justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 4, 2014 15:43:19 GMT -5
How is behaving exactly like her parents not parenting her? She's an adult, it's not "butting in" to allow another adult to stay at your house if you so choose.
Sorry, I just don't see how it's so awful for them to want their daughter's best friend, who they probably care about too, to be safe. They can't force her to go home. Their options are to let her stay there where she's safe and hopefully can finish high school, or hope she find some other decent place to crash. To me the only cross in to awful on the whole lets file a law suit for college money. The most I think they should have done was maybe talk to the parents about paying her hs tuition, but even then I'm not so sure.
The parents paying for the rest of her hs tuition won't mean crap if she's not in a place where she's safe, fed, and can get to the school and do her homework..
Though now I want to ask - so where do you think she could live. Parent's isn't an option. You don't think any other parent should take her in. They took back the car they bought. So where should she go and yet still be able to make it to the private school and do her homework?
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 4, 2014 15:44:50 GMT -5
In the article that I posted where they talked to the dad - he mentioned three rules: respect, curfew, and reconsidering the bf. I'm sure there were other things too, but those were the three listed. In my not so long ago experience as a teen (and then moving back after grad school where they saddled me with the my house my rules) the top few rules I broke were the ones they harped on me the loudest about. Obviously don't know the situation but could easily see fights about how she never disrespected them or missed curfew before she met bf, making even the other rules about the bf adding fuel to the fire. As for why I'm stuck on the bf - is because it's a damn stupid rule. The rest aren't - it makes sense to establish rules like that and want them followed. It's stupid as all get-out to try to force your teenage daughter to break up with her bf by making it a rule. Everyone knows that's just going to make her cling to him more, think it's them versus the world, that her parents just want to see her miserable. It's just a stupid, stupid rule and I think her parents are stupid for making that rule and even stupider for making it "reconsider". When you're dealing with stupid teenagers and their looooove you're immediately going all-in in a high-stakes game when you make them choose the bf or her parents. If you don't like what your kid is doing, even if you suspect it's heavily influenced by someone they know, you punish the actions instead of railing against the person. She missed curfew? Ground her for a week. She talks back? Sorry, can't go on your date tonight. Doesn't do her chores? You don't get your keys back until you do them for a week straight. No, she probably wouldn't be on the streets, she'd be couch surfing - but all of her other friend's parents should turn her away too according to you so I'm not sure where she'd go. Or at least any decently safe place. I just don't think it's her best friend's parents job to parent her or make it tough on her. I don't read it as a b/f issue, but one that she is not respecting the house rules. If the b/f is encouraging her to break them, then he IS a problem too. How do you know that this last punishment isn't after years of doing what you suggested? I really doubt that the parents went to this extreme without trying alternative methods. What last punishment? Telling her to break up with the bf or telling her to move out if she doesn't like the rules/kick her out?
|
|
Lizard Queen
Senior Associate
103/2024
Joined: Jan 17, 2011 22:19:13 GMT -5
Posts: 14,659
|
Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 4, 2014 15:48:12 GMT -5
How is behaving exactly like her parents not parenting her? She's an adult, it's not "butting in" to allow another adult to stay at your house if you so choose. Sorry, I just don't see how it's so awful for them to want their daughter's best friend, who they probably care about too, to be safe. They can't force her to go home. Their options are to let her stay there where she's safe and hopefully can finish high school, or hope she find some other decent place to crash. To me the only cross in to awful on the whole lets file a law suit for college money. The most I think they should have done was maybe talk to the parents about paying her hs tuition, but even then I'm not so sure. The parents paying for the rest of her hs tuition won't mean crap if she's not in a place where she's safe, fed, and can get to the school and do her homework.. Though now I want to ask - so where do you think she could live. Parent's isn't an option. You don't think any other parent should take her in. They took back the car they bought. So where should she go and yet still be able to make it to the private school and do her homework? Going back home and following the rules is THE option. How is that not an option? As an adult, I've had to do a lot of things that I rather not, following a few rules and doing a few chores would be a cakewalk by comparison.
|
|
|
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Mar 4, 2014 15:49:40 GMT -5
Where did you read that?
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 4, 2014 15:52:05 GMT -5
How is behaving exactly like her parents not parenting her? She's an adult, it's not "butting in" to allow another adult to stay at your house if you so choose. Sorry, I just don't see how it's so awful for them to want their daughter's best friend, who they probably care about too, to be safe. They can't force her to go home. Their options are to let her stay there where she's safe and hopefully can finish high school, or hope she find some other decent place to crash. To me the only cross in to awful on the whole lets file a law suit for college money. The most I think they should have done was maybe talk to the parents about paying her hs tuition, but even then I'm not so sure. The parents paying for the rest of her hs tuition won't mean crap if she's not in a place where she's safe, fed, and can get to the school and do her homework.. Though now I want to ask - so where do you think she could live. Parent's isn't an option. You don't think any other parent should take her in. They took back the car they bought. So where should she go and yet still be able to make it to the private school and do her homework? Going back home and following the rules is THE option. How is that not an option? As an adult, I've had to do a lot of things that I rather not, following a few rules and doing a few chores would be a cakewalk by comparison. She's 18, she's an adult. She has whatever option she chooses. It's probably wisest to go back to her parents that were paying for her tuition and apparently had a college fund for her, but she's chosen not to. This isn't a 10 year old, or even a 16 year old.
|
|
Lizard Queen
Senior Associate
103/2024
Joined: Jan 17, 2011 22:19:13 GMT -5
Posts: 14,659
|
Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 4, 2014 15:56:45 GMT -5
Well, then you can't have it both ways. Either you're a child that needs to be taken care of, or if you're an adult, take care of yourself and don't try to sue some money out of the parents.
|
|
|
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Mar 4, 2014 16:08:24 GMT -5
I can't imagine what her suing her parents will do to their relationship in the future. This has to burn a few bridges.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 4, 2014 16:19:17 GMT -5
Dudes, I never once said it was a smart/good/whatever idea that she was suing them. Never once.
Even though things have gone to hell in a hand basket, and she's 18 so it's her choice, I do think the parents should have paid for her last semester. I don't think it's really possible to switch to public for the last semester of high school and she is a good student. Though if I was going to take that stand against my parents I would have been trying every avenue I could get to complete the last semester somewhere.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Post by milee on Mar 4, 2014 16:44:34 GMT -5
Parents, daughter and crazy lawyer friend need some conflict management skills.
- The parents are not being very smart with the boyfriend ultimatum (unless they're protecting her from abuse, etc., which is the only time I can even picture such a strong stand being worth trying.) - The daughter isn't being very smart about just sucking it up and playing by the rules for another couple of months until graduation. - The lawyer friend appears to be meddling out of self-interest (publicity, fees, something.)
As a parent, I hope I wouldn't let things get so out of hand and adversarial that the situation risked my child not graduating from high school. But on the other hand, my house my rules is not something you're "saddled with", it's a reasonable system given the roles and who's paying the bills, so I don't think it's at all unreasonable to expect that a daughter living at home follows the house rules. As a legal adult, if you don't like the rules, it's up to you to decide if the subsidy of living at home is worth following the rules or if you need to support yourself so you can make your own rules.
As inconvenient as it would be, there's nothing stopping the daughter from transferring to and getting her degree from the public high school. Stopping the tuition is not a choice I'd personally make as a parent (it would have to be an incredibly serious situation for me to risk my kid not getting a diploma), but it's not wrong or immoral. Again, the daughter is now a legal adult and if she wants to graduate from that private high school so badly, she is welcome to choose to follow the rules so that her parents will pay.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Mar 4, 2014 17:09:50 GMT -5
When I was beholden to others, I played by their rules. If my parents had said break up with so and so, I'd have done so. Small price to pay for being supported. When I could support myself, I played by my own rules. When I supported my kids, they played by my rules. He who strokes the checks makes the rules. Or she.
|
|
Abby Normal
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 12:31:49 GMT -5
Posts: 3,501
|
Post by Abby Normal on Mar 4, 2014 17:19:24 GMT -5
I've always told my son that he has options- he just may not like the options he has.
Same situation here. I could see it coming to a head where if the daughter is THAT disrespectful, etc and things have been going on for a while, where you say " Live by my rules, or move out". It sounds like she took the latter option. But I could see where she goes to BFF's house and says " My parents kicked me out".
But we don't know what all lead up to it. It'll be interesting to see what the judge rules. What a can of worms it would open if it's decided that a parent has to pay for a college education.
|
|
973beachbum
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:13 GMT -5
Posts: 10,501
|
Post by 973beachbum on Mar 4, 2014 17:41:50 GMT -5
I used to think like all the posts here. If a teen said their parent was crazy, or my teen, I automatically believed the adult. My thinking was that the adult may have been choosing a way I wouldn't have, but they were undoubtedly doing what they thought was in their child's best interest. Then I met a couple of them! The reason their kids didn't follow their rules is because they changed every five minutes at best. At worst the teen was punished because she was the "bad seed". And trust me there was no way to ever make then happy. So punishment for one girl was not allowing the child to go to public school because everyone knows all the people there are bad influinces. At least that is what the parents said. It also helped them stop her from telling anyone what was actually happening or seeing what might be hiding under the Amish getup Mom would dress the bad seed in. The fact that it effectively isolated the girl from everyone but her whackadoodle abusive mother and sisters was just a happy accident. So while these parents might be totally reasonable people with very usual and normal rules, I no longer take it on general principal after having to meet a couple of them up close and personal.
|
|
Abby Normal
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 12:31:49 GMT -5
Posts: 3,501
|
Post by Abby Normal on Mar 4, 2014 17:57:33 GMT -5
Agreed- that's why I had said I'd like to know what the rules where. How reasonable, or unreasonable they were.
My mom actually kicked me out once. The summer after my freshman year of college. She and my dad were divorcing and she was a hormonal mess. We had been fighting a lot (and I wasn't even at home that much) but I was home for the summer. We had yet another argument and she finally said "pack your crap and get out". I was already going to my BFF's for the weekend (250 miles away- BFF family moved right after we graduated high school) so I said I'll be out on Monday and took off.
By the time, I reached their house my mom had called three times. I remember walking in the door of pseudo mom's house and she immediately told me to call my mom. I said no, she said yes, and wouldn't back down until I did. Long run, Mom apologize and we figured things out. We still laugh about it today. But my mom has always said she was glad that BFF's mom made me call, and I am too. That's how things should work.
In this case, the BFF's dad is making things worse. Give her a safe place, but I wonder if he bothered to call the parents and find out the other side of the story. There are always two sides, and the truth is somewhere in the middle.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Post by milee on Mar 4, 2014 19:08:19 GMT -5
I used to think like all the posts here. If a teen said their parent was crazy, or my teen, I automatically believed the adult. My thinking was that the adult may have been choosing a way I wouldn't have, but they were undoubtedly doing what they thought was in their child's best interest. Then I met a couple of them! The reason their kids didn't follow their rules is because they changed every five minutes at best. At worst the teen was punished because she was the "bad seed". And trust me there was no way to ever make then happy. So punishment for one girl was not allowing the child to go to public school because everyone knows all the people there are bad influinces. At least that is what the parents said. It also helped them stop her from telling anyone what was actually happening or seeing what might be hiding under the Amish getup Mom would dress the bad seed in. The fact that it effectively isolated the girl from everyone but her whackadoodle abusive mother and sisters was just a happy accident. So while these parents might be totally reasonable people with very usual and normal rules, I no longer take it on general principal after having to meet a couple of them up close and personal. Oh, I completely agree with you that the parents may be crazy or have totally unreasonable rules. Remember, my mother had severe mental health issues, so the "rules" changed all the time and included some things that no other parent would find OK.
The parents here may be unreasonable - it's very possible. But I still think that unless the parents' rules are illegal or abusive, that they have the right to make the rules and if the daughter wants to graduate from the private high school and get access to the college fund, she needs to follow the rules. Otherwise, she's making the choice that she values freedom more than she values the financial support - which is a completely OK choice.
|
|
|
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Mar 4, 2014 20:38:10 GMT -5
|
|
resolution
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:09:56 GMT -5
Posts: 7,244
Mini-Profile Name Color: 305b2b
|
Post by resolution on Mar 4, 2014 22:50:20 GMT -5
Sounds like her boyfriend is connected with her suspension from school for truancy. In that case I can understand why her parents told her to stop seeing him. She has also filed some emotional abuse claims against her parents with child protection, which were investigated and determined unsubstantiated. www.cnn.com/2014/03/04/justice/student-sues-parents-new-jersey/
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 9, 2024 0:26:55 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 23:03:02 GMT -5
Sounds like her boyfriend is connected with her suspension from school for truancy. In that case I can understand why her parents told her to stop seeing him. She has also filed some emotional abuse claims against her parents with child protection, which were investigated and determined unsubstantiated. www.cnn.com/2014/03/04/justice/student-sues-parents-new-jersey/Poor little rich girl!
|
|
resolution
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:09:56 GMT -5
Posts: 7,244
Mini-Profile Name Color: 305b2b
|
Post by resolution on Mar 4, 2014 23:05:05 GMT -5
|
|
grits
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 17, 2012 13:43:33 GMT -5
Posts: 3,185
|
Post by grits on Mar 4, 2014 23:24:03 GMT -5
I think she needs a good dose of reality. "Would you like fries with that?".
|
|
grits
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 17, 2012 13:43:33 GMT -5
Posts: 3,185
|
Post by grits on Mar 5, 2014 0:09:18 GMT -5
I think your parents would have rewarded you with something other than money.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Mar 5, 2014 9:12:02 GMT -5
What a shame that these parents tried to do all the right things for their child and only succeeded in raising a spoiled brat. I'm amazed that the judge ruled in their favor.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 5, 2014 10:41:11 GMT -5
Oh boy. Heard some of her emails on the radio this morning. The girl has dug her own grave. I retract my statement of even having the parents be nice and pay for her last semester of high school.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 5, 2014 10:42:26 GMT -5
Dudes, I never once said it was a smart/good/whatever idea that she was suing them. Never once. Even though things have gone to hell in a hand basket, and she's 18 so it's her choice, I do think the parents should have paid for her last semester. I don't think it's really possible to switch to public for the last semester of high school and she is a good student. Though if I was going to take that stand against my parents I would have been trying every avenue I could get to complete the last semester somewhere. But that's not what she's suing for. It's her last semester at private HS and all of her tuition costs for college. I understand that. I never said she should get both. I didn't even say she should sue to get the last semester of HS covered. Not sure what your point was.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 5, 2014 10:52:56 GMT -5
I understand that. I never said she should get both. I didn't even say she should sue to get the last semester of HS covered. Not sure what your point was. I was replying to this part of your post It read as you thought she was only trying to get the last semester of HS paid for. Ah, no. That comment was more of a - if the fights were getting that bad at home I would have been looking into options other than private HS to finish my degree in case I left/got kicked out. At the very least, she left in November...plenty of time to get put into public HS for the spring semester. In other words, she should have expected that moving out might mean her parents stop paying for private HS and acted accordingly (play nice with them, enroll in public HS, online HS, asking the private HS for a scholarship).
|
|
alabamagal
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 23, 2010 11:30:29 GMT -5
Posts: 8,147
|
Post by alabamagal on Mar 5, 2014 11:12:25 GMT -5
Well if you read the story, her parents stopped paying for private high school, but the school did not kick her out. The school says the parents owe for the tuition. They signed a contract at the beginning of the year.
What a spoiled brat! I am glad that the judge said the parents didn't have to pay for college. I feel I have the right to stop paying for anything after my kids turn 18. Fortunately I don't have spoiled brats for kids and I am glad to help them with their college education.
|
|
|
Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Mar 5, 2014 11:17:48 GMT -5
I'm glad the judge realized the repercussions of what awarding her this lawsuit would do in the future.
CPS called it right, she s a spoiled brat.
|
|
milee
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2012 13:20:00 GMT -5
Posts: 12,344
|
Post by milee on Mar 5, 2014 11:27:27 GMT -5
Oh boy. Heard some of her emails on the radio this morning. The girl has dug her own grave. I retract my statement of even having the parents be nice and pay for her last semester of high school. Yeah, her emails didn't help her.
As horrible as she comes across, though, I am guessing that it's not necessarily that the parents are model citizens, it's that they are older, wiser and at least savvy enough not to display their bad behavior in email, VM or other traceable form. He's in a highly political job, so is well aware of the importance of not leaving controversial things on email, VM, etc. so the fact that only the daughter has done that is no more than a sign that she's younger and more naïve about how to conceal bad behavior.
My bet is that there have been growing issues in that house for several years. The daughter is not a prize, but she didn't spring forth like that in a vacuum. The parents are savvy enough to not have put their dirty laundry on display like the daughter naively did, but it is highly unlikely that things got this far off the rails without some parental lapses at a minimum and outright bad parental behavior at a maximum. IMHO, there's more to this story than evil, spoiled daughter tries to victimize loving, perfect parents.
(All that said, I still don't think there's a legal case here. If the daughter wants out - and that may be the best thing for everybody - she needs to cowboy up and move on.)
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 5, 2014 11:27:57 GMT -5
Ah, hadn't heard that. I figured that since she was suing for it she got kicked out because if they let her stay it would be a bill the parents owe due to a contract - a school/parent issue that she has no part in.
|
|
justme
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 10, 2012 13:12:47 GMT -5
Posts: 14,618
|
Post by justme on Mar 5, 2014 11:32:19 GMT -5
Oh boy. Heard some of her emails on the radio this morning. The girl has dug her own grave. I retract my statement of even having the parents be nice and pay for her last semester of high school. Yeah, her emails didn't help her.
As horrible as she comes across, though, I am guessing that it's not necessarily that the parents are model citizens, it's that they are older, wiser and at least savvy enough not to display their bad behavior in email, VM or other traceable form. He's in a highly political job, so is well aware of the importance of not leaving controversial things on email, VM, etc. so the fact that only the daughter has done that is no more than a sign that she's younger and more naïve about how to conceal bad behavior.
My bet is that there have been growing issues in that house for several years. The daughter is not a prize, but she didn't spring forth like that in a vacuum. The parents are savvy enough to not have put their dirty laundry on display like the daughter naively did, but it is highly unlikely that things got this far off the rails without some parental lapses at a minimum and outright bad parental behavior at a maximum. IMHO, there's more to this story than evil, spoiled daughter tries to victimize loving, perfect parents.
(All that said, I still don't think there's a legal case here. If the daughter wants out - and that may be the best thing for everybody - she needs to cowboy up and move on.)
Oh, I definitely agree that the parents most likely knew not to put thinks in writing/vm (and with the rest of what you said). Especially after she put in those complaints to CPS or wherever it was. I would definitely be in a CYA mode as a parent.
|
|
Abby Normal
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 12:31:49 GMT -5
Posts: 3,501
|
Post by Abby Normal on Mar 5, 2014 11:55:22 GMT -5
The part that bothered me about her claim of abuse is that it's too vague. That just sounds strange to me as if she knew she had to come up with some reason her parents were evil. Mom made be bulimic and Dad wanted to molest me.
But the part that really gets me is the pictures of the hearing. Mom and Dad look devastated. She looks like she's bored and even happy in a few. If she were abused, you'd think she'd think be bothered by facing her abusers, or distraught at having to deal with it.
|
|