Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 9:57:24 GMT -5
Police brutality in general, not this case. Did I say this case? I am not sure what generalities have to do with this situation. The fact is that the evidence was brought to grand jury and they cleared him (or didn't find sufficient evidence to go forward). That should be the end of it.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Nov 25, 2014 9:57:26 GMT -5
Anyone can feel anyway they want and they can think whatever they want to think. But that doesn't mean that we should be condoning their actions. Fortunately, no one here has condoned the rioting. I wasn't talking just about the rioting. I was also talking about making every case a "race" case. I don't think it helps to deal and solve the real issues
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 25, 2014 9:57:50 GMT -5
I know - my point is I don't think we're quite qualified (as people looking in from the outside) to judge how the people of that community feel and what they've seen in their community and throughout their lives, so I don't think we should jump so quickly to condemn them for thinking what they think. I don't think anyone has condemned the community for feeling as they do, or thinking as they think. As I see it, there's a real problem in that community that needs to be addressed and corrected. However, violent riots, burning, and looting is not addressing the problem. It's compounding it.
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cael
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Post by cael on Nov 25, 2014 9:58:00 GMT -5
Because of their experiences and because young black men keep dying, again since I am not in that position I cannot speak to what their experiences are that lead them to be outraged. This is kind of my point. You can say you don't give a shit and that's fine, because anyone can think whatever they want - including those in that community.
I work with cops all the time and really feel badly that people generalize and think all cops are bad, because that isn't true.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2014 9:58:12 GMT -5
You know, people feel and act the ways we do based on our life experiences. You may be able to tell yourself to think rationally and look at facts and make a judgment using logic - that's how I try to do things. But the fact is, people in general do not think that way and cannot overlook emotions and experiences, no matter how much of the better option that may be. People just can't do it, nor should they feel the need to 100% of the time. Racism and police brutality exist as separate issues, and also can be related. This case they may be related, or they may not be. No one is ever going to agree and there's never going to be a "right" answer. I guess this is me trying to work my way through this and decide what I think. Except the evidence doesn't support the claim of police brutality. He wasn't some boy scout who was shot because he was "walking while black". He was a criminal who went up against a cop and lost. The evidence supported the cop. Case closed. Just out of curiosity, how much of the evidence have you actually seen?
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 9:59:56 GMT -5
I get so flamed for this, but this is about race bc it has been made about the race. It was about a criminal and a police officer. But that wouldn't be a story. So, let's bring race into this. And make big news. I couldn't disagree more. I think that a lot of people here are under the impression that this occurred in a vacuum. The killing of an unarmed black teen by a white police officer didn't cause the rioting and the protests, it was simply the precipitating factor. Was the cop justified in shooting the kid? I don't know, nor does anyone here. I rather doubt that this was a cold blooded execution but I do think that there was, at the very least, a gross overreaction to the situation. I do know that a person or persons in the Ferguson Police Department must have taken a course in how to make your department look bad, because the deception, posturing and utter lack of transparency didn't do much to allay suspicion. Anyone with even one eye open can see that Ferguson was a powder keg waiting for a spark. Any PD that has only three black officers in an area that has over sixty percent black people should raise a red flag right off the bat. Add to that their documented history of racial profiling and their remarkably poor community relations with blacks and the only surprise is that this didn't happen much sooner. As to the comment about why there wasn't a huge outcry about the unarmed white kid killed by the black cop, I know that's the battle cry of the " We whites are so oppressed" crowd but, seriously, you need to come up with a new shtick. That one just makes you look ridiculous. And, if you honestly can't figure out why, it would be a waste of time to try to explain it to you. I never said I was oppressed...but I am so sick and tired of EVERYTHING related to the black community turning into race! I am sick and tired of our BLACK PRESIDENT fanning the race flames. this kid was a thug, not some boy scout. Don't live the thug life if you don't want it to end badly. perhaps THAT should be what the black community in Ferguson should focus on.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 25, 2014 10:00:10 GMT -5
... I watch the news coverage and all I see are a bunch of thugs terrorizing the community...talk about living up to a stereotype. I watch the news coverage and I see and hear a lot of people not fitting a negative stereotype. I guess you can see the glass full of well meaning people or you can see only the sludge at the bottom.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 10:02:20 GMT -5
Because of their experiences and because young black men keep dying, again since I am not in that position I cannot speak to what their experiences are that lead them to be outraged. This is kind of my point. You can say you don't give a shit and that's fine, because anyone can think whatever they want - including those in that community. I work with cops all the time and really feel badly that people generalize and think all cops are bad, because that isn't true. Except most of them are dying at the hands of other black people....
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2014 10:02:08 GMT -5
I couldn't disagree more. I think that a lot of people here are under the impression that this occurred in a vacuum. The killing of an unarmed black teen by a white police officer didn't cause the rioting and the protests, it was simply the precipitating factor. Was the cop justified in shooting the kid? I don't know, nor does anyone here. I rather doubt that this was a cold blooded execution but I do think that there was, at the very least, a gross overreaction to the situation. I do know that a person or persons in the Ferguson Police Department must have taken a course in how to make your department look bad, because the deception, posturing and utter lack of transparency didn't do much to allay suspicion. Anyone with even one eye open can see that Ferguson was a powder keg waiting for a spark. Any PD that has only three black officers in an area that has over sixty percent black people should raise a red flag right off the bat. Add to that their documented history of racial profiling and their remarkably poor community relations with blacks and the only surprise is that this didn't happen much sooner. As to the comment about why there wasn't a huge outcry about the unarmed white kid killed by the black cop, I know that's the battle cry of the " We whites are so oppressed" crowd but, seriously, you need to come up with a new shtick. That one just makes you look ridiculous. And, if you honestly can't figure out why, it would be a waste of time to try to explain it to you. I never said I was oppressed...but I am so sick and tired of EVERYTHING related to the black community turning into race! I am sick and tired of our BLACK PRESIDENT fanning the race flames. this kid was a thug, not some boy scout. Don't live the thug life if you don't want it to end badly. perhaps THAT should be what the black community in Ferguson should focus on. Yes, I think we can safely assume that it's always one hundred percent the other side's fault. That sure saves a lot of time wasted looking at the actions or behaviors of our own side.
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Politically_Incorrect12
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Post by Politically_Incorrect12 on Nov 25, 2014 10:02:58 GMT -5
Why?
I can understand the disappointment of the President and others who want to fix things by due process, they know as well as the rest of us the people behaving badly will get most of the press and those who behaved well or tried to stop bad behavior won't get much press.
I think its horrible these people decided to damage things just for their own jollies. They are slowing the march to reasonableness because they have decided to act like lawless asses. I didn't follow this case much because from the beginning it did not scream police totally at fault.
Its unfortunate they didn't have enough police presence and the orders to arrest people right away before it got so out of hand.
It is a little number of people that are burning cats and looting and they are criminals and not protesters. The don't have interest in fixing the problem only they have interest in getting excited and having free stuffs. It is unfortunate that the news covers primarily the bad part of events....people who are peacefully protesting (whether I agree with them or not) will not get near the air time of those who are rioting. It is an unfortunate reality of the news, you can't completely ignore the bad and it should be covered...but there isn't much balance.
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TheHaitian
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Post by TheHaitian on Nov 25, 2014 10:03:59 GMT -5
Except the evidence doesn't support the claim of police brutality. He wasn't some boy scout who was shot because he was "walking while black". He was a criminal who went up against a cop and lost. The evidence supported the cop. Case closed. Just out of curiosity, how much of the evidence have you actually seen? She is going off her own bias... Her husband is a cop. But black people are not entitled to their own bias because we have no history of being mistreated by the police. As I Haitian I give you Abner Louima that was assaulted, brutalized and forcibly sodomized by NY finest. And pay attention to how the black looters are called "animals" repeatedly here but the Caucasians ones are just "white morons"... Another day in America!
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cael
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Post by cael on Nov 25, 2014 10:04:14 GMT -5
I know - my point is I don't think we're quite qualified (as people looking in from the outside) to judge how the people of that community feel and what they've seen in their community and throughout their lives, so I don't think we should jump so quickly to condemn them for thinking what they think. I don't think anyone has condemned the community for feeling as they do, or thinking as they think. As I see it, there's a real problem in that community that needs to be addressed and corrected. However, violent riots, burning, and looting is not addressing the problem. It's compounding it. I think people are condemning the community for feeling as they do.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 10:04:27 GMT -5
I never said I was oppressed...but I am so sick and tired of EVERYTHING related to the black community turning into race! I am sick and tired of our BLACK PRESIDENT fanning the race flames. this kid was a thug, not some boy scout. Don't live the thug life if you don't want it to end badly. perhaps THAT should be what the black community in Ferguson should focus on. Yes, I think we can safely assume that it's always one hundred percent the other side's fault. That sure saves a lot of time wasted looking at the actions or behaviors of our own side. And I can kick that back to the black community...let's act like this kid was an innocent boy scout killed by the evil white cop. The parents raised a thug who died the thug life. No different than a thug white kid who gets killed. You want to live that kind of life, odds are it is going to be a short one.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 25, 2014 10:04:38 GMT -5
What do you want to bet that even if the decision had gone the other way there would have been "jubilation" in the streets and property destruction and looting would have occurred? People came from all over the place to wait for that decision. A goodly portion of those outsiders weren't there for any purpose related to the Brown Boy's death, his parents' pain, or the pain of the community at large. They were there for very different reasons and I don't think they'd have let all the trouble they'd gone to to get there go to waste. I'm sure it wouldn't have been as wide-spread, or as ugly, but I believe it would have happened.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 10:05:26 GMT -5
Just out of curiosity, how much of the evidence have you actually seen? She is going off her own bias... Her husband is a cop. But black people are not entitled to their own bias because we have no history of being mistreated by the police. As I Haitian I give you Abner Louima that was assaulted, brutalized and forcibly sodomized by NY finest. And pay attention to how the black looters are called "animals" repeatedly here but the Caucasians ones are just "white morons"... Another day in America! I called the white people animals as well...and my husband is not a cop
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 25, 2014 10:05:37 GMT -5
Fortunately, no one here has condoned the rioting. I wasn't talking just about the rioting. I was also talking about making every case a "race" case. I don't think it helps to deal and solve the real issues What are the real issues?
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 10:07:19 GMT -5
Yeah, we had rioting down in Boston when the Red Sox lost. Or was it when they won?
I get so confuzzled. But it was reeely important, and we had to tip over cars and set them on fire! There is never a reason to riot. Innocent people are harmed by these animals. Here is where I called the white people animals...just so I'm not accused of racism...anyone that riots is an animal!
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TheHaitian
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Post by TheHaitian on Nov 25, 2014 10:07:33 GMT -5
Because of their experiences and because young black men keep dying, again since I am not in that position I cannot speak to what their experiences are that lead them to be outraged. This is kind of my point. You can say you don't give a shit and that's fine, because anyone can think whatever they want - including those in that community. I work with cops all the time and really feel badly that people generalize and think all cops are bad, because that isn't true. Except most of them are dying at the hands of other black people.... Oh the never ending black on black violence... Have you looked at white on white violence? Asian on Asian violence? Mexican on Mexican violence? You segregate a race you are most likely to have the highest rate of violence to be that race against guess what... Yes it's own. It is no difference for any race, but please let the world know only black people commit crime on their own race.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 25, 2014 10:07:44 GMT -5
I don't think anyone has condemned the community for feeling as they do, or thinking as they think. As I see it, there's a real problem in that community that needs to be addressed and corrected. However, violent riots, burning, and looting is not addressing the problem. It's compounding it. I think people are condemning the community for feeling as they do. One poster isn't "people", cael. I think most of us are well aware there are serious problems in that community.
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cael
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Post by cael on Nov 25, 2014 10:11:02 GMT -5
I know. I just think it speaks to how a large amount of people in general view this, though. (not just people on this board) Maybe I'm wrong but that's the sense I get.
I guess I'm thinking of this whole mess in terms of generalities and maybe I shouldn't, but that's how I'm trying to frame it.
And for the record, MT and anyone are obviously free to think what they want - I'm just defending my position as they defend theirs.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 25, 2014 10:11:52 GMT -5
White people are animals. Black people are thugs. White people cause disturbances and black people cause riots.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Nov 25, 2014 10:12:36 GMT -5
Except most of them are dying at the hands of other black people.... Oh the never ending black on black violence... Have you looked at white on white violence? Asian on Asian violence? Mexican on Mexican violence? You segregate a race you are most likely to have the highest rate of violence to be that race against guess what... Yes it's own. It is no difference for any race, but please let the world know only black people commit crime on their own race. I never said that whites didn't kill whites and Asians didn't kill Asians...I was replying to the comment that "black men keep dying"...
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 25, 2014 10:14:33 GMT -5
I know. I just think it speaks to how a large amount of people in general view this, though. (not just people on this board) Maybe I'm wrong but that's the sense I get. I guess I'm thinking of this whole mess in terms of generalities and maybe I shouldn't, but that's how I'm trying to frame it. And for the record, MT and anyone are obviously free to think what they want - I'm just defending my position as they defend theirs. I honestly believe thinking in generalities is what gets us all into this messy position. People are not herd animals for the most part; although, in some situations some of them may act like herd animals. Especially here in the US, people are individuals. By lumping various peoples together we come up with stereotypes. To me, that's the wrong way to approach the problem.
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PK Bucko
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Post by PK Bucko on Nov 25, 2014 10:16:42 GMT -5
The rioters are animals. There's no other way to explain that. These pieces of trash vandalized, looted and burned more than 90 business's here last night and there's no excuse for that.
More than 80 arrests were made and we're expecting more stupidity tonight.
Those morons have put the very worst face upon my city that they possibly could.
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cael
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Post by cael on Nov 25, 2014 10:18:28 GMT -5
I know. I just think it speaks to how a large amount of people in general view this, though. (not just people on this board) Maybe I'm wrong but that's the sense I get. I guess I'm thinking of this whole mess in terms of generalities and maybe I shouldn't, but that's how I'm trying to frame it. And for the record, MT and anyone are obviously free to think what they want - I'm just defending my position as they defend theirs. I honestly believe thinking in generalities is what gets us all into this messy position. People are not herd animals for the most part; although, in some situations some of them may act like herd animals. Especially here in the US, people are individuals. By lumping various peoples together we come up with stereotypes. To me, that's the wrong way to approach the problem. I guess trying to understand why people think and do what they do kind of forces one to consider generalities and stereotypes? I'd guess that community very much thinks in generalities because that's what they've seen? It doesn't mean it shouldn't change... ::has realized she's essentially posting in P&M and starts to back out very slowly...::
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2014 10:22:11 GMT -5
I wasn't talking just about the rioting. I was also talking about making every case a "race" case. I don't think it helps to deal and solve the real issues What are the real issues? I would say the real issues, other than the obvious one that blacks are killed by police at shockingly disproportionate rates, are things like the fact that, in Ferguson, 92 percent of vehicle searches are of vehicles occupied by blacks even though a higher rate of positive hits (contraband found) occur in white occupied vehicles (22 percent for blacks versus 34 percent for whites).
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Nov 25, 2014 10:22:51 GMT -5
I honestly believe thinking in generalities is what gets us all into this messy position. People are not herd animals for the most part; although, in some situations some of them may act like herd animals. Especially here in the US, people are individuals. By lumping various peoples together we come up with stereotypes. To me, that's the wrong way to approach the problem. I guess trying to understand why people think and do what they do kind of forces one to consider generalities and stereotypes? I'd guess that community very much thinks in generalities because that's what they've seen? It doesn't mean it shouldn't change... ::has realized she's essentially posting in P&M and starts to back out very slowly...:: Now, now. Politics isn't the same board it was a couple of years ago. Our posters do a darned good job of keeping a contentious subject battle-free. Sure, there are disagreements, but I've got to give the posters credit for their effort to keep it at that and not escalate. You hit right on my point. If we can just stop ourselves from thinking in generalities about people this type of thing will cease, over time. Give each person consideration as a human being, regardless of any differences. We are, after all, people before we're anything else.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 25, 2014 10:23:24 GMT -5
I honestly believe thinking in generalities is what gets us all into this messy position. People are not herd animals for the most part; although, in some situations some of them may act like herd animals. Especially here in the US, people are individuals. By lumping various peoples together we come up with stereotypes. To me, that's the wrong way to approach the problem. I guess trying to understand why people think and do what they do kind of forces one to consider generalities and stereotypes? I'd guess that community very much thinks in generalities because that's what they've seen? It doesn't mean it shouldn't change... ::has realized she's essentially posting in P&M and starts to back out very slowly...:: ...Too late.
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b2r
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Post by b2r on Nov 25, 2014 10:23:40 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2014 10:26:35 GMT -5
White people are animals. Black people are thugs. White people cause disturbances and black people cause riots. Fox News terminology conversion chart Whites | Blacks | Protesters Supporters Patriots Rally | Mob Agitators Thugs Riot |
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