How can people go from one extreme to another?

[whoisjohngalt]

There is a mother in  my homeschooling group who had very lax ideas about diet for her kids.  They ate everything and anything, including some very crappy things. 

Well, her DS has autisim and ever since they got an official diagnosis, she did a complete 180.

She is posting pictures of gluten free, dairy free, egg free foods, Whole Natural Shakes, she is now selling some kind of wonder juice and keep posting messages about all the most natural ways to feed your family. 

It's like she went from eating the crappiest of foods to....I don't even know...the latest "healthiest" of foods.

There are also some women who did this 180 on parenting styles and discipline.   There are other examples as well.

I get that people learn new things and change their habits and behaviors.  But how can you be so convinced of one thing and then so convinced of the complete opposite?  I don't trust people like that at all.

Is it just me being all cynical and cranky?

[milee]

In the case of the mother of the autistic child, I can understand a 180 degree shift. She's probably feeling: scared, guilty, hopeless, like she has no control, worried that her son will never be able to be independent, embarrassed, judged, without many alternatives, confused and 157 other feelings that may be fleeting or may linger.

If she believes that ________________________ (fill in the blank with any number of possible cures/mitigators/remedies, no matter how odd) will provide a glimmer of hope and comfort - why would you be surprised that she not grab that belief and hold on tight?  In her eyes, her "old" life has just ended, why would she care about worrying that she's not being consistent with her past beliefs?

[Deleted]

Well, do you really think she felt the crappy diet was the way to go?  She probably just needed the motivation to change and an autistic child can do that.  I'm pretty lax with diet, and even though I'll defend it as fine, I know it's mainly because I'm lazy and set in my ways.

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Hmmm, depends.

What do you feed YOUR kids?  

[milee]

BTW, I don't think any particular diet causes autism. On the other hand, undiagnosed food allergies or sensitivities in kids can cause health and behavior issues. So if your kid has been diagnosed with something for which there is no "cure" and you're feeling like there's nothing you can do, IMHO it's a very normal reaction to try to find any little way that you can help.  So if you think you might be able to help by testing for and discovering food sensitivities, that's not hurting anything and might bring you comfort because you're at least doing something in a situation that might otherwise feel hopeless.  Maybe finding out your kid is lactose intolerant for example won't cure him, but if it helps him feel more comfortable and able to control certain behavior, that would at least seem like a win.

[whoisjohngalt]

Nov 4, 2014 11:39:00 GMT -5 milee said:

In the case of the mother of the autistic child, I can understand a 180 degree shift. She's probably feeling: scared, guilty, hopeless, like she has no control, worried that her son will never be able to be independent, embarrassed, judged, without many alternatives, confused and 157 other feelings that may be fleeting or may linger.

If she believes that ________________________ (fill in the blank with any number of possible cures/mitigators/remedies, no matter how odd) will provide a glimmer of hope and comfort - why would you be surprised that she not grab that belief and hold on tight?  In her eyes, her "old" life has just ended, why would she care about worrying that she's not being consistent with her past beliefs?

I could see that, but she is a nurse.  She *knew* her son was autistic way before he got an official diagnosis. 

It's just so strange to see people do X one day and then 6 months later do the complete opposite.

I am truly not judging her or other ones.  I just can not imagine completely changing your ideas like that.

[Deleted]

I once had a nurse tell me her kids favorite breakfasts were pop tarts and fruity pebbles. I don't know why we insist on applying sainthood to specific labels... Just cause you complete a 2-4 year course of study, which probably includes one class in a specific subject, doesn't make you superhuman. 

I think when we find out something isn't working. And or we find out knew information that feels like revelation to us, we tend to embrace it with an enthusiasm which, to others, may appear a but crazed...

[lynnerself]

People have "awakenings" or discover new ideas all the time.

It is usually the new convert to an idea that is the most vocal and adamant about it's benefits.
They have "seen the light", changed their lives and want to share with everyone.

[ArchietheDragon]

She sounds like a slippery broad if you ask me. Steer clear.

[whoisjohngalt]

I don't know if it's bc I don't get "enlighten" too easily or I am slow to change, but I can't imagine an idea or topic that would turn me around this fast.  I also don't have a tendency to "go all in".  So, may be that's why it's hard for me to imagine such transformations.

[giramomma]

Maybe, too, she her kids/family accept change better when it comes from an authority figure?

My kids think their teachers walk on water.

My kids can get the same message from us parents and their teacher.  (Example: You need to slow down when you write so people can read it.)

My kids will fight DH and I: arguing, fussing, pouting, etc. The teacher...no issues.

Once I didn't want to discuss DS eating candy when he was getting over an illness. Finally I lied and told him "Look, I called up the dr and he said absolutely not." I didn't hear a peep out of my kid after that.

[Ryan]

I don't find it all that surprising that finding out your kid has autism would prompt a big change.  People go on massive diets simply because they couldn't fit in a ride at the carnival.

[bobosensei]

I am way more offended by the plethora of "vegans" who wear leather, silk, wool, etc or "vegetarians" that *just eat meat once a week*.

In the case of the OP yeah, maybe since the kid has autism the mom might have a little more reason to stick with this, but in most cases all these people making drastic changes don't stick with them for long.  They just go from one fad to the next.  I actually think we've always been this way, but with social media it makes people look a little more ridiculous to a lot more folks.

[Sam_2.0]

Nov 4, 2014 14:24:07 GMT -5 bobosensei said:

I am way more offended by the plethora of "vegans" who wear leather, silk, wool, etc or "vegetarians" that *just eat meat once a week*.

In the case of the OP yeah, maybe since the kid has autism the mom might have a little more reason to stick with this, but in most cases all these people making drastic changes don't stick with them for long.  They just go from one fad to the next.  I actually think we've always been this way, but with social media it makes people look a little more ridiculous to a lot more folks.

I get leather, but why not silk or wool? Or is it avoiding any potential animal product completely?

[imawino]

Nov 4, 2014 11:56:25 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

Nov 4, 2014 11:39:00 GMT -5 milee said:

In the case of the mother of the autistic child, I can understand a 180 degree shift. She's probably feeling: scared, guilty, hopeless, like she has no control, worried that her son will never be able to be independent, embarrassed, judged, without many alternatives, confused and 157 other feelings that may be fleeting or may linger.

If she believes that ________________________ (fill in the blank with any number of possible cures/mitigators/remedies, no matter how odd) will provide a glimmer of hope and comfort - why would you be surprised that she not grab that belief and hold on tight?  In her eyes, her "old" life has just ended, why would she care about worrying that she's not being consistent with her past beliefs?

I could see that, but she is a nurse.  She *knew* her son was autistic way before he got an official diagnosis. 

It's just so strange to see people do X one day and then 6 months later do the complete opposite.

I am truly not judging her or other ones.  I just can not imagine completely changing your ideas like that.

[bobosensei]

Nov 4, 2014 14:35:11 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Nov 4, 2014 14:24:07 GMT -5 bobosensei said:

I am way more offended by the plethora of "vegans" who wear leather, silk, wool, etc or "vegetarians" that *just eat meat once a week*.

In the case of the OP yeah, maybe since the kid has autism the mom might have a little more reason to stick with this, but in most cases all these people making drastic changes don't stick with them for long.  They just go from one fad to the next.  I actually think we've always been this way, but with social media it makes people look a little more ridiculous to a lot more folks.

I get leather, but why not silk or wool? Or is it avoiding any potential animal product completely?

Just as a disclaimer I am not vegan, but yes, they avoid anything that they perceive to cause animal suffering.  So much like they don't consume dairy or eggs because the treatment of the animals to get those products, they do not wear wool or silk because of what it takes to get those products.  

[Tiny]

Nov 4, 2014 12:24:36 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

I don't know if it's bc I don't get "enlighten" too easily or I am slow to change, but I can't imagine an idea or topic that would turn me around this fast.  I also don't have a tendency to "go all in".  So, may be that's why it's hard for me to imagine such transformations.

I get what you are saying.  I'm the same way.  I'm all for change... I'm trying to change a few things about myself, myself. but it's been my experience that it's a slow process - not something that happens overnight.

When someone is loudly preaching their "new ideology" I'm usually a bit skeptical - but mostly I just feel that there's a hint of desperation in the 'preaching'.

I have seen several people loose 50 to 100 pounds and keep it off for years.   I've also witnessed people loose 40 and then gain 50 and then loose 50 and then gain 65 and rinse and repeat until they get to be 100 plus pounds over weight. 

The first group was much more 'quiet' about their change in identity/ideals/whatever.   Yes, if you asked how they did it or how doing it - they'd say something (ususally along the lines of 'eating less and moving more').  Unlike the second group of yo-yo dieters (lots of immediate changes in behavors)   they didn't start every conversations with "I'm drinking this new miracle juice!  I bought a $600 juicer and that's making all the difference!"  Or "I'm only eating meat!  I had 2 pounds of bacon for breakfast! I'm gonna loose so much weight! Yeah me!"

Like I said, I tend to hear desperation when people start to preach about their life changing new habits. 

[Tiny]

Nov 4, 2014 12:45:11 GMT -5 Ryan said:

I don't find it all that surprising that finding out your kid has autism would prompt a big change.  People go on massive diets simply because they couldn't fit in a ride at the carnival.

I'd speculate that the carnival ride was 'the straw that broke the camels back' and not the sole reason for a life transformation.    The thing with being morbidly obese is that generally there's a very real hope that a life transformation is possible.  

I can see where someone who has been given a definite diagnosis of something that can't be cured might might be prompted to attempt a big change (that desperation aspect) in response.     Kinda like how some  terminal cancer patients attempt any sort of anything that promises to 'cure' them even if it goes against everything they have professed to believe as true in the past. 

  

[Tiny]

Nov 4, 2014 14:49:47 GMT -5 bobosensei said:

Nov 4, 2014 14:35:11 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I get leather, but why not silk or wool? Or is it avoiding any potential animal product completely?

Just as a disclaimer I am not vegan, but yes, they avoid anything that they perceive to cause animal suffering.  So much like they don't consume dairy or eggs because the treatment of the animals to get those products, they do not wear wool or silk because of what it takes to get those products.  

Vegans might also avoid any insect products as well..so certain makeup ingredients or dyes.   They may even avoid products that are 'tested on animals'.   

The 'vegetarian' who eats meat/fish once a week - is either a pescitarian (if they don't eat meat only seafood) or a flexitarian (eats meat and fish occassionally) -- if you want to split hairs and give  names to groups of dietary rules.   I say I'm a flexitarian when someone comments on how I always order something without meat or they've noticed my lunches are generally critter free.
I'll eat meat/fish if it's 'convenient' - like when joining family/friends at the primo steak and seafood restaurant to celebrate something.  Or if meat is part of the 'traditional meal' - like Thanksgiving or the Family Picnic when we roast lamb or a pig. 
I'm not a vegetarian even though I may be mistaken for one.     I don't have enough moral outrage to totally and completely avoid eating meat/fish and to make a big fuss about it... but I do have enough to feel that not eating critter with every meal is probably a worth while endeavor towards making the world a better place. I have gone 6 months with out eating critters  (eggs and dairy were on the menu).

[Ryan]

Nov 4, 2014 15:18:09 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Nov 4, 2014 12:45:11 GMT -5 Ryan said:

I don't find it all that surprising that finding out your kid has autism would prompt a big change.  People go on massive diets simply because they couldn't fit in a ride at the carnival.

I'd speculate that the carnival ride was 'the straw that broke the camels back' and not the sole reason for a life transformation.    The thing with being morbidly obese is that generally there's a very real hope that a life transformation is possible.  

I can see where someone who has been given a definite diagnosis of something that can't be cured might might be prompted to attempt a big change (that desperation aspect) in response.     Kinda like how some  terminal cancer patients attempt any sort of anything that promises to 'cure' them even if it goes against everything they have professed to believe as true in the past. 

  

I think that goes without saying, but it was still the catalyst that propelled them to change their lifestyle.  Nobody switches things up on a dime...the lady the OP mentions probably knew she was eating crappy the entire time.

[whoisjohngalt]

Thank you Tiny for post #16.  That's exactly what I was trying to convey.

And it's not just the diets.  I've seen people do that on all kinds of various issues.

ETA:  My mistrust comes from not understanding how you can strongly believe in A and then a few months later just as strongly believe in B.  I don't get.

[gooddecisions]

I don't know, maybe because there are several published book written about how diet can improve behaviors caused by Autism. Jenny McCarthy convinced a lot of people she cured her son's autism with diet and probiotics, you know- after the vaccinations caused it. A lot has been said since then about how he never really had autism, but changing diet may still give hope to people.

Maybe the doctor who provided the diagnosis made some suggestions, so she's embracing them. I could totally see how an autism diagnosis could change everything from what you eat, to what you clean with and store in your house, to what you wear, to the activities you fill your day with and maybe even what you wear.

[Deleted]

I strongly believed that if I brought up kids around junk food, it was always around, not taboo, kids would be occasional consumers and learn natural moderation. Worked great with son. Congrats to me in good parenting! Then daughter came along...<br><br>Eat less exercise more was never going to work for me. I required a major food overhaul, which included rethinking what are 'good' and 'bad' foods. It was a total change. <br><br>Im im not set in my ways too badly I guess. If I ask why or why not and someone can satisfactorily explain it yo me, I have no problem embracing something new. <br><br><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Also, sometimes people's first position is more upbringing and tradition than thought out action. <br><br></span><br>

[Tiny]

Google Doublethink


From the Wikipedia:

Doublethink is the act of ordinary people simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts.

I think even Aristotle commented on this amazing ability.

It's one of the amazing powers of human nature.


(I think it also plays into things like stockholme syndrome and bride kidnapping.)

[weltschmerz]

Nov 4, 2014 12:00:55 GMT -5 oped said:

I once had a nurse tell me her kids favorite breakfasts were pop tarts and fruity pebbles. I don't know why we insist on applying sainthood to specific labels... Just cause you complete a 2-4 year course of study, which probably includes one class in a specific subject, doesn't make you superhuman. 

I think when we find out something isn't working. And or we find out knew information that feels like revelation to us, we tend to embrace it with an enthusiasm which, to others, may appear a but crazed...

I'm a nurse who would have loved her child to eat Pop Tarts or Fruity Pebbles. Anything.
My kid would refuse to eat breakfast. Period.
He would go to school hungry and I'd be grateful for any fuel at all.

[weltschmerz]

Nov 4, 2014 14:49:47 GMT -5 bobosensei said:

Nov 4, 2014 14:35:11 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I get leather, but why not silk or wool? Or is it avoiding any potential animal product completely?

Just as a disclaimer I am not vegan, but yes, they avoid anything that they perceive to cause animal suffering.  So much like they don't consume dairy or eggs because the treatment of the animals to get those products, they do not wear wool or silk because of what it takes to get those products.  

I'm a pescatarian, but I still wear leather, and here's why.
Cows and pigs are slaughtered by the millions in order to supply the populace with Big Macs and BBQ ribs. Millions.
What do you suggest we do with the skin? Throw it out?
If I buy leather shoes, I'm not creating more of a demand for leather. Those animals will be killed for food ANYWAY, whether I buy leather shoes or not.
However, if I buy a steak or pork chops, I'm creating more of demand, and more animals will be killed. Simples.

[siralynn]

Nov 4, 2014 15:26:39 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Nov 4, 2014 14:49:47 GMT -5 bobosensei said:

Just as a disclaimer I am not vegan, but yes, they avoid anything that they perceive to cause animal suffering.  So much like they don't consume dairy or eggs because the treatment of the animals to get those products, they do not wear wool or silk because of what it takes to get those products.  

Vegans might also avoid any insect products as well..so certain makeup ingredients or dyes.   They may even avoid products that are 'tested on animals'.   

 

The "I don't use products that were tested on animals" thing drives me nuts. I get the idea, but the only reason that it's even possible to have products that are "not tested on animals" is because prior animal testing has generated a big list of ingredients that are "generally regarded as safe."

It would also be impossible to develop any new medications without animal testing. Who is going to volunteer for a clinical trial for a cancer medications that hasn't been tested in an animal model first?

[Shooby]

Kind of like a reformed smoker. They love smoking but when they quit it is now the worst thing ever.

[whoisjohngalt]

Nov 4, 2014 16:25:33 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Google Doublethink


From the Wikipedia:

Doublethink is the act of ordinary people simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts.

I think even Aristotle commented on this amazing ability.

It's one of the amazing powers of human nature.


(I think it also plays into things like stockholme syndrome and bride kidnapping.)

Very interesting.  Thank you!!

[sesfw]

It is usually the new convert to an idea that is the most vocal and adamant about it's benefits.
They have "seen the light", changed their lives and want to share with everyone.

This is me after DH had his heart attack and was told to limit sodium to 1500mg MAX per day.  I will get on a soap box any time mentions dieting.  DH lost 65 lbs and has kept it off just by watching the sodium.  This automatically made him watch his portion size.

PS: I lost 40 lbs by watching my sodium.  The other 15 was compliments of chemo.