Apple
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Post by Apple on Mar 4, 2014 10:47:48 GMT -5
Next year I plan to take my son on a month/5 week long vacation to Europe, with an emphasis on WWII history. It won't be my last trip over, but it could be his. He will be 17.
Do you know of any "must see" places?
We plan on visiting the following countries using the rail and buses. I don't plan on driving, never have driven in a foreign country, and don't think this will be the trip where I want to figure it out.
We plan to visit the following countries: France Germany Austria Poland The Netherlands (possible day trip, in and out) Belgium Switzerland (another possible day trip or two, if we're close) Czech Republic (again, may just be a day trip, if we're close)
I'm also hoping to accomplish this with a carry-on each and one bag for easy travel.
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nogooddeed
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Post by nogooddeed on Mar 4, 2014 10:51:12 GMT -5
No Ireland?
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Waffle
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Post by Waffle on Mar 4, 2014 10:55:23 GMT -5
No Italy?
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MarleyKeezy78
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Post by MarleyKeezy78 on Mar 4, 2014 10:55:34 GMT -5
I've never been to Europe but I would want to go to the Black Forest in Germany! My uncle went to Poland last Spring and he traveled to several cities and really enjoyed it. I don't remember off hand everywhere he went but Krakow(sp) was one city.
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Apple
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Post by Apple on Mar 4, 2014 10:57:31 GMT -5
No Ireland this trip. I took him there when he was nine, I fell In love with the place, but have to wait tog go back.
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pinkbow832
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Post by pinkbow832 on Mar 4, 2014 10:57:55 GMT -5
It might be a good idea to start by flying into Amsterdam, and then work your way across Europe from there. Belgium, France, Germany, Austria, Poland- something like that order. Between rail travel and day tours, you should be able to see just about everything in that period of time. I took a WWI/WWII field trip with my history prof. while I was in grad school in Belgium and can either list some of the places we visited or PM them to you if you would like.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Mar 4, 2014 10:59:14 GMT -5
I think your list is ambitious for 5 weeks, especially Ifyou are planning on seeing non-WWII places as well. For instance, you can spend a week in Paris and miss stuff.
JMHO
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Mar 4, 2014 11:00:16 GMT -5
Years ago we did a month in Germany (my In Laws were living there at the time). We "headquartered" at their house outside Wurtzburg. During the week while FIL was at work we would tour the little villages around them and on the weekends we'd go on a side trip. We spent time in Amsterdam, Salzburg, Prague and Frankfort. It was freaking awesome.
DS will be staying in Northern Germany for a month this summer. His host family knows he is a huge history buff so they plan on taking him to Berlin for a long weekend because they thought he'd get a kick out of that.
I'll email his host family and see if they have any suggestions.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Mar 4, 2014 11:08:00 GMT -5
Our plan was England for two weeks, Paris for a week, then take two weeks to get from Paris to Denmark, via Belguim, Netherlands, and Germany.
No WWII emphasis, just showing our kids different cultures, etc.
That is before we got DS's bill for braces.
I think we can swing two weeks, though. We'll probably spend it in England.
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milee
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Post by milee on Mar 4, 2014 11:09:15 GMT -5
You have to PM Bonny. (Sorry, I might be messing up her current screen name - but she was BonnAP for a while as well - know who I mean?)
I think she's done extensive WWII touring in Europe and also just came back from living in Germany.
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Apple
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Post by Apple on Mar 4, 2014 11:11:41 GMT -5
No Italy? did that when he was 11
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Mar 4, 2014 11:17:13 GMT -5
If you emphasis is WWII- it looks like you've got a good plan.
For me- I'd be hitting Greece, Italy, England, and Ireland. Those are all on my "someday" list.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Mar 4, 2014 11:19:22 GMT -5
And find debthaven2 - she's living outside of Paris. Her youngest might be about your boy's age. Not sure on that.
And Ratchets, while deployed right now, I think is based in England. He might have suggestions too.
I have no suggestions but I'm damn jealous right now.
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milee
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Post by milee on Mar 4, 2014 11:20:01 GMT -5
No advice on where to go for WWII history, but as someone who travels a lot, if you want to carry just a single carry on start looking now for Ex Officio clothes. They're travel clothes marketed to rich people, so they're pricey, but if you start looking now, you can get them on sale or even on Ebay. Nothing flashy, but they're awesome. Not only are they comfy with appropriate pockets, layers, etc., most are designed to be easily hand washed and to travel without wrinkling. They even have undies that are fugly, but hand wash and dry overnight. Can't say enough about their clothes. Not only was I super comfy no matter where I went, I even got compliments on how I looked, which was a surprise since I'd gotten most of them used on Ebay (outerwear, not undies ). Check them out.
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xia
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Post by xia on Mar 4, 2014 11:24:27 GMT -5
Since you will be in the area you should add Czech Republic to the mix. If touring WWll sites you can’t skip Lidice monument.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 11:31:13 GMT -5
Do not miss the Military Museum in Brussels. It's loaded with tanks and airplanes. DH and I went there planning to spend the morning and we ended up heading out for lunch and coming back. (One of the joys of traveling independently- you can change plans on a whim.)
If you're in Munich in warm weather take a Mike's Bikes tour. I did this years ago but it was a very relaxed ride on old-fashioned bikes with coaster brakes, English-speaking guides who knew a lot and had a sense of humor, and the tour ended up in a beer garden.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Mar 4, 2014 11:34:32 GMT -5
Personally, I would go to Hungary and the Czech Republic but my Great Grandma was born in Hungary and my Great Grandpa was born in what is now the Czech Republic. So, there is some personal history there that has me want to visit those places. We had kids instead.
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siralynn
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Post by siralynn on Mar 4, 2014 11:40:51 GMT -5
I highly recommend Munich. Spent several days there on my honeymoon, and it was awesome. The Mike's Bikes tour athena53 mentioned was great. And the WWII connection is there - Dachau is a bus ride outside the city, and is very powerful visit (though extremely intense emotionally). The other interesting WWII tie-in is that the city looks and feels brand new. Part of that can be attributed to the German sense of order (a very clean city), but then you suddenly come to the realization of "oh - it all really IS brand new, because we bombed it to the ground only ~70 years ago". Italy isn't on your list, and there isn't much direct WWII tie-in there, but it is an incredible country. I did 8 days in Venice/Rome/Florence about five years ago, and what a PHENOMENAL vacation. The food especially was incredible. Good luck planning! Wherever you go, you'll have a great time and your son will learn so much. ETA: Oops - missed your response that you've already done Italy.
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steph08
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Post by steph08 on Mar 4, 2014 11:44:32 GMT -5
Poland - we only did Krakow. Highly recommend Auschwitz and the Wieliczka salt mine.
Other than that, I recommend getting the hell out of Poland (trying to do anything/speak to anybody was terrible and it is still so Cold War-esque that it is depressing).
France - Versailles, WWII Museum at Caen, trip around Normandy beaches. We took a train from Paris, did a tour with the museum that picked us up at the station, drove us around in a bus/van all day to the sights, great tour guide, dropped us back off at the train station for trip back to Paris. Long day, but highly, highly recommend.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Mar 4, 2014 11:49:15 GMT -5
The salt mine was incredible. We did the shrine at Czestochowa, which was insanely crowded but fascinating. One of the women on my trip (it was a bus trip) was convinced that she was healed while there.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 4, 2014 12:11:52 GMT -5
As a matter of fact, I did a 6 week study abroad stint in Krakow, and I've been to the country a couple of other times besides. If WWII history is your emphasis, then Poland is the place to go. The last time I was there, it seemed like they were a bit obsessive about keeping the historic places intact. They rebuilt Warsaw's old town back from the rubble of WWII. Gdansk is actually where WWII began, so that could be a good place to go too. Krakow is my favorite though. I could spend the whole time there (and actually did!). Parts of Shindlers List (sp?) were filmed there, so if you watch the movie, you could spot some familiar places from the Jewish ghetto. As others have mentioned, Auschwitz is nearby, as well as the salt mines. I guess the Nazis stored some of their stolen artwork in the salt mines. I think Czestochowa is fairly close as well, if you're feeling churchy. (Its been more years than I care to admit, so I don't remember travel distances all that well.)
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Mar 4, 2014 12:17:06 GMT -5
I couldn't do Auschwitz. I just couldn't. My friend who was traveling with me did though.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 12:19:47 GMT -5
Hi Apple! Personally I think that's too many countries, but that's just me. This said the Netherlands and Belgium are small.
Definitely as Steph said, the War Memorial at Caen, which is near the landing beaches. I'd stay for one night around there. You can take a tour of the landing beaches. They have the tours divided into half-days by "nationality", ie the US beaches, the UK beaches, the Canadian beaches, etc. (We were just in the area two weeks ago, but barely ... we just went to the easternmost landing beach). They also offer full-day tours (as Steph said).
Yes, Versailles. For Paris, I'll give you some other ideas: the Conciergerie (the prison from the French Revolution) (kids / teens LOVE this because you can see the prison cells. There were differently priced cells depending on how rich you were. Very YM lol) Sainte Chapelle, Rodin Museum, Musee Marmottan. Plus the "classics". I hate the Louvre but I guess you've got to go lol. Depending on what time of year, it can be nice (and frugal) to picnic in a park. Pickpocketing has become a HUGE problem in Paris though, so be careful. It's tacky but a Seine tour, either Bateaux Mouches or Les Vedettes de Pont Neuf (which I prefer because they are smaller boats and closer to the water).
If you go to Amsterdam, Anne Frank's house.
If you go to Austria, we spent 4 days in Vienna and loved it: we went to a classical music concert at the Musikverein, and saw the Lippizaners at the Spanish Riding School. (We saw a practice session at the riding school, not the show, because it was really expensive and I opted for the concert). Your son will love the Hundertwasserhaus.
Belgium: never been to Brussels but Bruges is worth a trip (under an hour from Brussels). Very expensive food, lovely streets / canals and 2/3 shops sell amazing chocolate!
I've never been to Germany or Poland.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 4, 2014 12:23:45 GMT -5
I couldn't do Auschwitz. I just couldn't. My friend who was traveling with me did though. I don't blame you. There was a class at my university about the Holocaust that a couple of the other students had taken. I thought they were nuts. Don't get me wrong, I think it's incredibly important to preserve the history, but I guess it hits a little too close to home for me. If I were Jewish, I don't think I could have handled it at all. Some people would come out of the bunk houses at Auschwitz crying.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 12:26:02 GMT -5
I'm Jewish, my parents were from Russia / Poland, there is NO way I could handle visiting a concentration camp.
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Spellbound454
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Post by Spellbound454 on Mar 4, 2014 12:29:38 GMT -5
You could go to one of the war cemetaries....Its like that last scene from "The Good The Bad and The Ugly" So many graves, the sadness just takes your breath away. though the somme ones are WW1 Black Forest is good.... and there are some great lakes and mountains in Switzerland....Cows with bells... and Cuckoo clocks I've been to Europe before.... but have been looking at going on the Orient Express down to Venice...then flying back.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 4, 2014 12:32:53 GMT -5
For a WWII themed trip, I would focus on only 2, maybe 3 countiries at most. One of the countries should be Germany. France and the WWII battles (D-Day and other locations) might be the 2nd country.
You do not want to do an 'If It's Tuesday, It Must Be Belgium' trip of discovery and study.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Mar 4, 2014 12:33:09 GMT -5
I couldn't do Auschwitz. I just couldn't. My friend who was traveling with me did though. I don't blame you. There was a class at my university about the Holocaust that a couple of the other students had taken. I thought they were nuts. Don't get me wrong, I think it's incredibly important to preserve the history, but I guess it hits a little too close to home for me. If I were Jewish, I don't think I could have handled it at all. Some people would come out of the bunk houses at Auschwitz crying. I don't think I could do it now either. I want to take the kids to Europe at some point and if they wanted to go to Auschwitz, I'd suck it up and go. My back to back years of Europe were 1994 and 1995, so there was a lot of 50 Anniversary stuff taking place both years. The Scottish War Memorial in Edinburgh gave me the willies - I'm convinced it's haunted.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 12:36:34 GMT -5
Milee reminded me, there is a US military cemetery right outside Paris, in Suresnes, a very close western suburb. It's for both WWI and WWII.
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Apple
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Post by Apple on Mar 4, 2014 12:38:02 GMT -5
I know it's a lot of countries, BUT, like I said, it may be my son's last time over in Europe, and I want him to get to see what I can. He is absolutely terrified of flying, so without me dragging him, I don't know if he'll ever do a trip overseas on his own. He loves it once he is over somewhere, but the he gets so scared about the flight he can't look forward to the trip. I'd love to do a longer trip with him, but money and time are not unlimited (I'd never come home if they were!)
I will head back "someday" on my own, where I can spend more time in more places. I did England/Ireland/Scotland/Wales in two weeks once, then went back to just London for almost two weeks (when I got to meet Ratchets, WhocanIbe, and almost met Naggie). I've also taken my sister and son to Rome for a week+. So, I know there is no way I can really see everything, or even most things, and I won't be able to relax and just "hang out" like I'd like to, but, the point of this trip is just to get my son to see as many things in these countries as feasible.
We can/will do concentration camps, some of those may be day tours on a bus. I know it's depressing, but it's also very powerful. Just visiting the Holocaust portion of the Imperial War Museum in London was sobering. Part of the reason I have waited to do these countries was that I wanted my son to be older and more mature.
Please keep the ideas coming! I'm at work so can't post except during breaks, but I'll catch up tonight.
Any more ideas/travel tips are welcome as well. Feel free to PM info as well!
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