Pope Francis Says Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed

[Politically_Incorrect12]

Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds today when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists.

During his homily at Wednesday Mass in Rome, Francis emphasized the importance of "doing good" as a principle that unites all humanity, and a "culture of encounter" to support peace.

Using scripture from the Gospel of Mark, Francis explained how upset Jesus' disciples were that someone outside their group was doing good, according to a report from Vatican Radio.

“They complain,” the Pope said in his homily, because they say, “If he is not one of us, he cannot do good. If he is not of our party, he cannot do good.” And Jesus corrects them: “Do not hinder him, he says, let him do good.” The disciples, Pope Francis explains, “were a little intolerant,” closed off by the idea of ​​possessing the truth, convinced that “those who do not have the truth, cannot do good.” “This was wrong . . . Jesus broadens the horizon.” Pope Francis said, “The root of this possibility of doing good – that we all have – is in creation”

Pope Francis went further in his sermon to say:

"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can... "The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!".. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”

Responding to the leader of the Roman Catholic church's homily, Father James Martin, S.J. wrote in an email to The Huffington Post:

"Pope Francis is saying, more clearly than ever before, that Christ offered himself as a sacrifice for everyone. That's always been a Christian belief. You can find St. Paul saying in the First Letter to Timothy that Jesus gave himself as a "ransom for all." But rarely do you hear it said by Catholics so forcefully, and with such evident joy. And in this era of religious controversies, it's a timely reminder that God cannot be confined to our narrow categories."

Of course, not all Christians believe that those who don't believe will be redeemed, and the Pope's words may spark memories of the deep divisions from the Protestant reformation over the belief in redemption through grace versus redemption through works.

Read more at:  www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/22/pope-francis-good-atheists_n_3320757.html

[mmhmm]

I really like what I'm seeing of this guy.  He is, indeed, "the people's pope".  His humility and empathy stand out in these difficult times.

[thyme4change]

Wow - that changes my entire understanding of Christianity.  I was told that the ONLY thing you had to do is believe.  But now you don't have to do that if you are okay otherwise?  <br><br>Religion is a mess.

[resolution]

You have to love one of the comments under the article: 

This is a good day for all atheists who were afraid of not being redeemed by Jesus! :-)

[BeenThere...DoneThat...]

...Breaking News... another writer for the Huffington Post doesn't pay attention to what the guy actually said...

[Virgil Showlion]

May 23, 2013 14:13:56 GMT -5 BeenThere...DoneThat... said:

...Breaking News... another writer for the Huffington Post doesn't pay attention to what the guy actually said...

[Shooby]

  Even is redeemed through Christ IF and WHEN they accept HIM as their Savior.  So, yes, atheists do have that opportunity.  I think that HuffPuff is putting their "spin" on it.

[mmhmm]

This is what Pope Francis said:

"The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone! And this Blood makes us children of God of the first class! We are created children in the likeness of God and the Blood of Christ has redeemed us all!"


Text from page en.radiovaticana.va/news/2013/05/22/pope_at_mass:_culture_of_encounter_is_the_foundation_of_peace/en1-694445
of the Vatican Radio website


If you want to disagree, that's your prerogative.  I don't, however, see how the Pope said anything different than what has been quoted and claimed.

[Shooby]

  Well, you can certainly look at the Doctrines of the Catholic Church.  And, as the Pope , he represents their Doctrine.  If you and the HuffPuff want to pretend that there has been a fundamental shift in doctrine, then that is your prerogative.  But, i don't see this statement as evidence of that.

[mmhmm]

I didn't say there had been any fundamental shift, shooby.  Neither did Huffpo.  The Pope's words were quoted verbatim.  Nobody added anything to them, and nobody twisted them.  He didn't put any "ifs", any "ands", or any "buts" into his offering.  He stated what he believes to be the truth and the right way.  He wasn't making a pronouncement regarding Catholic dogma.  He was speaking at Mass to his beliefs.

[Shooby]

  He represents Catholic Doctrine.  If you are assuming that he means that Atheists go to Heaven as atheists than i disagree that he was saying that.  I am not twisting but neither should anyone read something that isn't there either.

[mmhmm]

*chuckle*  Shooby, atheists aren't worried about going to heaven.  Atheists don't accept the concept of heaven any more than they accept the concept of God.  I'm not going to make an assumption with regard to heaven and who's going there.  I just read the Pope's words and am taking them at face value to mean exactly what they say.  He's stated his belief.  He has not stated anything about changing Catholic dogma.  To say he is would be reading something that isn't there, IMO.

[Shooby]

  Well, the Law of Gravity applies to everyone, whether or not one "believes" in it.

[mmhmm]

This doesn't have anything to do with the law of gravity, shoobs.

[Shooby]

I think it does.

[Deleted]

May 23, 2013 14:51:24 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  He represents Catholic Doctrine.  If you are assuming that he means that Atheists go to Heaven as atheists than i disagree that he was saying that.  I am not twisting but neither should anyone read something that isn't there either.

I'm pretty sure you stop being an atheist when confronted by a Deity saying "Hi, I'm God, do you want to come in and hang out?"  We won't need faith after we're dead because we will either have a new reality or nothingness.

So, there will never be atheists in Heaven, only former atheists.

[Deleted]

May 23, 2013 14:56:41 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  Well, the Law of Gravity applies to everyone, whether or not one "believes" in it.

Seriously??!? Since NO ONE knows for sure what happens after we "shuffle off this mortal coil" people should be allowed to figure out their own truth.

One person's Law of Gravity is another person's Higgs boson. 

[Deleted]

"The Bible tells us to love our neighbors, and also to love our enemies; probably because they are generally the same people."


G.K. Chesterton

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G._K._Chesterton

[Shooby]

May 23, 2013 15:11:24 GMT -5 @beerwench said:

May 23, 2013 14:56:41 GMT -5 Shooby said:

  Well, the Law of Gravity applies to everyone, whether or not one "believes" in it.

Seriously??!? Since NO ONE knows for sure what happens after we "shuffle off this mortal coil" people should be allowed to figure out their own truth.

One person's Law of Gravity is another person's Higgs boson. 

Um, the POINT is that gravity applies to everyone whether you "believe" or not.  

[vonna]

I found when I quit believing in gravity, I just started floating around, feeling very lightweight, which transferred to light hearted. I'm in a happy place!

[The Captain]

If you  are an atheist but still were good in your soul you will have the opportunity to find out IF you were wrong...

If you believe in God and were good in your soul you will find out IF you were right...

If you were none of the above then it won't really matter, will it?

Either way, it pays to follow the golden rule.

[Shooby]

May 23, 2013 17:11:42 GMT -5 The Captain said:

If you  are an atheist but still were good in your soul you will have the opportunity to find out IF you were wrong...

If you believe in God and were good in your soul you will find out IF you were right...

If you were none of the above then it won't really matter, will it?

Either way, it pays to follow the golden rule.

Sorry, that ISN'T what the Bible actually says.

[The Captain]

 

John 14:6

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Like many things in the bible this is open to several interpretations.  I have always understood it that as a result of Jesus' sacrifice the way to God is open for all who do the work of God, regardless of whether or not they profess a belief in Him.

Is there something else you're thinking of?

[Shooby]

  If Jesus is "The Way", then He is "The Way".  The Bible doesn't talk about "other ways".  Kind of an all or nothing.

[Deleted]

Let's all argue about something that nobody in this world has any exact knowledge of.

[Shooby]

Nobody has "exact" knowledge about anything.  Just because we don't know everything about God doesn't mean we don't know something about God.

[The Captain]

@shooby - what exactly is meant by "no man cometh unto the Father, but by me"

[Deleted]

May 23, 2013 17:38:44 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Nobody has "exact" knowledge about anything.  Just because we don't know everything about God doesn't mean we don't know something about our personal understanding of God.

Fixed that for you.

[Shooby]

May 23, 2013 17:43:10 GMT -5 The Captain said:

@shooby - what exactly is meant by "no man cometh unto the Father, but by me"

  That in order to approach the Father, you need the Son.

[Shooby]

May 23, 2013 17:51:28 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

May 23, 2013 17:38:44 GMT -5 Shooby said:

Nobody has "exact" knowledge about anything.  Just because we don't know everything about God doesn't mean we don't know something about our personal understanding of God.

Fixed that for you.

What did you "fix"?  I dunno.