West SideTerror Ride

[Opti]

Hadn't heard about this until you posted. Definitely scary. The bad thing is most bikes have a top speed greater than most vehicles. While maybe he should have gone to the right lane, I'm not sure if he had many options given the guy brake checked probably too close for him to stop safely. Its like idiots who do shit too close to semis. You deserve to get hurt when you are that stupid. However with the mob mentality, not sure if the biker mob would have seen it that way in the heat of the moment.

Once he got out past the accident, he probably should have kept speeding to stay ahead of the guys hoping to attract cop attention. He also probably should have picked an exit sooner and driven to a police station or in front of a busy place or service station with cameras. I notice in the video at the top of the article that biker intentionally stayed back away from the action so they wouldn't be involved but would record instead. Maybe there were two people on that bike? I saw a black leather arm wave bikers on so whoever was driving the bike could be considered involved in helping create mob violence.


Not sure what I would have done. While it looks bad to leave the scene of an accident, with all those bikers closing in on you its not surprising a driver might fear for their own life. How to stop them. No great ideas. Keep a camera or video camera in the car to record things.

Lastly, to any biker on PB, try to remember every vehicle has different stopping distances.
A Land Rover because of its size and tires needs much more room to stop than say a Honda Civic at any given speed. In general, the heavier the vehicle, the longer the stopping distance.

[Deleted]

I hadn't heard about that either.    Bikers get a bad rap, but there is a reason for it.  

[workpublic]

they were swarming the streets of manhattan. they caused the incident. the young chinese family with their infant were terrified. imho it was all the bikers fault. the biker was arrested. another one was severly hurt when the terrified(rightly so) range rover driver ran him over. looks like the one who started it by doing a "brake check" was actually looking at the go pro camera on his buddies helmet and didn't realize he was about to hit the RR.

oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove

[Shooby]

If i was in my van with my spouse and children and surrounded by a gang of aggressive bikers, i would have done the same thing.

[workpublic]

there were several 911 calls about those assholes before the incident.  you can swarm the henry hudson parkway

[Shooby]

  I personally have seen several motorcycle riders riding like Aholes on the Interstate.  They swerve around, ride in pairs (which is illegal here) and if there is traffic, they drive up the side of the road.  I have seen them driving down the wrong side of the road backward on a 2 lane highway to backtrack to an exit when there is a traffic jam.  Ijits.

[Shooby]

  As far as i am concerned, that motorcycle driver deserved what he got.  Imagine the FEAR of this family when these Aholes then stormed the van and were smashing the windows.  Makes me think i need to start carrying a gun in my car.

[frankq]

Oct 3, 2013 10:00:41 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  As far as i am concerned, that motorcycle driver deserved what he got.  Imagine the FEAR of this family when these Aholes then stormed the van and were smashing the windows.  Makes me think i need to start carrying a gun in my car.

Don't let evt1 hear you say that. All hell will break lose. I his world, you only use the gun after your assailants put you in critical condition.

[justme]

From what I've read the RR did stop after the initial accident, but the bikers started to swarm the SUV and tried to slash the tires (I've even heard the RR driver had started to call 911 for the accident, but haven't heard a tape yet) and that's when/why he took off and happened to run over the other guy. Also read how the second guy injured has a long list of traffic infractions and doesn't currently have a license.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2013 10:00:41 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  As far as i am concerned, that motorcycle driver deserved what he got.  Imagine the FEAR of this family when these Aholes then stormed the van and were smashing the windows.  Makes me think i need to start carrying a gun in my car.

If you have a gun that would fit in your car and hold 200+ bullets go for it.    

[Shooby]

Oct 3, 2013 10:35:58 GMT -5 frankq said:

Oct 3, 2013 10:00:41 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  As far as i am concerned, that motorcycle driver deserved what he got.  Imagine the FEAR of this family when these Aholes then stormed the van and were smashing the windows.  Makes me think i need to start carrying a gun in my car.

Don't let evt1 hear you say that. All hell will break lose. I his world, you only use the gun after your assailants put you in critical condition.

If I am in an SUV with my 2 yr old and family and these thugs were trying to smash my window and get in i wouldn't hesitate.

[The Captain]

A good family friend is a motorcycle rider and set me straight on a few items (that I didn't know/understand).

Unlike cars, motorcycle engines are cooled not by a fan, but from the movement of the air through the engine as the bike is moving.  That is why you often see motorcycle riders going along the shoulder or in between lines of traffic, it's to cool their engines (especially in stop and go traffic where they can't simply turn the motor off and wait). 

Good motorcycle riders are very aware of how long it takes a vehicle to stop, they are on the lookout for you more often then you are on the lookout for them.

The guys in the video are NOT good riders. 

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2013 13:03:21 GMT -5 The Captain said:

A good family friend is a motorcycle rider and set me straight on a few items (that I didn't know/understand).

Unlike cars, motorcycle engines are cooled not by a fan, but from the movement of the air through the engine as the bike is moving.  That is why you often see motorcycle riders going along the shoulder or in between lines of traffic, it's to cool their engines (especially in stop and go traffic where they can't simply turn the motor off and wait). 

And you bought that shit?

[The Captain]

Oct 3, 2013 13:04:59 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Oct 3, 2013 13:03:21 GMT -5 The Captain said:

A good family friend is a motorcycle rider and set me straight on a few items (that I didn't know/understand).

Unlike cars, motorcycle engines are cooled not by a fan, but from the movement of the air through the engine as the bike is moving.  That is why you often see motorcycle riders going along the shoulder or in between lines of traffic, it's to cool their engines (especially in stop and go traffic where they can't simply turn the motor off and wait). 

And you bought that shit?

Seeing as how the dude is an auto engineer and is so serious about safety that he rides in full leathers even in summer, yea.

And this:

www.youmotorcycle.com/air-cooled-vs-liquid-cooled-motorcycle-engines.html

I've got no reason to doubt him.  Especially when I see motorcyclists on local tollways that will ride on the shoulder for a few hundered feet, then stop and wait with traffic, then do it again (when if all they wanted to do was shoulder ride they could keep going).

He also explained to me why motorcycles will sometimes have to go through a red light - not heavy enough to trip the weight sensor.

[Deleted]

ROFL!   Let me guess, there is also a legitimate reason they go 100 mph and pop wheelies on the highway.

[The Captain]

No, those are the same category of a$$holes that prompted this thread.

Not every motorcycle rider is a jerk.

[Angel!]

What kind of moronic motorcyclists doesn't realize that it takes a car A LOT longer to stop than a motorcycle.  You have to be an idiot to think brake checking a car is a good move. 

Is the driver of the RR being charged with anything? 

[justme]

What kind of moronic motorcyclists doesn't realize that it takes a car A LOT longer to stop than a motorcycle. You have to be an idiot to think brake checking a car is a good move.

There were comments on a site that had a story about it saying that it was a trick with shady motorcyclists. To find someone in an expensive vehicle, assume they have money and good insurance, break check them, and then sue for injuries and damages. There's people out there that do that stuff with cars, so I guess it's possible bikers do it too...but damn you better hope their brakes are good if you're on a bike!

ETA: Last I heard, no. I think it's the guy who break checked him and another that was smashing windows and turned himself in. They're looking for the guy who smashed the windows with his helmet and I think some other ones. I have a feeling the reported 911 call by the RR driver might explain why he's not charged.

[Angel!]

Oct 3, 2013 13:28:11 GMT -5 justme said:

What kind of moronic motorcyclists doesn't realize that it takes a car A LOT longer to stop than a motorcycle. You have to be an idiot to think brake checking a car is a good move.

There were comments on a site that had a story about it saying that it was a trick with shady motorcyclists. To find someone in an expensive vehicle, assume they have money and good insurance, break check them, and then sue for injuries and damages. There's people out there that do that stuff with cars, so I guess it's possible bikers do it too...but damn you better hope their brakes are good if you're on a bike!

ETA: Last I heard, no. I think it's the guy who break checked him and another that was smashing windows and turned himself in. They're looking for the guy who smashed the windows with his helmet and I think some other ones. I have a feeling the reported 911 call by the RR driver might explain why he's not charged.

Probably. And I am not saying he should be charged given that the reaction seems fear based and many of us would do the same. I was just curious.

[Peace Of Mind]

I would have gotten the hell out of there one way or the other and drove over whomever was in my way if I got swarmed and attacked like that. 

But what boggles my mind is neither parent thought to lock the SUV doors.  I always lock my doors any way (had an incident when I was a teenager where a huge woman jumped in my car and demanded I take her to a store because of the heat and she didn't want to walk) but even if I didn't already have the doors locked that would have been the first thing I'd have done.  In most vehicles it's just one button or switch to push.   

[justme]

The might have had them locked? When someone smashes in your car door window it pretty much makes locks useless since the can reach in and unlock it.

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2013 13:47:14 GMT -5 Peace Of Mind said:

I would have gotten the hell out of there one way or the other and drove over whomever was in my way if I got swarmed and attacked like that. 

But what boggles my mind is neither parent thought to lock the SUV doors.  I always lock my doors any way (had an incident when I was a teenager where a huge woman jumped in my car and demanded I take her to a store because of the heat and she didn't want to walk) but even if I didn't already have the doors locked that would have been the first thing I'd have done.  In most vehicles it's just one button or switch to push.   

Which, in this case, was the wrong thing to do.   You can't outrun 200 motorcycles in the middle of a city.

[Peace Of Mind]

Oct 3, 2013 13:51:21 GMT -5 justme said:

The might have had them locked? When someone smashes in your car door window it pretty much makes locks useless since the can reach in and unlock it.

I saw the original video on MSN yesterday and they pulled the door open that I saw.  They were hitting the windows with helmets and hands but they actually opened his driver's side door to beat him.  I was surprised they didn't think to lock the doors. 

Which, in this case, was the wrong thing to do.

The people in the SUV are still alive other than some cuts and stitches and his family was ok.  I think had he stayed and not drove off it would have been a significantly worse outcome.

[justme]

Oct 3, 2013 14:02:40 GMT -5 Peace Of Mind said:

Oct 3, 2013 13:51:21 GMT -5 justme said:

The might have had them locked? When someone smashes in your car door window it pretty much makes locks useless since the can reach in and unlock it.

I saw the original video on MSN yesterday and they pulled the door open that I saw.  They were hitting the windows with helmets and hands but they actually opened his driver's side door to beat him.  I was surprised they didn't think to lock the doors. 

Ah, I didn't notice a door open until the windows were smashed, but I didn't watch the video closely. Hmmm...could that be a safety feature? An impact causes the doors to unlock? But I'd be desperately trying to keep it locked if it was.

[workpublic]

If you have a gun that would fit in your car and hold 200+ bullets go for it.

weren't those made illegal in the last few years?

imho the "lord of the flies" class needs deterrents, not understanding, coddling.

are we headed to mad max time?

[Deleted]

Oct 3, 2013 14:17:02 GMT -5 workpublic said:

If you have a gun that would fit in your car and hold 200+ bullets go for it.

weren't those made illegal in the last few years?

imho the "lord of the flies" class needs deterrents, not understanding, coddling.

are we headed to mad max time?

The problem is, unless you are willing to wallow in the garbage along with them, those flies are likley to beat you every time.

[workpublic]

don't dragons eat flies? or am i thinking of dragonflies?

[Opti]

Archie, what would you have done? Except for not moving out of the center lane earlier, I'm not sure what this guy did that was so wrong. He had to hit the first idiot who braked while practicely on top of him and when they started streaming up and boxing him on all sides, well its easy to assume that isn't friendly behavior.

The only thing I might have done different than him is kept accelerating on the highway hoping they wouldn't want to go as fast as I did. If he knew the exits better, taking a exit it would be easier to manuever once off the highway would help. But he was hurt by the traffic on the roads not letting him keep going or manuever. Once the idiot forced him to hit him I don't see this mob choosing to back down and be reasonable. I read more on this after I saw this thread. Apparently brake checking can be used by big biker gangs like this to target rich people and shake them down for money. Lots of folks don't really carry much cash including the well off, so I'm not sure how well this really works but the fact most of them didn't have license plates and someone starts filming while driving on a highway ... seems awfully convenient and planned.

I hope the driver doesn't get charged and in the end incurs no costs of defending himself.
Looking at the video and from what I've read, both bikers deserved their hurt to some extent. One article suggested Gloria Allred(?) might be the lawyer for the guy who was hurt the most. Given his rap sheet concerning motorcycle riding he should probably be paying to fix the damages to the Range Rover along with brake check guy and window smasher. For the future it would be tempting to stock the car with crap to throw out the window that might make driving a cycle a challenge but be not so bad if you are in a car. Florida oranges, NY state apples, tennis balls...

[Deleted]

I don't know what I would have done.  I'd think to think I would have just pulled over and let the bikers pass long before it ever got to brake checking.  

[workpublic]

it's almost impossible to pull over when you are the center of a phalanx.

also, "brake checking" is a tactic used in insurance fraud.