Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:01:21 GMT -5
I had a nun tell a classmate if she stuck the tongue out at her again she'd cut it off. Kid tried her and got to stand by the teacher's desk and look at the woman with scissors in hand and cry and beg for mercy. We were in 3rd grade so no one had figured out that there was no way it was actually going to happen.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:03:53 GMT -5
She learned how to understand the system and work within it and she learned the material they're teaching. Not her fault they were so transparent or that passing from one grade to the next was so simple. Not her fault at all. not necessarily the schools fault either. They may have been doing the best they could. But it sounds like another environmental would have been better in challenging her and motivating her to learn. As a fellow slacker, nope. I went to both a Catholic school and a public school, didn't care at all at either. IDK if we had any Montessori type schools here in the dark ages of the 80s though. You couldn't motivate me, no matter what. The ONLY thing that makes me work at all is getting what I have to get done finished so I can get back to slacking.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:05:17 GMT -5
Not her fault at all. not necessarily the schools fault either. They may have been doing the best they could. But it sounds like another environmental would have been better in challenging her and motivating her to learn. As a fellow slacker, nope. I went to both a Catholic school and a public school, didn't care at all at either. IDK if we had any Montessori type schools here in the dark ages of the 80s though. You couldn't motivate me, no matter what. The ONLY thing that makes me work at all is getting what I have to get done finished so I can get back to slacking. Sounds like a school that required more work would have been good for you, then.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Mar 31, 2014 14:05:50 GMT -5
Swamp- she spits on you? That's not cool at all.
We sat down DS when he was younger and told him that as long as he treated us with respect that we would treat him with respect. There were likely a few hiccups along the way. When he would act up we would refuse to talk to him until he could conduct himself in a calm and reasonable manner. He learned to use his words to air any complaints that he had and we learned to "ask" him to do things rather than "tell" him. It's been working out pretty well for the past few years and has made everyone much happier and calmer.
Instead of yelling out "Bring me your clothes if you want them washed!" I'll stick my head in his door and say "when you get a chance get you bring your dirty clothes basket to the laundry room?" He'll say "sure thing" and bring it right to me. I'll say "hey bud, would you unload the dishwasher when you get a chance?" and 95% of the time he does it right then and there the other 5% he'll say "do you mind if I do it in a few minutes?" and he always does it when he says he will.
I've asked him before and he said he appreciates that we ask rather than tell him to do things. We take turns in our family and treat him as a full voting member. If we go out to dinner we take turns picking the restaurant. On family movie nights we take turns picking the movie. When we go to the grocery store we ask him if he has any requests. It's a respect thing and it seems to be working for us.
I don't know if that's right or wrong, good or bad. It's what worked for us.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:07:24 GMT -5
As a fellow slacker, nope. I went to both a Catholic school and a public school, didn't care at all at either. IDK if we had any Montessori type schools here in the dark ages of the 80s though. You couldn't motivate me, no matter what. The ONLY thing that makes me work at all is getting what I have to get done finished so I can get back to slacking. Sounds like a school that required more work would have been good for you, then. Nope, I accepted a few Fs in my time because I wasn't doing it and they couldn't make me. What I really wanted them to do was to leave me alone to read in peace and attend to the stupid people I had to share space with. (also known as classmates) most of what school taught me was to deal with obnoxious people and how to handle boredom without looking too bored or too without something to do
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t-dog
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Post by t-dog on Mar 31, 2014 14:08:13 GMT -5
RIGHT ON, Shoobs!! I am amending my first statement: Using test scores to gauge anything but how someone performed on a test is futile. Actually, studies have been done on college academic success with regards to standardized (ACT & SAT) test scores. While a high test score does not guarantee success is college, a low score will (in most cases) indicate much lesser degrees of success. And back to the subject: To me it's the same old story of giving a man (or child) a fish versus teaching a man to fish. So the fact that I couldn't crack 1000 on the SAT back in the late 80's should have had me at a low degree of success? Who knew that given I have managed 2 post graduate degrees and been practicing law for the last 15+ years...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:08:48 GMT -5
I'm afraid my youngest is going to be like Swamps daughter. He hates being told what to do as well, even if it's something he wants to do. I'll tell him to pick up his toys so we can go to the park and he'll throw them and say "FINE, WE WON'T GO TO THE PARK".
WTH?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 31, 2014 14:08:51 GMT -5
Swamp- she spits on you? That's not cool at all.
Not anymore........................
I ask instead of telling. I give them 3 tries. Then it becomes a command with a toy being taken away/time out.
DS usually complies. It's a power struggle with DD.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:09:30 GMT -5
Sounds like a school that required more work would have been good for you, then. Nope, I accepted a few Fs in my time because I wasn't doing it and they couldn't make me. What I really wanted them to do was to leave me alone to read in peace and attend to the stupid people I had to share space with. (also known as classmates) most of what school taught me was to deal with obnoxious people and how to handle boredom without looking too bored or too without something to do maybe what we (or at least I) am learning is that environment doesn't matter. You are born how you are and nothing is going to change that. Sort of takes a weight off.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:10:11 GMT -5
Swamp- she spits on you? That's not cool at all.
We sat down DS when he was younger and told him that as long as he treated us with respect that we would treat him with respect. There were likely a few hiccups along the way. When he would act up we would refuse to talk to him until he could conduct himself in a calm and reasonable manner. He learned to use his words to air any complaints that he had and we learned to "ask" him to do things rather than "tell" him. It's been working out pretty well for the past few years and has made everyone much happier and calmer.
Instead of yelling out "Bring me your clothes if you want them washed!" I'll stick my head in his door and say "when you get a chance get you bring your dirty clothes basket to the laundry room?" He'll say "sure thing" and bring it right to me. I'll say "hey bud, would you unload the dishwasher when you get a chance?" and 95% of the time he does it right then and there the other 5% he'll say "do you mind if I do it in a few minutes?" and he always does it when he says he will.
I've asked him before and he said he appreciates that we ask rather than tell him to do things. We take turns in our family and treat him as a full voting member. If we go out to dinner we take turns picking the restaurant. On family movie nights we take turns picking the movie. When we go to the grocery store we ask him if he has any requests. It's a respect thing and it seems to be working for us.
I don't know if that's right or wrong, good or bad. It's what worked for us. That's awesome if he's willing to show respect back. I'm still hopeful for the youngest since he appears to be slowly getting it. But it is slow going with him.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 31, 2014 14:10:06 GMT -5
I'm afraid my youngest is going to be like Swamps daughter. He hates being told what to do as well, even if it's something he wants to do. I'll tell him to pick up his toys so we can go to the park and he'll throw them and say "FINE, WE WON'T GO TO THE PARK". WTH? Finally!!!! Somebody who has a kid like mine.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:12:40 GMT -5
Nope, I accepted a few Fs in my time because I wasn't doing it and they couldn't make me. What I really wanted them to do was to leave me alone to read in peace and attend to the stupid people I had to share space with. (also known as classmates) most of what school taught me was to deal with obnoxious people and how to handle boredom without looking too bored or too without something to do maybe what we (or at least I) am learning is that environment doesn't matter. You are born how you are and nothing is going to change that. Sort of takes a weight off. YOU can definitely encourage what you want to see, but if they do it or not is up to them. Some kids can be guided, some are going to want to make their own trip no matter what you say. some of us are just extra hard headed and like to learn things the very hardest way possible
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:14:35 GMT -5
maybe what we (or at least I) am learning is that environment doesn't matter. You are born how you are and nothing is going to change that. Sort of takes a weight off. YOU can definitely encourage what you want to see, but if they do it or not is up to them. Some kids can be guided, some are going to want to make their own trip no matter what you say. some of us are just extra hard headed and like to learn things the very hardest way possible Sometimes I wonder if kids who don' put up a fight are destined to be walked all over their entire life.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Mar 31, 2014 14:19:56 GMT -5
CL- it's a give and take thing. We ask that he eats his vegetables and he asks that we not make carrots. It wasn't an overnight thing but it has been working. Sounds so cheesy but we started having regular family "meetings" every night. We'd sit in the living room and discuss our days, ask each other questions, try to impart some wisdom on the Boy, the usual. We started that a few years ago because we wanted him to communicate with us and we noticed he was holding things in. Once he got comfortable talking to us about anything and everything he has become an open book. If he asks us a question we answer him honestly and if we ask him questions he answers us honestly.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:20:47 GMT -5
YOU can definitely encourage what you want to see, but if they do it or not is up to them. Some kids can be guided, some are going to want to make their own trip no matter what you say. some of us are just extra hard headed and like to learn things the very hardest way possible Sometimes I wonder if kids who don' put up a fight are destined to be walked all over their entire life. IDK, all of mine fight me in some form or other.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Mar 31, 2014 14:27:53 GMT -5
Finally!!!! Somebody who has a kid like mine. My sister's little girl sounds a lot like yours, but she is only like that around my sister. She's a perfect angel when my sister isn't around. That describes every kid ever. They save the good stuff for the parents
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nutty
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Post by nutty on Mar 31, 2014 14:37:26 GMT -5
I was so stubborn, my dad couldn't even crack me. He tried he really did. I wore necklaces too school when I wasn't allowed to clarify at 7, I wore a pink jumper to school when the dress code was grey, if I didn't want to talk no-one was making me...
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Mar 31, 2014 14:40:25 GMT -5
Don't feel bad- most of my nieces and nephews are brats. My sister's kids are learning to behave finally. She had to figure out what punishments would be most effective. Turns out grounding them from her iPad is akin to torture so that's what she goes with. They really are getting much better but man it had gotten to the point where I'd refuse to go places with them. My niece had ruined trips to the outlet stores, the Zoo, the Mall of America, and numerous restaurants.
They finally got to the point in which they'd physically remove her from the situation and punish her (with the iPad grounding). They'd plan a fun day at the zoo and if she'd start acting like a brat they'd hire a baby sitter and leave her at home while they took her brother. Didn't take her too long to get with the program.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Mar 31, 2014 14:48:56 GMT -5
I'm afraid my youngest is going to be like Swamps daughter. He hates being told what to do as well, even if it's something he wants to do. I'll tell him to pick up his toys so we can go to the park and he'll throw them and say "FINE, WE WON'T GO TO THE PARK". WTH? Finally!!!! Somebody who has a kid like mine. If it makes you feel anybetter mine wouldn't clean up either. Not because he actually doesn't want to follow direction but it has the same effect. He takes every single thing in his bedroom and throws them on the floor for a reason only he understands. Then when I see it I tell him it has to be cleaned up. He always says yes but then somewhere inbetween saying yes and actually moving to pick something up he gets totally distracted and never touches a thing. It isn't willful but I defy anyone to walk around the house and see everything that had been put away neatly, suddenly unput away constantly.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 14:54:48 GMT -5
DD and I also have the same problem, 97. As in, we both have trouble staying on task.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Mar 31, 2014 15:05:14 GMT -5
What do your kids do that you have to spend so much time either punishing them or dreaming up ways to punish them? I really don't get it. I know I should be grateful that I have the kid I have because all of this talk of punishment is really strange to me.
DS will be 16 at the end of April. We haven't had to punish him for anything in several years. This makes me wonder if I am missing something.
So, seriously, what are your kids doing that require punishments?
I was punished frequently for missing my curfew that was the only thing I ever did wrong. I petitioned my parents to cancel my unnecessary curfews and once they did I never got in trouble from them again. I tell DD to do X. She looks at me, tells me "You can't tell me what to do" and walks away. I physically go get her to do it, and she drops on the floor.
She does NOT like being told what to do.
I was worried about the same thing with my oldest who is VERY strong willed kid So, I started doing a pre-emptive strikes. me: Well, E, I can't tell you what to do, but if you do A - here are the consequences and if you do B-here are the consequences. If you don't like your consequences - don't come crying to me.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Mar 31, 2014 15:12:14 GMT -5
I'm afraid my youngest is going to be like Swamps daughter. He hates being told what to do as well, even if it's something he wants to do. I'll tell him to pick up his toys so we can go to the park and he'll throw them and say "FINE, WE WON'T GO TO THE PARK". WTH? Finally!!!! Somebody who has a kid like mine. I think my littlest is going to be like this as well. My other two are not as strong willed as she is, thank goodness.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 31, 2014 15:13:51 GMT -5
Finally!!!! Somebody who has a kid like mine. My sister's little girl sounds a lot like yours, but she is only like that around my sister. She's a perfect angel when my sister isn't around. Exactly. DD is an angel at school, and several people have taken her places with their children and remarked how well behaved she is.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 15:30:35 GMT -5
My sister's little girl sounds a lot like yours, but she is only like that around my sister. She's a perfect angel when my sister isn't around. Exactly. DD is an angel at school, and several people have taken her places with their children and remarked how well behaved she is. Maybe boarding school is in her future?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2014 15:38:59 GMT -5
I think if you look at "being involved" as a whole, there is probably a lot of useless stuff. By I wouldn't say you can lump in helping with homework and volunteering for the PTA.
Personally, even though it sounds good to let your kids take responsibility, personally I would always keep an eye on my kid’s grades from a day to day level. I wouldn’t want to rely on the teacher to just deal with it with my kid. My wife was TOO HARD on herself when she was younger so she didn’t really need an extra set of eyes. I was a slacker when I was younger, so I probably could’ve used my parents to keep an eye on me a bit more.
You don’t need to do your kids homework or become their teacher. But when your kid knows there is an extra set of eyes (one that cares more than your teacher), they’ll try a bit harder. Once the habit is engrained, you’ll probably have to do it less and less.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Mar 31, 2014 15:47:37 GMT -5
Perspiration beats inspiration. Hard work will beat out anything else. Applying yourself and giving your all is what makes you successful. I am coaching elementary girls' basketball. There are a few girls on the team who really just don't have the passion for the game yet. I HOPE that they will in time. The other girls have caught the fire. But, no amount of coaching, teaching, encouraging is going to make them care or WANT to be the best they can be. I hope the fire of the other girls will encourage them and that we can get through. But, on the court, they have to WANT it. They have to CARE about it. If they don't, that isn't something you can force. And, our kids' lives will be about what becomes important to THEM. Learning has to come from within. It is internal. YOu can browbeat kids when they are young and force them to do their work. But , you can't browbeat someone into being a successful person. The drive and desire has to come from inside them. Shooby, you're right about the desire to be successful at anything being something you can't force on someone. Most people will be as successful, or unsuccessful, as they choose to be. (Maybe about 5% lack the ability acheive what they define as success. The rest, are meeting their own expectations.) Now, I'm not terribly athletic. Was not a good athlete as a kid. I was younger than my classmates, so I was uncoordinated compared to others. I don't have great fine motor skills. My vision means that my depth perception is a little sketchy. And, frankly, I didn't enjoy doing something that I wasn't particularly good at. Even so, after college I embarked on a reasonably successful local bicycle racing career, finding a type of racing that was suited to my physiology and psychology. Even though I did many different types of bicycle racing, time trials were my specialty. In addition, at close to 60 years old, I still have a season ski pass for access to several western US ski areas. Given my athletic skills, it took me much longer than many people (25 years) to learn and hone the skills to become a decent advanced level skier. But, it's something that I enjoy doing and plan to become one of the old guys who skis mid week about three days a week all winter long. And, I'm shooting to be doing it into my 80's. I'm not planning on being fast. And I'm not planning on being fancy. But, I'm planning on hearing "Did you see that guy? He's gotta be old as dirt!". Now, if we would just allow people to succeed financially, at the level of their choosing, the way I was allowed to choose my level of athlectic success, rather than giving people who are marginally motivated financially, rewards for simply coming to watch the game. That would be a step in the right direction. Allow people to define their own version of success, that is determined by the drive, desire, and commitment they exhibit.
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JustLurkin
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Post by JustLurkin on Mar 31, 2014 17:17:43 GMT -5
Keeping in mind I haven't read all the posts...
When I was in high school 100 or so years ago, I was taking 4th year Spanish and 2nd year Trigonometry...my parents were not going to be able to assist me with that.
My parents weren't really in the PTA and stuff, but I was on every high school committee imaginable and they encouraged participation and drove me and a friend back to school almost every night and/or weekend for things.
I used to volunteer at my son's school one day a week. When he reached junior high, the teachers told us to stop so the kids could basically have a "normal" junior high experience.
I do go to parents nights at my son's high school, but they are more informational for parents about different aspects of the life of a disabled child and preparing them for the future then they are about school. And, I've mentioned before, I treat myself to a bar appetizer and drink before I go.
Actually, after glancing over a few posts--I guess it's pretty much the way sheilaincali described it--and if the Catholic High School principal had a bar appetizer and drink life would be better!
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Apr 1, 2014 8:23:32 GMT -5
This was a timely thread- last night DS spent 2 hours helping DH with his homework. He has a test coming up in his logic class and was very confused. DS was very patient with him and a good tutor. DH is now confident that he knows that material This folks is what happens when you wait until you are 40 to finish your degree- you need your 15 year old to help you with the homework.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2014 9:01:57 GMT -5
Well, my older son's teacher emailed me last night to tell me that my son came in Monday morning and realized his homework wasn't done. She said he worked double-time on his in class works to get them done and skipped recess so he could finish his homework to get handed in on time, because "his Mom would kill him if she found out he didn't have it done". His teacher thought it was funny that he was more worried about me finding out than her. So, I CAN motivate him.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2014 9:09:29 GMT -5
Well, my older son's teacher emailed me last night to tell me that my son came in Monday morning and realized his homework wasn't done. She said he worked double-time on his in class works to get them done and skipped recess so he could finish his homework to get handed in on time, because "his Mom would kill him if she found out he didn't have it done". His teacher thought it was funny that he was more worried about me finding out than her. So, I CAN motivate him. You are not being lazy enough.
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