greeniis10
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Post by greeniis10 on Jun 10, 2013 13:12:17 GMT -5
I agree with Drama. And, I hate to always be the one who pipes up on your thread and says, "I know how you feel!", but we're going through something somewhat similar with DSD. As soon as she found out she was pregnant her boyfriend's mother purchased the engagement ring and orchestrated the proposal. Her mother joined right in. DSD never even had the change to consider her options. Beautiful baby girl was born May 1st and the wedding is in October. We've spoken to her frankly about what could happen, what we fear, and how she should protect herself. In the meantime, this is her choice and all we can do is support her.
If asked pointedly, do you think their marriage will last? Honestly, I'd have to say NO. Sad, I know. But outlandish wedding plans are in full swing and as long as she has that to occupy her everything will be "fine". Settling in and "playing house" full time is another story. She'll get tired of it quickly.
Anyway, I know everyone is telling you to back off and stop obsessing, but I think you are venting here and that in real life you aren't running her life. If I was posting threads about what my DSD is giong through I would sound obsessive, too, I'm sure. Reality is sometimes you just need to get it all out...
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 10, 2013 13:18:33 GMT -5
I don't remember Naggie posting anything about how DD feels about marriage and marrying BF in specific. Since it isn't 1950, perhaps their plan to live together was a wise one. Only time will tell.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jun 10, 2013 14:04:37 GMT -5
Living together, or married - they have the same problem - her income is not high enough to provide a nice life, and he doesn't appear to want to be gainfully employed.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jun 10, 2013 20:33:05 GMT -5
I don't remember Naggie posting anything about how DD feels about marriage and marrying BF in specific. Since it isn't 1950, perhaps their plan to live together was a wise one. Only time will tell. There was a study done in I think 2004 called Sliding vs. Deciding which explained why people who live together before marriage have a higher divorce rate than those who don't. Basically, statistically those who lived together before getting married were more likely to end up with an unplanned pregnancy and since they were already living together and having a baby, then why not get married. So, basically they "slid" into marriage instead of deciding to get married. I don't think living with a boyfriend with anger management issues is ever a good idea. Let alone have a baby with him.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jun 11, 2013 6:26:02 GMT -5
Drama, I live in a marital property state. No way in hell would I get married to someone that is not responsible. You are liable for all debt incurred "in the interest of the marriage". All credit card agreements have a statement in the boiler plate language that whatever goes on the card is "in the interest if the marriage". Really you are jointly and severally liable so the responsible one will pay off the debt then you can sue your ex for the $ they can't or won't pay.
Sent from my MB855 using proboards
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 6:57:04 GMT -5
Drama, I live in a marital property state. No way in hell would I get married to someone that is not responsible. You are liable for all debt incurred "in the interest of the marriage". All credit card agreements have a statement in the boiler plate language that whatever goes on the card is "in the interest if the marriage". Really you are jointly and severally liable so the responsible one will pay off the debt then you can sue your ex for the $ they can't or won't pay. Sent from my MB855 using proboards Really- even when the cc is in one spouse's name only? That would have cost me a darn fortune in my divorce and caused me a lot of aggravation beforehand. My Ex bought nice stuff for himself on credit cards- nothing such as furniture, clothes for DS or family vacations that would have legitimately been in the interests of the marriage. (We had enough equity in the house that he paid them out of his share when we divorced, but I would probably have had to fight off garnishments before that.) Another reason banks are sleazy.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Jun 11, 2013 7:35:30 GMT -5
I have been talking about this a lot with women my age recently (30s.) And I would tell your daughter the same thing I am telling all my single girlfriends: Don't get married.
I'm not saying don't live together, or have long-term monogomous (or non-monogomous, whatever floats your boat) commitments, or have kids, or design contracts to create ties to one another. But don't get married. Don't feel you have to check that box, or that it's a prereq for kids, or whatever.
But marriage changes relationships, and not always for the better. All the married women I talk to about this agree. And most of them say they wish they hadn't felt the need to get married. That it was a bum deal. That their husbands expected things of them that they didn't expect as live-in partners, and vice versa. That it was financially and emotionally stressful to get married and be married.
I tell my girlfriends not to get married. None of them believe me.
But that's just my opinion.
(For the record, I love my husband, and I'm not looking to get divorced or anything.)
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jun 11, 2013 7:38:21 GMT -5
If you marry someone that bad, it can be an awful experience. I was dating but had no plans to marry a very fun guy before DF. He accidentally let it slip that he owed the IRS a bundle. Another reason I wouldn't have married him. FF, he marries some dumb chick who didn't check him out before marrying him. He's VERY charming and fun btw. She is now getting an annulment so the IRS can't seize her money to pay his debts.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 8:08:11 GMT -5
But marriage changes relationships, and not always for the better. All the married women I talk to about this agree. And most of them say they wish they hadn't felt the need to get married. That it was a bum deal. That their husbands expected things of them that they didn't expect as live-in partners, and vice versa. That it was financially and emotionally stressful to get married and be married. I regret getting married. I just feel....trapped. Held hostage almost.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 11, 2013 9:35:29 GMT -5
I don't remember Naggie posting anything about how DD feels about marriage and marrying BF in specific. Since it isn't 1950, perhaps their plan to live together was a wise one. Only time will tell. There was a study done in I think 2004 called Sliding vs. Deciding which explained why people who live together before marriage have a higher divorce rate than those who don't. Basically, statistically those who lived together before getting married were more likely to end up with an unplanned pregnancy and since they were already living together and having a baby, then why not get married. So, basically they "slid" into marriage instead of deciding to get married. I don't think living with a boyfriend with anger management issues is ever a good idea. Let alone have a baby with him. I suspect the order of events are different than the study. It seems likely to me she found out she was pregnant and decided to live with the BF to determine what she should do next. Why she let a BF into her life with anger management issues is unknown to us. Also unknown is whether she shares that leaning or is one of those who thinks drama means great passion instead of lack of self control.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 9:39:38 GMT -5
But marriage changes relationships, and not always for the better. All the married women I talk to about this agree. And most of them say they wish they hadn't felt the need to get married. That it was a bum deal. That their husbands expected things of them that they didn't expect as live-in partners, and vice versa. That it was financially and emotionally stressful to get married and be married. I regret getting married. I just feel....trapped. Held hostage almost.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jun 11, 2013 9:48:52 GMT -5
But marriage changes relationships, and not always for the better. All the married women I talk to about this agree. And most of them say they wish they hadn't felt the need to get married. That it was a bum deal. That their husbands expected things of them that they didn't expect as live-in partners, and vice versa. That it was financially and emotionally stressful to get married and be married. I regret getting married. I just feel....trapped. Held hostage almost. I'm sorry MPL. Is there anything I/we/the board can do? In my relationship with DH, I'd have to say that the kids changed it more than the marriage did. But as you know, we didn't think/expect to have kids. I thought we were coming though the worst of the kids but Cabe (3.5) is being, um, challenging with DH a lot lately.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jun 11, 2013 10:01:49 GMT -5
Althena, It is the Wisconsin Marital Property Law. Yes even if it is in one spouses name only you are liable for 1/2 the debt. But you have no right to call the creditor to find out the balance or status...you can be garnished if it is delinquent but you have no right to check up on the status.
Same with a car. DH can buy a car and the finance company will send me a notice that they gave him a loan on a car. I am liable to pay, but my name is not on the title so I can not call to get any info on it. DH usually just hands the payment book to me and I set them up for autopay. Occasionally if there is an issue with the loan I am pounding my head up against the wall b/c DH says he is too busy to deal with it.
My attorney describes the Marital Property Law as the "Creditor's Protection Act" That is how I think of it now. Really if they wanted to protect spouses you would have aright to info and you would not be liable if you did not sign off on it.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jun 11, 2013 10:03:47 GMT -5
More reason to not be married. Other than the fancy party and gift grab, what's the point?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jun 11, 2013 10:12:01 GMT -5
More reason to not be married. Other than the fancy party and gift grab, what's the point? health insurance, survivorship benefits, inheritance rights.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jun 11, 2013 10:20:00 GMT -5
I can buy health insurance. I'm already in the will so I inherit and I have my own SS and retirement pension, such as they are!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 10:27:49 GMT -5
But that's a good reason why you shouldn't want your daughter to get married naggie. If this guy is an angry loser you don't want to make it any harder for him to walk away. You certainly don't want him to feel trapped and take it out on your daughter if he has the potential to become physical. Marriage changed things for me and DH, in a good way, more for DH. Probably because we are pretty traditional at heart. It certainly doesn't do that for everyone.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jun 11, 2013 10:35:41 GMT -5
In the guy's defense, naggie's DD doesn't sound like a prize either based on her reaction to the finger door slamming event.
They both sound extremely immature. Ideally they should have waited to grow the F up before getting pregnant but that didn't happen.
They still have the opportunity to grow up before they enter into marriage at least.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 11, 2013 10:46:30 GMT -5
But marriage changes relationships, and not always for the better. All the married women I talk to about this agree. And most of them say they wish they hadn't felt the need to get married. That it was a bum deal. That their husbands expected things of them that they didn't expect as live-in partners, and vice versa. That it was financially and emotionally stressful to get married and be married. I regret getting married. I just feel....trapped. Held hostage almost. What a shame, paintlady. Why do you feel trapped? Is it because you think you can't support yourself? Whatever it is, that's got to be a terrible feeling!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 11:03:26 GMT -5
I regret getting married. I just feel....trapped. Held hostage almost. What a shame, paintlady. Why do you feel trapped? Is it because you think you can't support yourself? Whatever it is, that's got to be a terrible feeling! Because he has made it clear...sickeningly clear...how much hell he is going to put me and the kids through if I pursue a divorce. I don't know 100% if I want out, but I hate feeling like I have no choice, or that the alternative is worse.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jun 11, 2013 11:05:18 GMT -5
Are you seeing a therapist or anyone?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 11:07:09 GMT -5
I don't see how you could turn a marriage around with a person who threatens to make life miserable for his own children? Did he threaten you, or do you feel threatened, physically?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jun 11, 2013 11:16:15 GMT -5
I worry about you minnesota. That sounds like classic abuse techniques to me.
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Jun 11, 2013 11:18:42 GMT -5
I worry about you minnesota. That sounds like classic abuse techniques to me. If you won't do what I want, I will bully you into doing it.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Jun 11, 2013 11:24:14 GMT -5
Edit: Erased by bsb. Apparently this is a bad idea, which I didn't think through.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jun 11, 2013 11:27:06 GMT -5
I worry about you too Minnesota, based on this and info you have shared before. Is there any chance of getting into couples counselling as a way to facilitate an exit for you? Couples counseling is a bad idea when one spouse is abusive. The abusive one will often take the information revealed in counseling and use it against the other spouse, or punish the spouse for sharing.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 11, 2013 11:28:40 GMT -5
I worry about you minnesota. That sounds like classic abuse techniques to me. Absolutely this! If your husband has threatened you, it doesn't only SOUND like classic abuse, it IS classic abuse. You're being abused, and if it continues, it's only going to get worse. You post here, so I presume you feel safe here. Talk, girl. Get this out in the open and let's see what we all can do to help you help yourself.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jun 11, 2013 11:30:00 GMT -5
I definitely agree with Swamp. This is not the time for counseling. That only becomes a tool of the abuser.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2013 11:31:34 GMT -5
Sorry...deleted. I don't want to get into this.
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souldoubt
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Post by souldoubt on Jun 11, 2013 11:31:44 GMT -5
I think about the last thing a couple who is unprepared for a pregnancy should do is getting married.
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