Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 10:59:13 GMT -5
Seriously? Probably for the same reasons whites shoot so many whites. Not all blacks in the USA are shooting at each other. There are a higher percentage of black on black shootings vs white on white shootings I would think you would be very happy about that.
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Ombud
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Post by Ombud on Jan 22, 2015 11:45:48 GMT -5
You have no idea what my race is so your response is very similar to a child saying if you don't agree with me I'm going home
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 11:57:44 GMT -5
You have no idea what my race is so your response is very similar to a child saying if you don't agree with me I'm going home A black mother would understand why someone would say 'BLACK LIVES MATTER''.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 11:59:04 GMT -5
There are a higher percentage of black on black shootings vs white on white shootings Compare poverty rates instead of skin color for shootings. so... they get a pass because they are poor. ok
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Ombud
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Post by Ombud on Jan 22, 2015 12:04:56 GMT -5
And black mothers ARE saying why so many black on black shootings?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 12:11:06 GMT -5
Good article, Billis. I read the article. And you have to admit, it's a minority of one. I will admit Michelle Obama is an outstanding black leader who has promoted the black on black issue. She should.
I think where I am concerned is when Sharpton and other so-called "black leaders" demands an investigation and "justice" it is always a white on black issue. When did he organize a demonstration or investigation in front of a media camera demanding an investigation of a black on black crime?
And I imagine the MSNBC'S and CNN'S of the world find it much easier to promote the first, rather than the second issue, but damn, it would be nice if Sharpton and Jackson's of the world would publicly go on record and demand the media cover this issue too, and have thousands demonstrate in the street with them. It sure as heck would not hurt their image, and might actually gain some traction with the rest of America.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 12:15:45 GMT -5
Good article, Billis. I read the article. And you have to admit, it's a minority on one. I will admit Michelle Obama is an outstanding black leader who has promoted the black on black issue. She should.
I think where I am concerned is when Sharpton and other so-called "black leaders" demands an investigation and "justice" it is always a white on black issue. When did he organize a demonstration or investigation in front of a media camera demanding an investigation of a black on black crime?
And I imagine the MSNBC'S and CNN'S of the world find it much easier to promote the first, rather than the second issue, but damn, it would be nice if Sharpton and Jackson's of the world would publicly go on record and demand the media cover this issue too, and have thousands demonstrate in the street with them. It sure as heck would not hurt their image, and might actually gain some traction with the rest of America.
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? Do you have any idea what city leaders, church leaders and the police are doing in Memphis to reduce black-on-black crime?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 12:19:46 GMT -5
I read the article. And you have to admit, it's a minority on one. I will admit Michelle Obama is an outstanding black leader who has promoted the black on black issue. She should.
I think where I am concerned is when Sharpton and other so-called "black leaders" demands an investigation and "justice" it is always a white on black issue. When did he organize a demonstration or investigation in front of a media camera demanding an investigation of a black on black crime?
And I imagine the MSNBC'S and CNN'S of the world find it much easier to promote the first, rather than the second issue, but damn, it would be nice if Sharpton and Jackson's of the world would publicly go on record and demand the media cover this issue too, and have thousands demonstrate in the street with them. It sure as heck would not hurt their image, and might actually gain some traction with the rest of America.
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? okay, spelling error. Happy? I have to get a can of compressed air and clean the keyboard too.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 12:22:09 GMT -5
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? okay, spelling error. Happy? I have to get a can of compressed air and clean the keyboard too.
How about your adressing your majority of one statement.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 22, 2015 12:22:22 GMT -5
If black mothers care about their sons and daughters, perhaps they ought to raise them better and set better examples for them.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 12:23:04 GMT -5
I read the article. And you have to admit, it's a minority on one. I will admit Michelle Obama is an outstanding black leader who has promoted the black on black issue. She should.
I think where I am concerned is when Sharpton and other so-called "black leaders" demands an investigation and "justice" it is always a white on black issue. When did he organize a demonstration or investigation in front of a media camera demanding an investigation of a black on black crime?
And I imagine the MSNBC'S and CNN'S of the world find it much easier to promote the first, rather than the second issue, but damn, it would be nice if Sharpton and Jackson's of the world would publicly go on record and demand the media cover this issue too, and have thousands demonstrate in the street with them. It sure as heck would not hurt their image, and might actually gain some traction with the rest of America.
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? Do you have any idea what city leaders, church leaders and the police are doing in Memphis to reduce black-on-black crime? No I do not. Please fill us in. You might change my opinion on this important subject.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 12:25:29 GMT -5
I read the article. And you have to admit, it's a minority on one. I will admit Michelle Obama is an outstanding black leader who has promoted the black on black issue. She should.
I think where I am concerned is when Sharpton and other so-called "black leaders" demands an investigation and "justice" it is always a white on black issue. When did he organize a demonstration or investigation in front of a media camera demanding an investigation of a black on black crime?
And I imagine the MSNBC'S and CNN'S of the world find it much easier to promote the first, rather than the second issue, but damn, it would be nice if Sharpton and Jackson's of the world would publicly go on record and demand the media cover this issue too, and have thousands demonstrate in the street with them. It sure as heck would not hurt their image, and might actually gain some traction with the rest of America.
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? Do you have any idea what city leaders, church leaders and the police are doing in Memphis to reduce black-on-black crime? And for clarification, it was a" minority" of one, not majority....... my mistake was "on", not minority.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 12:29:11 GMT -5
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? Do you have any idea what city leaders, church leaders and the police are doing in Memphis to reduce black-on-black crime? No I do not. Please fill us in. You might change my opinion on this important subject.
You really should have looked into what Memhis is doing to reduce black-on-black crime. It would at least tell me and others you are aware it is a recognized problem by the police, pastors and city leaders. That you state you do not know, tells me your comments are baseless and you just make stuff up. Do your homework.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 12:30:41 GMT -5
What on earth is a "majority on(sic) one"? Do you have any idea what city leaders, church leaders and the police are doing in Memphis to reduce black-on-black crime? And for clarification, it was a" minority" of one, not majority....... my mistake was "on", not minority. My error writing majority. So what was your minority of one comment about?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 12:43:56 GMT -5
Compare poverty rates instead of skin color for shootings. so... they get a pass because they are poor. ok
Wow. I don't understand why anyone would give poor people a pass for shooting people. YMMV What I was talking about was directly related to what I quoted. The significant factor that one should use when looking shooting statistics is socio-economic status, not skin color.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 13:00:03 GMT -5
And for clarification, it was a" minority" of one, not majority....... my mistake was "on", not minority. My error writing majority. So what was your minority of one comment about? I would suggest YOU do your homework on this. Hint: It was the title of the article that you congratulated Bills on.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jan 22, 2015 13:02:53 GMT -5
No I do not. Please fill us in. You might change my opinion on this important subject.
You really should have looked into what Memhis is doing to reduce black-on-black crime. It would at least tell me and others you are aware it is a recognized problem by the police, pastors and city leaders. That you state you do not know, tells me your comments are baseless and you just make stuff up. Do your homework. Tennesseer, I implore you to give me some homework with Memphis background. I surely would be disappointed if I found something not to your standard(s).
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 13:56:25 GMT -5
My error writing majority. So what was your minority of one comment about? I would suggest YOU do your homework on this. Hint: It was the title of the article that you congratulated Bills on.
As usual, your comment above does not make sense. The article title is ' Do black leaders ignore black-on-black crime?'. The word 'Leaders' is the plural of Leader. So where is the "majority of one" in the article title?
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jan 22, 2015 14:06:26 GMT -5
There are a higher percentage of black on black shootings vs white on white shootings Compare poverty rates instead of skin color for shootings. theweek.com/articles/452321/appalachia-big-white-ghetto"There's a great deal of drug use, welfare fraud, and the like, but the overall crime rate throughout Appalachia is about two thirds the national average, and the rate of violent crime is half the national average."I have family that lives in this part of the country. The level of poverty is grinding compared to what we see as "poverty" in poor Chicago neighborhoods. Yet the rate of violent crime is not anywhere comparable. I know it's only my perception based on what I read about (and see when we used to visit family out there) but I have noticed lower rates of violent crime in white impoverished areas as compared to what I read about every day here.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 22, 2015 14:10:08 GMT -5
You really should have looked into what Memhis is doing to reduce black-on-black crime. It would at least tell me and others you are aware it is a recognized problem by the police, pastors and city leaders. That you state you do not know, tells me your comments are baseless and you just make stuff up. Do your homework. Tennesseer, I implore you to give me some homework with Memphis background. I surely would be disappointed if I found something not to your standard(s). I gave you homework the other day after you claimed the majority of the 2014 campaign money donated to Mayor Emanuel came from Hollywood. Did you forget you wrote the following? "He took a page out of Obama's playbook. The majority of the money came from Hollywood, not Illinois or Chicago."I asked you for a link to your Hollywood claim and all I got back was the sound of crickets.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 14:10:38 GMT -5
Compare poverty rates instead of skin color for shootings. theweek.com/articles/452321/appalachia-big-white-ghetto"There's a great deal of drug use, welfare fraud, and the like, but the overall crime rate throughout Appalachia is about two thirds the national average, and the rate of violent crime is half the national average."I have family that lives in this part of the country. The level of poverty is grinding compared to what we see as "poverty" in poor Chicago neighborhoods. Yet the rate of violent crime is not anywhere comparable. I know it's only my perception based on what I read about (and see when we used to visit family out there) but I have noticed lower rates of violent crime in white impoverished areas as compared to what I read about every day here. Urban/rural.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jan 22, 2015 14:48:37 GMT -5
theweek.com/articles/452321/appalachia-big-white-ghetto"There's a great deal of drug use, welfare fraud, and the like, but the overall crime rate throughout Appalachia is about two thirds the national average, and the rate of violent crime is half the national average."I have family that lives in this part of the country. The level of poverty is grinding compared to what we see as "poverty" in poor Chicago neighborhoods. Yet the rate of violent crime is not anywhere comparable. I know it's only my perception based on what I read about (and see when we used to visit family out there) but I have noticed lower rates of violent crime in white impoverished areas as compared to what I read about every day here. Urban/rural. Then how do you account for this? graphics.chicagotribune.com/under-the-gun/2014/Go through the pictures. We have pockets of poverty in Chicago areas that are white, black, latino, and Asian in various neighborhoods. The Tribune is covering ALL shooting deaths, not just select demographics. Why the hell are the folks who are mourning their loved ones concentrated in one demographic? It's more than poverty. One of the saddest stories I read was this: www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/music/reich/ct-aaron-rushing-kenwood-jazz-band-20141209-column.html#page=2This story doesn't mention it, but another one on him did. His grandmother moved there from another area in the city to get him and his brother into a "safer neighborhood". He had the talent to get out of the "ghetto". The area where he was shot? A few blocks away from where I lived as a kid.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 15:05:58 GMT -5
I didn't find where there was a statistical analysis of anything at the site. Did I miss it?
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jan 22, 2015 15:29:58 GMT -5
I didn't find where there was a statistical analysis of anything at the site. Did I miss it? Are you implying the paper is choosing to show only photos of those murdered who belong to a certain demographic? How about you do some work and post links to statistical analysis that refute what is shown in the site? BTW the week (which is a British owned publication BTW) published some stats. Now are you claiming those are completely false and not fact checked? (I'll rely on a British publication over a US publication for fact checking any day of the week). Since you don't seem motivated to do any work here you go: Homicide[edit] "According to the US Department of Justice, blacks accounted for 52.5% of homicide offenders from 1980 to 2008, with whites 45.3% and "Other" 2.2%. The offending rate for blacks was almost 8 times higher than whites (per 100,000), and the victim rate 6 times higher (per 100,000). Most murders were intraracial, with 84% of white homicide victims murdered by whites, and 93% of black victims murdered by blacks.[32][33][34]" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_StatesThere, that really didn't take much effort at all.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 15:54:33 GMT -5
I didn't find where there was a statistical analysis of anything at the site. Did I miss it? Are you implying the paper is choosing to show only photos of those murdered who belong to a certain demographic? How about you do some work and post links to statistical analysis that refute what is shown in the site? BTW the week (which is a British owned publication BTW) published some stats. Now are you claiming those are completely false and not fact checked? (I'll rely on a British publication over a US publication for fact checking any day of the week). Since you don't seem motivated to do any work here you go: Homicide[edit] "According to the US Department of Justice, blacks accounted for 52.5% of homicide offenders from 1980 to 2008, with whites 45.3% and "Other" 2.2%. The offending rate for blacks was almost 8 times higher than whites (per 100,000), and the victim rate 6 times higher (per 100,000). Most murders were intraracial, with 84% of white homicide victims murdered by whites, and 93% of black victims murdered by blacks.[32][33][34]" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_StatesThere, that really didn't take much effort at all. Do you have a link to those "theweek" stats? Here is some work I did for you: Poverty and race/ethnicity
The US Census declared that in 2010 15.1% of the general population lived in poverty:[42] 9.9% of all white persons 12.1% of all Asian persons 26.6% of all Hispanic persons (of any race) 28.4% of all black persons. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_the_United_States#Poverty_and_race.2Fethnicity
Yes, it is easy to get simple statistics. What is difficult it to look at the interplay between poverty, race, and urbanization.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jan 22, 2015 16:54:17 GMT -5
billisonboard - I'm not claiming anything is easy, however I thought your first argument was that poverty was the single biggest indicator of violent crime? I then provided an example (of a pretty large part of the country) where that was not the case - which you then said was an issue of urban vs rural influences (despite stats that show rural areas have higher rates of gun ownership). I then link to an article that covers ALL shooting deaths during a year covering an urban area that has a large diversity of demographic populations with poverty concentrated in many neighborhoods yet the overwhelming majority of those murdered fell into one demographic. Even though that demographic is about 13% of the population they account for more than half of the homicides. If it were just about poverty we would see similar rates of homicides among the Hispanic population (based on your stats), but that is not the case. As far as the original article, I believe this may have been one of the studies they used for their source material: www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/189560.pdfIt is more than poverty, race, and urbanization. There are increasing studies that show it is more about the sense of community. I can't link to a source This is what I originally responded to.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 17:35:27 GMT -5
"I'm not claiming anything is easy, however I thought your first argument was that poverty was the single biggest indicator of violent crime? I then provided an example (of a pretty large part of the country) where that was not the case - which you then said was an issue of urban vs rural influences (despite stats that show rural areas have higher rates of gun ownership)."Actually, I am arguing is that if you look at perpetrators of violent crime: 1) with their socioeconomic status, and 2) with their race that a low socioeconomic status is a better predictor than race. In addition on the lower urban/rural rates: While crime in Appalachia is low compared to national averages (see Exhibit l), part of this is due to the predominately nonmetropolitan character of the Region. Crime levels in nonmetropolitan areas in every part of the country are almost always well below those of metropolitan locations. (page 6 of link provided by you in reply #828) I then link to an article that covers ALL shooting deaths during a year covering an urban area that has a large diversity of demographic populations with poverty concentrated in many neighborhoods yet the overwhelming majority of those murdered fell into one demographic. Even though that demographic is about 13% of the population they account for more than half of the homicides. If it were just about poverty we would see similar rates of homicides among the Hispanic population (based on your stats), but that is not the case.First: The racial makeup of the city in 2010 was 32% black (including Hispanics), 45% white (31% non Hispanic white + 14% white Hispanics), 5% Asian (including Hispanics), and 3% from two or more races (including Hispanics). en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Chicago Secondly: We do not have the percentages of each race's poverty rates.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 18:27:04 GMT -5
Well... people that AREN'T at fault shouldn't be found at fault... common sense to me. Prosecution or not I hope the message is sent.
And neither you or I have the information to determine whether or not Wilson fucked up. Common sense tells me regardless of a criminal case these incidents will help prevent incidents in the future. The autopsy (3 independent ones, actually) says he didn't fuck up... they released those findings (well the findings of one of them... the others can be assumed, since they concurred) So yes, we do have the information.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 18:29:54 GMT -5
It'd be nice if that was actually a readable link. Wouldn't let me read it without paying a subscription fee. So, I didn't read it.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 22, 2015 18:32:36 GMT -5
It'd be nice if that was actually a readable link. Wouldn't let me read it without paying a subscription fee. So, I didn't read it. Dang. Didn't do that to me when I first went to it. Thanks for letting me know it was doing that.
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