Malaysian Plane shot down by Russian Border 290 souls lost

[Artemis Windsong]

news.msn.com/world/malaysian-passenger-plane-crashes-in-ukraine-near-russian-border-ifax

[Virgil Showlion]

It's not known yet conclusively that it was shot down.

It's a safe bet that it was, but that's not confirmed.

[Opti]

Artemis, can you change Boarder to Border in your thread title?

I read the thread as being the plane was shot down by some Russian living(boarding) at someone's place.

Thanks!

[Value Buy]

Malaysian Airlines is on a roll with bad luck this year.

[Virgil Showlion]

I guess Interfax is willing to go on record that it was shot down by a "BUK" missile system. Ukraine is blaming pro-Russian rebels. Pro-Russian rebels are blaming the Ukraine. John McCain is likely bouncing happily from foot to foot, clapping his hands...

[Blonde Granny]

Jul 17, 2014 11:25:47 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

I guess Interfax is willing to go on record that it was shot down by a "BUK" missile system. Ukraine is blaming pro-Russian rebels. Pro-Russian rebels are blaming the Ukraine. John McCain is likely bouncing happily from foot to foot, clapping his hands...

And President Obama runs off to the golf course......just sayin'

However, it does make me wonder a little about the other Malaysian plane. Is there really no such thing as a coincidence?

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 17, 2014 11:35:07 GMT -5 Blonde Granny said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:25:47 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

I guess Interfax is willing to go on record that it was shot down by a "BUK" missile system. Ukraine is blaming pro-Russian rebels. Pro-Russian rebels are blaming the Ukraine. John McCain is likely bouncing happily from foot to foot, clapping his hands...

And President Obama runs off to the golf course......just sayin'

However, it does make me wonder a little about the other Malaysian plane. Is there really no such thing as a coincidence?

It does seem odd that two Malaysian Airlines planes would be brought down in the span of a few months, but if there's a conspiracy involved, I have no idea what it could be.

PS: Pres. Obama was already on the golf course.

[Opti]

Jul 17, 2014 11:35:07 GMT -5 Blonde Granny said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:25:47 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

I guess Interfax is willing to go on record that it was shot down by a "BUK" missile system. Ukraine is blaming pro-Russian rebels. Pro-Russian rebels are blaming the Ukraine. John McCain is likely bouncing happily from foot to foot, clapping his hands...

And President Obama runs off to the golf course......just sayin'

However, it does make me wonder a little about the other Malaysian plane. Is there really no such thing as a coincidence?

You could try reading the schedule once and awhile just to be correct,, just pointing it out...

www.whitehouse.gov/schedule

No golf on the schedule today, FWIW.

[ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ]

The thread title is bugging me too. The plane wasn't shot-down by a Russian Boarder - it's even unclear if it WAS shot-down - details are still sketchy as to why it crashed.

And it "Went Down in Ukraine - Near the Russian Border"

[djAdvocate]

Jul 17, 2014 12:00:09 GMT -5 Opti said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:35:07 GMT -5 Blonde Granny said:

And President Obama runs off to the golf course......just sayin'

However, it does make me wonder a little about the other Malaysian plane. Is there really no such thing as a coincidence?

You could try reading the schedule once and awhile just to be correct,, just pointing it out...

www.whitehouse.gov/schedule

No golf on the schedule today, FWIW.

please don't disturb a rant with facts.  it spoils all the misery.

[djAdvocate]

from the amount of wreckage i am seeing in the photos, it appears that the jet may have attempted a landing.

[Value Buy]

Jul 17, 2014 12:08:44 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Jul 17, 2014 12:00:09 GMT -5 Opti said:

You could try reading the schedule once and awhile just to be correct,, just pointing it out...

www.whitehouse.gov/schedule

No golf on the schedule today, FWIW.

please don't disturb a rant with facts.  it spoils all the misery.

OK, how about the President was daydreaming of being on the golf course while it happened?

[djAdvocate]

you know what is odd, VB?  i just looked up MH370 last night, for the first time in 3 weeks.  (shudder)

[steff]

A plane crashes on the other side of the world, yet BLAME OBAMA!  


GMAFB

[busymom]

The first article claims debris is spread over 9 miles. That is not a plane crashing into the ground. If the debris field is that large, it was shot down (or blown out of the sky).

[djAdvocate]

Jul 17, 2014 13:24:53 GMT -5 busymom said:

The first article claims debris is spread over 9 miles. That is not a plane crashing into the ground. If the debris field is that large, it was shot down (or blown out of the sky).

i'm just going by the pictures (and the description of the debris), busymom.  but if the article is correct, then yes, that is consistent with an explosion at altitude.

edit: i should also mention that the debris appears to be in a plain, not in hilly or mountainous area.  a skilled pilot can ditch a plane on level ground, generally speaking.  so, that would also indicate something catastrophic at altitude.

[PK Bucko]

Jul 17, 2014 11:39:02 GMT -5 @wrongsideof30 said:

Have passenger planes been flying over that area? It doesn't seem like a good idea to have a flight path over what some call a war zone.

Good question. I've been following this all morning and wondering why the hell they were in that airspace.

[Tennesseer]

The Ukrainian rebels claim they have the black boxes and will only turn them over to Russian authorities.

Expect a cover-up.

[Tennesseer]

Jul 17, 2014 13:29:34 GMT -5 PK Bucko said:

Jul 17, 2014 11:39:02 GMT -5 @wrongsideof30 said:

Have passenger planes been flying over that area? It doesn't seem like a good idea to have a flight path over what some call a war zone.

Good question. I've been following this all morning and wondering why the hell they were in that airspace.

Maybe the word did not get out to all of the world's airline industries. 

1:45 p.m. EDT: Aviation safety authorities in the United States and Europe warned pilots in April about potential risks flying in or near Ukraine airspace, where a Malaysian passenger airliner went down on Thursday. The U.S. Federal Aviation Administration on April 23 issued a "special notice" regarding Ukrainian airspace to U.S. aviators and air carriers advising them not to fly in airspace around the Crimean city of Simferopol without special approval of the U.S. government. The notice also warned U.S. operators and pilots flying in other parts of Ukraine, including Kiev, Lvov, Dnepropetrovsk and Odessa, to "exercise extreme caution due to the continuing potential for instability."  The warning remains in effect until April 23, 2015.

Malaysian airliner downed in Ukraine war zone, 295 dead

[djAdvocate]

NOTAMS are normally posted worldwide, but i think each country has their own protocols.

time for Malaysia to review theirs. 

[❤ mollymouser ❤]

On Wednesday evening, a Ukrainian fighter jet was shot down by an air-to-air missile from a Russian plane, Ukrainian authorities said Thursday, adding to what Kiev says is mounting evidence that Moscow is directly supporting the separatist insurgents in eastern Ukraine

The Federal Aviation Administration tells CBS News that the agency prohibited U.S. carriers from flying through this region.

Earlier this week, Ukraine said a military transport plane was shot down Monday by a missile fired from Russian territory.

*   *   *

Prayers and condolences to the family and friends of the passengers and crew

[Virgil Showlion]

There are some really weird conspiracy theories coming out of this one.

Some sources are reporting that Pres. Putin's plane was in the same general vicinity of MH17 when it came down. The BUK missile fired is one known only to be used by the Ukrainian army (apparently the rebels don't control any missiles with sufficient range), prompting speculation that NATO was attempting to assassinate Pres. Putin but targeted the wrong plane.

And now with the black boxes in the custody of the rebels... wow. This is going to be news for a while.

[djAdvocate]

this is starting to sound really ugly. 

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 17, 2014 14:09:06 GMT -5 @wrongsideof30 said:

Jul 17, 2014 14:06:36 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

There are some really weird conspiracy theories coming out of this one.

Some sources are reporting that Pres. Putin's plane was in the same general vicinity of MH17 when it came down. The BUK missile fired is one known only to be used by the Ukrainian army (apparently the rebels don't control any missiles with sufficient range), prompting speculation that NATO was attempting to assassinate Pres. Putin but targeted the wrong plane.

And now with the black boxes in the custody of the rebels... wow. This is going to be news for a while.

 What sites are you reading?

Check out the comments in your link. User "Publicus" posts this link. Further down, "WhackoWarner" cites Interfax on the nature of the missiles, and then several more users speculate about possible connections.

[billisonboard]

Jul 17, 2014 11:35:07 GMT -5 Blonde Granny said:

...
And President Obama runs off to the golf course......just sayin' ...

You volunteering a grandchild to go get blown away over this one Granny?

[Virgil Showlion]

Putin's plane on top. The plane shot down on bottom. Wouldn't be difficult to mistake the latter for the former.

And as I alluded to in a post last evening, the BRICS nations just held a conference to set up a lending facility in direct competition with the IMF and the US dollar. Pres. Putin was in fact flying back from that landmark conference when this happened.

If the plan was to blow him out of the sky to send a message, and make it look as though pro-Russian separatists had done it, they obviously made a grave mistake.

This is all just idle speculation. The trouble is that I wouldn't put it past TPTB for a second not to attempt something like this. The last two dictators who tried to lead the charge against deserting the US dollar--Hussein and Al Assad--well, we all know what happened to them...

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 17, 2014 15:27:55 GMT -5 @wrongsideof30 said:

Virgil Showlion, any thoughts about the ZH'er comments about this event providing cover for the ground assault into Gaza by the Israeli military?

I think the two are just coincidental, wrongside. The Israelis have been planning a ground force invasion since their counteroffensive began. It's not a sudden or unexpected thing.

I did see those comments, though. That's one of the nice things about ZH is that occasionally the commenters will pull in off-the-beaten-track sources. It all needs to be taken with a large grain of salt, but if the only alternative is the mainstream news outlets, I'll take my chances.

[Spellbound454]

It was flying at 33,000 on an established highway to Asia......and certainly looks like a surface to air missile attack

My bet is on the rebels.......probably by mistake......and with a BUK missile launcher, without realising its capabilities.

Everyone's eyes are on Putin.

[mmhmm]

The latest I've heard is it has been determined it was a missile of some kind. Now, they're looking to determine which side of the border it came from - Ukraine or Russia. What a mess!

[sesfw]

When I first heard about this it hit me in the stomach. Just like it did when the Towers were attacked and went town in 2001.

I DON'T UNDERSTAND

Who can possibly win? All of us lose ............. every single one of us.

My heart goes out to the families.