thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 28, 2013 10:58:18 GMT -5
Since we have all agreed that life was perfect when we were growing up, and the world is horrible now, I need a gauge. I know back in the 80's, teachers didn't curse in front of students, ever - but coaches were allowed to say all sorts of things that would make a sailor blush, and yell and scream, and it was okay because that was the culture. Now, kids are exposed to so much more.
At what age (age of team members) does it start to be okay when coaches curse in front of their team? Does that angry, yelling coach approach work? Does that make for strong kids, strong teams, winners?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2013 11:43:54 GMT -5
Teachers still don't curse in front of students where I teach. However, I have noticed a trend of students cursing in front of teachers. They weren't talking to me, but loudly enough where I could hear. I reprimand them, but it's not a detention issue if they only do it once.
I don't think it's ok for anyone to curse around kids . . . coaches, teachers, parents, and so on. They aren't old enough to differentiate when it is acceptable and when it is not.
Edited to add: If someone curses at the kids--coaches, teachers, parents, etc.--is it ok for the kids to curse back? That's why I said it's hard for them to differentiate when it is acceptable and when it is not. At an area high school, supposedly a coach cursed at the kid a lot. The kid got angry about it and cursed back. The coach shoved the kid, and the kid shoved back. The kid got in trouble, but the coach got fired. This is the newspaper version, anyway, since that's how I heard about it. I agreed that the whole thing showed a lack of professionalism.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 28, 2013 12:48:32 GMT -5
If there is Zero Tolerance for students, there should be Zero Tolerance for coaches. I coach girls basketball and i would NEVER use foul language in a game to address the refs or girls. This needs to STOP.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 28, 2013 12:48:57 GMT -5
And, it will stop when parents stand up and demand that it stops.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Apr 28, 2013 16:28:20 GMT -5
DH and I curse in front of the kids. When they were born, we figured we'd stop as soon as they started repeating them. They're 6&8 now and they've yet to start saying curse words. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2013 18:06:49 GMT -5
But why do you curse in front of the kids, SK? Is that acceptable language for them?
My oldest grandson at about age 5 told me his mother had called his father a "son of a bitch." I told him that he probably shouldn't share that information. Then I told my DIL what he said. She said, "Did you tell him you were the bitch?"
That's a cute comeback (and I love my DIL), but kids do pick this stuff up. It is a fine line to teach them when and not to say these words. I think the words are totally unnecessary because they show a lack of vocabulary. The f-word might work if you are talking about sex, but why does it become an intensifier like "very" in front of most nouns? It strikes me as just plain lazy.
But then I teach English so I am more aware of language.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Apr 28, 2013 18:18:27 GMT -5
Last year one of the minor hockey volunteer coaches was relieved of his duties for using inappropriate language towards the kids.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 28, 2013 18:19:21 GMT -5
DH and I curse in front of the kids. When they were born, we figured we'd stop as soon as they started repeating them. They're 6&8 now and they've yet to start saying curse words. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) You are their parents, if you want to curse at home, your choice. But, i would presume you aren't out cursing at other kids or using profanity on your job. I think Coaches can be able to follow a certain standard in that regard. And if they can't, then they can find the door. Yes, in the heat of the moment in some championship game, maybe some words might spill out and that could be forgiven. But, as rule and practice, no.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2013 18:37:44 GMT -5
I very rarely swear. And with some folks that makes me a freak of nature. But honestly people that swear as a regular part of their communication are just not that bright and have no class. Coaches fall into that category, brawn but not much brain. As far as I know they can't use that language until the kids are university age.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2013 18:54:10 GMT -5
I thought Thyme was looking for tips on how to start a part time gig coaching people like Later.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 28, 2013 18:55:15 GMT -5
But they didn't back in the day. Maybe that is why our society is soft - because we coddle our children?
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Apr 28, 2013 22:37:23 GMT -5
DH and I curse in front of the kids. When they were born, we figured we'd stop as soon as they started repeating them. They're 6&8 now and they've yet to start saying curse words. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) You are their parents, if you want to curse at home, your choice. But, i would presume you aren't out cursing at other kids or using profanity on your job. I think Coaches can be able to follow a certain standard in that regard. And if they can't, then they can find the door. Yes, in the heat of the moment in some championship game, maybe some words might spill out and that could be forgiven. But, as rule and practice, no. I've never called DH a name (ie "asshole") in my life ever and I've never sworn AT a person that I can remember. Usually it is swearing out of exasperation (ie "oh fuck I just missed the freeway exit"). It's not that we do it often (maybe a couple times a month?) but it definitely does happen. Maybe it isn't as apparent as I think it is as the kids have never picked up on it. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) I definitely subscribe to situational behavior and how I would speak at a job interview is different than how I'd speak with a close girlfriend. Heck, I speak differently with my more conservative friends than I do with my more liberal ones as I try to respect their wishes on how they'd like people around them to be. For example, my SIL has a problem with the word "butt" and is offended if someone says something like "sit on your butt." She prefers "bottom," so when I'm around her I use the word "bottom" (even though "butt" doesn't bother me) because I care about her and don't see the point in offending her.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2013 2:28:12 GMT -5
Back in the late 80's my softball coach (guy) was having a very open affair with one of the mom's. I don't know why his wife stayed with him when it was even obvious to us teens what was going on. They did eventually get divorced and he moved in with the other woman. He also threw fits, cursed, and carried on like a fool on the side lines. It was tolerated.
My history teacher came to school hung over and wrinkled clothes. He just got out of jail for a DUI and thought he should show up to teach. I think it was a bad decision even though he WAS my favorite teacher.
My computer teacher spiked his coffee every day. You could smell it a mile away. He was never fired for it. Oh, he also hated me, and swore at me several times and called me stupid for not understanding how a computer worked. I finally was able to switch classes but he never got in trouble for it.
My 7th grade science teacher got mad at a student one day for squeeking his shoes on the tile. He pushed the kid down in a chair, ripped his shoes off, and threw them out the window (2nd floor).
Oh we also had a teacher leave his wife for one of the Senior girls.
I don't think teachers or coaches were any better behaved back in the "good ol' days". I think that we just forget things like that happening. Or that it just makes the news more now.
As for teachers or coaches swearing now. I would not tolerate it as a parent. I would complain and complain loud. My kids do not need to be treated that way. I don't scream and swear at my kids, I expect teachers and coaches to refrain from doing it as well.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 29, 2013 6:22:36 GMT -5
You are their parents, if you want to curse at home, your choice. But, i would presume you aren't out cursing at other kids or using profanity on your job. I think Coaches can be able to follow a certain standard in that regard. And if they can't, then they can find the door. Yes, in the heat of the moment in some championship game, maybe some words might spill out and that could be forgiven. But, as rule and practice, no. I've never called DH a name (ie "asshole") in my life ever and I've never sworn AT a person that I can remember. Usually it is swearing out of exasperation (ie "oh fuck I just missed the freeway exit"). It's not that we do it often (maybe a couple times a month?) but it definitely does happen. Maybe it isn't as apparent as I think it is as the kids have never picked up on it. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) I definitely subscribe to situational behavior and how I would speak at a job interview is different than how I'd speak with a close girlfriend. Heck, I speak differently with my more conservative friends than I do with my more liberal ones as I try to respect their wishes on how they'd like people around them to be. For example, my SIL has a problem with the word "butt" and is offended if someone says something like "sit on your butt." She prefers "bottom," so when I'm around her I use the word "bottom" (even though "butt" doesn't bother me) because I care about her and don't see the point in offending her. I personally don't care for it when people say something "sucks". My son was saying that one day and we told him that was a curse word in OUR house. He argued that it technically wasn't a curse word but we dont' like it, it sounds crude and rude and he can refrain. As for swearing, there are times i swear. If someone practically side swipes me when i am driving our something i might blurt out "A hole or dumb bitch". I don't think swearing is necessarily a problem in casual language at home or whatever but i think it is wrong in a professional setting. I think people can tell the difference.
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toomuchreality
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Post by toomuchreality on Apr 29, 2013 6:52:35 GMT -5
Since we have all agreed that life was perfect when we were growing up, and the world is horrible now, I need a gauge. I know back in the 80's, teachers didn't curse in front of students, ever - but coaches were allowed to say all sorts of things that would make a sailor blush, and yell and scream, and it was okay because that was the culture. Now, kids are exposed to so much more. At what age (age of team members) does it start to be okay when coaches curse in front of their team? Does that angry, yelling coach approach work? Does that make for strong kids, strong teams, winners?While it may work for some people / kids, yelling or cursing has never worked for me. I tend to feel crushed. I don't think it makes for stronger people / kids. Maybe angrier, but not stronger necessarily. I am not a screamer. I don't yell and curse. I do say things like, Oh shit! Once after my nephew (22yrs) upset me, he told me it would be easier for him to deal with upsetting me, if I would rant and rave like most other people. Generally speaking, I think people that rant and rave, screaming and swearing, just seem out of control. Not a lot of intelligent things are said usually, IMO. ![](http://kenoshamargetwo.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/smiley-angry-shaking-fist.gif?w=869) It bugs me when I'm driving, and a passenger in my car starts swearing at another driver (road rage). Really? I'm driving and not freaking out. But you can't control yourself? ![](http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/bad/road-rage-smiley-emoticon.gif) Huh.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Apr 29, 2013 6:55:46 GMT -5
In my opinion, coaches who scream and yell and curse are doing so to cover up their LACK of coaching ability and knowledge. They don't know what else to do or understand the game or what needs done so instead, they scream at the players to try to make them look better.
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Apr 29, 2013 8:46:10 GMT -5
First of all "cursing" and "screaming at kids" can be two different things. It is also quite different depending on the age of the kids. Screamin at 7 year olds is a little different than screaming at high school kids.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 29, 2013 9:07:12 GMT -5
If there is Zero Tolerance for students, there should be Zero Tolerance for coaches. I coach girls basketball and i would NEVER use foul language in a game to address the refs or girls. This needs to STOP. Part of the problem is that YOUR defintion of "foul language" and MY definition of "foul language" and everyone else's definition of "foul language" might all be different. ::In my opinion, coaches who scream and yell and curse are doing so to cover up their LACK of coaching ability and knowledge. They don't know what else to do or understand the game or what needs done so instead, they scream at the players to try to make them look better.:: So then how do you explain that some of hte greatest coaches in the history of sports at the highest levels scream, yell, and curse? I would agree that in some cases coaches who don't know what they are doing choose to scream to cover for it. And some coaches who don't know what htey're doing say nothing because they don't want to say something stupid. And some coaches do other things to cover for it.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 29, 2013 9:11:32 GMT -5
First of all "cursing" and "screaming at kids" can be two different things. It is also quite different depending on the age of the kids. Screamin at 7 year olds is a little different than screaming at high school kids. I also think there is a difference between "yelling" and "screaming." To me, yelling is making your voice loud. Our soccer coach yells, but that is because we are outside and the field is kind of big. You have to be pretty loud to get someone to hear you. Screaming is more out of control and angry. I don't know if that is the official definition, but that is how I have always thought about it. The opposing team's coach this weekend was screaming and cursing. My son had a long decompression session after the game because he was upset by the behavior of the other coach.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Apr 29, 2013 9:14:00 GMT -5
Last year one of the minor hockey volunteer coaches was relieved of his duties for using inappropriate language towards the kids. A football coach (believe it or not - of 5th and 6th grade boys) in a neighboring town was dismissed for telling his boys to "shake the sand out of their vaginas". I guess that meant he thought they were playing like girls. I would gladly take him to the golf course, volleyball court or ball field so he can see up close and personal how girls really do play.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 29, 2013 9:14:01 GMT -5
::But, i would presume you aren't out cursing at other kids or using profanity on your job. I think Coaches can be able to follow a certain standard in that regard.::
You think people don't use profanity at their jobs? And that's completely ignoring the fact that the VAST majority of coaching that occurs in this country is not in any way related to someone's job.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 29, 2013 9:16:55 GMT -5
::I would gladly take him to the golf course, volleyball court or ball field so he can see up close and personal how girls really do play. ::
In general at a significantly lower level than their male counterparts? That'll teach him!
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 29, 2013 9:17:55 GMT -5
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Apr 29, 2013 9:29:34 GMT -5
::I would gladly take him to the golf course, volleyball court or ball field so he can see up close and personal how girls really do play. :: In general at a significantly lower level than their male counterparts? That'll teach him! Nope. I'll tee off from the white just so the pot-bellied pig can't claim I get an advantage.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 29, 2013 9:37:11 GMT -5
::But honestly people that swear as a regular part of their communication are just not that bright and have no class.::
People who do not regularly swear are just no that bright and don't have a very sophisticated vocabulary. "Stop playing like a group of females" just doesn't have the poetic ring of "shake the sand out of your vaginas". What beautiful wordsmithing.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 29, 2013 9:39:24 GMT -5
::I would gladly take him to the golf course, volleyball court or ball field so he can see up close and personal how girls really do play. :: In general at a significantly lower level than their male counterparts? That'll teach him! Nope. I'll tee off from the white just so the pot-bellied pig can't claim I get an advantage. Avoid the traps, I hear if you get sand in your vagina it can be a pain to shake it out.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2013 9:39:24 GMT -5
I very rarely swear. And with some folks that makes me a freak of nature. But honestly people that swear as a regular part of their communication are just not that bright and have no class. Coaches fall into that category, brawn but not much brain. As far as I know they can't use that language until the kids are university age. Sometimes an "F-bomb" conveys what I'm feeling more succinctly than any other word in the English language. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2013 9:39:50 GMT -5
Nope. I'll tee off from the white just so the pot-bellied pig can't claim I get an advantage. Avoid the traps, I hear if you get sand in your vagina it can be a pain to shake it out. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/star.gif) POTD ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/star.gif)
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Apr 29, 2013 9:41:18 GMT -5
Nope. I'll tee off from the white just so the pot-bellied pig can't claim I get an advantage. Avoid the traps, I hear if you get sand in your vagina it can be a pain to shake it out. You have NO idea!!! But I'm not worried. I'm rarely in the sand. Why? Because I play like a girl. Damn well. Plus? If I do happen to hit a trap, I don't have to sit down in it. What the heck kind of golf do you play?
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Apr 29, 2013 9:42:34 GMT -5
Plus? As a further sign of his idiocy? If you are unfortunate enough to get sand in your vagina, unless you are Michelle Dugger, it does not "shake out".
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