1 in 68 Children Have Autism. 1 in 42 Are Boys.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

I took a look at the link she posted. 

Quite frankly, it was so poorly organized, so busy, un referenced, that it makes me inclined to skip over it.  This is NOT the way to get the word out.  If you are going to tell me that the information out there is 2002 data, provide me with proof or I am not going to be inclined to read the rhetoric.

As I said earlier, I am going to be very curious as to what the complexion of the banquet we are attending in a couple of weeks is going to be like.  I have to wonder if the local autism chapters are still promoting vaccines as a cause.

[whoisjohngalt]

Mar 31, 2014 9:09:14 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

I took a look at the link she posted. 

Quite frankly, it was so poorly organized, so busy, un referenced, that it makes me inclined to skip over it.  This is NOT the way to get the word out.  If you are going to tell me that the information out there is 2002 data, provide me with proof or I am not going to be inclined to read the rhetoric.

As I said earlier, I am going to be very curious as to what the complexion of the banquet we are attending in a couple of weeks is going to be like.  I have to wonder if the local autism chapters are still promoting vaccines as a cause.

I am not sure if you saw my earlier post, but I would love for you to report back after your banquet

[skubikky]

www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1307491

I apologize if this was already posted.  From the New England Journal of Medicine.

www.nytimes.com/2014/03/25/science/seeking-autisms-biochemical-roots.html?src=rechp

[The Captain]

Mar 31, 2014 8:34:03 GMT -5 Formerly SK said:

Holy crap I got a 36 on that test! 

(makes feeble attempt at personal interaction) Hugs

Maybe we should start our own non-social society?

[Deleted]

So introvert is correlated with autistic? As per that quiz...

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Why would you waste her time, that could actually solve something so that the parents can meet researchers?

I doubt most parents would even listen. Look at the "Why isn't there a cure for cancer" thread Phoenix started way back. Several of us who are in research explained how the process works and why there is not a "cure" and we got a lot of backlash for what we said.

I'm not conducting autism research, but I'd be happy to help people sort thru the peer reviewed articles out there if they wanted. I'm happy to do that for anything. People never want me to do this and instead insist I am part of the "problem" b/c I will not agree with whatever random google web site they managed to come up with as evidence to support their stance.

Then you have the media who has zero understanding of how reserach actually works spouting ratings grabbing headlines. It's like banging your head against the wall for fun to explain that what Today said is NOT what the actual study said and why.

There are 25+ years of scientific evidence stating that vaccines do not cause autism, for example. Andrew Wakefield's 1985 article is discredited and removed from Lancet records. Yet Jenny McCarthy is still plugging away. Many many more people believe her over stacks of information saying otherwise.

Her message is simple and reinforces what people want to hear. It's going take me HOURS to explain to you the current research out there and even then you're not going to get any 100% solid answers from me b/c there aren't any, that's not how reserach works.

My time is far better spent doing my job than trying to explain 25+ years of literaure to people who don't want to listen to me.

[The Captain]

Apparently so, so again the question is are extreme introverts now being classed along the autism spectrum disorder?

BTW - I don't say this in any way to minimize people who exhibit (and I'm not a medical person) the "classic" form of autism.  As I've stated before, a relative was diagnosed at a very early age with Asperger's.  He had a private aid until the fourth grade, special daycare, one on one therapy etc.

I also had an employee who worked for me that exhibited the exact same characteristics.  This gentleman (older than me) never received any special therapy, resources, etc and did just fine. 

To my untrained eye, the outcomes for the two are not much different.  Both are very intelligent, but do not process social skills in the way most people do.  Neither will ever do well as a people manager, but that doesn't mean they can't have successful careers.

Sometimes I have to wonder how many labels we create for what is simply, different.

[973beachbum]

Mar 31, 2014 8:45:11 GMT -5 @beerwench said:

Mar 31, 2014 8:18:10 GMT -5 busymom said:

I believe what Les is pointing out, is, the number of kids with autism is continuing to grow at a fast rate, but the media falsely makes it sound like they're all smarter than average, but only socially awkward, so they'll be o.k.   Some will be o.k., but many will need supervision their entire lives.  It IS frustrating when a complex disability is trivialized by the media to convince the general public that "everything is going to be all right".

And Miss T pointed out that her DD had a "false" diagnosis in order to qualify for services. I wonder how many more false diagnoses are contribute to the growing numbers?

I have been told numerous times that if my son needs services he can be diagonosed as autistic.  he isn't autistic and everyone who has had interaction with him knows it.  But his Dr's said that there is so much overlap between it and ADD/ADHD and OCD , all of which he does have, that he could get that diagnosis added.

He had never needed it, but I did have one teacher out and out say that if he was diagnosed the extra in class support they could get for him would be a big help in the classroom for all the students. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Mar 31, 2014 9:10:15 GMT -5 whoisjohngalt said:

Mar 31, 2014 9:09:14 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

I took a look at the link she posted. 

Quite frankly, it was so poorly organized, so busy, un referenced, that it makes me inclined to skip over it.  This is NOT the way to get the word out.  If you are going to tell me that the information out there is 2002 data, provide me with proof or I am not going to be inclined to read the rhetoric.

As I said earlier, I am going to be very curious as to what the complexion of the banquet we are attending in a couple of weeks is going to be like.  I have to wonder if the local autism chapters are still promoting vaccines as a cause.

I am not sure if you saw my earlier post, but I would love for you to report back after your banquet

I saw it.  Banquet is the 17th, so I'll try to remember.  If not, just pm me and I'll tell you what it was like.

LOL.....the reason why we are going o it is not altogether altruistic.  The have an auction and one of the items up for auction is a weekend with a Porsche.  Neighbor wins it every year and TD is usually green with envy.  However, he would NOT tell TD when the event was because he would know that he'd get competition for the car.

I was out a couple weeks ago and stumbled over the announcement, so we bought tickets to it.  

[Deleted]

Good luck!

[whoisjohngalt]

Good luck on the auction!!!!!

[Sam_2.0]

Mar 30, 2014 23:05:12 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Mar 30, 2014 22:37:48 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Here ya go, Virgil.

Thanks.

The article indicates the average is 16.4, and 80% of those diagnosed with autism or a related disorder scored 32 or higher. I scored a 25. So 8.6 points above normal, but 7 points short of the "hot zone".

One unusual feature of the test is that the scoring doesn't differentiate between "definitely" and "slightly" in any of the questions. Only the "agree" or "disagree" factor is ultimately relevant. I wonder if they put in four possible responses simply because it's a standard scale or if there's a deeper reasoning behind it.

I got 34.

[Miss Tequila]

Mar 31, 2014 8:18:10 GMT -5 busymom said:

I believe what Les is pointing out, is, the number of kids with autism is continuing to grow at a fast rate, but the media falsely makes it sound like they're all smarter than average, but only socially awkward, so they'll be o.k.   Some will be o.k., but many will need supervision their entire lives.  It IS frustrating when a complex disability is trivialized by the media to convince the general public that "everything is going to be all right".

But will you conceded that many kids that aren't autistic are being given the label of autistic just because so much money is being thrown at Autism? I know I am not alone in accepting an invalid diagnosis of autism just so my child could attend a preschool that I knew would fit her needs. The criteria for autism is so broad that a lot of kids with plain old special needs will meet the criteria for autism. And since no one is throwing money and plain old mental retardation, parents like me will gladly take any diagnosis we can get so our child gets services. This is definitely throwing the numbers...the question is by how much

[milee]

Mar 31, 2014 8:34:03 GMT -5 Formerly SK said:

Holy crap I got a 36 on that test! 

Me, too.

Wouldn't surprise me if my husband was in that range as well... dang Nerd genes. 

[Miss Tequila]

Mar 31, 2014 10:01:33 GMT -5 @tbird said:

Mar 31, 2014 9:54:45 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

But will you conceded that many kids that aren't autistic are being given the label of autistic just because so much money is being thrown at Autism?  

that kind of disputes much of the OP though, doesn't it?

The OP is saying not enough is being done, ignored, etc. but you are saying that the services provided for an autistic dx is pushing people to take that dx even if it doesn't fit due to the services provided?

I'm not about to get into an argument with the OP...she is angry enough!

But yes, autism is the "hot diagnosis" right now. In terms of special needs children, there is a lot more funding for kids with autism than any other diagnosis (based on what I have personally seen...don't ask me for research). You now have two posters in this thread (me and Beach) who are telling you that we were told to take an autism diagnosis in order to get services. 

Im also not saying that the autism numbers aren't truly rising (after backing out those of us taking the diagnosis to get services). But how many of those "new" cases wouldn't have been diagnosed 30 years ago?  I don't have an answer to that. 

[milee]

Mar 31, 2014 9:21:38 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

  Look at the "Why isn't there a cure for cancer" thread Phoenix started way back. Several of us who are in research explained how the process works and why there is not a "cure" and we got a lot of backlash for what we said.

This post reminded me of another one of my (remember I'm guessing here, not advocating a position) theories about "autism". I put it in quotes, because I think that over time, we will discover that what we label "autism" is actually more than one single, identifiable cause/syndrome. Similar to cancer; we now know that even "breast cancer" isn't just one thing or type of cancer. We're now discovering that there are many, many different types of cancer that go under that one heading and what works well to stop one type actually exacerbates other types.  All those cancers may grow in the breast, but that's their only commonality - their physical manifestation.  Their various causes, cures, growth rates, etc are all completely different.  What we currently call "breast cancer" is probably 20+ different, unique types of cancer, all with unique causes and cures.

I think autism may be the same thing.  There may be a variety of underlying causes, physical oddities, chemical imbalances, etc. which are each individually very, very different but their outward manifestation is what we now lump together as the behaviours identified as "autism".  Until we identify these different underlying causes, again, looking for prevention or cures is going to be incredibly difficult.   

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 28, 2014 20:52:48 GMT -5 Sunnyday said:

tofu is not a new food.

And the rest of the subject matter, I can't contribute to a conversation about pseudo-science.

But yeah, tofu is not a new food. Just because it's new to you doesn't mean that it's new to a billion people who have been eating it for millenniums without incident.

ITA. BUT - we have not been eating monsanto GMO/pesticide laden tofu for eons. THAT can be a problem IMO. I only use organic soy products and I have been eating/doing soy for over 15 years now. That goes back to what Chiver has said - it's what's ON our food and IN our food, not the food choices themselves.

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 29, 2014 2:25:18 GMT -5 Sum Dum Gai said:

The only long term, 20+ year, study I've ever read on it found the single biggest link to be parental age at conception. The incidence rate climbed fairly dramatically with increased parental age and showed the increase from either or both parents. A young woman conceiving with an older man had just as many increased health issues in her offspring as an older woman having children.

Older parents have higher risks of damn near everything it seemed like, and people are waiting longer and longer to start families these days.

Yep, I agree. I did a lot of research on this when we were TTC and had multiple losses. The biggest SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN factor I could find was DH's age. I was happy to find out we were having a girl because boys seem to have a higher propensity for spectrum disorders... and I think DH himself is slightly on the spectrum (apologize is this is non-pc wording, it's how I think of it). So far DD is definitely an introvert but exhibits no signs of autism. I feel very lucky. My heart goes out to all the moms who have to deal with this every day.

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 30, 2014 21:26:10 GMT -5 les63 said:

Clicked on your link Mich. Big whoop. Like the bloggers on Age Of Autism say: and the band played/s on..... the autism community is Really getting tired of the continual bullshit.

With that I'm out....

Why is a scientific study bullshit to you?

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 30, 2014 22:37:48 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Mar 30, 2014 22:24:40 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Ah. So the ratio would be approximately 3 autistic boys to 2 autistic girls, rather than the 4.25 boys to 1 girl I calculated earlier. But you can see where my confusion came in.

Maybe I have autism. Is there an online test somewhere that can tell me if I do?

Here ya go, Virgil.

I got a 14. I would have thought it would be higher considering I'm an introvert. I think I'm a semi-social introvert, if such a thing exists.

I think I'm good at small talk and body language and stuff like that... but I don't like it lol

[swamp]

I have said this before. My business partner has a bunch of the signs of Aspergers/High Functioning Autism. Sometimes, it's like working with Sheldon Cooper. He is 67 years old. It wasn't a diagnosis when he was in school.

I have friends whose children are diagnosed as autistic as they had speech delays, fine motor skill issues, prefer to be alone, hate loud noises, and hate crowds/group activities.     And they are all what you would call "quirky."

It doesn't mean they won't live independently and thrive as an adult. However, several years ago, they would not have been given any diagnosis.  

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 31, 2014 9:17:56 GMT -5 oped said:

So introvert is correlated with autistic? As per that quiz...

I think that makes sense. Autistic individuals have difficulty with communication, eye contact, social situations, much like introverts. That doesn't mean that introverts are autistic. 

[HoneyBBQ]

Mar 31, 2014 10:04:16 GMT -5 milee said:

Mar 31, 2014 8:34:03 GMT -5 Formerly SK said:

Holy crap I got a 36 on that test! 

Me, too.

Wouldn't surprise me if my husband was in that range as well... dang Nerd genes. 

You'd think places like Seattle or Silicon valley would have much higher rates of autism due to the nerd genes prevalent there. I've never seen anything about it, though.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Mar 31, 2014 10:43:24 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

Mar 30, 2014 21:26:10 GMT -5 les63 said:

Clicked on your link Mich. Big whoop. Like the bloggers on Age Of Autism say: and the band played/s on..... the autism community is Really getting tired of the continual bullshit.

With that I'm out....

Why is a scientific study bullshit to you?

Les is angry, I understand that.  But when I have gone into some of the autism sites and read what they post, she is just spewing a lot of what other people say without really referencing anything.

Like Drama, when I see something in the popular press, I tend to take it with a grain of salt.  Also like Drama, I have been in the research trenches and understand the process.  But those who do not understand think that nothing is being done and lash out at the powers that be (aka government) that they are not doing enough.

When you consider that there are hundreds of other physical and mental conditions that are vying for the same $$ pot of money, then you need to understand that everyone has their own special platform that they lobby for.

Mine was dental research.  Seems trite, until you realize the impact that poor oral health has on your physical being.  More school days are lost due to dental pain than any other reason.  More systemic diseases are exacerbated by poor oral health than most know and new links are showing up every time I turn around.  Last year, we published on a link between Alzheimer's and oral disease.  AFAIK, that data was the first time someone has looked at the possibility of there being a link between these 2 conditions.  Right now, it's killing me as I am no longer involved in this, as I was involved in this from the beginning...did the work, did the stats, etc. and it is promising enough that I want to continue.  I really hope we continue on in this line of research, but suspect that it's going to have to be another facility as neither the gerontologist nor I am available to work on it.  Pity.

[973beachbum]

Honey try googling "half of sillicon valley is autistic" and see what comes up.

[CarolinaKat]

Mar 28, 2014 20:51:37 GMT -5 swamp said:

I'm pretty sure my business partner is on the autism spectrum. He's in his late 60's. 

I've worked with several engineers who are on the autism spectrum. I will never forget when one who I highly respected and pseudo-mentored me, walked into my office and told me he had been diagnosed, He was in his late 40s at the time. He found out during the process of getting his son identified. He looked at his son's therapist and said ' but x behaviors are normal, myself and my brothers were all that way and grew out of it'

No he self-taught coping skills tha allowed him to function. He eventually went though an evaluation himself and has Asberger's Syndrome, as does his son, and likely his siblings.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

But those who do not understand think that nothing is being done and lash out at the powers that be (aka government) that they are not doing enough.




As soon as people get wind I am in pharmacy research I get hounded about why isn't there a "cure for cancer" yet. It must be due to the fact that I am a shill for "Big Pharma" who wants to keep people sick so I can get more money.

In reality I make jack squat. I'm also not even involved in cancer research. I'm doing work on a relatively recent (as in the past 10 years) method of dialysis and studying the effects it has on drug clearance. This will be huge for people in the ICU b/c a standard therapuetic drug model can be developed to make sure they get hte treatment they need. Right now the majority of liteature is on other forms of dialysis and studies are showing you can't compare the forms when it comes to drug therapy.

I try to take people who lash out at me with a grain of salt b/c often times they are people who lose someone or will lose someone and they need someone to make into a scapegoat. I keep my mouth shut and let them yell at me.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

As soon as people get wind I am in pharmacy research I get hounded about why isn't there a "cure for cancer" yet. It must be due to the fact that I am a shill for "Big Pharma" who wants to keep people sick so I can get more money.

We did research for 'Big Pharma' too. It was a really fascinating study that would have essentially stopped periodontal disease in its track. Or at least it did in the animal model we used. I was blinded and I could tell the animals that were receiving drugs vs placebo just by looking at the data.

Only problem was that the drug was an injectable and needed to be injected 2x/day. We tried to switch over to an oral delivery and the taste was so bad that even a pill form would be unacceptable.

Injecting yourself 2x/day is acceptable if you need to save your life for diabetes, it's not to save your teeth.

[Sum Dum Gai]

Mar 31, 2014 10:53:44 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

Mar 31, 2014 10:04:16 GMT -5 milee said:

Me, too.

Wouldn't surprise me if my husband was in that range as well... dang Nerd genes. 

You'd think places like Seattle or Silicon valley would have much higher rates of autism due to the nerd genes prevalent there. I've never seen anything about it, though.

I don't know about Seattle but Silicon Valley is an autism hot spot. I've read several articles about it because it makes the rounds in local papers and magazines pretty frequently. Most HCOL areas have higher rates of autism than the general population. There are several factors that could be causing it. One, nerds are cool in Silicon Valley. They're sought out as mates. Anyplace that concentrates engineer types that are on the low end of the spectrum, and pays them very well, leads to them marrying others on the low end of the spectrum, which increases their children's risk of being on the spectrum. Two, it's friggin expensive to raise kids here, so people have kids later. Parental age is a big risk factor. Three people are pretty affluent in the valley, which gives them the resources to push for a diagnosis, any diagnosis, to get their kids help if they're struggling. Back when ADD was the it diagnosis Silicon Valley had higher rates of it than the general population as well.

It's possible that there's a pollutant or some other environmental factor causing all the cases in Silicon Valley, but they haven't found anything yet.

[busymom]

I've got too much happening here today, so this will be a bit of a "drive by" post.   DS actually has the medical diagnosis of autism (where you get the evaluation through a psychiatrist's office).  However, he also qualified through the "education" diagnosis, where you meet the criteria of your school district's evaluation. 

There is a community about 30-40 miles from here that is wealthy, that has an "autism cluster" of kids coming up.  That would be an interesting group to study.  Not sure if the "nerd" factor is part of the deal, or, for example, wealthier communities tend to make greater use of lawn services (chemicals), or why that particular area is getting more than the average number of autistic kids being born there.