Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 13:28:17 GMT -5
Minnesotapaintlady.. now I can't find it either.
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steff
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I'll sleep when I'm dead
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Post by steff on Aug 21, 2013 13:53:30 GMT -5
I have a very good friend in the same situation. His wife is a drunk (and a bitch IMO) & she just loves to use him as a punching bag when she's drinking. It has led to the cops being called to their house many times. CPS is involved. Last year at one point, SHE was removed from the home & permitted only supervised visits with her kids. She actually lost custody of her 2 oldest boys to her ex during this time. I begged & pleaded with him then to take action because he had the deck stacked in his favor at that time. He didn't. Recently when she went on another drunken tirade & started punching him, she called the cops & he was arrested because she had marks on her wrists. Somehow the fact that his face was bloodied didn't seem to matter to the cops. SHE was the victim. The deck is now stacked against him. She took out a restraining order against him & he went over 40 days without being allowed to see his kids. She broke her foot & he moved back into the house to take care of his kids (because she also is a pill popper). They had to pay lawyers to get the restraining order removed. Last week she was popped for a DUI while on the way to pick up their kids. I again have begged him to take action NOW because he holds the cards, but he won't. He won't leave his kids & he doesn't have the financial resources she has. She inherited big money when her dad died last year. It really does just kill me that he won't leave & can't afford to take his kids & run. And YES, I have suggested that to him more than once. To take his kids & run back to NZ where he's from. He did at least call CPS after her DUI arrest & had it recorded in their open CPS file. When I talked to him on Sunday, she was passed out at 3 pm & had already drank...hold onto your hats....28 beers & had taken 4 valium. I warned him that he's going to come home one day & find her in a pool of puke dead. All he said was "I know".
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HoneyBBQ
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Post by HoneyBBQ on Aug 21, 2013 14:46:23 GMT -5
I'm constantly amazed at how little self respect people have. It shows in who you have relationships with. There are many reasons why I'm single, but one of them is because I believe my companionship is valuable, and therefore I either spend my time with quality people, or alone. If you stay in an abusive relationship, even if it's just verbal abuse, you're acknowledging to yourself that your companionship has no value. Men and women who stay in abusive relationships reek of low self esteem. This is not really very helpful. There are kids and pets and a household involved. You don't have any ties to anyone from what I've read, so it's very easy to say this from afar when your life isn't intertwined with anyone else's. It may not be about self esteem. It may be a one-time event cause by drinking. It may be that he wants to stay in the relationship for the kids. Maybe he still loves her but she tends to get loopy when she drinks and needs help and he loves her enough to be willing to help her. There's a lot of reasons why he may stay other than self esteem. Just saying your grass is green doesn't help hoops' brother.
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cktc
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Post by cktc on Aug 21, 2013 15:14:15 GMT -5
There is a saying to the effect of when you wrestle with pigs, you both get dirty, but the pig likes it. He can’t win here. He has to understand that. She isn't going to change until she wants to and there isn't a damn thing he can do to hasten that process. Cops, divorce, it doesn't matter. She can blame him for her actions till she’s blue in the face, but he doesn't control her. In a case of he said, she said, she can say absolutely anything. It doesn't matter how squeaky clean he is if he can’t prove it. The best thing he can do is remove himself from the situation. If he has to be around her, it can’t be when she’s drinking and he needs someone with him. If he wishes to continue the relationship, he needs to do so with the knowledge that he will be risking his own well being. She isn't going to change and the only person he can control is himself. Don’t sugar coat it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 15:21:45 GMT -5
"This is not really very helpful. There are kids and pets and a household involved. You don't have any ties to anyone from what I've read, so it's very easy to say this from afar when your life isn't intertwined with anyone else's. It may not be about self esteem. It may be a one-time event cause by drinking. It may be that he wants to stay in the relationship for the kids. Maybe he still loves her but she tends to get loopy when she drinks and needs help and he loves her enough to be willing to help her. There's a lot of reasons why he may stay other than self esteem. Just saying your grass is green doesn't help hoops' brother." You said so much better than I would have! We have a saying in my country, translated "it is easy for a single person to divorce a spouse", I am sure you get the idea.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Aug 21, 2013 15:59:22 GMT -5
::You said so much better than I would have! We have a saying in my country, translated "it is easy for a single person to divorce a spouse", I am sure you get the idea. ::
We actually talked about this a little when he came over as well. Part of why he felt so conflicted was that he knows if someone asked him what they should do in this case, he'd tell them to call the cops and leave.
::If he has to be around her, it can’t be when she’s drinking and he needs someone with him. ::
Completely agree. This is an obvious requirement, but not something either of us had really thought about. He's actually around here a lot when she's drinking, just not when she's DRINKING!
::If you stay in an abusive relationship, even if it's just verbal abuse, you're acknowledging to yourself that your companionship has no value.::
I think the question for a lot of people is "is my occasional misery worth the majority time I am happy?". And then goes further into "is my occasional misery worth the misery I feel I am sparing my kids from going through a messy divorce?".
Nobody is going to be happy with their spouse 100% of hte time. Personally, I'd rather have someone who's occasionally verbally abusive toward me than someone who does a lot of other things (overspender, smoker, poor parents, etc). It's not much different than saying men and women who can't seem to find a significant other reek of having nothing to offer. When in reality I'm sure you believe the reason you're not in a relationship is because of other things.
I can't even imagine what the divorce rate would be if everyone divorced the second someone else was mean to them in some way.
::If he wishes to continue the relationship, he needs to do so with the knowledge that he will be risking his own well being.::
Yeah, he understands this already i think. He needs to understand he risks his children's well being to make a real change IMO. He doesn't get that yet because she only lashes out like this when they aren't there.
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Aug 21, 2013 16:09:41 GMT -5
I have a very good friend in the same situation. His wife is a drunk (and a bitch IMO) & she just loves to use him as a punching bag when she's drinking. It has led to the cops being called to their house many times. CPS is involved. Last year at one point, SHE was removed from the home & permitted only supervised visits with her kids. She actually lost custody of her 2 oldest boys to her ex during this time. I begged & pleaded with him then to take action because he had the deck stacked in his favor at that time. He didn't. Recently when she went on another drunken tirade & started punching him, she called the cops & he was arrested because she had marks on her wrists. Somehow the fact that his face was bloodied didn't seem to matter to the cops. SHE was the victim. The deck is now stacked against him. She took out a restraining order against him & he went over 40 days without being allowed to see his kids. She broke her foot & he moved back into the house to take care of his kids (because she also is a pill popper). They had to pay lawyers to get the restraining order removed. Last week she was popped for a DUI while on the way to pick up their kids. I again have begged him to take action NOW because he holds the cards, but he won't. He won't leave his kids & he doesn't have the financial resources she has. She inherited big money when her dad died last year. It really does just kill me that he won't leave & can't afford to take his kids & run. And YES, I have suggested that to him more than once. To take his kids & run back to NZ where he's from. He did at least call CPS after her DUI arrest & had it recorded in their open CPS file. When I talked to him on Sunday, she was passed out at 3 pm & had already drank...hold onto your hats....28 beers & had taken 4 valium. I warned him that he's going to come home one day & find her in a pool of puke dead. All he said was "I know". Steff, I have to ask: your friend says he cannot afford to take the kids and run back to where he's from, or at least go somewhere safe with them. Yet he can afford to have them in this situation, and the kids wind up dead at the hands of a woman who's way, way past the drunk stage? Twenty-eight beers and four Valium is not drunk, not high and not out for a good time. It's asking for, begging for, requesting death in capital letters with exclamation points. Even assuming the kids have passports, taking them out of the country is likely tantamount to kidnapping. I understand the desperation, though. But he could go to prison for such an act, valiant though it may be. He needs to set up a safe place - a county shelter location, friends, even family (his if he has some here, or hers if they realize what's going on), and be able to get the kids there. At the rate she's going, if she's not forced into treatment, death is coming - in the puke pile, as you said, or behind the wheel. And if it's behind the wheel, chances are she'll take other lives with her.
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milee
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Post by milee on Aug 21, 2013 16:26:03 GMT -5
Even assuming the kids have passports, taking them out of the country is likely tantamount to kidnapping. Not exactly. My husband is a legal citizen of another country and several years ago when we were having some issues and I consulted several divorce attorneys, all warned me to keep my son's passport secure because there is nothing to legally prevent a spouse from taking their child out of the country unless there is a court order stating otherwise. Now in theory, if the friend took the kids to NZ, I'm assuming the wife would file for a divorce and custody here in the US and those requests would have to work their way through the legal system. Presumably, the friend would also be filing in NZ, and who knows what their laws allow? But in any case, it wouldn't be illegal nor would it be kidnapping for the NZ guy to take his kids to NZ and let the wife try to fight to get them back. She might or might not win the court case and if she did win, she'd be dependent on the US Government's willingness and NZ's willingness (some countries have treaties for this and some don't) to actually enforce any custody order. Working it out would take many years during which time NZ guy could be happily living in NZ with the kids. Edited to add: That was before 911 and the procedures for leaving the country may have changed, but I don't think so. DH just took the boys out of the country for a visit with his family and wasn't asked if he had sole custody and nobody contacted me to see if I had given permission...
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milee
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Post by milee on Aug 21, 2013 16:33:42 GMT -5
Oh, and he did bring the boys back, just for the record. I don't worry about him kidnapping them any more. We've had them long enough that I know he'd rather be boiled in oil than be solely responsible for raising 2 boys.
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Aug 21, 2013 16:35:50 GMT -5
I take my kids out of the country without DH. Once in a while they ask me entering into Canada where my husband is, but most of the time they don't. Nobody stops me leaving the country.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 19:32:00 GMT -5
Well hell, I thought as long as I didn't sign for older son to get a passport I was safe. Glad I didn't read these posts years ago. I'm not worried about it anymore. He did take him to Canada once before they required passports, but I had to sign a form saying it was ok for him to take him out of the country. I ASSUMED they actually checked for these things.
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milee
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Post by milee on Aug 21, 2013 19:36:20 GMT -5
Well hell, I thought as long as I didn't sign for older son to get a passport I was safe. Glad I didn't read these posts years ago. I'm not worried about it anymore. He did take him to Canada once before they required passports, but I had to sign a form saying it was ok for him to take him out of the country. I ASSUMED they actually checked for these things. But as a practical matter, I'm not sure they should. There are few checkpoints that focus on people leaving the country, more attention is paid to who is coming into the US - and that's how it should be. Plus, what about widows and other people who don't have a second parent to get permission from? What would they do - bring a death certificate? Too much to expect the government to monitor the borders and check on people leaving the country, IMHO.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 20:30:04 GMT -5
You need both parents in person to get a passport for a minor. Or you need a notarized statement i think. if divorced, you need official papers showing sole custody or it is no different than above. I got my son's passport after the divorce. When he left the country with my mom i had all kinds of documents prepared but they didnt ask for anything, just passport.
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toomuchreality
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Post by toomuchreality on Aug 21, 2013 21:15:50 GMT -5
I have a coffee mug that says:
"Tis better to have loved and lost than to be stuck with a real loser for the rest of your entire, miserable existence!"
Now I realize that your brother is not entirely miserable and that she is not a total loser. But you get the idea.... When you're in the middle of all the crap, it feels that way. I got the mug when I was going through a horrible divorce (fighting for custody). I keep it cuz it's a good reminder. I never want to feel that way again!
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Aug 23, 2013 6:48:56 GMT -5
Well hell, I thought as long as I didn't sign for older son to get a passport I was safe. Glad I didn't read these posts years ago. I'm not worried about it anymore. He did take him to Canada once before they required passports, but I had to sign a form saying it was ok for him to take him out of the country. I ASSUMED they actually checked for these things. I sent my husband to gets our children's passports becaue I was really busy with work. They wouldn't issue them without both parents present. I had to leave work and meet them there with my own valid ID
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