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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:14:13 GMT -5
I wouldn't have if Zimmerman had just stuck to calling the cops. The cops probably would have driven by, talked to Martin and situation handelded. Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.We all like to think we know how we'd react. I know on P&M it's popular to say you know exactly how you'd handle the situation since you own a gun. Well we don't, even police and military people make mistakes. Now someone is dead. I do agree with people that his gun made him cocky, I also think he had an overblown sense of importance when it comes to being a member of the "neighborhood watch". He's an idiot, pure and simple. He may also be a racist I don't know, but I don't think that has anything to do with what happened. I can't speak about Florida laws but if you have a carry permit in Minnesota you have gone through training. GZ did not run up to TM and shoot him. According to witness testimony he did not fire his weapon until TM was on top of him and had already broken his nose and was banging his head into the sidewalk. I am not inside either of these people's heads and was not present to witness everything that lead up to that moment but if I was in GZ's place while TM was beating me and the beating continued; I would be afraid he wasn't going to stop until I was dead. After all I already had my face punched (broken nose) and he continued to beat my head into the sidewalk. If it were me at that point I would realize that: 1. I was not able to effectively fight off TM or I would have already gotten him off of me. 2. This guy wasn't stopping after getting me down and punching my face, in fact he was now smashing my head into the ground. 3. The choices I have at that point are to continue to struggle (ineffectively), yell (which it seems GZ did but no one came to help in time), or use the gun. Once you are in that situation your choices are limited. I know that GZ could have made other choices up to that point but he didn't. So he had to make that tragic decision based on what was happening then and not what he could have done earlier.
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Taxman10
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Post by Taxman10 on Jul 16, 2013 10:17:10 GMT -5
*
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jul 16, 2013 10:19:24 GMT -5
Where most of us live, I'm guessing that's true. In the example that I gave though, in the area that we lived in certain colors were tied in with certain gangs. I was wondering if hoody's could have been the same thing? I don't know, I was just wondering. I figured that if a color can be picked to identify a gang, why couldn't a hoody? Hard to say without knowing the particular area. I'm in SW Florida - across the state from Trayvon/Zimmerman territory, but within a couple of hours' drive. I have a 13 year old and am active in teaching youth sports, so see a fair number of young adults around this area. Hoodies aren't common. Not unheard of, but not common. It's just not cold enough around here for most of the year for people to wear them. Heck, people have made fun of me since I only own a single pair of jeans, but it's just not often cold enough to need jeans. Kind of like how I've worn a red bandanna here in the land of the senior citizen, but I probably wouldn't wear one in Compton, KWIM? BTW, I'm not weighing in on the Zimmerman verdict, just commenting that hoodies may - or may not - be common in their area and we don't really have a good way of knowing that unless we live there. Regarding the wearing of a hoodie, and not that it matters any more, it was a cool, damp day in Sanford, Florida on February 26, 2012: www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KSFB/2012/2/26/DailyHistory.html
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:20:20 GMT -5
I don't disagree that he's an idiot. But I think he killed in self defense, not due to hatred. He was getting the crap kicked out of him. At what point do you think to yourself, "we'll, it's him or me." Put me in that situation and I would pull the trigger too.
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Taxman10
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Post by Taxman10 on Jul 16, 2013 10:20:48 GMT -5
* crackers are yummy!
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Taxman10
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Post by Taxman10 on Jul 16, 2013 10:24:31 GMT -5
Of course my views on this, I've already posted. Something that I did wonder about is the hoody & did that play a part. When we arrived at a base once we were told not to wear a certain color or carry a bandana because we would be confused with members of a certain gang. Could the same thing apply to a hoody? Not being from that area, I have no idea if that's true but it might have been. A hoodie is a pretty standard wardrobe staple for a lot of people. I'm 32 and I wear them. But it just makes you look sad.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 16, 2013 10:24:50 GMT -5
Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.
x100. To me he is a complete idiot. He is actually lucky is ass isn't dead. He pursued someone who also could have been carrying a weapon. I agree. But I also feel TM was an idiot in this case, too. If what GZ said is true (no one knows) then TM confronted someone and started a fight with someone who was carrying. Throughout this thread several of you blasted gZ for not identifying himself as neighborhood watch...given that, TM acted like an arrogant kid who thought he could handle any situation. He didn't do the smart thing and now he is dead. I personally would kick my daughters ass if she ever approached any person who was following her. TM was an athletic 17 year old who could easily have outrun the chunky GZ. He chose not to
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Taxman10
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Post by Taxman10 on Jul 16, 2013 10:26:11 GMT -5
YES!!!!
I made it all the way through - 22 pages!!
So what did we decide??
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 16, 2013 10:26:51 GMT -5
YES!!!! I made it all the way through - 22 pages!! So what did we decide?? Not guilty? Haven't you watched the news??
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milee
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Post by milee on Jul 16, 2013 10:27:10 GMT -5
Hard to say without knowing the particular area. I'm in SW Florida - across the state from Trayvon/Zimmerman territory, but within a couple of hours' drive. I have a 13 year old and am active in teaching youth sports, so see a fair number of young adults around this area. Hoodies aren't common. Not unheard of, but not common. It's just not cold enough around here for most of the year for people to wear them. Heck, people have made fun of me since I only own a single pair of jeans, but it's just not often cold enough to need jeans. Kind of like how I've worn a red bandanna here in the land of the senior citizen, but I probably wouldn't wear one in Compton, KWIM? BTW, I'm not weighing in on the Zimmerman verdict, just commenting that hoodies may - or may not - be common in their area and we don't really have a good way of knowing that unless we live there. Regarding the wearing of a hoodie, and not that it matters any more, it was a cool, damp day in Sanford, Florida on February 26, 2012: www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KSFB/2012/2/26/DailyHistory.htmlSure, there are sometimes cooler days, but my point is that the cooler days are rare enough that most of the kids don't even own warmish clothes. At least around here they don't. Most of the teens I know own maybe one sweatshirt (the most common thing I see) or maybe a rain jacket. You don't even want to know what a PITA it is when the kids go on a field trip to a colder area - try several dozen parents all suddenly realizing that their kid is about to spend 5 days in a snowy area and the kid doesn't own anything other than t-shirts and shorts... Again, it varies by area and I'm not guessing what the clothing situation is in Sanford. Just making the point that less than 2 hours away, hoodies aren't common. Assuming hoodies are common because they are common where you live might not be a reasonable leap of logic. I remember when I got married and DH and I moved to North Carolina after having lived in SW Florida my whole life. My sister and I donated blood and received a "thank you" gift - some weird plastic thing. For a while, we couldn't figure out what it was and then were puzzled about why they'd give cat litter box scoopers as a gift. DH (who is English) laughingly explained to us that it was an ice scraper for your car. We'd never seen such a thing. Yes, maybe 5-8 nights a year the cars might get a light frost on them, but nobody we knew ever owned or used an ice scraper... So not owning a hoodie/jacket/mittens/etc isn't odd for down here.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:27:10 GMT -5
YES!!!! I made it all the way through - 22 pages!! So what did we decide?? That we need another real life court case circus to keep us occupied.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jul 16, 2013 10:27:39 GMT -5
I wouldn't have if Zimmerman had just stuck to calling the cops. The cops probably would have driven by, talked to Martin and situation handelded. Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.There was a random shooting at a Portland mall last winter (a few days before the Sandy Hook shooting). The shooter killed 3 people before killing himself. I was talking with a guy (call him X) who was in the mall at the time - he's a security guard and has a license to carry and was carrying a gun. The shooter looked at him and pointed his gun at him and X pointed his own gun back at him. X didn't fire though - because he saw other mall shoppers hiding in clothing racks behind the shooter and didn't want to accidentally kill one of them if he missed the shooter. He also didn't want to start a gunfight with the shooter and have his friends (who were standing right next to X) get shot. So they stood facing each other with guns pointed until the shooter walked away. THAT is being smart. To be in an intense emotional situation and recognize all the risk factors and act conservatively. X had had training and understood what to do. Sure, he could have shot at the shooter and maybe killed a bystander and probably wouldn't have been convicted of anything as "accidents happen" but then an innocent person would be dead and he didn't want that on his conscience. And yes, the shooter killed one person after their confrontation before killing himself so X has that on his conscience a bit. But ultimately he made the right decision (what the cops told him after it was all over.) Having the gun with him and pointing it at the shooter probably saved X's life (the shooter would probably have shot at him otherwise) but X used the gun wisely. GZ should never have had a gun.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jul 16, 2013 10:28:59 GMT -5
YES!!!! I made it all the way through - 22 pages!! So what did we decide?? Psssshhh. You need to read the Trayvon Martin thread on P&M. All 178 pages.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 16, 2013 10:30:54 GMT -5
Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.
x100. To me he is a complete idiot. He is actually lucky is ass isn't dead. He pursued someone who also could have been carrying a weapon. I agree. But I also feel TM was an idiot in this case, too. If what GZ said is true (no one knows) then TM confronted someone and started a fight with someone who was carrying. Throughout this thread several of you blasted gZ for not identifying himself as neighborhood watch...given that, TM acted like an arrogant kid who thought he could handle any situation. He didn't do the smart thing and now he is dead. I personally would kick my daughters ass if she ever approached any person who was following her. TM was an athletic 17 year old who could easily have outrun the chunky GZ. He chose not to You honestly don't think that Martin running would have made Zimmerman know he was right that this was a criminal who needed to be stopped? So what was he supposed to do? Not aimed at tina just in general. Walking slowly got him killed. We all know that taking off running would have had bad results. He wasn't tresspassing. He didn't have any drugs or weapons on him. What exactly was he supposed to do?
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 16, 2013 10:32:46 GMT -5
I wouldn't have if Zimmerman had just stuck to calling the cops. The cops probably would have driven by, talked to Martin and situation handelded. Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.There was a random shooting at a Portland mall last winter (a few days before the Sandy Hook shooting). The shooter killed 3 people before killing himself. I was talking with a guy (call him X) who was in the mall at the time - he's a security guard and has a license to carry and was carrying a gun. The shooter looked at him and pointed his gun at him and X pointed his own gun back at him. X didn't fire though - because he saw other mall shoppers hiding in clothing racks behind the shooter and didn't want to accidentally kill one of them if he missed the shooter. He also didn't want to start a gunfight with the shooter and have his friends (who were standing right next to X) get shot. So they stood facing each other with guns pointed until the shooter walked away. THAT is being smart. To be in an intense emotional situation and recognize all the risk factors and act conservatively. X had had training and understood what to do. Sure, he could have shot at the shooter and maybe killed a bystander and probably wouldn't have been convicted of anything as "accidents happen" but then an innocent person would be dead and he didn't want that on his conscience. And yes, the shooter killed one person after their confrontation before killing himself so X has that on his conscience a bit. But ultimately he made the right decision (what the cops told him after it was all over.) Having the gun with him and pointing it at the shooter probably saved X's life (the shooter would probably have shot at him otherwise) but X used the gun wisely. GZ should never have had a gun. Would you think he made the right decision if the shooter shot him? Crazy ass people aren't always deterred by knowing someone else has a gun. I love never shit someone but i fully believe I could do it without hesitation if some whackjob was pointing a gun at me or beating me to a pulp. Sorry, my life and that if my family is worth more to me than anyone else
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 16, 2013 10:35:02 GMT -5
Instead not only did Zimmerman profile but he decided that he was capable of handling the situation. He's not trained to do anything. Just because you are carrying a gun it doesn't mean you know how to handle/react in a certain situation.
x100. To me he is a complete idiot. He is actually lucky is ass isn't dead. He pursued someone who also could have been carrying a weapon. I agree. But I also feel TM was an idiot in this case, too. If what GZ said is true (no one knows) then TM confronted someone and started a fight with someone who was carrying. Throughout this thread several of you blasted gZ for not identifying himself as neighborhood watch...given that, TM acted like an arrogant kid who thought he could handle any situation. He didn't do the smart thing and now he is dead. I personally would kick my daughters ass if she ever approached any person who was following her. TM was an athletic 17 year old who could easily have outrun the chunky GZ. He chose not to I agree with you as well. TM probably didn't make smart choices either but 17 yr olds often make bad choices. I can't count the number of bad choices I probably made as a teenager. I guess I just expect a little more out of an adult than I do a 17 yr old.
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 16, 2013 10:37:54 GMT -5
YES!!!! I made it all the way through - 22 pages!! So what did we decide?? Psssshhh. You need to read the Trayvon Martin thread on P&M. All 178 pages. No thank you. I would rather not gouge my eyes out with a fork today
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Jul 16, 2013 10:38:08 GMT -5
"Broad" would be sexist, not racist. That's a different thread
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:43:48 GMT -5
Zimmerman's defense rested on his own emotions - what he felt. There is plenty of studies and evidence to show that he mostly likely felt more fearful for his life on an unconscious level because Trayvon Martin was a black male than if Trayvon Martin was white. According to the link I posted interracial interactions can start off with more anxiety for both sides, less eye contact, even less friendly dialogue. So you can take two guys who are already anxious - Zimmerman because of the break ins, Martin because some strange guy is following him in the evening, they have some sort of interaction that makes them both more anxious, a physical confrontation, and the one without a gun is dead.
It's going to feel really racial when you know that many white people are unjustly fearful of black males and their criminality due to tv, news, and unfairly applied school and criminal laws and that Zimmerman was freed because he said he was afraid. The implication is that it's okay to follow someone and then kill them if you are afraid of them - something that will disproportionately affect black males due to implicit racism.
There was simply no way for Martin to win in this confrontation and maintain his self-respect. What was he supposed to do? He saw someone follow him and kept walking, at least for a little while. If he ran away that would have made him look like a criminal. There's no guarantee that Zimmerman wouldn't have followed. Was he supposed to call the police himself? We already know there's a lot of unfairness in the way the police treat black and white suspects. That probably didn't seem like an option. At some point Martin and Zimmerman exchanged a few words, maybe.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jul 16, 2013 10:43:55 GMT -5
There was a random shooting at a Portland mall last winter (a few days before the Sandy Hook shooting). The shooter killed 3 people before killing himself. I was talking with a guy (call him X) who was in the mall at the time - he's a security guard and has a license to carry and was carrying a gun. The shooter looked at him and pointed his gun at him and X pointed his own gun back at him. X didn't fire though - because he saw other mall shoppers hiding in clothing racks behind the shooter and didn't want to accidentally kill one of them if he missed the shooter. He also didn't want to start a gunfight with the shooter and have his friends (who were standing right next to X) get shot. So they stood facing each other with guns pointed until the shooter walked away. THAT is being smart. To be in an intense emotional situation and recognize all the risk factors and act conservatively. X had had training and understood what to do. Sure, he could have shot at the shooter and maybe killed a bystander and probably wouldn't have been convicted of anything as "accidents happen" but then an innocent person would be dead and he didn't want that on his conscience. And yes, the shooter killed one person after their confrontation before killing himself so X has that on his conscience a bit. But ultimately he made the right decision (what the cops told him after it was all over.) Having the gun with him and pointing it at the shooter probably saved X's life (the shooter would probably have shot at him otherwise) but X used the gun wisely. GZ should never have had a gun. Would you think he made the right decision if the shooter shot him? Crazy ass people aren't always deterred by knowing someone else has a gun. I love never shit someone but i fully believe I could do it without hesitation if some whackjob was pointing a gun at me or beating me to a pulp. Sorry, my life and that if my family is worth more to me than anyone else So someone points a gun at you/your family and you shoot at him but kill an innocent bystander by accident. Is that bystander's life worth less than your own because you don't know them? Really? The point of guns is to MINIMIZE murder/violence, not escalate it. Even police are trained to disarm a guy rather than just shooting him.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 16, 2013 10:50:21 GMT -5
Would you think he made the right decision if the shooter shot him? Crazy ass people aren't always deterred by knowing someone else has a gun.
I don't think either one made good decisions, but Martin is dead. He suffered the ultimate price of losing his life for the poor choice he made in deciding to confront Zimmerman. I'm not sure what else can be said about that, it isn't like he can stand trial, which he probably would have if he lived.
Zimmerman should face consequences for his decisions as well.
I agree with the jury's decision based on the evidence provided. I also don't think this is suitable for a federal hate crime case.
BUT I'm not going to hold up Zimmerman as some sort of pariah that had no choice but to shoot Martin. He put himself in a situation that could have been avoided complerely. He had plenty of "choices" that didn't have to end in killing someone.
He'll have to live with that knowledge the rest of his life. He'll also have to live with knowing he drug his family thru the mud with him and ruined another family by killing their son. I hope it was all worth it.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:53:59 GMT -5
Zimmerman's defense rested on his own emotions - what he felt. There is plenty of studies and evidence to show that he mostly likely felt more fearful for his life on an unconscious level because Trayvon Martin was a black male than if Trayvon Martin was white. According to the link I posted interracial interactions can start off with more anxiety for both sides, less eye contact, even less friendly dialogue. So you can take two guys who are already anxious - Zimmerman because of the break ins, Martin because some strange guy is following him in the evening, they have some sort of interaction that makes them both more anxious, a physical confrontation, and the one without a gun is dead. It's going to feel really racial when you know that many white people are unjustly fearful of black males and their criminality due to tv, news, and unfairly applied school and criminal laws and that Zimmerman was freed because he said he was afraid. The implication is that it's okay to follow someone and then kill them if you are afraid of them - something that will disproportionately affect black males due to implicit racism. There was simply no way for Martin to win in this confrontation and maintain his self-respect. What was he supposed to do? He saw someone follow him and kept walking, at least for a little while. If he ran away that would have made him look like a criminal. There's no guarantee that Zimmerman wouldn't have followed. Was he supposed to call the police himself? We already know there's a lot of unfairness in the way the police treat black and white suspects. That probably didn't seem like an option. At some point Martin and Zimmerman exchanged a few words, maybe. So, no matter what, if a black person has a crime committed against them by a person other than a black person, you're saying its racially motivated because society has basically programmed non blacks to be fearful of blacks? I can't agree with you there. I'm sorry, but there's only so long that a group of people can play the victim card. And, IMHO, riots, etc when jury verdicts don't go your way don't help your case. I'd feel the same way no matter what the races were between the two people. While obviously I can't be sure, from what I've heard about GZ, had the break ins been done by a young Hispanic guy, he'd have followed an unknown, young, Hispanic around too. Would the same thing have happened? Maybe. And then would everybody be up in arms about it? No.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 10:59:02 GMT -5
No, I'm saying that when your level of fear is what dictates whether or not you are considered innocent and you are more fearful because of someone's race, then it matters.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 16, 2013 11:12:26 GMT -5
I agree. But I also feel TM was an idiot in this case, too. If what GZ said is true (no one knows) then TM confronted someone and started a fight with someone who was carrying. Throughout this thread several of you blasted gZ for not identifying himself as neighborhood watch...given that, TM acted like an arrogant kid who thought he could handle any situation. He didn't do the smart thing and now he is dead. I personally would kick my daughters ass if she ever approached any person who was following her. TM was an athletic 17 year old who could easily have outrun the chunky GZ. He chose not to You honestly don't think that Martin running would have made Zimmerman know he was right that this was a criminal who needed to be stopped? So what was he supposed to do? Not aimed at tina just in general. Walking slowly got him killed. We all know that taking off running would have had bad results. He wasn't tresspassing. He didn't have any drugs or weapons on him. What exactly was he supposed to do? Take a step back...what would you tell your daughter to so if some stranger was following her? I would run like a bat out of hell. Not casually walk and carry on a conversation with my friend about some creepy saltine following me. So anytime a person is being followed they should casually walk down the street like it is no big deal? That is certainly not what I am teaching my kids
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movingforward
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Post by movingforward on Jul 16, 2013 11:56:46 GMT -5
Where most of us live, I'm guessing that's true. In the example that I gave though, in the area that we lived in certain colors were tied in with certain gangs. I was wondering if hoody's could have been the same thing? I don't know, I was just wondering. I figured that if a color can be picked to identify a gang, why couldn't a hoody? To me, the part about the hoodie doesn't signify a gangbanger... but if the hoodie is up and it's dark and rainy, it makes it pretty hard to determine race from any sort of distance. Which is why I don't think this is the race hate crime that everyone is trying to make it out to be. Agreed. To me it is more of a gun issue than a race issue. Isn't your husband in law enforcement? I would be interested in his opinion. I have a good friend who is a police officer and he believes GZ should have waited for the police to show. At any rate, it is over and I am about ready to put this issue to bed already. I feel sorry for TM's family but I really think the anger in this issue needs to be more over guns than over race, but there are some people that live for the drama. ETA: And I am not directing that at people of any certain race. There is plenty of drama in every race to go around. When Casey Anthony was found not guilty I never could figure out why people were harassing her MOTHER.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2013 11:57:47 GMT -5
No, I'm saying that when your level of fear is what dictates whether or not you are considered innocent and you are more fearful because of someone's race, then it matters. And you don't think that you should be afraid of someone that just broke your nose and is banging your head against the concrete sidewalk/curb?
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 16, 2013 12:15:52 GMT -5
You honestly don't think that Martin running would have made Zimmerman know he was right that this was a criminal who needed to be stopped? So what was he supposed to do? Not aimed at tina just in general. Walking slowly got him killed. We all know that taking off running would have had bad results. He wasn't tresspassing. He didn't have any drugs or weapons on him. What exactly was he supposed to do? Take a step back...what would you tell your daughter to so if some stranger was following her? I would run like a bat out of hell. Not casually walk and carry on a conversation with my friend about some creepy saltine following me. So anytime a person is being followed they should casually walk down the street like it is no big deal? That is certainly not what I am teaching my kids Teens are taught not to run. It makes them look like a criminal. Just think back to watching a Law and Order show. What does it mean when the perp runs? In this case Zimmerman probably would have chased him. I'm not saying there is a right answer. that is the problem. There was nothing he could have done to stop Zimmerman from coming after him. If he was thinking with the front side of his brain he would have stayed in the car like the police told him to. Now that martin is dead he can't tell his side of the story, so everything we have heard is what Zimmerman wanted us to. Zimmerman started the whole chain of events that ended with him killing someone, but some how everyone is trying to figure out to what extent it is the victim's fault Zimmerman killed him.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on Jul 16, 2013 12:25:06 GMT -5
Welcome to America, where we put young black men on trial for their own murder.
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geenamercile
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Post by geenamercile on Jul 16, 2013 12:34:13 GMT -5
Well you could go back and say who ever was doing the break ins started the whole chain, since that is the reason the neighborhood watch was created. Without the break ins none of this would have happen either.
And just for the record, no I don't think Zimmerman should have been carrying a gun since it went against the neighborhood watch rules. And I do think his actions certainly was a part of that chain of events, and if he had changed any of his choices we would have had a differnt out come, so yes I do think he is responsible for the death. But just because someone is responsible for a death does not make it murder, or a crime.
And I agree GZ is an idiot.
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Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 16, 2013 12:35:21 GMT -5
Take a step back...what would you tell your daughter to so if some stranger was following her? I would run like a bat out of hell. Not casually walk and carry on a conversation with my friend about some creepy saltine following me. So anytime a person is being followed they should casually walk down the street like it is no big deal? That is certainly not what I am teaching my kids Teens are taught not to run. It makes them look like a criminal. Just think back to watching a Law and Order show. What does it mean when the perp runs? In this case Zimmerman probably would have chased him. I'm not saying there is a right answer. that is the problem. There was nothing he could have done to stop Zimmerman from coming after him. If he was thinking with the front side of his brain he would have stayed in the car like the police told him to. Now that martin is dead he can't tell his side of the story, so everything we have heard is what Zimmerman wanted us to. Zimmerman started the whole chain of events that ended with him killing someone, but some how everyone is trying to figure out to what extent it is the victim's fault Zimmerman killed him. I've never taught my kids to run from someone. This man was not a cop and according to many on here, he never even identified himself as a cop. What parent in their right mind would teach a kid not to run from a random stranger who was stalking them? A police officer is one thing, a random "creepy as cracker" and the smart thing to do is run, scream and call the cops
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