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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 10:58:52 GMT -5
isn't it pretty conservative in the midwest? I think it might be a little too much so for us to fit in there. But, who knows?
I don't think Minnesota is that conservative, its a democratic state anyhow, but I've been here my whole life, so I don't have a lot to compare to, but hey, we just approved gay marriage and decriminalized marijuana use a while back.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Dec 5, 2013 11:03:01 GMT -5
isn't it pretty conservative in the midwest? I think it might be a little too much so for us to fit in there. But, who knows?
I don't think Minnesota is that conservative, its a democratic state anyhow, but I've been here my whole life, so I don't have a lot to compare to, but hey, we just approved gay marriage and decriminalized marijuana use a while back. I do think that WI is increasing less progressive than it used to be. I'll leave it at that.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Dec 5, 2013 11:04:11 GMT -5
-Low cost of living. During your working years, a HCOL area is better. As an example, say that all things cost 50% more and wages are 50% higher (a loose assumption). So your income/expenses ratios are about the same as for a LCOL. Two exceptions - #1 - car costs are based on national prices, not regional. So a new car costs only 2/3 as much in a HCOL area. #2 - your family wealth - 401k, IRA, savings - is 50% more in the HCOL area. Ultimately, an HCOL worker can retire, take their +50% stash, and retire to a LCOL area. But a LCOL worker cannot, s/he must stay in a LCOL area.
-Small town. Your politics becomes way more important to you in your 40s/50s and beyond than it is now in your 20s. If you are Left Leaning you'll want Irvine, San Fran, Seattle, Portland, Mpls, Madison. If you are Right Leaning you'll like the small towns such as Boise ID, WY, MT, UT.
-Northwest states. A big factor in selecting geography is natural-disaster mitigation. West Coast has earthquakes/mud slides, East Coast has killer hurricanes, Midwest has killer tornadoes, etc.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 11:04:35 GMT -5
isn't it pretty conservative in the midwest? I think it might be a little too much so for us to fit in there. But, who knows?
I don't think Minnesota is that conservative, its a democratic state anyhow, but I've been here my whole life, so I don't have a lot to compare to, but hey, we just approved gay marriage and decriminalized marijuana use a while back. I do think that WI is increasing less progressive than it used to be. I'll leave it at that. Yes, I agree, WI is going the other way.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Dec 5, 2013 11:04:59 GMT -5
You can move here to Minnesota. Now today isn't the best time to plan a visit (tonight's low is supposed to be in the negatives).
Small Town: My town has around 60,000 people but within 15 miles of us are a dozen small towns with less than 2,000 people. We are a fast 65 mph 4 lane drive from the Twin Cities (can be at the Mall of America in about an hour)
Career Opportunities: We have two Universities (and a community college) in our town and one private university in the small town 10 miles from us. Tuition at the local Minnesota State University is pretty reasonable. DH's current semester cost around $3,000 for full time tuition. MN is home to 3M, Kraft, Best Buy, etc. Taylor Corp is large employer in our town (think wedding invitations, website development, etc). We also have a small publishing company in our town and several other manufacturing centers.
Relatively low cost of living if you want it to be. Our town has everything from $50,000 hundred plus year old houses that need work to million dollar mansions. If you are willing to live 10 to 15 miles out of town you can get a lot of land and more house for your money. Daycare costs around $140 per week per kid (based on current information because that's what my brother pays for my nephew).
Upside- can be a pretty state- Duluth, 10,000 lakes, hiking, camping etc. Mayo has bought a lot of the hospitals around here so you have amazing access to their specialists. Children's Hospital in Minneapolis is where my niece and nephew doctor and it's great hospital too (shunt in niece's brain and hole in nephew's heart)
Downside- it's freezing cold in the winter and we can get a fair amount of snow (but they are usually pretty prompt on the snow plowing and snow removal)
Major Upside- Hello- I live here and I'm freaking awesome.
Plus- there are 3 wineries within 15 minutes of us. I've been at them all and although I don't personally drink my husband and my friends do and they speak highly of the wine at each of the places.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Dec 5, 2013 11:09:13 GMT -5
isn't it pretty conservative in the midwest? I think it might be a little too much so for us to fit in there. But, who knows?
I don't think Minnesota is that conservative, its a democratic state anyhow, but I've been here my whole life, so I don't have a lot to compare to, but hey, we just approved gay marriage and decriminalized marijuana use a while back. Minnesota is like only state that voted for Mondale for pete's sake. We almost always go Democrat in our electoral votes. Plus like MPL says- we allow Gay Marriage. I'm an extremely outspoken person and they haven't run me out of the state yet. Everyone knows I'm a tree hugging, reformed vegetarian, equal rights supporting Atheist and they are cool with it. Even my Catholic dad voted for Same Sex Marriages to be legal in Minnesota.
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Rocky Mtn Saver
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Post by Rocky Mtn Saver on Dec 5, 2013 11:10:31 GMT -5
Firebird, have you considered eastern WA? Housing costs are much lower and they get snow in winter.... I was going to say the same. There's tons of places in both OR and WA that would fit the bill. Bend area might be nice, but a bit more isolated career-wise. Portland is a good choice, smaller than Seattle and it has lots of nearby rural areas.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Dec 5, 2013 11:12:02 GMT -5
lol - are we listing this as a pro? Or a con?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 5, 2013 11:13:38 GMT -5
We have a couple local wineries. www.loesshillsvineyardandwinery.com/phwine.com/I've never been so I can't say what the wine is like. There a couple art galleries in CB but if you hop over into Omaha there are way more and there is also the Durham Museum, Children's Museum and the Josyln Museum. Plus there are tons of little co-op ones scattered all over, especially in the Old Market area.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Dec 5, 2013 11:15:38 GMT -5
Apparently, the Riesling is good: www.foodandwine.com/articles/michigan-in-defense-of-b-list-wine-countryOr if you like beer, Grand Rapids has Founders and Kalamazoo produces Bell's. As far as the midwest being too conservative, I think there are pockets of each here and there--at least in Michigan, I can't say for other states. I'm usually pretty middle of the road myself, but this board often makes me feel like I'm a "flaming liberal".
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 11:17:03 GMT -5
You can move here to Minnesota. Now today isn't the best time to plan a visit (tonight's low is supposed to be in the negatives).
Small Town: My town has around 60,000 people but within 15 miles of us are a dozen small towns with less than 2,000 people. We are a fast 65 mph 4 lane drive from the Twin Cities (can be at the Mall of America in about an hour)
Career Opportunities: We have two Universities (and a community college) in our town and one private university in the small town 10 miles from us. Tuition at the local Minnesota State University is pretty reasonable. DH's current semester cost around $3,000 for full time tuition. MN is home to 3M, Kraft, Best Buy, etc. Taylor Corp is large employer in our town (think wedding invitations, website development, etc). We also have a small publishing company in our town and several other manufacturing centers.
Relatively low cost of living if you want it to be. Our town has everything from $50,000 hundred plus year old houses that need work to million dollar mansions. If you are willing to live 10 to 15 miles out of town you can get a lot of land and more house for your money. Daycare costs around $140 per week per kid (based on current information because that's what my brother pays for my nephew).
Upside- can be a pretty state- Duluth, 10,000 lakes, hiking, camping etc. Mayo has bought a lot of the hospitals around here so you have amazing access to their specialists. Children's Hospital in Minneapolis is where my niece and nephew doctor and it's great hospital too (shunt in niece's brain and hole in nephew's heart)
Downside- it's freezing cold in the winter and we can get a fair amount of snow (but they are usually pretty prompt on the snow plowing and snow removal)
Major Upside- Hello- I live here and I'm freaking awesome.
Plus- there are 3 wineries within 15 minutes of us. I've been at them all and although I don't personally drink my husband and my friends do and they speak highly of the wine at each of the places. I'm going to put in a plug for the Mississippi River Valley area here. I live on the ridge overlooking the valley and it's like a different world down there. I'll be facing sub-zero winds and blizzard like conditions headed to work, get to the bottom of the hill and there's no snow on the ground and people are complaining about why they cancelled school that day (for all of us NOT in the valley!). Yeah, still cold, and still gets plenty of snow, but being nestled between the MN and WI bluffs shelters you quite a bit and winters are definitely milder. Plus, it's beautiful and the Great River Road I drive to work every day is always making the list for most scenic drives in America.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Dec 5, 2013 11:26:46 GMT -5
MPL lives in one of the prettiest parts of the state. Every time we go over that way DH comments that he wants to move to that area.
Phil- I HATE the Mall of America with a passion. I don't like to be in places where I can't see the exit plus I hate shopping. When the German Exchange students were hear they LOVED that place. Were always begging their host families to bring them there so they could go shopping.
We have all the major sports teams- Timberwolves (Basketball), Vikings (Football), Twins (baseball) and Wild (Hockey). We get decent concerts in the cities and they have the Guthrie and other theaters.
I like living in a small town with hardly any traffic but I have the ability to drive an hour and be in the thick of things
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Dec 5, 2013 11:31:36 GMT -5
Beth starts to make a smartass comment about the Vikings and realizes she's in a town with the Bucks (NBA) and Brewers (MLB) and doesn't have a leg to stand on...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 11:34:24 GMT -5
Beth starts to make a smartass comment about the Vikings and realizes she's in a town with the Bucks (NBA) and Brewers (MLB) and doesn't have a leg to stand on... Not to mention your one man football team.
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sheilaincali
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Post by sheilaincali on Dec 5, 2013 11:34:32 GMT -5
I don't follow sports but I do know that the Vikings are their own worst enemy. To harass my brother I usually cheer for whoever they are playing against that week
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Dec 5, 2013 11:36:06 GMT -5
Beth starts to make a smartass comment about the Vikings and realizes she's in a town with the Bucks (NBA) and Brewers (MLB) and doesn't have a leg to stand on... Not to mention your one man football team. There is that...
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Dec 5, 2013 11:36:48 GMT -5
lol - and your voters put Al Franken into the US Senate.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Dec 5, 2013 11:36:59 GMT -5
I don't follow sports but I do know that the Vikings are their own worst enemy. To harass my brother I usually cheer for whoever they are playing against that week I usually cheer for whomever is playing against Denver and Dallas... I'm still harboring resentment against them...
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Dec 5, 2013 11:38:24 GMT -5
FB,
Once you get out of the major metropolitan areas and the mid-coast, even CA becomes dramatically affordable. Our 1500 sq.ft. cabin in Idyllwild (Riverside, CA) is only worth about $240k. At 5,500' you get plenty of "seasons" . Pop is about 5k. Closest airport is 45-1 hour away in Palm Springs or 90 minutes in Ontario, CA.
You can also look in far north CA (Mendocino County) lol, @copper pouches' parents might have some land to sell you. You'll be close to or in wine county.
Another recommendation for the PNW, eastern WA; DH's uncle and wife loved Yakima and had a very sweet ranch there. They did relocate to the Portland, OR area later due to his health issues.
I'd also look into NW Nevada (greater Reno area) and Northern AZ (Flagstaff). These higher elevation areas are dramatically different landscapes than the Las Vegas or Phoenix stereotypes.
I think the driver in your decision is going to be employment. And as wonderful as the internet is, as a consultant you're most likely going need to get your butt on a plane every month or so. Therefore I would recommend that you be within 90 minutes of a major metropolitan airport.
Good luck with your decision.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Dec 5, 2013 11:54:22 GMT -5
Firebird, have you considered eastern WA? Housing costs are much lower and they get snow in winter....
Whereabouts? Washington is definitely not out of the question if we can find an area where it's possible to afford the kind of house that we want. I mean, that's where we originally wanted to go. We just realized, after a lot of discussion, that Seattle and the outlying areas (which is where DH's family lives) is not right for us. Separate living spaces is a must, though. We want to be close but we are all very private people and need our own spaces. I'm not terribly familiar with WA east of the Cascade Mountains. We drive over there occasionally. I do know people living there: the cost of housing is much lower, dunno about others costs. Personally I don't care for the weather; it gets really hot in summer and snows in winter, much like Idaho's weather. As already pointed out, the tri-cities area are metropolitan. The daughter and husband of another friend live there - he is a nuclear engineer and she is a vet tech. He got a job right out of college at the nuclear plant there. Another friend of mine just bought a house in Concrete, WA for $55,000 (a fixer). Concrete is this side of the mountains, but lower COLA than the Seattle metro area.... Housing costs go down the further away from Seattle you get. Separate living spaces is a must, though. We want to be close but we are all very private people and need our own spaces.
Re my friend (who lives with her son & family) - they live in basically a 2 family house. Entire living quarters downstairs and upstairs. Only the kitchen and dining are not duplicated. Right now, they are renting, but the son is looking for a house to buy where both families can have privacy and personal space... This experiment is into year 2 now. It appears to be working because there is a win-win for both families. I think the 5 yr/old is the biggest winner. She will have a very special bond with her grandmother.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Dec 5, 2013 12:01:36 GMT -5
Interestingly, if you go up to BC you see these HUGE houses where there are many generations that are living together under the same roof. I've not been in any of the houses, but have often wondered how it is laid out in order for families to have some sort of autonomy in their life, but be close enough to be living together. For instance, does the house have one huge kitchen or is it like apartments where each family has their own living space?
Might be worthwhile to look into some of those floor plans when you get to that point.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on Dec 5, 2013 12:55:49 GMT -5
I'm in the Northeast and it seems like in-law apartments are getting more common up here. Something like a colonial for the main family and then a two story addition on one side where there is a small living area and kitchen on the first level and two bedrooms upstairs.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Dec 5, 2013 13:08:21 GMT -5
Except that assumption is wrong. My salary, bonus, and 401K contribution is about $80k a year. I would make about $100k to $120k in the highest cost of living areas. My mortgage for a new 3/2 house (well it was new 7 years ago when we built it) on 10 acres was $180k. I would never be able to duplicate the 10 acres in one of those HCOLA. In suburbia here in town, my house would be about $120k. Daycare here runs about $500 a month (assuming we need it - just preschool is $280). It would be $1500 a month minimum in a place where I would get that "double" salary. Utilities are also cheap here. Bonus is that my commute is 20 minutes all day every day. Maybe twice a year there is an accident on the freeway or the snow is bad enough. Other than the times my car broke down, my longest commute ever was 40 minutes. I'm still in the county with the City and that gives me access to an amazing library system. It has great parks.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Dec 5, 2013 13:17:05 GMT -5
Firebird - I'm far enough south that it is pretty conservative here. (I'm in Springfield, MO). Some towns are worse than others. I do my shopping in Republic and driving through that town makes me, a regular church goer, scared. There are entire streets where they have signs with bible verses on them. Scary. That said there are a lot of people who have moved here in recent years and parts of Springfield have become more diverse. We have something like 7 colleges. One is the second largest university in the state. Someone suggested Northern Missouri. I disagree with it. There is not a lot of midsized towns with industry up there. There are plenty
BTW: This is where I went to college).
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on Dec 5, 2013 13:17:11 GMT -5
I'm biased, but I like the Kansas side of the Kansas City area. If you go west of the metroplex to Lawrence, you're in a pretty liberal college town. There are also small towns that have affordable housing, and the overall cost of living is definitely not bad. You're also not that far from an airport, depending on exactly where you live, and have access to theater, music, and sports if you're interested. There are definitely houses with in-law suites in the basement that have completely separate entrances, or you can get a house with enough land to have two dwellings on it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 13:21:22 GMT -5
come on, Firebird - you know you want to move to NJ and pay too much for everything! COME ONNNN!!!!!
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Dec 5, 2013 13:28:52 GMT -5
I had a friend that lives outside of KC, Missouri. It's a beautiful area. She was in sales in several different industries. She did get laid off, but was never without a job for too long.. She also paid $500/month for full time inhome daycare, less taxes, and more acreage for the same priced home.
Now, I couldn't live in the South. Far too conservative for me. But, I've also formed my biases through a very small amount of folks. (My BFF married a man who literally believed women belonged barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen to serve her man. He was planning to raise their daughter with these notions. She also told me people were very much into only teaching creationism in the schools)..When we went to the south a few times, I witnessed things that just made me cringe..
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Dec 5, 2013 13:30:30 GMT -5
Um, I should note that eastern WA is far more conservative than the Seattle/Puget Sound area.... So not sure about that part...
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Dec 5, 2013 13:33:42 GMT -5
I had a friend that lives outside of KC, Missouri. It's a beautiful area. She was in sales in several different industries. She did get laid off, but was never without a job for too long.. Now, I couldn't live in the South. Far too conservative for me. But, I've also formed my biases through a very small amount of folks. (My BFF married a man who literally believed women belonged barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen to serve her man. He was planning to raise their daughter with these notions. She also told me people were very much into only teaching creationism in the schools)..When we went to the south a few times, I witnessed things that just made me cringe.. I have family that lives in Missouri, Arkansas, Louisiana and Texas. I visit, but could never live in any of those states. (Lived in Houston from 1978-1980)... Totally different culture and I have to bite my tongue a lot. Love my extended family, but religiously and politically we are 180 degrees apart. DH refuses to go with me. So I travel with my sis and we pretend we are in another country...
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on Dec 5, 2013 13:55:08 GMT -5
Full disclosure: my parents live outside Bloomington, IN which has IU, Indiana's main public university. They retired on 120 acres, about 20 min outside town. It's cheap, it's pretty, it snows. Bloomington is a nice little town in terms of restaurants and such. Somehow they can't manage to have a decent pizza joint or a real deli, but other than that pretty decent. I would look for something like that in your preferred areas.
ETA: OR move to Bloomington and hang out with Mid and occassionally me. I know nothing about the PNW but, My in-laws are in IN and it is pretty there and LCOL compared to what I'm used to in NC. I got to see snow there last winter and built my first real-person sized snow-woman! Also, Mid is Awesome Also Oliver Winery's Camelot mead is Awesome Also I think DH and I would like it if my parents were closer, so I understand the wanting to take them with you. Makes sense to me.
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