mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Dec 6, 2013 2:45:05 GMT -5
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP, I added a link to your copy/paste in Reply #142. Always link to the source when you copy/paste. You know this! - mmhmm, unhappy P&M Moderator who doesn't want moonbeam to have to deal with copyright issues!
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,243
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Dec 6, 2013 9:24:13 GMT -5
I saw the title change of this thread yesterday. It makes me feel we are at a point like we were in the last election between Romney and Obama. Apparently PPACA's survival is guaranteed.
I do hope for some changes but I expect they are different than the OP's hopes. Phoenix, its true I didn't read up much on insurance requirements of the law and apparently neither did most of those complaining about which insurance plans basically no longer exist. I haven't seen any stats on who percentagewise actually had catostrophic(sp?) coverage versus the more usual insurance one gets through an employer. My reading concentrated on the purchase requirements, penalties and exclusions.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 6, 2013 10:51:39 GMT -5
So we are all real clear what are these key (worst) features that will go away? 1) Guarantee issue: Not going away 2) Community rating: Not going away 3) Mandated coverage: Not going away 4) Required MLR: Not going away So what does that leave? My prediction- health insurance companies are going away- at least they are not going to resemble, in any substantive way, what they are today. Might be a couple decades but that is where we are going- no other choice really. That is certainly the objective- to kill the private insurance and private health care industry. To get this through, they had to lie. My point is, it might be a tough sell for the people that deliberately lied to claim to have a fix.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 6, 2013 10:54:01 GMT -5
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP, I added a link to your copy/paste in Reply #142. Always link to the source when you copy/paste. You know this! - mmhmm, unhappy P&M Moderator who doesn't want moonbeam to have to deal with copyright issues! I'm not sure which post you're referring to- I didn't make post 142?
|
|
djAdvocate
Member Emeritus
only posting when the mood strikes me.
Joined: Jun 21, 2011 12:33:54 GMT -5
Posts: 76,496
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"000307"}
|
Post by djAdvocate on Dec 6, 2013 12:13:17 GMT -5
So we are all real clear what are these key (worst) features that will go away? 1) Guarantee issue: Not going away 2) Community rating: Not going away 3) Mandated coverage: Not going away 4) Required MLR: Not going away So what does that leave? My prediction- health insurance companies are going away- at least they are not going to resemble, in any substantive way, what they are today. Might be a couple decades but that is where we are going- no other choice really. That is certainly the objective- to kill the private insurance and private health care industry. To get this through, they had to lie. My point is, it might be a tough sell for the people that deliberately lied to claim to have a fix. hadn't considered that happy prospect (the insurance comment). i doubt it will happen, but it is nice to imagine.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Dec 6, 2013 13:00:33 GMT -5
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP, I added a link to your copy/paste in Reply #142. Always link to the source when you copy/paste. You know this! - mmhmm, unhappy P&M Moderator who doesn't want moonbeam to have to deal with copyright issues! I'm not sure which post you're referring to- I didn't make post 142? Mea culpa! The post I edited is Reply #1141. I just added a link to a source on which I was able to find that information.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 6, 2013 14:19:53 GMT -5
I'm not sure which post you're referring to- I didn't make post 142? Mea culpa! The post I edited is Reply #1141. I just added a link to a source on which I was able to find that information. Cool. I thought you might have met 1142, but that was a shorty- I guess I thought I clipped the link. Sorry about that.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Dec 6, 2013 14:31:05 GMT -5
|
|
workpublic
Junior Associate
Catch and release please
Joined: Dec 30, 2010 14:01:48 GMT -5
Posts: 5,551
Favorite Drink: Heineken
|
Post by workpublic on Dec 6, 2013 15:25:44 GMT -5
i would rather see medicare expand to everybody rather than medicaid expanding.
but IMHO that's where we're going, single payer, whether it's medicare or medicaid or a combo.
i don't know how "down hill" medicare services have gone in the last 10 years(if any) but my mother and father had no problems using medicare with an AARP supplement(under $50 a month in the late 90s early aughts).
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 64,501
|
Post by Tennesseer on Dec 6, 2013 16:01:35 GMT -5
I saw the title change of this thread yesterday. It makes me feel we are at a point like we were in the last election between Romney and Obama. Apparently PPACA's survival is guaranteed.I do hope for some changes but I expect they are different than the OP's hopes. Phoenix, its true I didn't read up much on insurance requirements of the law and apparently neither did most of those complaining about which insurance plans basically no longer exist. I haven't seen any stats on who percentagewise actually had catostrophic(sp?) coverage versus the more usual insurance one gets through an employer. My reading concentrated on the purchase requirements, penalties and exclusions. There were 24 thread title changes to the author's election thread and look where it finally got him.
'I Was Wrong. No Mittmentum. Obama Re-elected.'
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 8, 2024 6:46:47 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2013 16:12:45 GMT -5
When people say they want Medicare expanded, what, exactly, do they mean? I understand that they want people covered by Medicare, but what else is involved?
|
|
workpublic
Junior Associate
Catch and release please
Joined: Dec 30, 2010 14:01:48 GMT -5
Posts: 5,551
Favorite Drink: Heineken
|
Post by workpublic on Dec 6, 2013 16:14:58 GMT -5
"expanded" to people under 65.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Dec 6, 2013 17:25:47 GMT -5
I saw the title change of this thread yesterday. It makes me feel we are at a point like we were in the last election between Romney and Obama. Apparently PPACA's survival is guaranteed.I do hope for some changes but I expect they are different than the OP's hopes. Phoenix, its true I didn't read up much on insurance requirements of the law and apparently neither did most of those complaining about which insurance plans basically no longer exist. I haven't seen any stats on who percentagewise actually had catostrophic(sp?) coverage versus the more usual insurance one gets through an employer. My reading concentrated on the purchase requirements, penalties and exclusions. There were 24 thread title changes to the author's election thread and look where it finally got him.
'I Was Wrong. No Mittmentum. Obama Re-elected.'
Really? I didn't know. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like you've brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything.
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Dec 6, 2013 17:29:13 GMT -5
Anyone who's that smug and goes on for page after page after page in every single thread with predictions and "facts" that the rest of us are just too stupid to grasp is going to be eating a cubic fuck ton of humble pie when they're wrong. If DJ wasn't reminding everyone somebody else would be. He's still here day after day making predictions even with his horrible track record over the last 5 years and two boards.
My favorite was when he predicted Herman Cain taking the Republican nomination. Cracked me up.
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 64,501
|
Post by Tennesseer on Dec 6, 2013 17:32:21 GMT -5
There were 24 thread title changes to the author's election thread and look where it finally got him.
'I Was Wrong. No Mittmentum. Obama Re-elected.'
Really? I didn't know. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like you've brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything. The author's prognostications are infamous. And why not repeat it? After all, the author uses the word liberal in every sentence of every post. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like he brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 8, 2024 6:46:47 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2013 18:09:18 GMT -5
"expanded" to people under 65. Yeah, I get that. But how? I'm asking for more specifics.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 6, 2013 19:14:53 GMT -5
Really? I didn't know. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like you've brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything. The author's prognostications are infamous. And why not repeat it? After all, the author uses the word liberal in every sentence of every post. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like he brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything.
My key miscalculation was that I made the erroneous assumption that more "likely voters" than did, apparently, understood the ramifications of ObamaCare. Had I been correct about that, Obama would NOT have been re-elected. And there's evidence to support this: www.capitalisminstitute.org/no-vote-obama-lying/Mid-term elections are dangerous for Democrats who rely on low information voters- who don't get out of bed for mid-terms. However, now that a lot more people know, and the small business mandate rolls out a month before the election- I'd say the law and/or the Democrats are pretty well screwed. I maintain that if the GOP infighting doesn't sabotage them, they stand a very strong chance of taking the Senate- the House has always been a sure bet to all but the wildly delusional.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 6, 2013 19:21:41 GMT -5
I've said it before, I'll say it again- and I've yet to hear sound reasoning to the contrary: You can hide Benghazi. You can whitewash the IRS, and NSA scandals (though the NSA scandal, along with the floundering economy thanks to Obamanomics, have hit Obama's key constituency- the young know-it-alls- pretty hard). However, you can't ignore ObamaCare. The deadline is December 23rd- it's right there in their faces. ObamaCare is unique among all the Obama failures- it's a catastrophic, across-the-board disaster and there's nobody that isn't DIRECTLY and TANGIBLY affected by it.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 8, 2024 6:46:47 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2013 19:26:52 GMT -5
You understand that the article you quoted specifically says the chance of repeal happening are remote...
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,243
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Dec 6, 2013 19:53:08 GMT -5
How about a link for post #1163 for the quote? Found something on the poll. washingtonexaminer.com/gop-poll-many-would-not-have-voted-for-obama-in-2012-if-they-knew-about-broken-health-care-promise/article/2539650The national survey, conducted by Wilson Perkins Allen Opinion Research, the same firm that advises Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas. According to the poll, 23 percent of voters who supported Obama would not have voted for him had they known that Obamacare would force insurance companies to cancel non-compliant health policies despite Obama's promise. The WPA poll was conducted Monday through Wednesday when congressional Republicans were on the offensive against Obamacare. It has a 3.5 percent margin of error. The question asked of respondents who voted for Obama in 2012 was: “As you may know, millions of Americans have lost their insurance plans despite President Obama’s promise that, quote, ‘if you like your plan, you can keep it.’ If you knew in 2012 that this promise was not true, would you still have voted for Barack Obama?” I'm interested to know what DJ thinks of this outfit. Interesting poll if you first poll for how they voted and then ask different questions based on that. I do wonder the ultimate purpose of such a poll given Obama is elected and Cruz is likely still unloved by more than 23% of American voters.
|
|
EVT1
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 30, 2010 16:22:42 GMT -5
Posts: 8,596
|
Post by EVT1 on Dec 6, 2013 20:02:15 GMT -5
It is no doubt the 'majority' is not satisfied with the law- however, single payer has majority support. Funny that was off the table in record time.
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 64,501
|
Post by Tennesseer on Dec 6, 2013 20:15:59 GMT -5
The author's prognostications are infamous. And why not repeat it? After all, the author uses the word liberal in every sentence of every post. But that's forgivable. I mean it's not like he brought it up twice a week for the past 13 months or anything.
My key miscalculation was that I made the erroneous assumption that more "likely voters" than did, apparently, understood the ramifications of ObamaCare. Had I been correct about that, Obama would NOT have been re-elected. And there's evidence to support this: www.capitalisminstitute.org/no-vote-obama-lying/Mid-term elections are dangerous for Democrats who rely on low information voters- who don't get out of bed for mid-terms. However, now that a lot more people know, and the small business mandate rolls out a month before the election- I'd say the law and/or the Democrats are pretty well screwed. I maintain that if the GOP infighting doesn't sabotage them, they stand a very strong chance of taking the Senate- the House has always been a sure bet to all but the wildly delusional. That's nice. But ìn the end, you were wrong. Simple as that.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,243
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Dec 7, 2013 2:22:02 GMT -5
? www.cnn.com/2013/11/22/politics/obamacare-signup-delay-2015/index.htmlWashington (CNN) -- White House spokesman Jay Carney denied Friday that next year's midterm elections are the reason behind the administration's decision to postpone the 2014 opening date for 2015 enrollment in Obamacare -- from October 15 to November 15. Pushing back the start date, Carney said, will give insurers more time to get an idea of their new pool of customers before they set their 2015 rates. Some critics, including Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, said that the move was simply a political ploy and that any changes to health care plans, such as premium increases, for example, should be public before the election. But Carney said the administration expects more people to sign up for health care insurance at the end of the current, initial open enrollment period -- which ends March 31, 2014 -- in part because of the website problems, so starting the next enrollment window later in the year would buy insurers more time to assess the situation. Mid-term elections are Nov. 4th. The new date is November 15th.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 7, 2013 8:59:30 GMT -5
My key miscalculation was that I made the erroneous assumption that more "likely voters" than did, apparently, understood the ramifications of ObamaCare. Had I been correct about that, Obama would NOT have been re-elected. And there's evidence to support this: www.capitalisminstitute.org/no-vote-obama-lying/Mid-term elections are dangerous for Democrats who rely on low information voters- who don't get out of bed for mid-terms. However, now that a lot more people know, and the small business mandate rolls out a month before the election- I'd say the law and/or the Democrats are pretty well screwed. I maintain that if the GOP infighting doesn't sabotage them, they stand a very strong chance of taking the Senate- the House has always been a sure bet to all but the wildly delusional. That's nice. But ìn the end, you were wrong. Simple as that. Sorry, but Obama's "Signature Achievement" is the signature demonstration that big government doesn't work- the law is practically a parody of itself. It will not last.
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 7, 2013 9:02:22 GMT -5
? www.cnn.com/2013/11/22/politics/obamacare-signup-delay-2015/index.htmlWashington (CNN) -- White House spokesman Jay Carney denied Friday that next year's midterm elections are the reason behind the administration's decision to postpone the 2014 opening date for 2015 enrollment in Obamacare -- from October 15 to November 15. Pushing back the start date, Carney said, will give insurers more time to get an idea of their new pool of customers before they set their 2015 rates. Some critics, including Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, said that the move was simply a political ploy and that any changes to health care plans, such as premium increases, for example, should be public before the election. But Carney said the administration expects more people to sign up for health care insurance at the end of the current, initial open enrollment period -- which ends March 31, 2014 -- in part because of the website problems, so starting the next enrollment window later in the year would buy insurers more time to assess the situation. Mid-term elections are Nov. 4th. The new date is November 15th. Well, either it's the law, or it's not. If it's the law, then all this moving around dates by Presidential decree is illegal and unConstitutional. They've had three years to prepare for the implementation of the law, if it's not ready now, it won't be ready then. And if it can't be ready Oct 15, it won't be ready Nov 15. I doubt such a transparently partisan move for purely political purposes is going to be missed by the motivated voters that vote in mid-term elections will not distract them from what they are going to the polls to do: get rid of ObamaCare.
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 64,501
|
Post by Tennesseer on Dec 7, 2013 9:17:26 GMT -5
That's nice. But ìn the end, you were wrong. Simple as that. Sorry, but Obama's "Signature Achievement" is the signature demonstration that big government doesn't work- the law is practically a parody of itself. It will not last. Okay.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,243
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Dec 7, 2013 9:37:51 GMT -5
We can't vote for against Obamacare and I know like many I'll be voting for or possibly against some candidates.
Christie did a similar politically oriented move only it cost NJ taxpayers. We had a special election just a few weeks prior to the November election in which Christie was up for re-election. We wasted money on a primary and another election for what - Christie won easily anyway. Most knew it was political crap, but re-elected him anyway.
There won't be a repeal. The only thing to do is to amend and change the law but the GOP isn't doing anything useful on that front at all to my knowledge. Even if you don't like Obamacare, some of us do not want to vote in another government shutdown and drama queens.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Dec 7, 2013 9:51:57 GMT -5
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP, I've edited your Reply #1163 to add a link. This is twice I've had to find links for your copy/pastes in this thread. Any further copy/pastes that do not contain a link to the article's source will be removed. - mmhmm, P&M Moderator (not your personal link-finder)
|
|
AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
Posts: 31,709
Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
|
Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 7, 2013 12:59:27 GMT -5
I am 100% positive I posted the link. There is no doubt. I'm not sure why it isn't showing up- but I put it in there-- just like this link:
Obama Refuses To Rule Out Jail Time For People Who Don't Purchase Insurance
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,243
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
|
Post by Opti on Dec 7, 2013 13:05:22 GMT -5
The Cloudfare server eats posts. What you write to be posted and what actually gets posted may not match. Always good to check your post just in case. FWIW.
|
|