DD & MIL's Issues

[Pants]

Pat - you are so close to getting a break finally. Hang in there and don't get derailed this close to the finish line! 

In terms of your DH, yes, you guys do seem on different pages. Somehow, eventually you're going to have to figure that out, but not now.

[zibazinski]

Maybe some counseling too. I'm not a fan of counsellors but it may be helpful.

[busymom]

I vote for "just breathe". Once your DD is in her new place, do nothing. And, I agree that now may not be the time for any big decisions. Just catch up on your rest, go out to eat, & just relax for awhile. You've been going 100 miles an hour, trying to deal with everyone & everything for so long, that it'll take time to allow yourself to slow down.

[bean29]

Sept 2, 2015 10:19:49 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I'm not upset, I am royally pissed, buy 2 more rent houses, that made me madder then anything in the world he

could have said. Like I said, to much said today. And what I told her did not upset DD at all.  At this rate, he might

as well just keep working, saving money, more and more is about his only concern. 

Hopefully he will dismiss the idea now that he knows how you feel. My DH sometimes proposes things I don't agree with. I find if I say what I think, and leave him to reflect for awhile, he will change his plans. Our current dilemma is someone approached and is interested in purchasing our vacant rental. We don't know xactly what it is worth and they are working on street, so value will better when street reopens. He was intrigued by selling as-is, vs. completely repaired. I think we will wait a year and he can do some updates.

[zibazinski]

She has no business driving anyway.

[NastyWoman]

@patstab, big  for you.  You are almost there just a few more days!  And as far as DH is concerned, yes he was more than a little off with his additional rental homes and you rightfully told him so.  However, I may be wrong (wouldn't be the first time, nor would it be the last time) I can somewhat see where he is coming from.  From his POV he has been working all these years so that you have enough money for your own retirement plus a legacy for your DD.  Now the situation with DD is changing but for him this is be a big adjustment as well and it will take time to get that through his thick head.

I would say, keep telling him "no" if he comes up with another likewise scheme, and once DD is in her new home start looking for that camper deal so you don't have to give up on this dream of yours.  you have given too many of those up already and enough is enough!

[zibazinski]

Sept 2, 2015 14:22:23 GMT -5 @patstab said:

Went over keys are hanging in the normal place

I told her quit saying people are stealing things, in fact 2 sets

were there and I brought another home.

I said you are having problems, she says I'm not that bad. We are thinking

of going down to my moms old house and getting away from everybody. I

said, not going to happen, its rented and also belongs to DH and his brother,

FIL signed it over to them. I will go down and sleep in the car down there,

I said go ahead they will call the police. Well I can go to the highrise, I said

you need more then that.  You need to eat, need companionship, and more.

So we talked about it but it won't happen. I told her please don't wait till

we have to make you do something.  She said she won't bother me, well

that won't happen.  She is going to get better, I told her no she isn't.

She goes I don't have the money I said yes, you do. 

Don't and let me repeat this, don't borrow more trouble from your MIL. She has no business driving a car and she needs to STOP bothering you except for what you normally do for her, whether that be grocery shopping or doctor appointments. Let all her calls go to voice mail, then once a week or whatever you decide is suitable for her needs, go there. Jumping up and running over there whenever she calls is nonsense. 

[zibazinski]

Engaging her in conversation is as futile as engaging DD. maybe worse. Why bother?

[zibazinski]

I bet you do. Totally stress related. 

[dannylion]

Dementia/Alzheimer's is such a cruel disease.  It steals the ability to reason and recognize reality and often involves hallucinations that are absolutely real to the person. It is so frustrating trying to interact with someone with dementia because they are so sure that what they believe is happening or has happened is true, and they don't remember what you told them last week about the same situation because their short-term memory is gone.  

My mom had Alzheimer's for many years before she had a stroke that immobilized her, which was a horrible thing but a sort of perverse blessing in a way.  After her stroke, she was cared for in a good nursing home, and my Dad, while devastated and determined to spend all day, every day with her, no longer had the stress of caring for her or worrying about whether she would wander away if not watched. She had vivid hallucinations (visual and auditory) and would see people who were not there or whole vistas and landscapes that did not exist.  Before her stroke, she would lose/hide things, but I think it wasn't so much that she was hiding them as she was putting them away. She was obsessed with tidying up. One Thanksgiving I was getting ready to make green bean casserole at their house and had all the ingredients out on the counter. I turned around to get the dish and utensils out, and while my back was turned, Mom had put everything away.  I tried to explain what I was doing, but she was convinced that I had "made a mess" that she had to clear up. Five minutes later she had no recollection of the incident.   

It's no good trying to reason with a person suffering from dementia. They no longer have the ability to follow a conversation rationally or retain information. What is happening in their heads is more real to them than the people who are trying to deal with them. They are not being deliberately annoying, even though it may seem like it. They do not have the ability to alter their behavior, so reasoning with them is futile and unnecessarily stressful on the healthy person trying to deal with them.  They will claim not to have been told something that they have been told a hundred times because they genuinely do not remember it.  They are not forgetting on purpose; their brain has betrayed them and they are lost. They sometimes have brief periods of semi-lucidity where they realize something awful is happening to them, and it makes them sad and frightened.   

I'm so sorry you have to deal with this on top of what is going on with your daughter, Pat. It is more than anyone should have to bear alone.  I wish I had some magic words to use to make your MIL reasonable and compliant, but there aren't any. She simply does not have the ability to understand or interact rationally anymore.  I hope you can find someone to help with her or find a way to get her into a supervised living situation to give you some respite.    

I will be thinking good thoughts for you that you can have some peace and rest once your daughter is settled.

[TheOtherMe]

Sept 2, 2015 9:15:57 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I will have to be very careful of what I eat before I fly and eat very sparingly for a couple of days. Hopefully

that will make it ok.  I will also take immodium which can really help. 

Pat, I have similar issues, especially when I am stressed.  I do the same thing when I'm traveling and I also have a prescription medication from my doctor. 

I would still rather fly than drive.  I don't have a motor home, though.  That means I am in search of a rest area if I need the bathroom.

[ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ]

My husband said now you aren't spending the money on a motorhome we can buy a couple more rent houses,
that was the wrong thing to say. I told him forget that, I'm not doing that.

Exactly!!! Because HE wouldn't be around to take care of even more rental properties - all the work would fall onto YOUR shoulders, since he's never home .

I'm relieved to hear that things are moving forward quickly in regards to your daughter's placement. Whatever you do, don't mention to her that it's definitely going to take place on the 9th. That would mean more outbursts & screaming - and you've already mentioned she's been violent lately. Say nothing.

[Ombud]

Can you ship her other things after she moves in? She might like getting packages

[kjto1]

Good luck Pat!  Hugs!
I would try to pack one bag to stash in the garage/car.  If you can drop her off in the morning, you can go home and get some more things ready for that day - especially if the maintenance people will come and get them.  Or let her sleep on their bed for one night, and that will give you 24 hours to get some things ready.

[mmhmm]

Sept 2, 2015 20:58:25 GMT -5 @patstab said:

We are talking bed, mattress, chest of drawers, curtains, bedding, recliner, TV, table, all her DVD stuff, some of

her stuffed things, pillows. Lamp, computer, you name it, shoes, clothing some summer and a few fall things.

The maintenance people will come and get them but I need to get them ready and can't do it. Just like I can't do

anything on my trip, can't talk about it as she might overhear. 

If you want to get this going with the least amount of trouble, you might consider contacting a small moving company in your area and asking them to come get this stuff and move it for you. You've probably got it boxed up pretty well, but a moving company can even help with that. If you've got strangers in your home to help take her things to where they need to be, she'll be less likely to go completely ballistic on you. You've said before she tends to be more controlled in the presence of strangers. It'll cost you something, but it would be worth it to me to get this done without letting her cow you into submission with her antics. She's going to have to go. There's no way around it. It's time she realized this is going to happen and whatever is necessary to make it happen as pain-free as possible for you is exactly what's going to be done.

[skubikky]

Pat, you really do have a lot going on.
It'll work out but of course not without extracting all your energy in the process.

I was thinking about your MIL's dementia and obvious inability to take care of herself anymore.
Your DH, besides needing to be home for you and your daughter, needs to take care of his mother's living situation.

It sounds like both she and her sister need memory care in a good facility.

Neither should be driving.
Her doctor can recommend an evaluation by a OT/PT and they will report their findings to the state/DMV.

We just did this for my Dad.  Except the evaluation was done at the VA.
He failed the written test so never even got as far as the road test.

Your husband is the one who needs to see to this, not you.
I suspect that your nest egg is big enough now to assure a secure retirement and your DD's well being.

If you pass on buying a big RV I bet your DH could stop working within a few months.     It appears that he keeps finding reasons to keep working?

I know that you're frustrated, tired and dealing with your own physical issues right now.   Your MIL needs a care taker or your DH to get her into a good facility.

You don't have the bandwidth now to care for her.   Just not possible unless you're going to compromise your own health more than it already has been.
All the best.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Sept 2, 2015 19:39:33 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I bought some over the counter prevacid for my stomach, going to try that. Got my tramadol filled that has already helped my

back. I sleep with my back brace some nights and that helps.

I have picked up 4 pounds and that isn't good, I can feel it in my hips, have to work on that but right now not trying to do anything else.

Just finished watering the new garage floor again so it won't crack think I have to do that 2 times a day for 5 days.

Just breathe Pat. 1 week.  You can continue holding everything together for that long.  Then you can just lock yourself into the house or a hotel room or a day spa or wherever you want to be and ignore the world.  It's gonna be ok. 

[Wisconsin Beth]

Hugs Pat.  Lots of hugs. 

[mmhmm]

Sept 3, 2015 8:17:05 GMT -5 @patstab said:

I need to get in her room and pack things, she will go ballistic. Will have to take a suitcase and come home and do it while she isn't here. Will

arrange for the maintenance people to come then too.

This afternoon I am taking her to the day center, I expect grief from that visit too and my stomach is just knotting up.

I did get up this morning and she had fixed herself cereal and milk and was quietly eating. She has taken her bath and came and got my

plate to put it in the sink. She is way to late and besides a few days of good behavior won't last. I am so sad for her but nothing is

changing this decision. We are beyond fortunate to get her placed this quickly and not about to jeopardize it. I know its hard on her too, I can

only imagine the turmoil in her mind and likely can't understand why we are doing this.

I'm sad for her, too, hon. I think we all are. I've sat here and read your posts about this with tears in my eyes - for both of you. Her situation, in some ways, isn't much different than your MIL's. Your MIL is at the stage of dementia where she knows she's not thinking properly but can't control it. That's frightening, and saddening for her. DD is in the same position. She's not so profoundly disabled that she doesn't know she's disabled. She knows and she doesn't want it to be true - but, it is true. So very, very sad. However, we have to realize that people who are affected in this way are still capable of manipulation and they use it often. They manipulate their own thoughts and actions and they manipulate others. It's part of the way they cope. Alzheimer's victims, at this stage, often confabulate to cover up the fact they can't remember. DD manipulates you through going from tantrums to pleasantness. It's not done maliciously. It's done because it's the only way she can feel she has any control at all.

If you're sure the maintenance people will be available at the time you need them, what you plan may work. I'd be sure to let the accepting facility know exactly when they'll be needed so they can be made available. Otherwise, it may become a logistics nightmare.

[zibazinski]

I'm so sorry. These last few days are going to be hell on earth for you. I wish I or one of us could be there for you because you need a friend right not, not virtual, but real.

[bean29]

Sept 3, 2015 9:39:21 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

I'm so sorry. These last few days are going to be hell on earth for you. I wish I or one of us could be there for you because you need a friend right not, not virtual, but real.

I have felt the same way.  I just feel such a need to be there for you physically.  I am waiting for a call from my doctor, hopefully it will be good news -  but I am afraid I will need my vacay for health issues. 

[Ombud]

bean29, hugs & fingers crossed.  

[CCL]

Sept 3, 2015 10:06:52 GMT -5 bean29 said:

Sept 3, 2015 9:39:21 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

I'm so sorry. These last few days are going to be hell on earth for you. I wish I or one of us could be there for you because you need a friend right not, not virtual, but real.

I have felt the same way.  I just feel such a need to be there for you physically.  I am waiting for a call from my doctor, hopefully it will be good news -  but I am afraid I will need my vacay for health issues. 

Hoping for good news for you.

[CCL]

Sept 2, 2015 17:25:37 GMT -5 dannylion said:

Dementia/Alzheimer's is such a cruel disease.  It steals the ability to reason and recognize reality and often involves hallucinations that are absolutely real to the person. It is so frustrating trying to interact with someone with dementia because they are so sure that what they believe is happening or has happened is true, and they don't remember what you told them last week about the same situation because their short-term memory is gone.  

My mom had Alzheimer's for many years before she had a stroke that immobilized her, which was a horrible thing but a sort of perverse blessing in a way.  After her stroke, she was cared for in a good nursing home, and my Dad, while devastated and determined to spend all day, every day with her, no longer had the stress of caring for her or worrying about whether she would wander away if not watched. She had vivid hallucinations (visual and auditory) and would see people who were not there or whole vistas and landscapes that did not exist.  Before her stroke, she would lose/hide things, but I think it wasn't so much that she was hiding them as she was putting them away. She was obsessed with tidying up. One Thanksgiving I was getting ready to make green bean casserole at their house and had all the ingredients out on the counter. I turned around to get the dish and utensils out, and while my back was turned, Mom had put everything away.  I tried to explain what I was doing, but she was convinced that I had "made a mess" that she had to clear up. Five minutes later she had no recollection of the incident.   

It's no good trying to reason with a person suffering from dementia. They no longer have the ability to follow a conversation rationally or retain information. What is happening in their heads is more real to them than the people who are trying to deal with them. They are not being deliberately annoying, even though it may seem like it. They do not have the ability to alter their behavior, so reasoning with them is futile and unnecessarily stressful on the healthy person trying to deal with them.  They will claim not to have been told something that they have been told a hundred times because they genuinely do not remember it.  They are not forgetting on purpose; their brain has betrayed them and they are lost. They sometimes have brief periods of semi-lucidity where they realize something awful is happening to them, and it makes them sad and frightened.   

I'm so sorry you have to deal with this on top of what is going on with your daughter, Pat. It is more than anyone should have to bear alone.  I wish I had some magic words to use to make your MIL reasonable and compliant, but there aren't any. She simply does not have the ability to understand or interact rationally anymore.  I hope you can find someone to help with her or find a way to get her into a supervised living situation to give you some respite.    

I will be thinking good thoughts for you that you can have some peace and rest once your daughter is settled.

[Jaguar]

Hoping the best news for you bean29. <<< BIG HUGS >>>

[bean29]

Thanks for the well wishes everyone, no word yet.

 

[debthaven]

More hugs for you and your DD Pat. I know it's incredibly hard but it really is the right decision.

I agree that your DH's suggestion of more rentals is beyond ridiculous, but except for a few weeks home here and there, he is totally disconnected from basically everything ... from what YOU are going through, from what your DD is going through, from what his mom is going through, and from what his aunt is going through (which you of course shouldn't even have to think about but her state affects your MIL's)

ETA: I also think he is ABSOLUTELY TERRIFIED at the idea of coming home for good. So more rentals = more busy work. 

[Value Buy]

Sept 3, 2015 16:34:12 GMT -5 debthaven said:

More hugs for you and your DD Pat. I know it's incredibly hard but it really is the right decision.

I agree that your DH's suggestion of more rentals is beyond ridiculous, but except for a few weeks home here and there, he is totally disconnected from basically everything ... from what YOU are going through, from what your DD is going through, from what his mom is going through, and from what his aunt is going through (which you of course shouldn't even have to think about but her state affects your MIL's)

ETA: I also think he is ABSOLUTELY TERRIFIED at the idea of coming home for good. So more rentals = more busy work. 

I am not sure how wrong he really is.
Remember Pat and her husband do not believe in stock investments.
They have to put their money to work for them for some equity growth.
This might be a case where that is exactly where they feel "safe" in investing their money. They have always done this, so I could see him say this. It is something he feels "safe" doing.
I get Pat might be finished with rentals, but she has to show her husband she means it.
Just look at her work lists she puts together here every week.
I get worn out just thinking about it, and I am younger than they are.

[CCL]

[Ombud]

I think the stress and fear (yes, fear) of moving DD to a place you wouldn't personally live in is getting to you. But what would happen if she was placed after you died? It'd be in the 1st bed .... nice or not.

And with your DH not here and DD placed, why can't you just get up and go? Your MIL's situation will progress the same whether you're here or not. Your DD's roof over her head will be paid by SSI after you're gone so you really can enjoy some of those hard earned $$ saved or invested

Just go!! Trains sounded awesome. Too bad they're not based in CA