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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 21:41:41 GMT -5
So whip out that list and tell us some costs from different doctors you consulted... I'd be interested to know that they charge...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 21:44:35 GMT -5
Do you mind if I ask which company your insurance is through R?
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 10, 2015 21:58:22 GMT -5
Wait...aren't you for universal healthcare? Where do you think that money comes from, if not the taxpayers? It not a gift from the healthcare fairy.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 10, 2015 22:01:40 GMT -5
like the Iraq War, for example....? Somewhat... but, even then, the bombs that were dropped actually exploded. and made us safer! ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png)
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 22:06:56 GMT -5
Do you mind if I ask which company your insurance is through R? Blue Cross Blue Shield of Tennessee.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 22:09:14 GMT -5
Wait...aren't you for universal healthcare? Where do you think that money comes from, if not the taxpayers? It not a gift from the healthcare fairy. LOL... seriously? My issue is that the money spent is completely and utterly wasted because it's paying for coverage that's completely pointless. Universal healthcare would actually let people go see doctors and have tests done. I know the money comes from the same place, the difference is, with UHC it wouldn't be simply flushed down the proverbial toilet.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 22:12:01 GMT -5
So whip out that list and tell us some costs from different doctors you consulted... I'd be interested to know that they charge... 2 things... 1> I'm not at home, so don't have access to it at the moment. 2> It's irrelevant what the costs are. They are more than I can pay (unless I'm perfectly healthy and won't need any tests or x-rays or anything... and I DO get one of those, as long as it's scheduled in advance). Leave it at that.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 10, 2015 22:17:28 GMT -5
Wait...aren't you for universal healthcare? Where do you think that money comes from, if not the taxpayers? It not a gift from the healthcare fairy. LOL... seriously? My issue is that the money spent is completely and utterly wasted because it's paying for coverage that's completely pointless. Universal healthcare would actually let people go see doctors and have tests done. I know the money comes from the same place, the difference is, with UHC it would be simply flushed down the proverbial toilet.I'm not following. You call treating everyone through UHC "flushing money down the toilet'? I call it an investment.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 22:28:06 GMT -5
LOL... seriously? My issue is that the money spent is completely and utterly wasted because it's paying for coverage that's completely pointless. Universal healthcare would actually let people go see doctors and have tests done. I know the money comes from the same place, the difference is, with UHC it would be simply flushed down the proverbial toilet.I'm not following. You call treating everyone through UHC "flushing money down the toilet'? I call it an investment.
Oops. Typo. With UHC it WOULDN'T be. I'll go fix!
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jun 10, 2015 22:38:09 GMT -5
I don't know what your situation is, Richard, so please do not assume I am referring specifically to you here. I'm putting the idea out there for anyone to whom it may apply.
If you are working, even for low pay, it may be possible depending on one's circumstances and financial situation to shift income from one year to another. As one possible example, if one is able to contribute anything to a retirement plan (and also depending how far above the Medicaid threshold one is) they may be able to double up contributions for one year and eliminate them the next. It may be that the extra deduction could qualify them for Medicaid for the one year, and they could get things taken care of under that. Then, go back on the subsidized, high-deductible plan afterward, when you hopefully would not need to get care.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2015 22:41:18 GMT -5
Doesn't apply to me... but is a good suggestion for any it might apply to. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png)
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Jun 10, 2015 22:57:32 GMT -5
Wait...aren't you for universal healthcare? Where do you think that money comes from, if not the taxpayers? It not a gift from the healthcare fairy. LOL... seriously? My issue is that the money spent is completely and utterly wasted because it's paying for coverage that's completely pointless. It's still catastrophic insurance. That is not wasted or pointless. If you break a leg, get cancer, have a heart attack, end up hospitalized with pneumonia, or any other serious event, then you are covered for everything over your deductible. That means that the hospital, and as a result people who pay their medical bills, aren't covering for tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars for your emergency. That isn't wasted IMO. That is the entire purpose of catastrophic insurance. You view it as wasted because you don't foresee an emergency, but no one plans to have an emergency, they just happen.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 10, 2015 23:02:53 GMT -5
Doing nothing is generally the best idea of all.
It's no surprise conservatives think this way and gleefully let 40,000+ Americans die every year due to lack of access caused by no insurance. These poor people, a large percentage of whom are minorities, are not really their constituency so who gives a fuck.
I would have loved it if they had "done nothing" about Iraq instead of destabilizing the entire Middle East with their conflict of interest war profiteering/mongering/criminality/torture bullshit. That would have been the best idea of all.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 11, 2015 2:16:56 GMT -5
LOL... seriously? My issue is that the money spent is completely and utterly wasted because it's paying for coverage that's completely pointless. It's still catastrophic insurance. That is not wasted or pointless. If you break a leg, get cancer, have a heart attack, end up hospitalized with pneumonia, or any other serious event, then you are covered for everything over your deductible. That means that the hospital, and as a result people who pay their medical bills, aren't covering for tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars for your emergency. That isn't wasted IMO. That is the entire purpose of catastrophic insurance. You view it as wasted because you don't foresee an emergency, but no one plans to have an emergency, they just happen. Exactly! My son had to have emergency surgery yesterday. This thing came out of the blue. Nothing too serious, but I looked up the cost and it was about $15,000 for the surgery, plus about 7-10 subsequent doctor's visits for wound cleaning and packing, whatever that costs. Perfectly healthy kid, but sh!t happens. It always does. Best to have insurance. Do you have that kind of money tucked under your mattress?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 7:40:35 GMT -5
I never said that it was a good thing or a bad thing. The point of that comment was: "There was actual, provable, value for the money"... Unlike Obamacare. Obamacare purchased (for many) the equivalent of what's known in programming circles as "vaporware": looks awesome... until you actually try to use it... then it vanishes.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jun 11, 2015 7:43:53 GMT -5
And with regard to the working poor, it still seems the fault lies with the states that did not expand Medicaid. The ACA had a solution for an awful lot of those people. The states chose not to implement it. Blame them.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 11, 2015 10:32:15 GMT -5
Of course many of those states are south of the Mason~Dixon Line, have White Christian governors, and many of those that would get the Medicaid are poor Blacks.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 10:49:23 GMT -5
I never said that it was a good thing or a bad thing. The point of that comment was: "There was actual, provable, value for the money"... Unlike Obamacare. Obamacare purchased (for many) the equivalent of what's known in programming circles as "vaporware": looks awesome... until you actually try to use it... then it vanishes. Use mine all the time. Works for me. Hope to not have to use it for anything catastrophic. Glad it's there if I should have to... If you don't think you should have any personal responsibility for your health, sorry I don't agree. If you are really to destitute to be able to take any personal responsibility for your health, blame your state... As others have said.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 18:41:39 GMT -5
And with regard to the working poor, it still seems the fault lies with the states that did not expand Medicaid. The ACA had a solution for an awful lot of those people. The states chose not to implement it. Blame them. There was a perfectly valid reason for what they did though. When Obamacare implodes (which it will), that expansion will have to be paid 100% by the state. MOST states have enough trouble funding their version of Medicaid as it is. The states that didn't expand did so to protect their financial solvency. Yes it hurts in the short term... but it will hurt much less in the long term than those that expanded will be hurt. Blame still falls on Obamacare for that reason.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 18:42:47 GMT -5
I never said that it was a good thing or a bad thing. The point of that comment was: "There was actual, provable, value for the money"... Unlike Obamacare. Obamacare purchased (for many) the equivalent of what's known in programming circles as "vaporware": looks awesome... until you actually try to use it... then it vanishes. Use mine all the time. Works for me. Hope to not have to use it for anything catastrophic. Glad it's there if I should have to... If you don't think you should have any personal responsibility for your health, sorry I don't agree. If you are really to destitute to be able to take any personal responsibility for your health, blame your state... As others have said. Glad it works for you. That's awesome! Bill Gates is a Billionaire... I guess everyone should be one based on that theory then... ETA: and I believe that everyone should have personal responsibility for their healthcare... when they have the means to be responsible for it. In my case that means NOT going to see doctors and running up bills for OTHER PEOPLE to pay. In my case that means paying for bills that I do create should I need to go to the ER... no matter how long it takes. Don't think for a single MINUTE that I don't believe in "personal responsibility".
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 11, 2015 18:51:06 GMT -5
Just ditch the plan, save the taxpayers the $$$, and take the risks and responsibilities of paying for your own healthcare out of pocket. Then shoot the grouse and serve it for dinner.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 18:57:02 GMT -5
Just ditch the plan, save the taxpayers the $$$, and take the risks and responsibilities of paying for your own healthcare out of pocket. Then shoot the grouse and serve it for dinner. Do you have problems comprehending English? It's the law. I HAVE TO HAVE A PLAN, BY LAW. And I DO pay everything I have to pay OUT OF POCKET.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jun 11, 2015 19:40:37 GMT -5
And with regard to the working poor, it still seems the fault lies with the states that did not expand Medicaid. The ACA had a solution for an awful lot of those people. The states chose not to implement it. Blame them. There was a perfectly valid reason for what they did though. When Obamacare implodes (which it will), that expansion will have to be paid 100% by the state. MOST states have enough trouble funding their version of Medicaid as it is. The states that didn't expand did so to protect their financial solvency. Yes it hurts in the short term... but it will hurt much less in the long term than those that expanded will be hurt. Blame still falls on Obamacare for that reason. But as I said earlier, they are throwing the poor under the bus. Things MAY implode, they may not. But even if those states are correct, they are still throwing the poor under the bus. They are choosing to (possibly) protect the wealthy IF things go bad. The poor are hurt either way. People like you are hurt either way. Why? Because those leaders don't care about people like you. And why don't they? Because they don't have to.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2015 20:10:48 GMT -5
There was a perfectly valid reason for what they did though. When Obamacare implodes (which it will), that expansion will have to be paid 100% by the state. MOST states have enough trouble funding their version of Medicaid as it is. The states that didn't expand did so to protect their financial solvency. Yes it hurts in the short term... but it will hurt much less in the long term than those that expanded will be hurt. Blame still falls on Obamacare for that reason. But as I said earlier, they are throwing the poor under the bus. Things MAY implode, they may not. But even if those states are correct, they are still throwing the poor under the bus. They are choosing to (possibly) protect the wealthy IF things go bad. The poor are hurt either way. People like you are hurt either way. Why? Because those leaders don't care about people like you. And why don't they? Because they don't have to. There is no "may" with Obamacare. It will implode. It's a foregone conclusion. It was written in such a way that it has no option BUT to fail (not going to comment on whether it was written that way or not though). In fairness to politicians (boy how I hated to write that), they weren't given much of a choice... hurt the poor now a little or hurt them a lot later. Other than that I agree with you. The leaders DON'T care.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jun 25, 2015 9:20:45 GMT -5
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 25, 2015 10:22:18 GMT -5
i was in DC when this happened. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png)
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 25, 2015 11:10:39 GMT -5
It seems there are a good 5 to 10 threads where ObamaCare is the subject, or at least it has come into the discussion. My aim here is to focus on the failed roll-out and the eventual total meltdown and collapse of ObamaCare; and the political implications for Obama and the Democratic Party. CBS News Director, John Richarderson has now come out and said that Obama is in a "credibility death spiral" with respect to ObamaCare. www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/10/21/john_Richarderson_obama_headed_toward_credibility_death_spiral_over_obamacare.htmlConsumer Reports rates ObamaCare "Don't even bother trying" www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/21/consumer-reports-dont-even-bother-trying-obamacare/We all know I'm not much for predicting what people will do at the ballot box, but I simply cannot believe that ObamaCare is not in a permanent, irreversible meltdown- that it will NEVER be up and running EVER, and that it will finally implode. The question is whether the Democrats and Obama will be sucked into the black hole? That last one is trickier- my gut is, no- of course not. Why would they ever be held accountable? They've already screwed up the entire housing market and managed to blame it on such laughable culprits as "the free market"- why wouldn't they be able to say industry and the GOP "sabbotaged" ObamaCare or else it'd be fine? Paul, you were saying..? So much for "Don't doubt me, ever!"
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jun 25, 2015 12:05:27 GMT -5
i was in DC when this happened. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png) Some in Washington and elsewhere must have wished six supreme justices had fallen into the maw of Hell after the decision was announced. Have a good time.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 25, 2015 13:31:01 GMT -5
What is really laughable, from the old Paul post above, is that he actually believes the demos "screwed up the entire housing market". I guess he means the Greenspan/BushCo. crash that happened when the conservatives were completely in charge of everything. Coupled with the "death spiral" that many Americans have suffered from due to the 23 repo governors not signing up for expanded Medicaid under the ACA, causing thousands of deaths in the poor and minority populace, they can no longer claim to be: THE PARTY OF FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY OR THE PARTY OF FAMILY VALUES. RIP mf'ers. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wilted.png)
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 25, 2015 14:37:07 GMT -5
i was in DC when this happened. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png) Some in Washington and elsewhere must have wished six supreme justices had fallen into the maw of Hell after the decision was announced. Have a good time. the atmosphere around the SCOTUS was almost mockingly joyous.
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