."

[Deleted]

I think using the word to discuss the word is appropriate.

I guess he could have said 'it not being polite to say the n word in public' ... But I don't see how use of the word in this context is going nits worthy. That said, the going nuts does not surprise me.

[The Captain]

Jun 23, 2015 9:23:54 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Jun 23, 2015 9:20:39 GMT -5 The Captain said:

Either it's a vile, disgusting word that does not deserve use in a civilized conversation or it's ok for everyone to use it.

I'm not sure how it was used or what they're going nuts over.  I do know that I'm having DD read Tom Sawyer and we're having some conversations about historical context due to that one word.

Here is what he said:


"I always tell young people in particular: Do not say that nothing's changed when it comes to race in America unless you lived through being a black man in the 1950s or '60s or '70s," Obama began. "It is incontrovertible that race relations have improved significantly during my lifetime and yours." Then, on a less hopeful note, Obama said, "What is also true is that the legacy of slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination in almost every institution of our lives -- that casts a long shadow. That's still part of our DNA that's passed on.  Racism, we are not cured of it. And it's not just a matter of it not being polite to say n----- in public. That's not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. It's not just a matter of overt discrimination. Societies don't, overnight, completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior. ... Progress is real and we have to take hope from that progress, but what is also real is that the march isn't over and the work is not yet completed."

I think he used it in an appropriate manner to discuss a point he was trying to make. It wasn't used for shock value or in a derogatory way.

Not sure why anyone would get riled up over this use.  I think it's more important that a frank discussion be held about the topic, rather than the word that is representative of the topic.

[Deleted]

I'm a Yankee in my 50s and that word has not been appropriate to use in my lifetime because it is a demeaning slur.

Looks like Obama is using it in a historical context to frame the reference on racism progress, or lack thereof. I don't have a problem with him using the word in the context he did. Open discussion of racism needs to be occurring, but I'm not sure how people become racist so I don't know how you stop them being racists. I was raised understanding that a mix of people was desirable and better than a homogeneous community.

I wonder however, whether a white leader could make those statements. Seems a little dicey because I honestly don't think that a lot of whites believe or understand what white privilege is. As a white woman, I have not been subjected to the kinds of discrimination a black man has, so although I can see it and think I kind of get it; I also know that I don't really get it. I am glad I have not been subjected to that kind of persecution, but it also makes it harder for me to actually understand/feel it.

[Tennesseer]

It was used appropriately in the discussion.  I would find no problem with anyone using the word in an intelligent discussion.  

It is inappropriste when it is used in a matter of contemp, anger and mockery for an individual or class of people

[Deleted]

I was in the city a few weeks ago and stopped at Target and it wasn't until I was combing the book department there that I realized Harlequin has many AA character series. It made me stop and think. Just another one of those examples of how being a majority culture/race/etc is taken for granted. I don't need to search out books with characters that look like me. I don't have to live in a large minority population area for stores to carry products targeted to me. 

[djAdvocate]

i don't think any word should be taboo.  you all should know that from how i post.

[billisonboard]

Jun 23, 2015 9:53:43 GMT -5 oped said:

I was in the city a few weeks ago and stopped at Target and it wasn't until I was combing the book department there that I realized Harlequin has many AA character series. It made me stop and think. Just another one of those examples of how being a majority culture/race/etc is taken for granted. I don't need to search out books with characters that look like me. I don't have to live in a large minority population area for stores to carry products targeted to me. 

I remember when I had a like experience with faces on greeting cards.

[deziloooooo]

Jun 23, 2015 9:23:54 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Jun 23, 2015 9:20:39 GMT -5 The Captain said:

Either it's a vile, disgusting word that does not deserve use in a civilized conversation or it's ok for everyone to use it.

I'm not sure how it was used or what they're going nuts over.  I do know that I'm having DD read Tom Sawyer and we're having some conversations about historical context due to that one word.

Here is what he said:


"I always tell young people in particular: Do not say that nothing's changed when it comes to race in America unless you lived through being a black man in the 1950s or '60s or '70s," Obama began. "It is incontrovertible that race relations have improved significantly during my lifetime and yours." Then, on a less hopeful note, Obama said, "What is also true is that the legacy of slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination in almost every institution of our lives -- that casts a long shadow. That's still part of our DNA that's passed on.  Racism, we are not cured of it. And it's not just a matter of it not being polite to say n----- in public. That's not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. It's not just a matter of overt discrimination. Societies don't, overnight, completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior. ... Progress is real and we have to take hope from that progress, but what is also real is that the march isn't over and the work is not yet completed."

As almost always ..and actually I can't remember when  he wasn't "right on"..this President , whether you agree or not with all his presidential  decisions or  personal feelings..is as good as any if not one of the best in communicating with others...{ Kennedy for  those who  remember..also  one of the better ones..}  

Any one who is objecting to his use of the N word in this communication..wasn't sure if it was a interview, speech, just a talk with a few  others present..IMHO..is just another looking to find some thing negative relating to this President or  his family and one who has no interest in listening  to his words and absorbing their meanings..just looking  for a zinger they  can capitalize on in a negative way against him and his..

In this particular venue..perfectly ok to use the word ....Lets face it..the right has  some major problems in this country...to satisfy all parties who think of themselves belonging to  such a branch..it is  impossible and it seems that they don't have the bal%s to rid them  selves of the extremist of their group thus turning off many who other  wise might want to  support  them on some issues

[ArchietheDragon]

Jun 23, 2015 12:03:26 GMT -5 deziloooooo said:

Jun 23, 2015 9:23:54 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Here is what he said:


"I always tell young people in particular: Do not say that nothing's changed when it comes to race in America unless you lived through being a black man in the 1950s or '60s or '70s," Obama began. "It is incontrovertible that race relations have improved significantly during my lifetime and yours." Then, on a less hopeful note, Obama said, "What is also true is that the legacy of slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination in almost every institution of our lives -- that casts a long shadow. That's still part of our DNA that's passed on.  Racism, we are not cured of it. And it's not just a matter of it not being polite to say n----- in public. That's not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. It's not just a matter of overt discrimination. Societies don't, overnight, completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior. ... Progress is real and we have to take hope from that progress, but what is also real is that the march isn't over and the work is not yet completed."

As almost always ..and actually I can't remember when  he wasn't "right on"..this President , whether you agree or not with all his presidential  decisions or  personal feelings..is as good as any if not one of the best in communicating with others...{ Kennedy for  those who  remember..also  one of the better ones..}  

Any one who is objecting to his use of the N word in this communication..wasn't sure if it was a interview, speech, just a talk with a few  others present..IMHO..is just another looking to find some thing negative relating to this President or  his family and one who has no interest in listening  to his words and absorbing their meanings..just looking  for a zinger they  can capitalize on in a negative way against him and his..

In this particular venue..perfectly ok to use the word ....Lets face it..the right has  some major problems in this country...to satisfy all parties who think of themselves belonging to  such a branch..it is  impossible and it seems that they don't have the bal%s to rid them  selves of the extremist of their group thus turning off many who other  wise might want to  support  them on some issues

i agree.   So, is there any validity to the right being upset or is it just politics as usual?

[Tennesseer]

Jun 23, 2015 12:06:21 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Jun 23, 2015 12:03:26 GMT -5 deziloooooo said:

As almost always ..and actually I can't remember when  he wasn't "right on"..this President , whether you agree or not with all his presidential  decisions or  personal feelings..is as good as any if not one of the best in communicating with others...{ Kennedy for  those who  remember..also  one of the better ones..}  

Any one who is objecting to his use of the N word in this communication..wasn't sure if it was a interview, speech, just a talk with a few  others present..IMHO..is just another looking to find some thing negative relating to this President or  his family and one who has no interest in listening  to his words and absorbing their meanings..just looking  for a zinger they  can capitalize on in a negative way against him and his..

In this particular venue..perfectly ok to use the word ....Lets face it..the right has  some major problems in this country...to satisfy all parties who think of themselves belonging to  such a branch..it is  impossible and it seems that they don't have the bal%s to rid them  selves of the extremist of their group thus turning off many who other  wise might want to  support  them on some issues

i agree.   So, is there any validity to the right being upset or is it just politics as usual?

I know you asked Desi-but....it's political.

[kent]

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

[The Captain]

Jun 23, 2015 9:53:43 GMT -5 oped said:

I was in the city a few weeks ago and stopped at Target and it wasn't until I was combing the book department there that I realized Harlequin has many AA character series. It made me stop and think. Just another one of those examples of how being a majority culture/race/etc is taken for granted. I don't need to search out books with characters that look like me. I don't have to live in a large minority population area for stores to carry products targeted to me. 

OMG please tell me you don't read that drivel!!!

[Tennesseer]

Jun 23, 2015 12:35:05 GMT -5 kent said:

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

I disagree (imagine that)! If a white man said the word in a educational discussion about race relations and negative perceptions of others, there would not be any problem.

It is all in how, when, where and why the word is used.

[Deleted]

Jun 23, 2015 12:38:12 GMT -5 The Captain said:

Jun 23, 2015 9:53:43 GMT -5 oped said:

I was in the city a few weeks ago and stopped at Target and it wasn't until I was combing the book department there that I realized Harlequin has many AA character series. It made me stop and think. Just another one of those examples of how being a majority culture/race/etc is taken for granted. I don't need to search out books with characters that look like me. I don't have to live in a large minority population area for stores to carry products targeted to me. 

OMG please tell me you don't read that drivel!!!

Well, I read everything, so I can't say I never have ... In this case though I was just going up the book aisle and they had a huge section and so much of it was AA I couldn't miss it. 

[Deleted]

Jun 23, 2015 12:35:05 GMT -5 kent said:

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

Not true. Context is everything.

[deziloooooo]

Jun 23, 2015 12:35:05 GMT -5 kent said:

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

Possible but then again..possible not....depending in what context  it was used...In many ways we have come along way...and then again, in other ways ..not at all.

[deziloooooo]

Jun 23, 2015 12:44:00 GMT -5 oped said:

Jun 23, 2015 12:38:12 GMT -5 The Captain said:

OMG please tell me you don't read that drivel!!!

Well, I read everything, so I can't say I never have ... In this case though I was just going up the book aisle and they had a huge section and so much of it was AA I couldn't miss it. 

Sorry but  on some things I am slow..AA..??   

[Deleted]

African American

[Deleted]

Jun 23, 2015 12:35:05 GMT -5 kent said:

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

Honestly, if I heard a white man say exactly what Obama said, I would have had a "wait! Did he just say what I thinik he said?!" moment. And being honest again, I would have had the same kind of moment if I'd actually heard President Obama speaking.

In either case, I wouldn't have had a stroke about it once I got over my initial surprise, because of the context.

[happyhoix]

I actually get kind of annoyed when people say "the N word" in these kind of circumstances. This was an adult man in a rationale discussion about race relations, everyone knows what the N word means, seems silly in the same way that using the P word for Penis would sound silly, coming from a grown man in an adult discussion.


The F word for gay is kind of the same way - we know it was used in a very negative, ugly way, but at the same time it's part of our history. With both words, I think it shows are far we've come as a society that you don't hear people dropping either the N word or the F word in casual conversations.

Not surprised the right is exploding, there are some members of the right that eagerly await any opportunity to pounce on anything the president says or does that can in any way be spun in a negative fashion. Remember the whole 'saluting awkwardly' photo scandal?

 

[zibazinski]

HE'S allowed.

[steff]

The F word for gay is kind of the same way - we know it was used in a very negative, ugly way, but at the same time it's part of our history. With both words, I think it shows are far we've come as a society that you don't hear people dropping either the N word or the F word in casual conversations.

My gay brother told me the "F" word was the only word I could say about gays that was incredibly offensive and would piss him off.  We were having a very deep, honest conversation about him coming out and he had opened the floor up to any and all questions no matter how much I thought it might be offensive or something I shouldn't ask. 

Believe it or not, I've had the same kind of conversation with a very close black friend too.  I wanted to make sure that I never offended him thru stupidity or cluelessness.  He appreciated that I made the effort and was honest about why we were talking about it.  He's the one who told me he's "black", not "AA". 

IMO, if a conversation/discussion is being had for the right reasons & both parties understand that, then things can be said & talked about that you would never throw out there offhanded.

[billisonboard]

Jun 23, 2015 14:00:06 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

...

Not surprised the right is exploding, there are some members of the right that eagerly await any opportunity to pounce on anything the president says or does that can in any way be spun in a negative fashion. ...

And on cue:

Jun 23, 2015 14:02:57 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

HE'S allowed.

[kent]

Jun 23, 2015 12:41:59 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Jun 23, 2015 12:35:05 GMT -5 kent said:

I have no problem whatsoever with him saying it. What I do have a problem with is that if a white guy said it all hell would break loose and they context in which it was said would be completely ignored.

I disagree (imagine that)! If a white man said the word in a educational discussion about race relations and negative perceptions of others, there would not be any problem.

It is all in how, when, where and why the word is used.

Tenn - given you disagree, I may have no choice but to block you - need to think about that. 

90% of those that post here don't have their head up their [whatever] and, as such I'm in total agreement with them that it wasn't a big deal given the context.  It's the loons (left and right) that take any opportunity to stir the pot that drives me nuts.

OK, I've thought about it and have decided to let you off with a formal written warning - consider yourself lucky my friend.    

[Tennesseer]

Jun 23, 2015 14:38:09 GMT -5 kent said:

Jun 23, 2015 12:41:59 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I disagree (imagine that)! If a white man said the word in a educational discussion about race relations and negative perceptions of others, there would not be any problem.

It is all in how, when, where and why the word is used.

Tenn - given you disagree, I may have no choice but to block you - need to think about that. 

90% of those that post here don't have their head up their [whatever] and, as such I'm in total agreement with them that it wasn't a big deal given the context.  It's the loons (left and right) that take any opportunity to stir the pot that drives me nuts.

OK, I've thought about it and have decided to let you off with a formal written warning - consider yourself lucky my friend.    

[deziloooooo]

Jun 23, 2015 13:00:20 GMT -5 oped said:

African American

Gotcha........told you I am slow......

[deziloooooo]

Jun 23, 2015 14:00:06 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

I actually get kind of annoyed when people say "the N word" in these kind of circumstances. This was an adult man in a rationale discussion about race relations, everyone knows what the N word means, seems silly in the same way that using the P word for Penis would sound silly, coming from a grown man in an adult discussion.


The F word for gay is kind of the same way - we know it was used in a very negative, ugly way, but at the same time it's part of our history. With both words, I think it shows are far we've come as a society that you don't hear people dropping either the N word or the F word in casual conversations.

Not surprised the right is exploding, there are some members of the right that eagerly await any opportunity to pounce on anything the president says or does that can in any way be spun in a negative fashion. Remember the whole 'saluting awkwardly' photo scandal?

 

I was going to say how much  I agree with you regarding those on the right and also was going to suggest till they change they will continue to have a problem getting the average voter to vote and agree with them..The problem with that thought  however is that as of right now they  have both houses plus so many of the state houses and governors ...

The real big prize  is the Presidency though and  just possible what is the holding of both houses is just what happens after being in power to long..electorate want a change..many times just because...It should be a interesting new Presidential battle for 2016 if it's between say Jeb and Hillery...though Jebs ideas on education, immigration...over seas confrontations are a bit much for me...who knows how the country or where the electorial votes lie is more the thing will go....{ So far aI don't see another Pub getting the nod but then again what do  I know...}