Ephiphany . . . no more "family" Christmases

[Miss Tequila]

Dec 1, 2013 11:44:01 GMT -5 @tbird said:

I guess I'm confused on how - what - 6 adults to 8 kids was overwhelming. There were 2 babies, but still, didn't each brood have 2 parent there? who was minding them?

Seems like there should have been some semi-structured time supervised by various adults....kids getting too wild (and they will, kids can spiral up on adrenal when allowed to go wild) some adult intervenes, and declares movie time (or board game time, and set up 2-3 games for the various ages) or reading time - put the older in charge of reading to the rest, just a short seasonal story - maybe like the night before christmas etc or an adult reads - or everyone looks at books on their own)..or time to work with blocks - legos for the older kids, then some other stuff for the youngers.

So they get a bit out of hand - and then someone steps in and settles them down into something.

Just getting them all to be quiet at the same time for about 15 minutes really de-escalates things. 

but left to their own devices - they will spiral up into a hurricane.

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 12:13:56 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

Dec 1, 2013 11:44:01 GMT -5 @tbird said:

I guess I'm confused on how - what - 6 adults to 8 kids was overwhelming. There were 2 babies, but still, didn't each brood have 2 parent there? who was minding them?

Seems like there should have been some semi-structured time supervised by various adults....kids getting too wild (and they will, kids can spiral up on adrenal when allowed to go wild) some adult intervenes, and declares movie time (or board game time, and set up 2-3 games for the various ages) or reading time - put the older in charge of reading to the rest, just a short seasonal story - maybe like the night before christmas etc or an adult reads - or everyone looks at books on their own)..or time to work with blocks - legos for the older kids, then some other stuff for the youngers.

So they get a bit out of hand - and then someone steps in and settles them down into something.

Just getting them all to be quiet at the same time for about 15 minutes really de-escalates things. 

but left to their own devices - they will spiral up into a hurricane.

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

I sort of get it.  When I go to my parents it is relax time for me.  I let my parents deal with my kids.   if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

[NoNamePerson]

Dec 1, 2013 12:13:56 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

Dec 1, 2013 11:44:01 GMT -5 @tbird said:

I guess I'm confused on how - what - 6 adults to 8 kids was overwhelming. There were 2 babies, but still, didn't each brood have 2 parent there? who was minding them?

Seems like there should have been some semi-structured time supervised by various adults....kids getting too wild (and they will, kids can spiral up on adrenal when allowed to go wild) some adult intervenes, and declares movie time (or board game time, and set up 2-3 games for the various ages) or reading time - put the older in charge of reading to the rest, just a short seasonal story - maybe like the night before christmas etc or an adult reads - or everyone looks at books on their own)..or time to work with blocks - legos for the older kids, then some other stuff for the youngers.

So they get a bit out of hand - and then someone steps in and settles them down into something.

Just getting them all to be quiet at the same time for about 15 minutes really de-escalates things. 

but left to their own devices - they will spiral up into a hurricane.

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

Most people who know me wouldn't want me keeping their kids in line, heads would be rollin' and bottoms would be burnin' I'm a meanie 

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 12:23:34 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Dec 1, 2013 12:13:56 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

I sort of get it.  When I go to my parents it is relax time for me.  I let me parents deal with my kids.   if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

They are your kids, not your parents' kids. Unless someone has blatantly said they'll take DS for a while, we actively supervise him at every gathering.

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 12:27:28 GMT -5 @moneyjenny82 said:

Dec 1, 2013 12:23:34 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

I sort of get it.  When I go to my parents it is relax time for me.  I let me parents deal with my kids.   if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

They are your kids, not your parents' kids. Unless someone has blatantly said they'll take DS for a while, we actively supervise him at every gathering.

ugh.  no thanks.  I prefer watching the football game or shooting the shit.

[Miss Tequila]

Dec 1, 2013 12:23:34 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Dec 1, 2013 12:13:56 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

I sort of get it.  When I go to my parents it is relax time for me.  I let my parents deal with my kids.   if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

Wow...really? I can't imagine dumping the responsibility of watching my kids in someone else...especially not when they are cooking and getting ready for dinner. I always made sure that either my husband or I was watching the kids 100% of the time.

Conversely, I get very pissed if someone comes to my house and doesn't watch their kids. There are people I will not invite over because their kids are wild and I'm not chasing them around, telling them not to jump on my furniture, etx.

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 12:28:55 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Dec 1, 2013 12:27:28 GMT -5 @moneyjenny82 said:

They are your kids, not your parents' kids. Unless someone has blatantly said they'll take DS for a while, we actively supervise him at every gathering.

ugh.  no thanks.  I prefer watching the football game or shooting the shit.

Yeah, I'd much prefer relaxing and catching up with family, but unfortunately I can't do that.

[Deleted]

I should call my parents and thank them...

[Deleted]

Well, if kids are at my house, it's free spirit for all, for the most part... But that is because I invite it. I will say that preparation is key there. We live a really wash and ready life, but if something isn't for public use or could be broken, it's up high, or in a locked room... Plus I might put ... 'Nobody under 10 goes in that room without someone over 10' ... type rules...

Normally speaking though, if there is stuff to do set up everywhere, kids spend less time finding themselves things to do.  It sounds like ODD kid might be outside the norm there 

[muttleynfelix]

We have 7 grandkids on my side of the family and they are spread out a little more than Susanna's but HELL NO do they get wound up. They have a play room at mom and dad's house, but if they get too noisy, then we intervene - the play room is really for only 2 and up. So JoJo won't be allowed in the play room this year.  The 2 teens try to find a quiet corner to play their games without their little sister and cousins bothering them.  But even when they were little, the answer was the same.  We still expect order.  Now part of the way of ensuring order is that under 3 and we still enforce naps no matter where we are.  That helps keep the older kids settled down too - as in settle down or you will wake your cousin.  This is a big reason why I ask my in-laws to come out to my house rather than go to their house (it is only 15 minutes away). The kids are more likely to nap at home.  

I sort of get it. When I go to my parents it is relax time for me. I let my parents deal with my kids. if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

My sister was that way with her kids. But it isn't just my parents there most of the time.  I was there (and later my DH), my Grandparents, my Great Aunt and Uncle, sometimes my brother, sometimes my Aunt and Uncle. Even though my Grandparents and Great Aunt and Uncle would always be able to discipline, they were always there with attention and would say something if things got out of control.  I would step in if necessary along with my parents and brother (and his wife). My brother and I are stricter with our kids than my sister was. Now that we all have kids, it is a group effort. Having an age range of 11 months to 16 years old helps. The older ones help out with the little ones.  DH and i don't have to be quite as "on" as we are at home since we have tons of back up. It helps that everyone knows the rules - respect property, respect each other and help enforce them.  I do look forward to going to my parent's house to relax a bit, but my kids still have to behave and at the end of the day the buck stops here with that. 

[NoNamePerson]

I sort of get it. When I go to my parents it is relax time for me. I let my parents deal with my kids. if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

I bet if you just drop the kids off at your parents they will behave and your parents can enjoy them without you - win win 

When I had the parents of friends tell me how well behaved my son was at their house I had to make sure I had dropped off and/or picked up the right kid. He behaved for others way better than he did at home..

If kids behave this way at another person's home, I have to wonder what they are like at home. Not counting little ones in this equation but 6,7 ?

[sheilaincali]

I sort of get it. When I go to my parents it is relax time for me. I let my parents deal with my kids. if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

No offense Archie but I hate that!  My brother does that to my parents constantly.  It's really annoying to watch because then if someone else does discipline them he loses his shit but he doesn't pay enough attention to discipline them himself.   His kids (age 6 and 4) are complete holy terrors.  They are ill behaved brats.  You tell the 4 year old "please don't ram that heavy metal trunk into Nana's cabinets" and he ignores you or my brother will yell from the other room "It's fine". 
I once made the mistake of putting the 6 year old when she was 4 in a time out because she called her cousin a "Stupid F%&king Bitch".  My brother lost it, how dare I discipline his precious daughter that he had been actively ignoring for the past couple of hours.

When it's a weekend day and he has the kids he dumps them off on my parents around 8am and will ignore them and watch football while my mom cleans up after them, feeds, them, entertains them, etc.  He doesn't leave with them until my parents basically push him out the front door so they can go to bed at night.

They let him get away with it because they figure if they are watching the kids they know the kids are in a safe environment and getting their vegetables. 

[Deleted]

Dec 2, 2013 10:35:13 GMT -5 sheilaincali said:

I sort of get it. When I go to my parents it is relax time for me. I let my parents deal with my kids. if they get really bad I may say something, but one of the reasons I like going to my parents house is that I get a little time off.

No offense Archie but I hate that!  My brother does that to my parents constantly.  It's really annoying to watch because then if someone else does discipline them he loses his shit but he doesn't pay enough attention to discipline them himself.   His kids (age 6 and 4) are complete holy terrors.  They are ill behaved brats.  You tell the 4 year old "please don't ram that heavy metal trunk into Nana's cabinets" and he ignores you or my brother will yell from the other room "It's fine". 
I once made the mistake of putting the 6 year old when she was 4 in a time out because she called her cousin a "Stupid F%&king Bitch".  My brother lost it, how dare I discipline his precious daughter that he had been actively ignoring for the past couple of hours.

When it's a weekend day and he has the kids he dumps them off on my parents around 8am and will ignore them and watch football while my mom cleans up after them, feeds, them, entertains them, etc.  He doesn't leave with them until my parents basically push him out the front door so they can go to bed at night.

They let him get away with it because they figure if they are watching the kids they know the kids are in a safe environment and getting their vegetables. 

No offense taken.

[sheilaincali]

Thanks- FWIW Archie, I am sure you are a much better parent than my idiot brother.  I doubt your kids put a shovel through the tv this weekend or called your dear mother horrible names while swearing like sailors.

[whoisjohngalt]

My kids don't see my parents' house as "someone else's", they see it as family=their own.

That being said, they can do whatever my parents are comfortable with them doing it.

My kids are very active, so my Dad would do a dance-a-thon with them or something to get the energy out.  But there are also tons of board games and chess to play for "you guys need to calm down a bit". 

As much as I would love to go hands-off, I would feel terrible if my Mom felt so overwhelmed and tired afterwards. 

[Deleted]

Dec 1, 2013 13:17:42 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

I should call my parents and thank them...

I didn't.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Better late than never Archie.



Susana, you need to do what works for you.  That said, I grew up with the huge family Christmas Day at the grandparents event.  We all have fond memories of it, as far as I know. 

I do tend to relax a bit more when I and the kids are at my parents - because I know there are 2-? more pairs of eyes watching.  And I have no problems if someone else disciplines the kids for something.  They know there are different rules at Grandma E's house than at home.  In fact, the 4 year old has been explaining them to people lately. 

[michelyn8]

Dec 1, 2013 12:13:56 GMT -5 Miss Tequila said:

Dec 1, 2013 11:44:01 GMT -5 @tbird said:

I guess I'm confused on how - what - 6 adults to 8 kids was overwhelming. There were 2 babies, but still, didn't each brood have 2 parent there? who was minding them?

Seems like there should have been some semi-structured time supervised by various adults....kids getting too wild (and they will, kids can spiral up on adrenal when allowed to go wild) some adult intervenes, and declares movie time (or board game time, and set up 2-3 games for the various ages) or reading time - put the older in charge of reading to the rest, just a short seasonal story - maybe like the night before christmas etc or an adult reads - or everyone looks at books on their own)..or time to work with blocks - legos for the older kids, then some other stuff for the youngers.

So they get a bit out of hand - and then someone steps in and settles them down into something.

Just getting them all to be quiet at the same time for about 15 minutes really de-escalates things. 

but left to their own devices - they will spiral up into a hurricane.

I think the issue is that the ones that should have stepped in (the parents) didn't. I wouldn't be happy if I am hosting a dinner and my guests expected me to keep their kids in line, too.

I wouldn't have been happy if I was hosting a dinner and my children expected me to keep their kids in line too.  That to me is a huge show of disrespect and I'd have a really hard time not giving my children an earful about it.  I was always lenient but they know my limits and don't push them because it was respecting those limits that got them the freedoms they had growing up.

But then again, I've been told I'm to hard on my kids.............not surprisingly by someone whose kids could use some lessons in respecting their elders.

[muttleynfelix]

But then again, I've been told I'm to hard on my kids.............

I've been told this by my GRANDMA!!!!   I know she was as hard on me as a kid and she is my Grandma.  I am not hard on my kids at all.

[The Captain]

My mom once told me I was too strict with DD...umm, yea - do you remember (fill in long paragraph of things parents nowadays do NOT expect from their kids).

Her response?  It was different back then, and I had three of you to keep in line.

[Pants]

I'm kind of with Archie - when we go to my parents's house, my parents watch DD a lot. They get up early with her so we can sleep in, watch her for the afternoon so we can go out, whatever. DH and I keep an eye on her too, but they serve as extra eyes and hands and often tell me to go away so they can play or whatever.

At DH's parents' house, there are extra hands and eyes too... but only the women. Men apparently have no children as soon as they grace the threshold. Charming.

[Chocolate Lover]

When I'm at a gathering with MY family it's me in charge of them but if someone else catches them acting up they say something. I'm perfectly fine with that. My oldest will still tell you about the time his aunt threatened to cut his feet off if he didn't quit running in the house.   Of course she wouldn't, but at 3 he didn't know that. He stopped running. 

I stopped going to any large gathering with the inlaws years ago. They all had kids and they all didn't bother to watch them. And all the adults smoked, except me. So they'd wander out to smoke one by one and never say to me "hey you mind watching the kids while I'm outside?". Sooner or later it'd be me and half a dozen unruly kids, since no one ever bothered to come back in. I would make them behave and then they wouldn't be willing to come to my house later. Win/win  

[sheilaincali]

Rukh- my brother is very volatile and anything you say that he thinks he should take offense to will set him off.  He has a bad temper and honestly he is the reason I very rarely go to my parents house.  They live in the same town as me but I only physically go to their house a handful of times a year because he is always there.

A couple of years ago I literally caught my nephew when he was falling down the stairs- I caught him right before he landed on the hard tile floor.  I said something like "wow buddy, someone has to keep an eye on you every second don't they".  My brother took that to mean that I was calling him a bad parent and insulting him.  He actually screamed at me for catching the kid because I "scared" the kid.  I was across the room when it happened, I suggested they not let him play on the stairs, they ignored me and I saw the kid fall backwards and dashed over to catch him.  In the end I was the bad guy so no I don't say anything about it anymore.  When his brats are coloring on my mom's walls I just leave the room, when they ram the trucks into the custom cherry and glass front cabinets I get up and use the bathroom, and so forth. 

Not my kid, not my problem is my new philosophy.  My parents know how he is and they allow him to act that way so it's their fault not mine.

[zibazinski]

   Unfortunately, raising feral children only hurts those kids in the end. 

[dcmetrocrab]

Dec 2, 2013 12:52:17 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Dec 1, 2013 13:17:42 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

I should call my parents and thank them...

I didn't.

There's still time. 

Everyone's families are different with expectations and relationships. In the OP's scenario, I would fully expect the parents to realize that expecting grandma to both host and look after 8 kids is not reasonable, but assumed expectations are what leads up to disappointment. It sounds like OP doesn't want to confront them on that point, so it's good that she came to an amicable and non-confrontational solution that makes everyone happier and keeping the guests none the wiser of the root cause.

[zibazinski]

We figured out the feral grandchildren actually behave when not around their mother, sad to say but understandable given her past.  So now we see them without her whenever possible. She actually has said she knows they behave better when not around her. That comment breaks my heart. She doesn't feel heard or worthy of being heard. She just wants their love, they know it and use it against her.

[sheilaincali]

Dec 3, 2013 8:00:33 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

We figured out the feral grandchildren actually behave when not around their mother, sad to say but understandable given her past.  So now we see them without her whenever possible. She actually has said she knows they behave better when not around her. That comment breaks my heart. She doesn't feel heard or worthy of being heard. She just wants their love, they know it and use it against her.

Away from my brother his kids behave just fine.  I've babysat the nephew that smashed the tv on a handful of occasions and he is quite content to color or do craft projects with me, sweep my floor, pet the dog, etc.  My brother tends to stress the kids out so they misbehave (or at least that's my dad's philosophy)

[Lizard Queen]

Dec 3, 2013 10:04:36 GMT -5 sheilaincali said:

Dec 3, 2013 8:00:33 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

We figured out the feral grandchildren actually behave when not around their mother, sad to say but understandable given her past.  So now we see them without her whenever possible. She actually has said she knows they behave better when not around her. That comment breaks my heart. She doesn't feel heard or worthy of being heard. She just wants their love, they know it and use it against her.

Away from my brother his kids behave just fine.  I've babysat the nephew that smashed the tv on a handful of occasions and he is quite content to color or do craft projects with me, sweep my floor, pet the dog, etc.  My brother tends to stress the kids out so they misbehave (or at least that's my dad's philosophy)

Sounds like they could be doing it to try to get his attention.

[Lizard Queen]

How bad is it that I let DS1 run hog wild with his cousins after TG dinner?  He had an absolute blast.  I couldn't wait for them to leave--good thing they were over an hour late so they couldn't stay too long.

Also, is it bad that I let DS run in the house?  Our house is pretty long ranch, and our weather sucks, so he doesn't get to go outside too much.  My MIL scolds him for running (in OUR house), but I don't care, as long as he doesn't jump all over the furniture.  Am I raising a feral child?

[Lizard Queen]

Dec 3, 2013 10:28:36 GMT -5 @anne81 said:

Your house, your rules.

In SS' case there is a grandchild with ODD. He has to be watched closely. I feel for his parents who are probably tired but when you know a kid has an issue like that you have to be careful about monitoring them.

Oh, I agree that it is beyond rude to bring your kids to someone else's house and let them run wild.  It's about respect, even if they are grandparents.