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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 18:30:34 GMT -5
Much if they weren't biologically yours?
My wife test results came back and she is ok; awesome! Next week she is up for some blood test and follow up visit with doctor the week after that.
So we decided to start trying as soon as she gives us the green light which we hope is at that visit and we discussed the "what if" it doesn't work? Would I be ok with a sperm donor ?
I suggested "adoption" and my wife said she would be willing to adopt but she wants to experience pregnancy once, dreamed of it her whole life.
For some reason in my mind I am perfectly ok with adopting yet I still cannot come to term with my wife carrying another man's child. Yes I know it would be ours and I would love him/her as if he/she was biologically mine but I wonder if it would bother me if deep inside I knew he/she was technically my wife's child but not mine.
So fucked up on so many level to be thinking about it but cannot stop thinking about it since we talked about it last night. Would I be able to love my wife child that is not biologically mine? Do I love her enough to give her the joy of carrying someone else child?
And do we tell the kids? Do we tell our families? Telling either of our moms is like telling the whole family; those two ladies cannot keep a secret to save their lives.
Why am I ok with adopting yet still not 100% ok with the other route if needed? Oh well, maybe we will get lucky and this will be a moot point.
*as for cost we are doubly insured for both dental and medical (both out jobs). We did the calculations : paying 2 insurance premiums is insanely cheaper than the cost of fertility treatments with one insurance if we need to go that route (comparing/adding the two). To make this YM related lol
-> but to the YM crowd: do you think you would love your kids just as much if they weren't biologically yours?
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 19, 2014 18:36:25 GMT -5
I think I would feel the same way you do - if we used my husband's sperm but not my eggs.
ETA: and then I think I would secretly wonder if they felt more towards my husband somehow....I would probably be paranoid and insecure about the whole thing
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Feb 19, 2014 18:39:39 GMT -5
That is a tough one. I would think so. Especially since you will be there 100% every step of the way & there is no other father in the picture. The only way you won't be this child's father is biologically & we know that being a biological father doesn't really count for anything sometimes.
I can understand why it is hard for you though. I would really try to work through your feelings before proceding that way though. You don't want to be trying to cope with this at the same time that your wife is pregnant & everything is changing.
As far as telling families - only if you don't care it is open knowledge. Given the gossip in your family, I wouldn't. But, then the truth is likely to come out eventually (even if you keep the secret it may come out because of different blood types, genetic testing, etc), so I don't know if sooner is better than later.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Feb 19, 2014 18:42:30 GMT -5
Love is a Tricky Thing. It seems to me that there is no gaurentee that you'll love your own biological children (or that they will love you). You may feel more 'obligation' towards them cause culture sez you have to do X for 'family' but you might not feel much love for them.
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travelnut11
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Post by travelnut11 on Feb 19, 2014 18:48:01 GMT -5
HI Cawaiu-
I don't have kids and haven't started trying yet so am not sure how this will go for us. I'm already advanced maternal age so it could go poorly and I'm not sure what we'll do in this case but my example is from some friends that had this exact issue...she was fine but his sperm count was nearly non-existent. They considered IVF to give themselves a shot at a totally biological child but the doctor was even skeptical at that because of his sperm quality/quantity. My friend's husband decided at the last minute that he could deal with not being biologically related and they used a sperm donor and it worked on the first try. He has absolutely no issues loving his non-bio child.
Of interest to you might be the huge difference in cost. They did an IUI using Clomid only so the whole cost was clomid (cheap)+sperm($600ish)+office visit($300)=$1000. IVF would have been more in the $15K range and was no guarantee of a baby at the end. Not that IUI was a guarantee either but at only $1k a pop they could've done it a few times.
As for who to tell...they plan to tell their son though I'm not sure at what point. They have to I think because at this point too many people know already. I don't think they're at all trying to hide it from him but trying to figure out how/when to tell in an age appropriate manner (their son is currently 4).
Anyway, one data point for you. I honestly think when the kid arrives it is not going to matter and you are going to adore him/her. Most of our friends don't even remember that this particular friend used a sperm donor. It's just a non-issue.
Good luck to you and your wife!
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 19, 2014 18:50:36 GMT -5
If they weren't biologically yours? My wife test results came back and she is ok; awesome! Next week she is up for some blood test and follow up visit with doctor the week after that. So we decided to start trying as soon as she gives us the green light which we hope is at that visit and we discussed the "what if" it doesn't work? Would I be ok with a sperm donor ? I suggested "adoption" and my wife said she would be willing to adopt but she wants to experience pregnancy once, dreamed of it her whole life. For some reason in my mind I am perfectly ok with adopting yet I still cannot come to term with my wife carrying another man's child. Yes I know it would be ours and I would love him/her as if he/she was biologically mine but I wonder if it would bother me if deep inside I knew he/she was technically my wife's child but not mine. So fucked up on so many level to be thinking about it but cannot stop thinking about it since we talked about it last night. Would I be able to love my wife child that is not biologically mine? Do I love her enough to give her the joy of carrying someone else child? And do we tell the kids? Do we tell our families? Telling either of our moms is like telling the whole family; those two ladies cannot keep a secret to save their lives. Why am I ok with adopting yet still not 100% ok with the other route if needed? Oh well, maybe we will get lucky and this will be a moot point. *as for cost we are doubly insured for both dental and medical (both out jobs). We did the calculations : paying 2 insurance premiums is insanely cheaper than the cost of fertility treatments with one insurance if we need to go that route (comparing/adding the two). To make this YM related lol -> but to the YM crowd: do you think you would love your kids just as much if they weren't biologically yours? Pregnancy is overrated.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 19, 2014 19:02:24 GMT -5
Carl-Say your wife was previously married (widowed?) and she had a three-year-old child when you married her, could you come to love her child?
A sperm donor is just a sperm donor. But a nuturing father is many things.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Feb 19, 2014 19:06:50 GMT -5
I think this is really dependent on the person. I was never a "kid" person but I had a string desire to have kids. I wanted to experience pregnancy. We ran into fertility problems and I had to consider whether I could love a baby that wasn't mine biologically. I really thought I could have but my husband flat out refused to raise a baby that wasn't his biological child. He is definitely not a "kid" person so for him he meets that genetic link.
It really is what you can deal with and everyone is different.
I really wish you and the misses tons of luck
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Feb 19, 2014 19:08:10 GMT -5
Carl-Say your wife was previously married (widowed?) and she had a three-year-old child when you married her, could you come to love her child? A sperm donor is just a sperm donor. But a nuturing father is many things. I know I don't have it in me to be a step-parent. Teenage years are hard enough without having two sets if parents with different rules. We live in the same house and my dd tries to play is off one another....can't imagine what she would pull if we were divorced!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 19:21:01 GMT -5
Carl-Say your wife was previously married (widowed?) and she had a three-year-old child when you married her, could you come to love her child? A sperm donor is just a sperm donor. But a nuturing father is many things. I don't know because I am not in that position. I have witness and been victim of step parents treating their biologically kids differently vs how they treat their non biological kids. Maybe the difference exist because they had both and knew one was theirs and the other wasn't; I don't know. But the difference was clear to see... I have seen parents treat their previous kids differently when they had kids with the new/current husband/wife. My cousin was never told till he was 25 that he had a different father but he said he felt his whole life that his dad treated him differently vs the way he treated his sister (dad got together with his mom she was pregnant from a previous relationship). Being told just made it click; suddenly it made sense. That is the concern... Would I feel differently? What if we try with a sperm donor have a kid and then she gets pregnant with my kid... Would my feelings change? I am not sterile; just low sperm count and motility. Those are all the things that are going through in my head and would I want to put a kid through that. I know how it felt to be treated differently, like a second class citizen in your own house and I always swore I would never get remarried if I had kids because I refuse to give my kids the kind of stepmothers I had (yes not all stepmothers are the same, I know) or have a second or third family and be treated as non valuable/replaceable like my own father did to me. So yes I am weighting all dad and thinking: would knowing the kid is not mine turn me into the person I swore I would never be?
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Feb 19, 2014 19:25:44 GMT -5
If you have a low sperm count, can't they remove one of her eggs, fertilize it from a sperm sample of yours, then insert the egg? I don't see why you'd need to use a donor if you aren't actually sterile?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 19:33:46 GMT -5
If you have a low sperm count, can't they remove one of her eggs, fertilize it from a sperm sample of yours, then insert the egg? I don't see why you'd need to use a donor if you aren't actually sterile? Cost like the poster above said 1k vs 15-25k Also the reason we got her insurance is while my insurance covered some fertility treatment it did not cover IVF Her insurance covers some percentage of IVF; but we still have to pay some.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 19:33:49 GMT -5
Being a step parent is a MUCH different situation than being the parent of a child that is doesn't have your genetic make up.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Feb 19, 2014 19:41:17 GMT -5
Carl-you and your wife will have to figure out what is the best case scenario for each of you. Take your time as it is a big decision to all involved.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Feb 19, 2014 19:43:55 GMT -5
If it's something you're not sure you can deal with, it might be worth paying more to get your "own" kid. $15k sounds like a lot, but when it comes to kids it's really not much. I know people spending that every year in daycare.
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milee
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Post by milee on Feb 19, 2014 19:56:10 GMT -5
It really doesn't matter how I would feel. It really doesn't matter how any other poster on the board would feel. It only matters what you and your wife feel.
If you're concerned about this (and you've mentioned it before, so this isn't the first time it's come up as an issue), maybe it's worth a few visits with a counselor by yourself to explore this topic. There's no right answer and you shouldn't be pressured into doing something you'll be uncomfortable with. Go to some sessions with a professional counselor and sort this out so you know you're OK with what you decide. If it's something different than what your wife wants, then you might need to add in a few sessions with the two of you together, but first you should go by yourself.
As for the issue of telling the family, take out the drama and remove all potential future bombshells by just being blasé and upfront with whatever you do. Just telling people something in a boring, clinical way removes most temptation to gossip and incentive for it to become a hot topic or secret. BTW, this works great with telling kids about sex and other uncomfy topics. If you start with boring, basic blasé biology at a young age, it's not a big deal, there's no shame or embarrassment and they get the facts without any need for a weird bombshell discussion later.
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ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
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Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Feb 19, 2014 19:56:24 GMT -5
If it's any consolation, my SIL could not get pregnant/carry to term - she and my brother desperately wanted a family - and weighed all their options.
They chose adoption after much soul-searching. Both children were adopted as newborns. First their daughter, and then about 3 yrs later, their son.
These kids ARE their children in every way except "blood". Bringing them home shortly after their births, was (for them) bringing home THEIR newborn daughter then son. They fell in love with both of them the moment they set eyes on them after their birth. They are their family and my niece/nephew.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 19:57:18 GMT -5
If it's something you're not sure you can deal with, it might be worth paying more to get your "own" kid. $15k sounds like a lot, but when it comes to kids it's really not much. I know people spending that every year in daycare. True if it was 100% bullet proof 1 round turns into two, then 3... Then maybe the 4th one will be the one. And you don't get a refund!
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travelnut11
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Post by travelnut11 on Feb 19, 2014 20:01:28 GMT -5
If it's something you're not sure you can deal with, it might be worth paying more to get your "own" kid. $15k sounds like a lot, but when it comes to kids it's really not much. I know people spending that every year in daycare. I think most people would agree that $15K would be worth it to get a kid for life but the problem with IVF is that nothing is guaranteed. You could spend that $15-25K and still end up with no baby. Or you could do multiple cycles and still end up with no kid after $100K. That's the part that's tough to take. If the IVF guaranteed a kid I'm sure they'd just go for it. Of course Mr and Mrs Cawaiu are young so the infertility treatments should go better for them so they do have that going for them. Adoption comes with its own set of problems and is not cheap in most cases (unless you adopt from foster care) but is, of course, a great option as well. Being Haitian I'm assuming they're not trying to compete with tons of white people trying to adopt blond haired/blue-eyed kids so their wait to be matched with a baby would likely be much, much shorter if they went the domestic route. Sadly and unfortunately there is a hierarchy and supply/demand situation for adoptable babies in the U.S. and being black will actually be a great advantage to Mr/Mrs. C.
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Feb 19, 2014 20:25:13 GMT -5
Everyone is different. Obviously, I am okay with not having biological child. I've pondered raising a child that was C's and not mine, and the truth is, I knew I was willing to go to court to have custody of that child (should it have existed, which the mom assures us it doesn't, long story). But that is me. How I feel matters not, and should have absolutely no impact on you.
Adding a child to your family is a deeply personal decision. How you go about it even more personal. And you have the right to make whatever decisions feel best for you. I completely agree with milee that seeing a counselor on your own to figure out what you want is probably the right decision.
There is NOTHING wrong if you decide you can't raise a child that is biologically your wife's and not yours, if you are more comfortable with adoption than sperm donation- because that's how you feel, and you are entitled to your feelings. The important thing here is to not feel bullied or coerced into a situation. And that's where counseling comes in- first for you, and then for your wife.
Talk to your doctor. Ask them to recommend a counselor who specializes in infertility problems. There are lots of them out there. (Most of the fertility clinics up here actually require that you see a counselor while undergoing treatments.)
You want to be the best father you can be, and I think it's great that you are thinking about these things and willing to put your feelings out there.
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justme
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Post by justme on Feb 19, 2014 20:33:57 GMT -5
If it's something you're not sure you can deal with, it might be worth paying more to get your "own" kid. $15k sounds like a lot, but when it comes to kids it's really not much. I know people spending that every year in daycare. True if it was 100% bullet proof 1 round turns into two, then 3... Then maybe the 4th one will be the one. And you don't get a refund! I know some fertility clinics have a sort of package deal where you do get some sort of guarantee. Not sure if it works with insurance, and not sure what it is. It varies by clinics - I think I've read one that was pay for 3 and if you're not pregnant the 4th try is free. I think one group refunds the whole thing if you're not pregnant by the end of the package. Also, erm, going to be totally un-YM and say maybe this is something the moms could help with?
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JustLurkin
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Post by JustLurkin on Feb 19, 2014 20:39:38 GMT -5
Being a step parent is a MUCH different situation than being the parent of a child that is doesn't have your genetic make up. Eh, I'm pretty sure my step-dad likes me much more than his bio-kids.
But, on the other hand, I would not date a guy with minor children.
But, on the other other hand, I look forward to being a foster parent some day.
Yea, I know, way helpful.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 20:40:52 GMT -5
TheHaitian one of the biggest shocks of my life was realizing that biological families have favourites and second class citizens too, even when everyone was biologically equal. That isn't a function of biology. Blows your mind right? But it's true!
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Feb 19, 2014 20:41:05 GMT -5
I'm on my phone so I can't go into depth, but 1) our fertility clinic required us to go to therapy to deal with these issues. It is ok and normal for you to feel like this. 2) yes, yes, yes you must tell the child(ren). If they find out on their own it becomes something to be ashamed of. We have had many conversations with ds 4 how mommy and daddy wanted a baby so much that we went to the doctor and a man donated sperm so we could have him and dd.
I know its not the same for us since there was never any chance of us conceiving alone, but dh loves our kids more than anything without any genetic link.
Sent from my ADR6410LVW using proboards
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Sunnyday
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Post by Sunnyday on Feb 19, 2014 21:17:40 GMT -5
my entire life I felt odd about how I was treated in my family. I found out years later from my father that I wasn't wanted because I was a girl. Oddly, my father didn't mind girls, it was my mother who didn't want girls.
I always knew that something was off in how I was treated, but when my father told me that in my early twenties. Everything clicked, and I understood all my interactions with my mother.
And I am their biological daughter without a shadow of a doubt. Today, I am estranged from several members of my biological family. Blood means shit to me.
Only you can really know how open your heart is. And honestly, as long as you never father any of your children, you will never know any different, so really it's a non-issue.
They will have half your wife's DNA, and that has got to mean something if that sort of thing is important to you.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2014 21:31:37 GMT -5
Being a step parent is a MUCH different situation than being the parent of a child that is doesn't have your genetic make up. Eh, I'm pretty sure my step-dad likes me much more than his bio-kids.
But, on the other hand, I would not date a guy with minor children.
But, on the other other hand, I look forward to being a foster parent some day.
Yea, I know, way helpful.
But you have to admit that a step parent coming into a family with their own baggage and the baggage of the family is easy different than starting a family with an adopted baby.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 19, 2014 21:32:39 GMT -5
I've spent far too much time in family court recently, and blood relations are also overrated.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Feb 19, 2014 21:34:43 GMT -5
If it's something you're not sure you can deal with, it might be worth paying more to get your "own" kid. $15k sounds like a lot, but when it comes to kids it's really not much. I know people spending that every year in daycare. True if it was 100% bullet proof 1 round turns into two, then 3... Then maybe the 4th one will be the one. And you don't get a refund! About 6 months before DH and I considered conceiving our third, we set a dollar limit on how far we would go. IVF isn't for me. I knew that before we started. During our journey, I could barely tolerate the high octane drugs for four days. The first day I had to inject myself I cried for a half hour and told my husband I couldn't do it. You don't know how you are going to feel until you go through the process. I mean, you can come to terms with your feelings about using donor sperm (and the chance of multiples with said sperm), adoption, etc. But, your wife will not be able to come to terms with the actual fertility treatment until she goes through it. She has to be ready for anything and everything. My RE took a new job on day 13 of my cycle. When I went in for my IUI, I got a new RE. Literally, we shook hands and then he performed the IUI. We never talked before then. I like to joke that a strange man knocked me up while my H was at work. As for biology, I spend quite a lot of time working with kids that aren't my own. Granted I don't "love" them, but there are a few, particularly the ones that come from rougher homes, that I would absolutely open up my home to. I've also had my students use me as a sounding board when things were rocky at home, actually with blessings from a parent. Regarding who we will tell about my fertility issues: daughters will have to know, as there's a good chance they may inherit them from me. I did not tell people who I felt would not be supportive about our journey. It did not matter how close or distant family was. If it wasn't in my best interests to tell them, I didn't.
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JustLurkin
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Post by JustLurkin on Feb 19, 2014 21:38:22 GMT -5
Nope, sorry, not the way Cawiau has described his family.
I think he touched on the subject before of the "shame" that can be associated with adoption.
Of course, this isn't what he asked about.
I think the baggage would be different, but still present.
But, I get what you're saying...you heard me say I wouldn't date a guy with minor kids! (At least I can tell major kids to F-off! )
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 19, 2014 21:45:32 GMT -5
When you have no kids, pregnancy and the origins of a baby seem like the most important thing in the world. By the time you have a toddler or a preschooler, you realize pregnancy is like parking the car at Disneyland. All anticipation and making sure you note which row and aisle, but the good stuff is on the other side of the gate. You will forget the DNA portion of it in your heart pretty quickly.
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