Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Aug 12, 2013 16:10:48 GMT -5
Saturday night live has done political satire on every president since the show began in 75.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2013 16:15:36 GMT -5
do you believe that their satirical humor has been meted out evenly?
or has one side been the focus more than another?
I can say the same thing about the Jon Stewart show....the Bill Maher show.....and a bunch of others
Most (not all) of the tv land executives and talent tend to side with one particular political view.....
Or do you disagree with that statement?
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Aug 12, 2013 16:19:36 GMT -5
Yeah. I wasn't alive or old enough to watch the early SNL, but from the mid 90s on, yeah I'd say it was pretty even. They had a field day with Clinton for example, and Bush gave comedians material almost every time he opened his mouth.
I agree with that statement in the sense that most networks do favor one side or the other, but I don't think they're all favoring the same side. Fox News is clearly a Republican leaning network. MSNBC is clearly Democratic leaning. Most of the others fall somewhere in between, but it seems like over the last decade everyone is abandoning the middle and picking one side or the other.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2013 16:24:10 GMT -5
we were discussing comedy (specifically SNL)
you think Jon Stewart, Bill Maher, and SNL are even handed on which side they take politically?
i do agree that fox is far right, and msnbc is far left
abc, nbc lean left
cbs, cnn, and some pbs give the most even handed coverage
imho.....
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Aug 12, 2013 16:44:18 GMT -5
I think most people are saying, gdgyva, they don't like it either way. It's crass, to put it politely.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 12, 2013 16:45:20 GMT -5
What was the intent of playing with the lips of the Obama mask? Several thoughts come to mind. Apparently you've never seen a political cartoon in your lifetime. Feature exxageration is common. I have seen many in my lifetime unlike you in your tender, young, little age. Besides-it wasn't a politic cartoon was it. It was a mask. Please learn the difference in the future.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 12, 2013 16:57:26 GMT -5
Apparently you've never seen a political cartoon in your lifetime. Feature exxageration is common. I have seen many in my lifetime unlike you in your tender, young, little age. Besides-it wasn't a politic cartoon was it. It was a mask. Please learn the difference in the future. Then you should be aware that features are exxaggerated for comedic effect. The same principle applies to masks as it does to cartoons. Why is it okay on a cartoon but not for a mask?
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 12, 2013 16:59:47 GMT -5
Anyway, my overall take on it is that it was in poor taste, and I personally would not have found it amusing, but I also don't think it's that big of a deal. I support people's right to free speech, even if I don't like what they have to say, which is true in this instance.
I view this in the same vein as I do Rush Limbaugh, or the Daily Show. It's all just political entertainment. What is dangerous is the idea we should be censoring peoples' expressions because we don't like what they have to say, even if it's for something as trivial as a rodeo clown.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 12, 2013 17:06:29 GMT -5
do you believe that their satirical humor has been meted out evenly? or has one side been the focus more than another? I can say the same thing about the Jon Stewart show....the Bill Maher show.....and a bunch of others Most (not all) of the tv land executives and talent tend to side with one particular political view..... Or do you disagree with that statement? I can't really think of many right wing satirical people, unless you consider Rush to be funny. The right seems to go more towards the shouting, pontificating talking heads like Bill O'Riley and Rush. The left seems to capture most of the political satire people like Stewart and Colbert. Although both of those people do not hold back from skewering left wing idiots where they find them. There are a few left wing talking heads on MSNBC but I don't think they have the popularity (or notority) of O'Riley and Rush. I think both ends can and have gone to far, at times.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 12, 2013 17:08:07 GMT -5
I have seen many in my lifetime unlike you in your tender, young, little age. Besides-it wasn't a politic cartoon was it. It was a mask. Please learn the difference in the future. Then you should be aware that features are exxaggerated for comedic effect. The same principle applies to masks as it does to cartoons. Why is it okay on a cartoon but not for a mask? Yea. Let's exaggerate and play with the lips of a black man for comedic effect.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Aug 12, 2013 17:11:54 GMT -5
Anyway, my overall take on it is that it was in poor taste, and I personally would not have found it amusing, but I also don't think it's that big of a deal. I support people's right to free speech, even if I don't like what they have to say, which is true in this instance.
I view this in the same vein as I do Rush Limbaugh, or the Daily Show. It's all just political entertainment. What is dangerous is the idea we should be censoring peoples' expressions because we don't like what they have to say, even if it's for something as trivial as a rodeo clown. I think the problem was that he was an employee of the state fair, and that reflected badly on the whole fair and the whole state. I can send an email calling Obama whatever name I want to - that's protected free speech. I can even make up a sign showing Obama as a monkey and walk around downtown all day if I want to - also free speech. But if I get up in front of 200 people at one of our quarterly meetings and give a slide show presentation featuring pictures of Obama as a monkey, you can bet your ass I would be fired, because that would reflect badly on my company. There is a reason you aren't supposed to discuss religion or politics at work.
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formerroomate99
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Post by formerroomate99 on Aug 12, 2013 17:15:22 GMT -5
It would be pathetically easy to dredge up examples, but you're just going to deny their validity because they'll mostly come from right wing websites, since the mainstream media tends to cover up stuff that makes the left look bad.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 12, 2013 17:35:22 GMT -5
i condemn all such speech. do you? no. i believe in free speech. threatening speech is not free speech.I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Voltaire i agree with Voltaire, but threatening bodily harm is just that. it is not, in any way, protected. you can call Obama names. you can say he is a war criminal. you can say that you wish for justice to be brought to him by whatever legal means are available. but threatening bodily harm is not protected, and it is even less protected when the person being threatened is a head of state.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Aug 12, 2013 17:38:00 GMT -5
Get over your mis-read of the situation. Its about respect not racism. If we dissed you anywhere near what Obama endures you'd be whining constantly IMO. Nixon bashing was mostly Watergate and the aftermath. It did go on a long time, but again no public incidents like this one ever hit the media. You'll can pretend this happened before to other Presidents, but show me the stories!!! Where is the evidence? Could it have happened at private parties? Sure. Probably happens for Obama now too. But in public as part of the entertainment when its not comedy or a roast? Yep, so far you'll got nothing. Just assertions with no evidence. i remember the saturday night live skits oooh...but its just a joke.....that was the remarks coming back from the left when the right took the bashing a little too hard yeah....a joke seen by millions..... here...we have a small rodeo.....attended by what, 3 thousand? and omg look at the people on the left now..... i didnt like that then.....i dont like this now i think you are conflating bashing with threatening. they are very different. saying "kill Bush" is not satire. it is not critique. it is not mockery. it is a threat.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 12, 2013 18:26:45 GMT -5
I guess no one on the conservative side wants to acknowledge threats to kill a sitting President in a public fair using taxpayer money isn't OK. That it isn't equivalent to satire.
I remember photos and videos of people in foreign countries burning Bush in effigy. I thought that had to be scary and hoped that would never be acceptable here. Today, I'm not so sure as quite a few posters can't seem to differentiate between mocking Obama saying "do you want to see him killed?" basically and the usual political mocking in SNL, political cartoons and late night comedians. I've always appreciated folks like Jay Leno and South Park, both of which skewer both sides.
Former if you actually had equivalent examples you could probably find them on lots of websites not just right wing ones. If something this bad really happened to W, Bush, and Reagan damn straight it would have made news. Until someone brought it up I forgot that 9/11 actually gave W a free pass for awhile compared to any sitting President. He encouraged IMO the belief that any criticism of his self or policy was giving comfort to the enemy.
This has been a great reminder to the blinding power of bias. The inability to actually compare like to like.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 12, 2013 19:20:51 GMT -5
So I was thinking about former Presidents and I remembered something. So I decided to pretend some of you were advisors to Reagan back in the day. Well, yes President Reagan Mr. Hinkley did threaten to assasinate you to win Jodie Foster, but I wouldn't take it seriously. After all, Carter got alot of grief about lusting in his heart in that interview. I'm sure nothing will happen. All Presidents get kidded and told things. No big deal. Carter is still alive, I wouldn't worry about it. Maybe we should bring out fewer Secret Service agents when we go out too. Don't want the people to think we can't handle a little ribbing, eh?
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Aug 12, 2013 21:21:59 GMT -5
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 12, 2013 21:28:25 GMT -5
I remember the Nixon bashing and the ford bashing and the bush bashing but it was okay for them to be bashed but racist if its Obama. original quote deleted Based upon your past (moderator deleted) posting history, I don't find it the least bit odd at all of you to write <removed by moon>. The shoe has always fit you perfectly.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Aug 12, 2013 21:37:19 GMT -5
While I get that some don't like Obama (and some absolutely despise him), this is an embarassment to our country to act like this. Do we really think England would play "trample the prime minister?" I agree with the person in the article that said we are better than this. All this does is make us look like a country of disrespectful baffoons to the rest of the world. This is far beyond a SNL spoof or a joke on Comedy Central. This is actively applauding violence on our Commander in Chief, and shows an extreme lack of class. Unless there is something I'm not getting here, he is not my CinC.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 12, 2013 21:41:55 GMT -5
While I get that some don't like Obama (and some absolutely despise him), this is an embarassment to our country to act like this. Do we really think England would play "trample the prime minister?" I agree with the person in the article that said we are better than this. All this does is make us look like a country of disrespectful baffoons to the rest of the world. This is far beyond a SNL spoof or a joke on Comedy Central. This is actively applauding violence on our Commander in Chief, and shows an extreme lack of class. Unless there is something I'm not getting here, he is not my CinC. Whether you like it or not, and if you are active U.S. military, President Obama is your Commander In Chief.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Aug 12, 2013 22:05:56 GMT -5
Unless there is something I'm not getting here, he is not my CinC. Whether you like it or not, and if you are active U.S. military, President Obama is your Commander In Chief. Then I will assume hurley's "our" applied to herself, and not to folks on here in general. Sorry for misreading, hurley... and thank you for your service.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 12, 2013 22:17:58 GMT -5
Obama is the Commander in Chief of my nation's military thus I have no problem with the idea that he is "my" Commander in Chief even though my time in service is long past.
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ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
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Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Aug 12, 2013 22:26:27 GMT -5
Oh, puleeze! Political figures - especially the POTUS (no matter who that might be at any given time) have always been satirized/mocked. It goes with the territory.
Even civic politicians have their day in the "mockery spotlight". It just goes with the territory (politics) - not matter who is in power and at what level - most are savvy enough to brush it off as satire and continue on with their job.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2013 23:10:35 GMT -5
THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Aug 13, 2013 1:15:40 GMT -5
If he is talking about the country and its people in general, I have my doubts. If he is referring specifically to either right-wing Republicans* or rural Missourians, I have even more of them. The reason that politics has become so ugly and this country is so polarized is because we are NOT better than this. It is said that we get exactly the type of government we deserve, and when people would rather rant and blame than think and fix, no, we are not better than this.
* Note: The same would apply to the far-left as well were the incident targeted the other way. This comment is a Republican governor talking about "we" but neither extreme has a monopoly on disgusting behavior. They both engage far too frequently and we all pay the price.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Aug 13, 2013 6:27:13 GMT -5
AGB, Thanks for the post. I've been without TV/cable for over 6 years so I may have missed some of these. The two top videos you posted appear to be done by individuals with very few bystanders. Not good at all, especially the top one, but they don't appear that public or supported by tax dollars. The second one IMO appears more as a protest against the war than anything else.
In the not cool and unacceptable category: all the images calling for Bush's death literally or figuratively, i.e. shot to the head etc. Hate Bush, Hate Obama, still protected speech. Not great, but still on the correct side of the line. (The get free cupcakes of course shows a serious lack of class.)
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Aug 13, 2013 6:50:03 GMT -5
You'll can pretend this happened before to other Presidents, but show me the stories!!!Where is the evidence? Could it have happened at private parties? Sure. Probably happens for Obama now too. But in public as part of the entertainment when its not comedy or a roast? Yep, so far you'll got nothing. Just assertions with no evidence. I'm still getting through all the posts on this so not sure if the above has been addressed yet... Obama is the first president where YouTube was up for the full term of his presidency. Couple that with the wide availability of smart phones/video recording devices and the potential for this type of display to go "viral" is exponentially higher than at any other point in history. YouTube was only up for the (I believe) last few years of Bush Jr.'s term and was not the phenomenon it is today. I dont' condone the behaviour as I believe we should respect the office. However I VIVIDLY remember some protests when Jimmy Carter was in office during the oil/energy crisis when things were going south in Iran and I even remember him being burned in effigy on the news. It was one of the first times my parents explained the concept of free speech to me. Here's the link... news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1891&dat=19781212&id=TKUfAAAAIBAJ&sjid=PtYEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4376,1588975
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Aug 13, 2013 6:55:12 GMT -5
I have childhood memories of a tent fair where one act was two clowns lampooning (then Prime Minister) Brian Mulroney. One clown was wearing a Mulroney mask and the other one eventually threw a pie at him. Everyone thought it was hilarious, myself included.
The incident described in the OP seems more hostile than that, but it can be hard to tell from just a description. If the crowd loved the act, the clowns would do their best to drag it out. Their job is to make people laugh, and Pres. Obama is an obvious target.
Having said that, I agree with the many posters arguing that we ought to avoid mocking our leaders--or at least do so sparingly. They face enough criticism as it is.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2013 8:16:46 GMT -5
i remember the saturday night live skits oooh...but its just a joke.....that was the remarks coming back from the left when the right took the bashing a little too hard yeah....a joke seen by millions..... here...we have a small rodeo.....attended by what, 3 thousand? and omg look at the people on the left now..... i didnt like that then.....i dont like this now i think you are conflating bashing with threatening. they are very different. saying "kill Bush" is not satire. it is not critique. it is not mockery. it is a threat. if that truly is the case, and they truly were threatening the president then i believe we have remedies in place for idiots like that the secret service comes to mind, along with the FBI
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2013 8:21:47 GMT -5
I was there. It was mild humor at best. All the thin skinned liberals here have nothing to worry about in regards to their much loved president being poked fun of at a very redneck rodeo in Missouri. If it bothers Y'all that much, just pretend it was a George Bush mask.
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