Cleveland "Hero" is a Felon & Serial Domestic Abuser

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Oh, well- so much for that warm fuzzy...

www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/cleveland-hero-charles-ramsey-8702415

[EVT1]

I knew the minute you saw the photo you would be all over it.  No way some hood rat can be a hero-right  Good job.

[swamp]

<p>just because someone has a felony conviction doesn't make them a bad person all around.  </p>


ETA:  Maybe this guy was an Eagle Scout when he was a teen?

[jkapp]

May 9, 2013 9:32:40 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

I knew the minute you saw the photo you would be all over it.  No way some hood rat can be a hero-right  Good job.

It's usually only a matter of time before some dirt is dug up on anyone who is in the spotlight.  For some reason, the only thing people love more than a hero is to watch a hero fall.

[Deleted]

There is a certain irony to this.

[EVT1]

Yep- and it's kind of irrelevant to the story.  If someone hauls a baby out of a burning building some asshole is always going to point out that 20 years ago they got caught with weed. 

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

May 9, 2013 9:32:40 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

I knew the minute you saw the photo you would be all over it.  No way some hood rat can be a hero-right  Good job.

Moses was a murderer.  God does His will through imperfect people all the time.  It was just a let down.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

May 9, 2013 10:11:56 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Yep- and it's kind of irrelevant to the story.  If someone hauls a baby out of a burning building some asshole is always going to point out that 20 years ago they got caught with weed. 

He didn't get caught with weed.  He beat his wife to a pulp.

After pleading guilty to the felony abuse charge, Ramsey was sentenced to eight months in prison and ordered, following his release from custody, to be placed on “post release control” supervision for the maximum term allowable by Ohio law.

Ramsey served his time at the Lorain Correctional Institution, where he posed for the above 2003 mug shot. He had previously done two separate one-year stretches at Lorain, for early-90s convictions for drug abuse, criminal trespassing, and receiving stolen property.

This is a systemic problem, and not something I'd automatically file under "nobody's perfect" and "anyone can change" - both true.  This is a problem of our system.  Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time.  Third time? Nice knowing you.  Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance.

Ramsey’s first domestic violence charge came in February 1997. He entered a no contest plea a year later and was found guilty of the count by a Cleveland Municipal Court judge. While waiting to be sentenced, Ramsey was again arrested for domestic violence.

At the time of Ramsey’s second collar, in July 1998, he was already the subject of an arrest warrant issued in connection with his failure to appear for a court hearing in the first domestic violence case. As a result, Ramsey was jailed for violating terms of his release on bond. Ramsey subsequently entered a no contest plea to the second case and was, again, found guilty by a Cleveland judge.

The domestic violence cases apparently were consolidated for sentencing in August 1998, when Ramsey was ordered to serve six months in jail, placed on five years probation, and directed to attend a domestic violence counseling program.

Following his release from custody, Ramsey violated probation terms, according to an April 1999 court docket entry. While an arrest warrant was issued for Ramsey, it is unclear from court records whether it was executed before both misdemeanor cases were formally closed several years later.

Ramsey was again busted for domestic abuse in January 2003. He was subsequently indicted for felony “domestic violence with prior conviction,” a reference to his previous abuse cases.

[swamp]

If he beat her to a pulp, he would have gone away for much longer than 8 months.  Not that what he did was OK, but we don't know how bad the injuries were.

[Jaguar]

We can't pick and choose who our heroes will be.

[jkapp]

May 9, 2013 10:30:00 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

May 9, 2013 10:11:56 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Yep- and it's kind of irrelevant to the story.  If someone hauls a baby out of a burning building some asshole is always going to point out that 20 years ago they got caught with weed. 

He didn't get caught with weed.  He beat his wife to a pulp.

After pleading guilty to the felony abuse charge, Ramsey was sentenced to eight months in prison and ordered, following his release from custody, to be placed on “post release control” supervision for the maximum term allowable by Ohio law.

Ramsey served his time at the Lorain Correctional Institution, where he posed for the above 2003 mug shot. He had previously done two separate one-year stretches at Lorain, for early-90s convictions for drug abuse, criminal trespassing, and receiving stolen property.

This is a systemic problem, and not something I'd automatically file under "nobody's perfect" and "anyone can change" - both true.  This is a problem of our system.  Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time.  Third time? Nice knowing you.  Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance.

Ramsey’s first domestic violence charge came in February 1997. He entered a no contest plea a year later and was found guilty of the count by a Cleveland Municipal Court judge. While waiting to be sentenced, Ramsey was again arrested for domestic violence.

At the time of Ramsey’s second collar, in July 1998, he was already the subject of an arrest warrant issued in connection with his failure to appear for a court hearing in the first domestic violence case. As a result, Ramsey was jailed for violating terms of his release on bond. Ramsey subsequently entered a no contest plea to the second case and was, again, found guilty by a Cleveland judge.

The domestic violence cases apparently were consolidated for sentencing in August 1998, when Ramsey was ordered to serve six months in jail, placed on five years probation, and directed to attend a domestic violence counseling program.

Following his release from custody, Ramsey violated probation terms, according to an April 1999 court docket entry. While an arrest warrant was issued for Ramsey, it is unclear from court records whether it was executed before both misdemeanor cases were formally closed several years later.

Ramsey was again busted for domestic abuse in January 2003. He was subsequently indicted for felony “domestic violence with prior conviction,” a reference to his previous abuse cases.

I suppose there's one silver lining...at least he still sounds better than the Castro guy

[Deleted]

This is a systemic problem, and not something I'd automatically file under "nobody's perfect" and "anyone can change" - both true. This is a problem of our system. Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time. Third time? Nice knowing you. Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance.

This is my favourite thing that you have ever said. I'd actually give you a bunch of karma if we still had that system.

[EVT1]

What difference does it make?  A bad guy can't do a good thing and get any credit- just shit on?

     "This is a problem of our system. Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time. Third time? Nice knowing you. Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance."

As for a 4th of 5th chance?  He served his time- and he might do something bad again- maybe he won't.  So are you (PBP) willing to spend the money to lock up that many people for the rest of their lives?  You own prison stock?



It could have been worse- he could have murdered some kid on neighborhood watch like the other guy charged with a felony and accused of domestic violence

[Deleted]

May 9, 2013 11:47:54 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

What difference does it make?  A bad guy can't do a good thing and get any credit- just shit on?

     "This is a problem of our system. Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time. Third time? Nice knowing you. Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance."

As for a 4th of 5th chance?  He served his time- and he might do something bad again- maybe he won't.  So are you (PBP) willing to spend the money to lock up that many people for the rest of their lives?  You own prison stock?

so how many bites of the apple do we allow then?

is there a limit in your eyes?

or do we continue to set them free to probably harm someone else down the road

where does his freedom end, and the safety of the community begin?

[The Captain]

"This is a systemic problem, and not something I'd automatically file under "nobody's perfect" and "anyone can change" - both true. This is a problem of our system. Somewhere around the second charge for beating your wife, you need to do hard time. Third time? Nice knowing you. Goodbye. You shouldn't get a forth and fifth chance."

Again with the broad statements, what are the details?  I'm not defending him, we just don't know how serious it was. 

Wonder if the sentiment would be the same about a woman slapping a man.  No it's not right, but is it worth of doing hard time for the rest of your life if you've slapped someone three times?

And yes, I will say he is a hero, he had no idea if there was a nutcase with a gun behind that girl.  What he did was a good thing.

[The Captain]

OMG - I'm actually in agreement with EVT1 on a topic, is that one of the 7 signs? 

[steff]

This is exactly why more random folks don't step in and try to help in a bad situation now days.  Because no matter how incredible your act in the current moment, someone is going to dig thru everything & show that you aren't a great person after all. 

While Mr Ramsey has had issues in his past, I'm going to focus on the good he did this week by not ignoring a plea for help & not worrying about what folks would say if they dug up his history.  He stepped up & did the right thing & the result was beyond what anyone could have hoped for.  3 young women & 1 child are safe & free. 

[Deleted]

but we don't know how bad the injuries were.

So it's okay if he only beat up his wife a little bit??

we just don't know how serious it was.

Serious enough that he it is accurate to say he is a Felon and Serial Domestic Abuser.

This is exactly why more random folks don't step in and try to help in a bad situation now days. Because no matter how incredible your act in the current moment, someone is going to dig thru everything & show that you aren't a great person after all.

The bad stuff was already all there. By doing this good thing he now gets to say he has been an ass at times and an idiot but on this one day he got to prove that he isn't all bad and he saved 3 women and a little girl gave them their lives back. Just maybe that helps to balance his ledger out a bit.

[steff]

Charles Ramsey -- the hero who helped free Amanda Berry and 2 other women in Ohio -- tells TMZ ... he's not ashamed that media outlets have uncovered the domestic violence arrests in his past, claiming he used the incidents to grow into a better person.

After Ramsey exploded into viral superstardom thanks to his heroic actions (and follow-up interviews), several websites posted the details from 3 separate domestic violence arrests involving an ex-wife that all took place between 1997 and 2003.

We spoke to Ramsey, who told us ... "I've made amends with the people involved and we've all moved on and grown up."

Ramsey adds, "Those incidents helped me become the man I am today and are the reason why I try to help the community as much as I can ... Including those women."

"If I had so much hatred for women, I would have minded my own business this week and walked away instead of risking my life to save someone else."

For her part, Ramsey's ex-wife says Charles eventually apologized for the domestic incidents and the two are now on an "okay basis."


Read more: www.tmz.com/2013/05/09/charles-ramsey-domestic-violence-arrest-ohio-hero/#ixzz2SogE2vjX

[mmhmm]

As is so often true, paul, your hyperbole saps the meaning from anything you bring here, rendering the vast majority of it just pap.  There is no evidence Mr. Ramsey beat anyone "to a pulp".  He's been convicted, more than once, of domestic abuse.  That's all we know, and you don't know any more than the rest of us.  Your input would be a great deal more valuable if it wasn't inevitably laced with overstatement and superfluous sensationalism.<br>

[The Captain]

May 9, 2013 12:11:45 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

but we don't know how bad the injuries were.

So it's okay if he only beat up his wife a little bit??

 No, and you know that.

we just don't know how serious it was.

Serious enough that he it is accurate to say he is a Felon and Serial Domestic Abuser.

And an 18yo who sleeps with a 16yo is a rapist and child molester in some states with a Felony charge and a lifetime requirement to be registered as a sex offender - even if he later marries that same 16yo who gave consent in the first place. Would you lock him up for life and say he isn't capable of changing or doing good deeds? 

This is exactly why more random folks don't step in and try to help in a bad situation now days. Because no matter how incredible your act in the current moment, someone is going to dig thru everything & show that you aren't a great person after all.

The bad stuff was already all there. By doing this good thing he now gets to say he has been an ass at times and an idiot but on this one day he got to prove that he isn't all bad and he saved 3 women and a little girl gave them their lives back. Just maybe that helps to balance his ledger out a bit.

[Deleted]

And an 18yo who sleeps with a 16yo is a rapist and child molester in some states with a Felony charge and a lifetime requirement to be registered as a sex offender - even if he later marries that same 16yo who gave consent in the first place. Would you lock him up for life and say he isn't capable of changing or doing good deeds?

We aren't talking about rape laws, we are talking about domestic abuse laws. Which domestic abuse law do you think is too harsh or irrelevant? Just how much do you think it is okay for a man to abuse his wife?

[Deleted]

Even Ramsey did not try to say his convictions were wrong or irrelevant. He said he learned and grew from there and that isn't who he is today.

[swamp]

So it's okay if he only beat up his wife a little bit??

It's never OK to hit your spouse.  The comment was in response Paul's comment that "he beat his wife to a pulp."  Um, no he didn't.  If he did, he would have gone to prison for much longer. 

Serious enough that he it is accurate to say he is a Felon and Serial Domestic Abuser

It was a misdemeanor assualt that was elevated to a felony because of a prior conviction.

Are you just looking to argue with me for the sake of arguing?

[swamp]

May 9, 2013 12:26:12 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

Even Ramsey did not try to say his convictions were wrong or irrelevant. He said he learned and grew from there and that isn't who he is today.

nobody's excusing what he did.  we're pointing out paul's bullshit.  He's a flawed dude who did something great.  Kind of like lots of other people. 

[billisonboard]

May 9, 2013 12:11:45 GMT -5 @justaposter said:

... Just maybe that helps to balance his ledger out a bit.

Wonder what it looks like on the ledger of those who felt the need to publish the information?

[The Captain]

I'm not saying spousal abuse is right, it clearly is not.  There are degrees of abuse and the punishment should fit the crime.  We don't know the circumstances.  However there were unsupported, wild assed statements about him beating his wife to a pulp then speculating that happened three times and saying why wasn't this guy put away for life.

Abuse is not right, but like many crimes there are degrees of severity.  In this guys case it appears that the impact on his life was such that he (hopefully) was able to turn things around.

I also notice there are no comments on a woman slapping a man, that's abuse but we don't see women going to prison for it, do we?

I just think it's better to know the details before declaring the man a monster.

[Deleted]

insert quote here

I wasn't arguing with you in particular. The majority of stuff Paul says I disagree with. Saying that domestic violence is not on par to being caught with some weed is one thing I tend to agree with.

[kittensaver]

So - what is the point? I guy with a negative history is not capable of stepping up and helping someone out in an emergency? I don't think so . . .

[Tennesseer]

Damn uppity black people trying to help.