AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 4, 2015 14:32:29 GMT -5
That's your opinion. I don't see taking a stand for tax transparency 'unbusinesslike'. I think if more businesses would work to raise awareness of the tax and regulatory cost of everything we could have much more sane policy debates. One area I'd especially like to see tax transparency is gasoline taxes. I think the state, local, and federal taxes should be line-itemed at the gas pump. I think gas stations should be allowed to post the ACTUAL price per gallon they're charging, and add tax like every other product or service. That way when you gas up for $1.45 per gallon and pay $2.05 it might dawn on you that $10.00 of filling your minivan was TAX. Might get some people's attention. And a customer that would stop using my product or service because they object to my policy of tax transparency is probably just the sort of mentally unstable fucking weirdo I'd prefer went to some other restaurant.
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EVT1
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Post by EVT1 on Feb 4, 2015 17:20:09 GMT -5
Except that 2% is not a tax. Might as well be a 2% grease disposal or employee uniform surcharge..
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 4, 2015 17:40:58 GMT -5
That's your opinion. I don't see taking a stand for tax transparency 'unbusinesslike'. I think if more businesses would work to raise awareness of the tax and regulatory cost of everything we could have much more sane policy debates. One area I'd especially like to see tax transparency is gasoline taxes. I think the state, local, and federal taxes should be line-itemed at the gas pump. I think gas stations should be allowed to post the ACTUAL price per gallon they're charging, and add tax like every other product or service. That way when you gas up for $1.45 per gallon and pay $2.05 it might dawn on you that $10.00 of filling your minivan was TAX. Might get some people's attention. And a customer that would stop using my product or service because they object to my policy of tax transparency is probably just the sort of mentally unstable fucking weirdo I'd prefer went to some other restaurant. Those customers you don't want would most definitely get a better meal at some other restaurant. Bullshit isn't tasty.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Feb 4, 2015 18:43:52 GMT -5
Except that 2% is not a tax. Might as well be a 2% grease disposal or employee uniform surcharge.. Even if it was not a TAX, which it is, you have to agree it is a federally mandated charge to the business that they must pay.
If we are to have mandated healthcare, I believe it should be paid by the Federal Government rather than corporations or individuals. It is the Federal government that put it in place and demanding it be paid.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 19:00:42 GMT -5
Except that 2% is not a tax. Might as well be a 2% grease disposal or employee uniform surcharge.. Even if it was not a TAX, which it is, you have to agree it is a federally mandated charge to the business that they must pay.
no, i don't. they absolutely do NOT have to pay that tax.
If we are to have mandated healthcare, I believe it should be paid by the Federal Government rather than corporations or individuals. It is the Federal government that put it in place and demanding it be paid.
corporations are people too, my friend.
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 19:02:28 GMT -5
That's your opinion. I don't see taking a stand for tax transparency 'unbusinesslike'. I think if more businesses would work to raise awareness of the tax and regulatory cost of everything we could have much more sane policy debates. One area I'd especially like to see tax transparency is gasoline taxes. I think the state, local, and federal taxes should be line-itemed at the gas pump. I think gas stations should be allowed to post the ACTUAL price per gallon they're charging, and add tax like every other product or service. That way when you gas up for $1.45 per gallon and pay $2.05 it might dawn on you that $10.00 of filling your minivan was TAX. Might get some people's attention. And a customer that would stop using my product or service because they object to my policy of tax transparency is probably just the sort of mentally unstable fucking weirdo I'd prefer went to some other restaurant. i believe that the mentally ill are a protected class. you should probably take care with that attitude.
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 19:03:37 GMT -5
Interesting. I've never lived in a state where that was the requirement. O.k. ... I'll amend the question: In states where it's legal to include tax in the listed price of an item, what is the political statement of businesses that use a line item to display the tax instead? i think i already answered that question. do you need me to find the post?
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 19:04:38 GMT -5
in CA, it is, in fact, required. so, if it is legally required, then it is not a political statement. just following the rules. in all other instances, it is just playing games with your customers, and/or trying to make some sort of point.Soo... what "point" is it trying to make, having a separate line for the sales tax? that was an either/or statement. but assuming he was not playing games, perhaps he is, as Paul recently said, some "sort of mentally unstable fucking weirdo I'd prefer went" away.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2015 19:16:55 GMT -5
Even if it was not a TAX, which it is, you have to agree it is a federally mandated charge to the business that they must pay.
no, i don't. they absolutely do NOT have to pay that tax.
If we are to have mandated healthcare, I believe it should be paid by the Federal Government rather than corporations or individuals. It is the Federal government that put it in place and demanding it be paid.
corporations are people too, my friend. Contrary to popular belief... no... they actually are not. When they can think on their own. When they, themselves, not their owners, are "self aware", MAYBE I'll reconsider that... but not until then.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2015 19:18:57 GMT -5
Interesting. I've never lived in a state where that was the requirement. O.k. ... I'll amend the question: In states where it's legal to include tax in the listed price of an item, what is the political statement of businesses that use a line item to display the tax instead? i think i already answered that question. do you need me to find the post? You actually havent' answered the question of " what is the political statement of having that line... when it's sales tax, and optional?" You've danced around the issue, but never answered the actual question about the political statement.
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Post by Value Buy on Feb 4, 2015 19:39:35 GMT -5
Even if it was not a TAX, which it is, you have to agree it is a federally mandated charge to the business that they must pay.
no, i don't. they absolutely do NOT have to pay that tax.
If we are to have mandated healthcare, I believe it should be paid by the Federal Government rather than corporations or individuals. It is the Federal government that put it in place and demanding it be paid.
corporations are people too, my friend. Your right. They both have to pay a "penalty" to the government, but not a tax.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 20:23:10 GMT -5
corporations are people too, my friend. Contrary to popular belief... no... they actually are not. When they can think on their own. When they, themselves, not their owners, are "self aware", MAYBE I'll reconsider that... but not until then. i think i have Mitt's phone number around here somewhere......
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 20:24:00 GMT -5
corporations are people too, my friend. Your right. They both have to pay a "penalty" to the government, but not a tax.
no, they don't. i own two corporations, and neither of them have to pay ANY ACA "penalty".
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Post by EVT1 on Feb 4, 2015 20:26:55 GMT -5
You are making an assumption- do you know whether they are providing health insurance or not? Whether they even meet the requirement to provide it?
It is just a dick move- nothing more. But if they want to print something accurate and they are not providing the insurance- then it should read "2% was added to your bill because we feel our employees do not deserve health insurance and we have decided to let the taxpayers cover them incurring a penalty which we feel you should pay"
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 4, 2015 20:27:15 GMT -5
i think i already answered that question. do you need me to find the post? You actually havent' answered the question of " what is the political statement of having that line... when it's sales tax, and optional?" You've danced around the issue, but never answered the actual question about the political statement. actually, until THIS POST, i had no idea what you were asking. you must be a rather unusual dance partner. to answer your HYPOTHETICAL question from a HYPOTHETICAL situation with a HYPOTHETICAL answer, how about this: "i don't believe in taxes". or maybe "join the anarchist brotherhood of free corporations"? hell if i know. ask someone who does it. i can think of at least five other examples, i am sure. but then again, so can you.
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Post by Value Buy on Feb 4, 2015 21:30:49 GMT -5
Some of the hyperbole posted by members here is getting out of hand.....
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2015 22:50:10 GMT -5
You actually havent' answered the question of " what is the political statement of having that line... when it's sales tax, and optional?" You've danced around the issue, but never answered the actual question about the political statement. actually, until THIS POST, i had no idea what you were asking. you must be a rather unusual dance partner. to answer your HYPOTHETICAL question from a HYPOTHETICAL situation with a HYPOTHETICAL answer, how about this: "i don't believe in taxes". or maybe "join the anarchist brotherhood of free corporations"? hell if i know. ask someone who does it. i can think of at least five other examples, i am sure. but then again, so can you. You were one of the people suggesting that it MUST be a political statement of some kind if it's not just mixed in with the "listed price" of an item... I was curious what the "statement" could be for that tax line... that's all. Now that you have answered it from their "hypothetical" point of view... what statement do YOU get from any place that has an unnecessary "sales tax line" on their receipts? I mean if it HAS to be a statement... then you must get a statement out of it... right? Or... do you do like most people and just assume it's a necessary charge/cost of doing business, thus invalidating your claim that (paraphrased) "individual lines for extra fees/charges must be a political statement"?
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Post by EVT1 on Feb 4, 2015 23:03:13 GMT -5
To intrude- the statement for the tax line is Sales Tax.
That is what is done, has been done, what is expected.
Cost of goods or service, sales tax, total.
Adding a new line of charges is making a statement. Could be a fuel surcharge, could be a snow fee, what the hell ever. I call it shitty business- every wing slinger is subject to the same laws so price changes should reflect the costs of doing business not asinine extra charges.
How about a 4% tax because the CEO needs another 6 gold plated toilets and a new shark tank for his 25,000 square foot obscenity Oligarch fee, Golden parachute surcharge, hooker hush money, right wing political donation fund.......,,.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2015 23:48:06 GMT -5
To intrude- the statement for the tax line is Sales Tax.
That is what is done, has been done, what is expected.
Cost of goods or service, sales tax, total.
Adding a new line of charges is making a statement. Could be a fuel surcharge, could be a snow fee, what the hell ever. I call it shitty business- every wing slinger is subject to the same laws so price changes should reflect the costs of doing business not asinine extra charges.
How about a 4% tax because the CEO needs another 6 gold plated toilets and a new shark tank for his 25,000 square foot obscenity Oligarch fee, Golden parachute surcharge, hooker hush money, right wing political donation fund.......,,. Interesting way of phrasing all of that... Adding a new line ISN'T necessarily "making a statement". You may see it as such, but that doesn't mean that was the intent of it. But that's beside the point of my reply to your post. I find it interesting that you contradict yourself in not only one paragraph, but manage to do it in one sentence. "Price changes should reflect the costs of doing business"... a line item addition IS a "price change", so it DOES "reflect the costs of doing business"... And then you go on to completely obliterate what you just said by calling the cost of doing business "asinine extra charges"... There's nothing asinine about the costs involved in paying for insurance. It's a cost that has to be accounted for by the business.
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EVT1
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Post by EVT1 on Feb 5, 2015 1:25:04 GMT -5
You view the world through a strange lens- being a business owner is not one of them
I am all for it- I wish more companies would do it.
Print the whole cost structure and see which business go under on principle- as in you greedy fucks. Doubt Walmart would survive.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Feb 5, 2015 14:23:18 GMT -5
Snarky responses aside, I'm still having difficulty understanding those who object to transparent pricing which includes the cost of taxes? What are you Grubers afraid of?
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 14:28:30 GMT -5
Snarky responses aside, I'm still having difficulty understanding those who object to transparent pricing which includes the cost of taxes? What are you Grubers afraid of? nothing. is fear the only thing that motivates you?
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 14:34:23 GMT -5
actually, until THIS POST, i had no idea what you were asking. you must be a rather unusual dance partner. to answer your HYPOTHETICAL question from a HYPOTHETICAL situation with a HYPOTHETICAL answer, how about this: "i don't believe in taxes". or maybe "join the anarchist brotherhood of free corporations"? hell if i know. ask someone who does it. i can think of at least five other examples, i am sure. but then again, so can you. You were one of the people suggesting that it MUST be a political statement of some kind if it's not just mixed in with the "listed price" of an item... I was curious what the "statement" could be for that tax line... that's all. actually, no. what i suggested is that EITHER they were messing with their customers, OR it was a political statement. in post 147, the political statement wasn't even my first choice, because i don't think it is first in the mind of businesses that do it (though, based on what i now know about Kendall, i am betting that it WAS political in his case). by "messing with", i meant excusing the higher prices, or apologizing for them, by advertizing the reasons behind them. do you DISAGREE that this is the ALTERNATE scenario?Now that you have answered it from their "hypothetical" point of view... what statement do YOU get from any place that has an unnecessary "sales tax line" on their receipts? i have not seen anything other than a hypothetical case. can you give me one?I mean if it HAS to be a statement... then you must get a statement out of it... right? still missing the "OR". ibidOr... do you do like most people and just assume it's a necessary charge/cost of doing business, thus invalidating your claim that (paraphrased) "individual lines for extra fees/charges must be a political statement"? i don't assume anything is necessary in business other than making a profit. i suggested a way of doing that that is more straightforward, brave, and clear: to charge what you need to charge and let the customer decide, on that basis, if it is worth his money or not.
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 14:39:16 GMT -5
Some of the hyperbole posted by members here is getting out of hand..... in what sense? it has inspired probably (30) responses. is the goal of discussion to make a bunch of milquetoast points, have everyone nod in agreement, and go back to watching TV?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2015 18:43:32 GMT -5
You were one of the people suggesting that it MUST be a political statement of some kind if it's not just mixed in with the "listed price" of an item... I was curious what the "statement" could be for that tax line... that's all. Now that you have answered it from their "hypothetical" point of view... what statement do YOU get from any place that has an unnecessary "sales tax line" on their receipts? I mean if it HAS to be a statement... then you must get a statement out of it... right? Or... do you do like most people and just assume it's a necessary charge/cost of doing business, thus invalidating your claim that (paraphrased) "individual lines for extra fees/charges must be a political statement"? i don't assume anything is necessary in business other than making a profit. i suggested a way of doing that that is more straightforward, brave, and clear: to charge what you need to charge and let the customer decide, on that basis, if it is worth his money or not. Isn't that what that line item is doing though?
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 19:45:06 GMT -5
i don't assume anything is necessary in business other than making a profit. i suggested a way of doing that that is more straightforward, brave, and clear: to charge what you need to charge and let the customer decide, on that basis, if it is worth his money or not. Isn't that what that line item is doing though? in a cowardly, unbusinesslike and political way? sure.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2015 19:58:01 GMT -5
Isn't that what that line item is doing though? in a cowardly, unbusinesslike and political way? sure. You have a funny definition of cowardly. I always thought that cowardly was doing things in hiding, afraid for people to see what something really is. That's the exact opposite of putting it out as a line item. It's in the open, and broadly proclaimed... the very opposite of cowardly... in my book.
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 20:00:54 GMT -5
in a cowardly, unbusinesslike and political way? sure. You have a funny definition of cowardly. I always thought that cowardly was doing things in hiding, afraid for people to see what something really is. That's the exact opposite of putting it out as a line item. It's in the open, and broadly proclaimed... the very opposite of cowardly... in my book. i meant cowardly in the sense that a person feels the need to explain their price increases. i don't feel any such need. i charge what i feel i need to to make an adequate income. if i reach a point where my income is not adequate i raise prices. this business of putting in line items for every little thing is childish, imo. i understand you don't share that opinion. i am good with that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2015 20:06:48 GMT -5
Ahhh... I consider being willing to explain charges as "open" not "cowardly".
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 5, 2015 20:22:05 GMT -5
Ahhh... I consider being willing to explain charges as "open" not "cowardly". i am perfectly willing. i just don't wear it on my sleeve, like Kendall does. doing so seems totally whiny to me. if i want to know, i will ask. advertizing your costs seems like a profoundly bad idea to me, at many levels, unless you are compelled to do it.
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